posted April 25, 2012 01:41 PM            

So I can't agree that the Piscean era was all deception/confusion.

Frankly I don't see how the Aquarian age promises to be superior, in any self-evident way. And this- "fortunately, the Age of Aquarius will resolve this"- looks overly optimistic to me.

If we lack the heart and compassion of Pisces, it might still turn out to be the age of global dominion and endless warfare. "Intelligence in the service of madness" as Eckhart Tolle put it...THAT could be in the cards.

posted April 25, 2012 04:07 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
I go by the conventional wisdom amongst astrologers that Pisces is the most advanced, mature sign, representing the culmination of human experience. A lot was happening in the Piscean era apart from Christianity that has served as a groundwork for the spiritual advances we are making now: such as science building up toward quantum physics, kirlian photography, and astronomical knowledge lending itself to astrology. (Such as we have on this forum, where we can look up charts and have instant results, and communicate with people around the world instantly!).

So I can't agree that the Piscean era was all deception/confusion.

Frankly I don't see how the Aquarian age promises to be superior, in any self-evident way. And this- "fortunately, the Age of Aquarius will resolve this"- looks overly optimistic to me.

If we lack the heart and compassion of Pisces, it might still turn out to be the age of global dominion and endless warfare. "Intelligence in the service of madness" as Eckhart Tolle put it...THAT could be in the cards.

Unless you can tell me more...I might be convinced yet.

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I don't necessarily think that the Aquarian Age will be objectively better but I do think that the influence of Neptune causes confusion. This is because of the dissipating energies of the planet, and as far as I know that IS conventional astrological wisdom. This is an excerpt with respect to age cusps:

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Many astrologers consider the entrance into a new astrological age is not a single moment of time but a process commonly referred to as `the cusp', by which one age initiates its influences in a slowly increasing way before the end of the previous age. For example, Ray Grasse states that an astrological age neither begins at an exact day or year.[18] Paul Wright states that cusps do not exist in horoscopic astrology (a planet is either in one zodiacal sign or the next), but a cuspal effect does occur at the border of the astrological ages. Consequently, the beginning of any age cannot be defined to a single year or a decade but blend its influences with the previous age for a period of time until the new age can stand in its own right.[19] Be that as it may, there is no consensus on this point. Basically, those that follow the cusp approach believe that there is a merging of influence between each adjoining ages. Many astrologers believe that the world is currently on the cusp of the Pisces and Aquarian ages, explaining why so many developments in the world today can be aligned to Pisces (i.e. continuing strong religious influences especially from Christianity) and Aquarius (traditional archetypes associated with Aquarius include electricity, computers and democracy). A few astrologers consider the last ca. 10 degrees of a given age (ca. 720 years) as the time period during which the new age starts to make visible its influences, also called "orb of influence". In Nicholas Campion's The Book of World Horoscopes there are six pages listing researchers and their proposed dates for the start of the Age of Aquarius indicating that many researchers believe that each age commences at an exact date. Marcia Moore and Mark Douglas claim that the lighting up of the earth artificially by electricity is a sign of the Age of Aquarius.

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The sign of Pisces at its essence represents a deep sense of how we're all connected, and spirituality. Neptune's energy at its worst brings confusion and deception. Similarly, the sign of Aquarius fundamentally represents progress in a pragmatic/human rights sense, and technology. At its worst you have extreme detachment from fellow human beings and I think we're already seeing the beginnings of that, with people becoming increasingly isolated in their homes and communicating via computer. So I am by no means saying that in an all-encompassing way, the Age of Aquarius is objectively better, I am talking specifically about the spiritual realm.

What was once unquestionable (punishable by death to discuss) regarding for instance the origins of the Catholic Church and Martin Luther's translations from ancient Hebrew to Germanic (this is one example) are slowly being unravelled; this is the drizzle before the downpour.

