Lindaland
  Lindaland Central 2.0
  Do you ever worry that...

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq

UBBFriend: Email This Page to Someone! next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Do you ever worry that...
wheels of cheese
Knowflake

Posts: 71
From:
Registered: May 2009

posted May 21, 2009 07:45 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for wheels of cheese     Edit/Delete Message
you'll become so enlightened that the Universe will just pluck you from this mortal coil because your work here is done?

Not that this is going to happen to me anytime soon

But seriously, whenever I think of the phrase "Only the good die young" is this because they "got it" and then therefore there they were better off doing their work somewhere else?

And sometimes, without sounding up my own @rse, the understanding of myself that I have achieved over the last couple of years, sometimes I think "Whoah" because I'm scared if I "get it" too much then I'll die.

Is this a really boring subject? I can hardly tell. (NB: I leave it to to other people to start threads sometimes and this is lame)

IP: Logged

PeaceAngel
Moderator

Posts: 438
From: peace.angel@live.com.au
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 21, 2009 08:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for PeaceAngel     Edit/Delete Message
I don't really believe that only the good die young. People tend to say things because they think it's the right thing to say socially or whatever, and people are quick to jump on the bandwagon.

If you look at the people that have died young, many of them have lived excessive lives and lifestyles. It's not like they're saints.

Of course, children die, but that is just tragic, in my eyes - the saddest thing.

I think people fear speaking ill of the dead, and that's not an honest thing. If someone acted like an arsehole in life, that doesn't change in their death.

I also don't think that it's possible to ever be enlightened anyway. The universe is ever expanding and evolving. So there is something more to always aspire to or to grow into. I think humanity is far from evolved, as a whole, but also our idea of it would be quite limited to how huge the universe really is.

IP: Logged

eve
Knowflake

Posts: 78
From: jane
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 21, 2009 03:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for eve     Edit/Delete Message
Hi wheels. I love boring convos.

quote:
you'll become so enlightened that the Universe will just pluck you from this mortal coil because your work here is done?

Maybe it's your Gemini Moon that inclines you to see achieving a state of enlightenment as your work here. But that state may just be the beginning of your work! Trying to get out of the toil, huh? How cardinal of you, you Libra sun , to see the start as the end. So wham, bam, I-think-therefore-I-am, thank you ma'am of you.

Maybe the best living doesn't even start until that state, and instead of signalling the end, it signals the beginning of a higher way of living.

I've wondered similar things myself, except about our own individual purpose (not enlightenment in general). I wondered if enlightenment about ourselves could mean our end. If we figure out what we're meant to learn, break past our issues, are we done? Was that our purpose in this incarnation and now we bite it? I don't think so, though. I think it's the same as what I said above about enlightenment, that we're meant to live from that new state, not just meet and greet it. And from that state, more growth and transformations may occur.

quote:
sometimes I think "Whoah" because I'm scared if I "get it" too much then I'll die.

I think those fears of death point to how transformation is death and rebirth. Your new understanding may have killed off the old way you experienced life and created a new way.

IP: Logged

MyVirgoMask
Knowflake

Posts: 378
From:
Registered: May 2009

posted May 21, 2009 03:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyVirgoMask     Edit/Delete Message
Wheels, I've been thinking the same thing for a year now since I've gone through all this transformation. I have moments of 'Am I getting so much inner growth since I'm going to DIE now?' lol.
And then another voice comes in and argues and says, 'The old self is done, so in a way you've already died.'
'No, I'm talking about physical death.'
'Yeah, you'll die like everyone else at some point.'
'But...'

This goes on for HOURS

I do agree with Eve that it's definitely a theme which goes hand in hand with re-birth and transformation. None of this stuff really became an issue until I began shedding old skin and walking away feeling like a new person altogether (after a long process of 'gestation')
And it's kind of funny because there's something that feels innocent about this line of questioning when I begin it in my own head. Maybe it's a side-effect of being reborn in some way, into this child-like state.

IP: Logged

blue moon
Knowflake

Posts: 201
From: U.K
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 21, 2009 04:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for blue moon     Edit/Delete Message
I drove past the corner of my street today to see bouquets of flowers and clusters of crying teenagers hanging around. A couple of nights ago a kid changing gears at high speed went out of control and mounted the pavement. Killed their friend.

Walk along a street wrong place, wrong time, it might be you. Or would it be part of a higher plan that we can't possibly understand, slotted into place at the moment of your maximum enlightenment?

