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Author Topic:   Declinations
TheMusician00
Newflake

Posts: 22
From: Seattle, WA
Registered: Aug 2017

posted October 20, 2017 03:47 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for TheMusician00     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
How exactly do declinations function when the two planets are parallel with differing energies or contraparallel with similar energies? For example say Venus in Cancer parallel Mars in Sagittarius. Let's say they're quincunx as well.

From what I understand, parallels function like low energy conjunctions, but conjunctions normally happen between similar energies from an astrological perspective. How would we describe this blend between two different planetary energies in signs with different receptivities, modalities, and elements?

Or, how could we describe Mercury in Aquarius contraparallel Uranus in Aquarius? In that case, both the sign and planetary energies would blend nicely, but they're now contraparallel? Do these effects just cancel out?

Additionally, if we liken parallel and contraparallel to conjunct and opposite, why do we not have latitudinal trines, sextiles and inconjunctions. It feels tedious at that point, but isn't astrology inconsistent and incomplete if we don't?

I'm editing as I think of questions, but if parallels function to blend the energies of two planets, will those two planets take on the qualities of the individual planetary aspects affecting them simultaneously?

Using the first example, what happens if my Mercury is in Virgo and sextiles my Venus in Cancer which parallels my Mars in Sagittarius? Assume that Mercury is at 10 degrees N while Venus and Mars are at 15 degrees N. Does the sextile energy flood through to Mars in Sagittarius, using the parallel as a conduit? (By the way, in this situation, Mars and Mercury would be square as well.) Does that sextile flooding counteract the square? Even if it doesn't and there is no flooding, the Mars square Mercury sextile Venus quincunx Mars triangle would still create a 3 dimensional configuration, so why don't we consider it as such?

This is where it makes me wonder why we don't have smaller geometric aspects for declinations. We have configurations for three planets in aspect with each other longitudinally. We have established that latitude is important as well in declinations. But, we consider latitudinal and longitudinal aspects independently of each other. Something tells me that we're not evaluating these aspects precisely when we consider the two separately and fail to see these connections in three dimensions. Thoughts?

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Kannon McAfee
Moderator

Posts: 2859
From: Portland, OR - USA
Registered: Oct 2011

posted October 20, 2017 02:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kannon McAfee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by TheMusician00:
How exactly do declinations function when the two planets are parallel with differing energies or contraparallel with similar energies? For example say Venus in Cancer parallel Mars in Sagittarius. Let's say they're quincunx as well.

Venus in Cancer cannot be parallel Mars in Sagittarius. So I assume you mean contra-parallel. This is a relational dynamic of beauty/action objectifying, perhaps idealizing. There will be an alternating dynamic between vulnerability and sentiment (Venus/Cancer) and idealistic action (Mars/Sag). If they are also quincunx, this is a particularly important learning dynamic in which it is important for the native to often take a step back each time there is awareness of this dynamic kicking in -- before the point of consequential decisions/actions are made. A balance needs to be found between that soft, vulernability found in what is very personal -and- decisive, free action based on idealism or the optimism there is something bigger, better .... This aspect could appeal to one's heroic fantasy in order to get love and affection, when in fact it may first be much better to clearly acknowledge feelings and values, not allowing instinctual actions to overcome them.

quote:

From what I understand, parallels function like low energy conjunctions, but conjunctions normally happen between similar energies from an astrological perspective.

Parallels, especially when tight, can be just as strong as some conjunctions -- but yes, they do have the same dynamic of blending the two energies. Conjunctions can take place between any two planets/bodies, even if they are not similar, such as Mars-Saturn, Jupiter-Saturn, Moon-Pluto, Venus-Pluto, etc.

quote:

Or, how could we describe Mercury in Aquarius contraparallel Uranus in Aquarius?

That cannot happen. Two planets in Aquarius could be parallel, but not contra-parallel. The ecliptic and all planets moving through Aquarius are in the range of medium southern declination.

quote:

Additionally, if we liken parallel and contraparallel to conjunct and opposite, why do we not have latitudinal trines, sextiles and inconjunctions. It feels tedious at that point, but isn't astrology inconsistent and incomplete if we don't?

Not in my view. Latitude varies very little and does not create a celestial second axis with longitude. Declination, the north-south axis, does.

quote:

I'm editing as I think of questions, but if parallels function to blend the energies of two planets, will those two planets take on the qualities of the individual planetary aspects affecting them simultaneously? ]

Yes.

quote:

Using the first example, what happens if my Mercury is in Virgo and sextiles my Venus in Cancer which parallels my Mars in Sagittarius? Assume that Mercury is at 10 degrees N while Venus and Mars are at 15 degrees N. Does the sextile energy flood through to Mars in Sagittarius, using the parallel as a conduit?