The 3 Abrahamic faiths all idealize the martyr which is consistent with Piscean suffering/ideology. But one must also keep in mind,

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The 12th house in astrology is traditionally considered the most unfortunate house. While the 6th house name was called " the house of bad fortunes ", the 12th house being " the house of bad spirits ", most of things associated with the 12th are unpleasant : slavery , imprisonment, self-undoings, institutions, despair, sadness, sorrow, addiction, secret enemies, etc. Slavery was a lot more common in the past, but this is not to say it is no longer existing in today's world, although less likely. Human traficking and sex slaves are forms of slavery. Although, the more common expression of the 12th house is slavery to one's own desire. One can be a slave to alcohol, sex, drugs, etc, which lead to one own's demise. Venus was traditionally said to joy in this house along side with Saturn. Venus rules desire and while she bestows merriment, happiness, and joy in the 5th where she rules, those same things can actually become our own enemies if allowed excessively.

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posted April 25, 2012 07:20 PM            

I do have my doubts about our scientific progress being linear. There are some indications that early technologies (and I would entertain the idea of magic seriously as well) reflect an advanced "scientific" mind, i.e. grasp of what the natural world is and how is works, beyond what we have even now. Lost wisdom. For example, Damascus swords: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/11/061116-nanotech-swords.html

I don't know if those anomalies reflect Pisces attunement with the universe or what. In other words, if Pisces is psychic power AND deception...maybe both expressed themselves in extremes in the Piscean era.

I am future-minded and see the dissolution of religion as a positive; will we really make strides in humanitarianism? It's looking like a toss up so far. We have both war and acceptance- I see that. I like your observation about how isolation of individuals behind computers blends the good and bad of Aquarian energy.

And I wonder what the Age of Capricorn's going to look like? Any ideas? I have it in mind that the planet will be so wrecked after Aquarius, we go back to "earth"...and if we are progressing this way (backwards through the zodiac) I wonder that says about humanity in general and our purpose here.

It's a subject I haven't studied enough...hope that's not too obvious. But if you'd like to share your theories, I'm very curious.

posted April 25, 2012 08:16 PM            

This is a resource that I have found, I think the astrologer has done a good job summarizing the (known) effects of the previous ages: http://www.astrodynamics.net/Articles/Cycles/Age%20of%20Aquarius.htm. You bring up a good point re. humanitarianism in the coming age. If Lynn's speculation is right and humanity itself may be transformed that naturally leads to question of how. I myself envision a "Demolition Man" sort of world where reproduction is handled solely by way of science and sperm banks, lab-created wombs; the sex act itself is revolutionized and depersonalized, perhaps even sex with robots (already happening in Japan)? Perhaps something similar to the Jetsons where people are so isolated that they go to sleep, study, etc. in individual pods? It's a fascinating question. It's difficult to conceptualize from our current frame of reference. The other thing that could happen is that humanity significantly shrinks in size! And the revolution could be one of rejecting what man has known for millenia (the nuclear family, serial monogamy) in favour of something else altogether... perhaps communal living?

posted April 25, 2012 10:50 PM            

quote:

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The date for the end of the Piscean age is in much dispute. As earlier discussed, most would like the Ages to fit into a nice 2000 year package which would put us squarely in the beginning of the Aquarian age. However, astronomical calculations tell us that this is not true, and that the Aquarian age technically will not begin until approximately 2600 CE. Regardless, we are in the last decan of Pisces and moving away from the Pisces influence of sacrifice of the individual ego. As the Piscean mists begin to separate, the knowledge and understanding that Aquarius demands is beginning to make itself known.

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That threw me for a loop. Now I have to re-adjust my thinking, looking at us in the last decan of Pisces NOW.

Hmm. But it seems SO Aquarian...maybe we haven't seen anything yet!

I was talking to my 12 year-old son today. He said, "Robots will never have feelings." I said, "wait and see," and we started talking about stuff like synthetic DNA, artificial organs, using electrodes to map mental brain storms, all the ways that biology and technology are intermingling. So it's synchronistic for me, that you mentioned outright sex with robots.

I don't rule anything out for the future, at this point. Your Brave New World-type scenario of families being deconstructed and everything orchestrated from "above" seems plausible to me. There are little signs of that even now.

Are you familiar with the whole idea of The Singularity? Sorry if you already are, but in case anyone who doesn't is reading:

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Technological singularity refers to the hypothetical future emergence of greater-than-human intelligence through technological means.[1] Since the capabilities of such intelligence would be difficult for an unaided human mind to comprehend, the occurrence of a technological singularity is seen as an intellectual event horizon, beyond which events cannot be predicted or understood. Proponents of the singularity typically state that an "intelligence explosion"[2][3] is a key factor of the Singularity where superintelligences design successive generations of increasingly powerful minds.