Who knows? I don't.

But what I do know is that there are classic lines of thought people use to make unpleasantries (they struggle to cope with) seem O.K. If, like me, you are something of a tragic figure, you will develop a hawklike radar in this regard. There is something in the 'work is done' theory that is striving to make the unpalatable more digestible.

Do I ever worry that.....?

No.

There's deep-thinking, and there's wasting some of the valuable time I have left however long or short.

IP: Logged

cpn_edgar_winner
Knowflake

Posts: 319
From: Toledo, OH
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 21, 2009 04:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cpn_edgar_winner     Edit/Delete Message
blue moon-

there really is no making that ok, or trying to come with grips in your head of why.

that poor childs parents.

believe it or not when the kids and thier boyfriends, girlfriends, talk to me about stuff, sometimes they say stuff like, your the one we all run to to make things make sense, or "everybody comes to you becasue they know you will point us in the right direction" (sometimes i feel like my growth and the things that didnt makes sense to me that have happened in my life, make me the unshockable supportive person these young adults turn to when they are having thier "times") maybe it isless about my enlightenment and more about mypurpose.

i don't know.

tragic things don't make much sense. they never will.

everytime i think i am getting enlightened, its one step up, two steps back, like a dance. i purpose things in my heart, and then find i have a hard time living up to what i know is right. but i keep on trying. keep on practicing.

and yet, when i look at myself say 10 years ago, i know i have made big strides, one baby step at a time.

i think when we percieve ourselves as "enlightened" or "there" we look at others in judgeing way, and can go back to square one, when we first learned not to stand in judgement of others.

life is a beautiful thing and a wonderful gift.

but some things will never makes sense. i have known much tragedy in my life, and certain things will never ever make sense. like that child mowed down, his parents will NEVER be the same.

we can not take what we have for granted as it is what it is called, the "present".

without the darkness, we don't know light.

sometimes when i think i might be gone soon, i also think, the kids need me more than ever, to talk to , to guide them, so i have to hope and pray for thier sake that i will be able to be there in the flesh to help them when they need me to.

i used to think i would be happy when a certain person that hurt me and my little brother much when i was a child was dead. he dies last week. i was AMAZED that i didn't feel what i thought i would. i heard about how terribly he was abused as a child and i heard how tormented his spirit was in the last days of his death, and i just felt sad at it all. it actually surprised me.

life is a funny thing and fragile, more than we know. sorry to ramble.


IP: Logged

Cheshire Kat
Knowflake

Posts: 124
From: Wonderland
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 21, 2009 05:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Cheshire Kat     Edit/Delete Message
Not really, if my end comes when I am seventeen or when I am sixty, it really does not make difference to me, it was just my time to go until then I accept that death is inevitable and do what I can on Earth in my physical being..while nurturing my spiritual being.

IP: Logged

katatonic
Knowflake

Posts: 397
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 21, 2009 05:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for katatonic     Edit/Delete Message
first, i think every one is "good" in some way. and second, i think plenty of people who die young do so because they are NOT getting it and don't listen to the warning bells. yet going hell for leather and using up your nine lives fast could be a great way of getting to the NEXT life sooner!

i am pretty sure that most people could live to be 900 like methuselah and still not "get it"! so i doubt you have anything to worry about on that count.

some kids do seem too wise and angelic for this earth, and some of them die young, but i agree that that phrase is for those left behind. or maybe it was invented to make someone feel better about being wicked!!

IP: Logged

Dervish
Knowflake

Posts: 38
From:
Registered: May 2009

posted May 21, 2009 10:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dervish     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
you'll become so enlightened that the Universe will just pluck you from this mortal coil because your work here is done?

No. But if it happened, the Universe will have some splainin' to do, because I don't answer to people, no matter how powerful, that way who just use & abuse me any way they see fit, no matter how good their intentions or how righteous they feel their goals are. Perhaps the universe can crush me, but if so, they'll be minus an enlightened worker, won't they (or It, whatever).

MY fear is that there IS a universal consciousness, and that it's insane.

quote:
But seriously, whenever I think of the phrase "Only the good die young" is this because they "got it" and then therefore there they were better off doing their work somewhere else?

I think overall that many people who are young start out as fairly idealistic, or at least haven't dirtied their hands too much. As they get older, people tend to make more and more compromises until they're "part of the problem" and have had to make too many decisions to survive that lead either to disillusionment or mad rationalization skills (and thus hypocrisy).