This question seems to assume the energy dynamic is pre-prescribed. It is not. It is up to you how to act upon these energies and direct them. But generally, it is the more inner personal planets, starting with luminaries and those closest to them that initiate the energetic exchange. Then the planets further out come into play to direct those energies outward. The further out, the more they urge real inner/outer development that cannot be ignored.

quote:

(By the way, in this situation, Mars and Mercury would be square as well.) Does that sextile flooding counteract the square?

I think a better way to think of it is counter-balancing. So aspects don't cancel or neutralize others. They all are active, but will rise in prominence or expression generally at different times.

Mercury sextile Venus is an aspect that stretches out the mental reach of thinking/communicating in a diplomatic/artful way. Mercury's square to Mars urges the communication portion of this dynamic so that it cannot be overlooked for silent diplomacy (or people-pleasing). This urges constant waking thought and reaction. Think of Venus as there for support towards the values in using this.

quote:

This is where it makes me wonder why we don't have smaller geometric aspects for declinations.

There is. We do, and I'm one of just a few astrologers actively using them. Check out Fred Bickum's freeware Declinations Aspect Calculator that calculates minor aspects in declination: http://sbastro.com/software.htm
Scroll to bottom of the page for description and download.

quote:

We have configurations for three planets in aspect with each other longitudinally. We have established that latitude is important as well in declinations. But, we consider latitudinal and longitudinal aspects independently of each other. Something tells me that we're not evaluating these aspects precisely when we consider the two separately and fail to see these connections in three dimensions. Thoughts?

Latitude has not been established as important as declinations. Reason, above.

To determine the position of any stellar body you need an x-axis and a y-axis. Longitude/zodiac is one axis. Declination is the second, measuring north/south of the celestial equator.

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The Declinations Guy-Expert birth chart rectification
Clickable Rising Signs

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TheMusician00
Newflake

Posts: 22
From: Seattle, WA
Registered: Aug 2017

posted October 20, 2017 05:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for TheMusician00     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm confused because latitude is how I'm referring to declinations. Aren't they the same thing? Latitude refers to something's position North/South of an equator. I'm using latitude to refer to a planet being North or South of the celestial equator.

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Kannon McAfee
Moderator

Posts: 2859
From: Portland, OR - USA
Registered: Oct 2011

posted October 21, 2017 02:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kannon McAfee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by TheMusician00:
I'm confused because latitude is how I'm referring to declinations. Aren't they the same thing?

No.

quote:

Latitude refers to something's position North/South of an equator. I'm using latitude to refer to a planet being North or South of the celestial equator.

Declination is the correct term. It is clearer, I guess, to leave out use of 'longitude' when zodiac position is meant so that geographic and celestial coordinate measures are not conflated. I apologize if I have contributed to any confusion.

Notice here that Latitude is listed separately from Declination. Notice that no latitude is given for the calculated positions (houses cusps) in the right side column.

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The Declinations Guy - Expert birth chart rectification
Clickable Rising Signs>

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TheMusician00
Newflake

Posts: 22
From: Seattle, WA
Registered: Aug 2017

posted October 22, 2017 07:14 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for TheMusician00     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
So then, with correct terminology, let me reexplain myself.

My main question is, why do we not consider configurations and aspects in three dimensions. For example, Sun in Pisces contraparallel and trine Mars in Cancer contraparallel and opposite Moon in Capricorn which is sextile and parallel the Sun?

It seems odd that we interpret grand crosses, t-squares, and grand trines, but declinations aren't included in that interpretation. Two parallel planets in a t-square would change how it's expressed entirely.

Does this question make more sense now?

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Kannon McAfee
Moderator

Posts: 2859
From: Portland, OR - USA
Registered: Oct 2011

posted October 22, 2017 06:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kannon McAfee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by TheMusician00:
So then, with correct terminology, let me reexplain myself.

My main question is, why do we not consider configurations and aspects in three dimensions. For example, Sun in Pisces contraparallel and trine Mars in Cancer contraparallel and opposite Moon in Capricorn which is sextile and parallel the Sun?


I do. But that is in my private readings for individuals once I am able to properly study the whole chart.

What you're talking about is synthesis. That is something that develops over time. Most people coming into this Astrology 2.0 sub-forum ask questions about particulars -- particular planet/sign combinations, Ascendants, Midheavens, etc. I also spend a fair amount of time just trying to dispel errant thinking from pop astrology and reframe it with free will in mind.

But you're right, there is an overall better synthesized approach to interpretation that is missed when declinations aren't include or are not integrated with the feature of the flat wheel chart.

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The Declinations Guy - Expert birth chart rectification
Clickable Rising Signs>

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