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My hunch, however, is that technology is sort of like hobbling along on a crutch you don't need. Everything we think we are seeking through technology can be better obtained straightforwardly through nature.

Memory-enhancing plants instead of computers. True aphrodisiacs instead of psychiatric drugs. Ultra-pure water as a medicine. That kind of thing.

But as the earth gets more and more polluted, its vital force is depleted, and plant life can no longer provide that kind of sustenance. And as the rain forests, lungs of the earth, are chopped down, the oxygen level in the air falls, and the brain is not fed as well as it used to be.

So...it's like we are simultaneously creating big problems (pollution, population explosion, people drugged out on Piscean TV myths, with oxygen-starved brains) and big solutions (whatever technology is serving up.)

It's hard for me to imagine things improving overall, no matter the age.

The Biblical concept of "the remnant," of a certain number of people who will remain sane through all upheavals, appeals to me. I think there are corollaries for that notion in other religions; at any rate, I do believe we have enlightened souls alive today, and they transcend time issues.

I like what you said about how the Cap Era might cling to the Aquarian Era before it...a nice puzzle. What would that be like?

All things considered, I do best when I just try and be centered and sane, while taking the "pulse" of the culture around me, (and watching what the solar system's doing, of course!) then just hang on for the ride.

posted April 26, 2012 10:33 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
That threw me for a loop. Now I have to re-adjust my thinking, looking at us in the last decan of Pisces NOW.

Hmm. But it seems SO Aquarian...maybe we haven't seen anything yet!

I was talking to my 12 year-old son today. He said, "Robots will never have feelings." I said, "wait and see," and we started talking about stuff like synthetic DNA, artificial organs, using electrodes to map mental brain storms, all the ways that biology and technology are intermingling. So it's synchronistic for me, that you mentioned outright sex with robots.

I don't rule anything out for the future, at this point. Your Brave New World-type scenario of families being deconstructed and everything orchestrated from "above" seems plausible to me. There are little signs of that even now.

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Well personally I subscribe to the "orb of influence" theory and I believe that the age of Pisces is cusping now and this is the "dawning," for lack of a more creative term.

quote:

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Memory-enhancing plants instead of computers. True aphrodisiacs instead of psychiatric drugs. Ultra-pure water as a medicine. That kind of thing.

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^I agree with all of this. I think an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. But personally though I do not have a lot of earth to ground me and I admit that I myself would probably be too inclined to rely on a "longevity pill" in the future instead of naturopathic medicine and eating the proper foods. Did you know that chili peppers alone account for the low incidence in cancer rates in Mexico and India? There is a chemical contained in it called capsaicin which causes cancer cells to literally switch off and die. This type of intuitive knowledge... is being lost in the developed world.

quote:

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Technological singularity refers to the hypothetical future emergence of greater-than-human intelligence through technological means.[1] Since the capabilities of such intelligence would be difficult for an unaided human mind to comprehend, the occurrence of a technological singularity is seen as an intellectual event horizon, beyond which events cannot be predicted or understood. Proponents of the singularity typically state that an "intelligence explosion"[2][3] is a key factor of the Singularity where superintelligences design successive generations of increasingly powerful minds.

---

Now this is really something for me to ponder. What does this entail? Are they talking about literally fusing humans and machine/robots together or is this like lab-designed "superbabies," with superhuman intelligence, a sort of condoned eugenics? Like they come right out of the womb like that? "...where superintelligences design successive generations of increasingly powerful minds." Are they talking about human life designed by or with the AID of robots? This is all too much for me to even comprehend. No, I hadn't heard of Singularity... Very interesting!!

posted April 26, 2012 02:20 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:
The major faiths that exist today (including the 3 Abrahamic faiths) all became established during the Age of Pisces, which is synonymous with confusion/deception. In short, they are a lie. Fortunately, the Age of Aquarius will resolve this.

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Resolution: The knowledge that anything powerful be it religion or science that is used in the wrong hands has disastrous consequences.