As much as we'd like to pretend otherwise, many people who live by the sword never die by it, just as many who live peaceful lives can be viciously bullied, tormented & tortured, raped, and killed. Nice people rarely get to succeed.

For example, the Stanley brothers made a steam driven car that was quite excellent, and could probably compete (with a little work) even in today's market. But they didn’t believe in advertisement (saw it as dishonest) or mass production (saw it as exploitative in more ways than one), so Henry Ford, who had no such moral qualms, not only surpassed them with ad campaigns & production, but also smeared his competition. The brothers wouldn't sink to his level and are now just a footnote in history while Ford changed America.

Politics, where power is even more extreme, attracts the most unscrupulous, and those with moral qualms are gonna get eaten alive.

The point being, those who are "wicked" are gonna be the ones to succeed, and the only place they'll look good is in their publicity campaigns and history books (that they get to write). Success forgives all crimes. And so they call the shots, and others below them either jump through the hoops, making endless compromises & rationalizations as they join in the march of corruption, or they (and their families) suffer their moral qualms (at least materialistically speaking), and may become quite bitter about it and/or how they're then treated by society that preaches one thing but practices something very different from what it preaches.

Those who die young miss that corruption and selling out. And those that live long enough almost always become either corrupt or forgettable. So I can understand the saying, and don't see it as anything to do with "death by enlightenment."

IIRC, the Ancient Greeks also said that the kindest fate the gods could give was to kill someone very fast & painlessly while they were still young (like say adolescent).

IP: Logged

Benedict Moon*
Knowflake

Posts: 71
From: formerly Dulce Luna
Registered: May 2009

posted May 22, 2009 12:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Benedict Moon*     Edit/Delete Message


Nope, and my opinion is based on the majority of young people I've known that have died: the ones who were completely oblivious to their mortality and lived as though they had nine lives.


Though if enlightenment is truly our goal...I guess it isn't time for me to go yet, huh? But what's the point of becoming so....if you're only gonna expire right after? I mean, that would suck. Wouldn't you want to live out what you've learned? Or is the world that craptastic that once your eyes are opened, you'll wanna cap off yourself? (mostly rhetorical)

IP: Logged

Deux*Antares
Knowflake

Posts: 89
From: No Permanent Address
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 22, 2009 02:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Deux*Antares     Edit/Delete Message
I believe that as you reach higher degrees of enlightenment you become less afraid of death. Most of us fear death because we think it is the END and that it is a BAD thing. It is impossible to be highly enlightened and fear death at the same time. (Note to Death: I suggest launching a major PR campaign to clean your image and please get a new mascot! ).

I used to be very afraid of dying, and that changed when I realized that it was only my EGO that was at the root of that feeling. It was so attached to the here and now, thinking that the here and now was the only experience available and that after this I become nothing. Who would want to become nothing? It was then I realized that my ego is not the totality of me, that my conscious mind know nothing at all, and that there is this greater/grander/bigger/better/higher part of me that understands all/itself/life/me/everything and knows that it is indestructible.

I am not saying I am an enlightened person (just a better version of myself maybe). All I'm saying is that I now have a different view of death.

I am not an expert on cultures and religions, but I believe that those two factors are what form the backbone of how we view and react to death and should therefore be examined. Merging science and spirituality helped me come to my new life/death philosophy.

As to good people dying young, I believe that is what they had signed up for before they came here. It is not like God/Universe/TheForce/Whatever cheated them, punished them or deprived them of something. I will cry if someone dies because it will make me sad that I will no longer be able to physically interact with that person. But I will be ok because the higher part of me knows that all relationships are eternal.

IP: Logged

Randall
Webmaster

Posts: 332
From: Columbus, GA USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 22, 2009 10:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message
Nah, there's always work to be done...and anyway, the Uni-verse can't take away my Free-will Tinker Toys when I want to play. There are no time-outs in this sandbox.

------------------
"Fortune favors the bold." Erasmus

IP: Logged

Benedict Moon*
Knowflake

Posts: 71
From: formerly Dulce Luna
Registered: May 2009

posted May 23, 2009 09:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Benedict Moon*     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
believe that as you reach higher degrees of enlightenment you become less afraid of death. Most of us fear death because we think it is the END and that it is a BAD thing. It is impossible to be highly enlightened and fear death at the same time. (Note to Death: I suggest launching a major PR campaign to clean your image and please get a new mascot! ).