Religion of some sorts has always and will always be in man.

You remember that virgo is the shadow of the piscean age. All religious/spiritual thought has been or will be dissected, analyzed, and hopefully put back together so the machinery can work again. We should know what is good and bad by now.

You are attacking the wrong thing. The people that do crazy things no matter what they use as excuse is what you can focus on and gain significant ground with others. (you know bombs,murdering etc etc. Things that are already common sense but people ignore them.)

Too Long, Didn't Read Version:

Weak People Do Weak Sh*t, Old school knowledge. No pride in that lions mane.

posted April 30, 2012 06:44 AM            

It's how some people go about being religious that is bad.

I don't feel that it's fair to lump all Christians/Muslims/Jews/etc. into one category. Even within the same 'umbrella' religion, there are denominations. Christianity has so many different denominations that I don't even remember offhand how many there are, and they're always adding new ones. Judaism has Orthodox, Conservative, Reform, and a few others. Muslim, Sunni, Shia, Sufis. Not every person of faith is the same, even if they come from the same 'tent'. People are individuals, even though they are members of groups.

I also think, too, that neither side can prove their case. Religious people can't prove that there is a God beyond any doubt. Anti-religious people likewise cannot prove definitively that there is no God. The argument can only end in a stalemate: if this was a court decision, I would say it ends in a mistrial. Thus, within reason, I say people should do their thing and let the other side do their thing, as long as it doesn't go to extremes (such as people committing acts of violence or oppression).

I believe in a separation of church and state: both get to co-exist, not just one or the other.

And, too, if anti-religious people/atheists want their views respected, it's only fair, then, that they at least respect religious people. That's not to say that they should have to share religious views or agree with them, just that they should be courteous. And the same goes for religious people: you want respect, you give it. Both sides should really kind of can it with the vitriolic rhetoric.

It seems so pointless to me that both sides just fight each other so much when it leads nowhere. It would make a lot more sense to stop bickering over beliefs and work together for the common good, regardless of whether or not you have the same spiritual views. Build homes for Habitat for Humanity together, for example. Feed the hungry together. Raise money for victims of natural disasters together. Find out what you have in common and build on that instead of having stupid arguments that have no purpose. I don't understand why people are so focused on figuring out "the truth" (if there even is one single right set of answers in life, which I doubt more and more as I get older) when no one can prove it satisfactorily anyway. Honestly, I feel that people should just kind of stop yapping about their differences and wasting so much time and should instead just do the work that needs to be done in the world: for people of faith, this meets both a spiritual and moral obligation; for people not of faith, an ethical one.

posted April 30, 2012 07:27 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by RegardesPlatero:

And, too, if anti-religious people/atheists want their views respected, it's only fair, then, that they at least respect religious people. That's not to say that they should have to share religious views or agree with them, just that they should be courteous. And the same goes for religious people: you want respect, you give it. Both sides should really kind of can it with the vitriolic rhetoric.

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quote:

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Honestly, I feel that people should just kind of stop yapping about their differences and wasting so much time and should instead just do the work that needs to be done in the world: for people of faith, this meets both a spiritual and moral obligation; for people not of faith, an ethical one.

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Well said, again.

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I personally know plenty of spiritual people who have master's degrees and doctorates. Some have several.

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Ditto. I've known outright geniuses who are also fundamentalist Christians. I cannot overstate how smart these people are.

A.J. Jacobs' book The Year of Living Biblically does an excellent job deflating the myth that religious people are stupid. In fact, he's saying some of them are so smart and so persuasive, they catch people off guard, and can turn the other person's confusion into a conversion.

And I have seen that happen as well.

posted April 30, 2012 07:32 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:

Now this is really something for me to ponder. What does this entail? Are they talking about literally fusing humans and machine/robots together or is this like lab-designed "superbabies," with superhuman intelligence, a sort of condoned eugenics? Like they come right out of the womb like that? "...where superintelligences design successive generations of increasingly powerful minds." Are they talking about human life designed by or with the AID of robots? This is all too much for me to even comprehend. No, I hadn't heard of Singularity... Very interesting!!

All of it almost makes me HOPE that reincarnation is real, so that in one sense, I can be around to witness it all!

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Aquacheeka, I have no idea...I think the Singularity is the break-over point, beyond which we cannot fathom what will happen. Of course, it's all just theoretical and may never come to that at all.

I wouldn't be surprised if people started getting their brains outfitted with microchips or some kind of computer gadgetry to enhance function. It seems we aren't far from that.

I just hope that whatever intelligence is gleaned with this "enhancements" guides the people toward peace and preserving the earth.

Actually, if it doesn't, I wouldn't even call it "intelligence."

posted April 30, 2012 08:25 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
Aquacheeka, I have no idea...I think the Singularity is the break-over point, beyond which we cannot fathom what will happen. Of course, it's all just theoretical and may never come to that at all.

I wouldn't be surprised if people started getting their brains outfitted with microchips or some kind of computer gadgetry to enhance function. It seems we aren't far from that.

I just hope that whatever intelligence is gleaned with this "enhancements" guides the people toward peace and preserving the earth.

Actually, if it doesn't, I wouldn't even call it "intelligence."

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This might sound really dumb, but this made me think of something that I was thinking about the other day. It's tangential from the original subject, but related to your post.

I've wondered from time to time if humans will simply become obsolete and 'outdated'.

I mean, I already see it in grocery stores, with automatic scanners that take the place of cashiers and baggers. They need people to run the machines of course, but eventually, I could see that job becoming a thing of the past.

When I think about this, I wonder if eventually more and more jobs will become that way. If fewer and fewer people are actually needed for anything, I wonder if there will be any reason for people to exist, eventually. After all, knowing human nature, if it can be done cheaper by a corporation, it will be. If corners can be cut for profit, they will be. It doesn't seem out of the realm of possibility that someday in the future, more and more jobs will be done by robots or machines.

Several sci-fi shows have already addressed this, come to think of it. It showed up in the episode of the original Twilight Zone entitled "The Brain Center at Whipple's" and then in another episode whose title escapes me in which a family has robot servants. Actually, come of think of it, there was another episode called "Number 13 Looks Just Like You" (or something similar to that), in which people, at a certain age, were given this makeover, and they picked from a few 'acceptable' models. After being changed, they lost what had made them unique and essentially they all became clones of each other. There's another episode, too, called "Eye of the Beholder", in which people deemed "ugly" are segregated and kept away from "normal" people, and another called "The Obsolete Man" (in my opinion, one of the best episodes of the entire series) that explored what it would be like if everyone was required to think the same way, if religion was outlawed (as the entity called "the State" had declared that there was no God), and if people deemed "obsolete" were executed. That show definitely had an anti-statist/anti-totalitarianism bent to it.

The newer "Outer Limits" also had some episodes on this topic, two that I've seen: one in which babies are genetically enhanced, and another in which a human father buys a robot and eventually the robot takes his place. The one about genetic enhancement was particularly hard-hitting because competition in the human race had become so fierce that people HAD to do it to even have a chance in life, yet there was a terrible possible side effect. The side effect was that the child could develop this disorder that essentially turned it into a homicidal monster, one that would be hunted and killed to protect society due to its violent nature and the fact that rehabilitation was not possible. I won't spoil the ending, but it really made me think about why it could be very dangerous to go about genetic enhancement: like any other medical procedure, there would definitely be risks.

posted April 30, 2012 09:39 AM            

Talk the boss into adding video embed so people can post examples easily. Most have features letting you show the exact piece you want to show now.

**

posted April 30, 2012 11:53 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Regardes Platero:
It seems so pointless to me that both sides just fight each other so much when it leads nowhere. It would make a lot more sense to stop bickering over beliefs and work together for the common good, regardless of whether or not you have the same spiritual views. Build homes for Habitat for Humanity together, for example. Feed the hungry together.

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An interesting observation I have made is that the religious are more likely to serve in Virgoan or Piscean fashion (building homes for the poor), while atheists are more likely to serve in an Aquarian fashion (wants the system to be fundamentally and structurally altered so that the poor are housed by the system). Atheist countries like Denmark are extremely socialist and have very egalitarian income distribution.

posted April 30, 2012 11:58 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by RegardesPlatero:
[b]Lastly, I have to disagree strongly that religious people are automatically stupid.[/b

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posted April 30, 2012 01:09 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:
It's always sort of baffled me how the religious right absolutely abhors the idea of sharing their money/food/healthcare through taxes. What happened to feeding the poor? You think the only way to do that is volunteering at a food bank?