(actually in response to your whole post) In Mozambique, funerals are more cheerful than weddings. Okay, that was partially a joke, but ppl notice thats they aren't as somber as in the West. It could be circumstancial though, but mostly I've noticed that death isn't worried about there even with alot of the social problems....people don't even care about aging as much as here (then again, biologically our true ages never show anyways ). Its totally different mindset.

IP: Logged

Coffee
Knowflake

Posts: 381
From: Leeds
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 23, 2009 04:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Coffee     Edit/Delete Message
Great post Dervish, even if a little revealing. Liked it.

quote:

you'll become so enlightened that the Universe will just pluck you from this mortal coil because your work here is done?


Damn, that mean I have more to do. What is it? Tell me at once!
quote:

But seriously, whenever I think of the phrase "Only the good die young" is this because they "got it" and then therefore there they were better off doing their work somewhere else?

Maybe. I guess some people are here to get to know themselves, others to fufil a wish, to find a partner, have ego massaged...whatever. I guess we choose a reason for coming here.
I doubt it is like you propose.

I pondered the idea at some point.
I also thougt that when we pass, we turn into stars in the night sky shining brightly.

IP: Logged

MyVirgoMask
Knowflake

Posts: 378
From:
Registered: May 2009

posted May 23, 2009 06:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyVirgoMask     Edit/Delete Message
That's interesting, Benedict... when I lived in New Orleans, I was lucky enough to see a couple of jazz funerals. Death, a celebration...it was one of the most wonderful things I'd seen.
First they play a somber tune (a full band in procession with the coffin) as they march through the streets to the cemetery. They keep playing this sad music until the coffin is lain down, and the moment it is, the band goes full tilt boogie into this really upbeat party-style music.
It's pretty incredible really.
By tradition they play this upbeat music to 'shake off' any possible dead spirits which might decide to follow them out of the cemetery.... but the effect is pretty amazing. It's like a celebration of sorts.
There's a whole lot of death and decay in that place, but it's always teeming with life as well.

IP: Logged

SunChild
Moderator

Posts: 157
From: Melbourne. Victoria. Australia
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 24, 2009 12:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SunChild     Edit/Delete Message
Randall

IP: Logged

pire
Knowflake

Posts: 72
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 25, 2009 06:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for pire     Edit/Delete Message
you'll be fine. u are a great person, and good things happen to good people.

there is a long time that i wanted to say that but never found the best way, because of all the complication in saying the most essential things but since you started this thread, let me tell you that i use you as a yardstick, an example.

you'll be fine. enjoy!

IP: Logged

pire
Knowflake

Posts: 72
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 25, 2009 06:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for pire     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
the understanding of myself that I have achieved over the last couple of years, sometimes I think "Whoah" because I'm scared if I "get it" too much then I'll die.

die is may be not the right word here.

words are not enough.

IP: Logged

Benedict Moon*
Knowflake

Posts: 71
From: formerly Dulce Luna
Registered: May 2009

posted May 25, 2009 03:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Benedict Moon*     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
That's interesting, Benedict... when I lived in New Orleans, I was lucky enough to see a couple of jazz funerals. Death, a celebration...it was one of the most wonderful things I'd seen.
First they play a somber tune (a full band in procession with the coffin) as they march through the streets to the cemetery. They keep playing this sad music until the coffin is lain down, and the moment it is, the band goes full tilt boogie into this really upbeat party-style music.
It's pretty incredible really.
By tradition they play this upbeat music to 'shake off' any possible dead spirits which might decide to follow them out of the cemetery.... but the effect is pretty amazing. It's like a celebration of sorts.
There's a whole lot of death and decay in that place, but it's always teeming with life as well.


Oh yeah, I know of someone who played trumpet for one of those funerals down there and he said it was a goosebump worthy experience...whatever that means. haha But yeah, I guess the comparision could be made to a Mozambican funeral, but I recall that Irish funerals are also pretty similar in terms of the mood too.

IP: Logged

katatonic
Knowflake

Posts: 397
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted May 25, 2009 03:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for katatonic     Edit/Delete Message
well the irish are great celebrators of the passing over...whether it's an excuse to get sozzled or a real celebration? i never figured out but wakes are usually great parties.

i think you are here for whatever reason you chose to be here, it's not cut-and-dried by some higher authority. and i think there are truly enlightened souls among us so i don't worry about "getting there" too fast!!

IP: Logged

All times are Eastern Standard Time

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | Linda-Goodman.com

Copyright © 2008

Powered by Infopop www.infopop.com © 2000
Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.46a