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Agreed. The truth is they don't care about the poor, they don't care about anyone but themselves. People serve as a platform for them to further exploit.

It all just goes to show the differences between the types of people these "religious right" actually are and the false image they project to the world. They're basically just out for themselves. They're pretty much Barbarians except Barbarians aren't ashamed to admit they don't give a d$mn about anyone else. It's quite a paradox really and sickening. I'm just waiting until these things known as religions are poof gone! It's time for people to take ownership for their actions and not hide from their true motivations. Religious affiliations will no longer act as a shield for people behaving badly and dividing the masses.

posted May 01, 2012 04:33 AM            

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:

(Looks around confused) Not sure who you're talking to. Where on this thread is that stated? Methinks I am hearing a little projection or defensiveness .

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posted May 01, 2012 04:38 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by NativelyJoan:
Agreed. The truth is they don't care about the poor, they don't care about anyone but themselves. People serve as a platform for them to further exploit.

It all just goes to show the differences between the types of people these "religious right" actually are and the false image they project to the world. They're basically just out for themselves. They're pretty much Barbarians except Barbarians aren't ashamed to admit they don't give a d$mn about anyone else. It's quite a paradox really and sickening. I'm just waiting until these things known as religions are poof gone! It's time for people to take ownership for their actions and not hide from their true motivations. Religious affiliations will no longer act as a shield for people behaving badly and dividing the masses.

Btw, Aqua, I think your parallels between Aquarius and secularism are spot on.

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--It's why I wish that the religious left was more vocal and had more of a presence, as opposed to hiding out on the 'backstreets' of religious groups.

And yes, there IS a religious left. We're just not as loud and in-your-face as the religious right, but we do exist.

posted May 01, 2012 09:58 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by NativelyJoan:
Agreed. The truth is they don't care about the poor, they don't care about anyone but themselves. People serve as a platform for them to further exploit.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_behavior

Human behavior refers to the range of behaviors exhibited by humans and which are influenced by culture, attitudes, emotions, values, ethics, authority, rapport, hypnosis, persuasion, coercion and/or genetics.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pecking_order

The basic concept behind the establishment of the pecking order among, for example, chickens, is that it is necessary to determine who is the 'top chicken,' the 'bottom chicken' and where all the rest fit in between. The establishment of the dominance hierarchy is believed to reduce the incidence of intense conflicts that incur a greater expenditure of energy. The dominance level determines which individual gets preferential access to resources such as food and mates.

(Dominant people will flock to whatever has power, Pecking orders arise naturally out of the human beast. The need for alpha is strong, anyone not on top of the pile feels exploited by the one who is. Ages Old.)

Example:

"There is a strange pecking order among actors. Theater actors look down on film actors, who look down on TV actors. Thank God for reality shows, or we wouldn't have anybody to look down on."

-George Clooney

http://www.ccsf.edu/Resources/Tolerance/sfor/look01.html

"In these days a lot of people talk about tolerance and equal rights. The fact is that most people look down on each other because of their occupation, education, appearance, religion, culture, gender, sexual orientation, color of one's skin and a lot more. There's discrimination, suppression and racism all over the world. I think a lot of misunderstanding rises up because of prejudice, not knowing other cultures, religions and maybe many people are afraid of that and so they act in a hostile manner."

-Michaela Horak

posted May 01, 2012 10:01 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by NativelyJoan:
Agreed. The truth is they don't care about the poor, they don't care about anyone but themselves. People serve as a platform for them to further exploit.

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posted May 01, 2012 10:09 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by RegardesPlatero:

I've wondered from time to time if humans will simply become obsolete and 'outdated'.

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Interesting thought- it does seem like technology is taking on a life of its own. And technology is what's altering the shape and condition of the planet more than the people themselves.

Thank you for the sci-fi examples. None of them were tangential, since we are talking about the future and so are they

The military is also making robots that a soldier can step inside of, that will enable the soldier to have superhuman strength.
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=2184377