posted October 14, 2003 12:35 PM            

I went back to California last week for business and spent a day with an old friend. He has been a friend on my family (more specifically my younger brother) for almost 18 years. He is an Aqua with a Virgo moon.

We met in Irvine, near my old house in Laguna Hills. I hadn't been back to my old neighborhood since my grandmother died almost two years ago. "D", as I will call him, has always been a negative person, but we always attributed that to the fact that his mother has brain cancer and he lost his younger brother at the age of 16. It was emotional in that I was back in my old area and because he proceeded to lecture me on my failed marriage and why my ex and I had to still be friends. He put down my brother and his wife. He railed against my family for no reason at all. My family had always kept the door open for him and treated him as though he belonged to us even through the his hard times. I was appalled at his negativity and at the fact that here he was berating me and telling me he's been in love with me for over ten years at the same time. I told him I was involved (Mr. Leo) and he lit into me again. As it happened, we went to the bookstore and I gravitated to the astro section. He started to bash on that and I had finally had enough. I left. I walked away, got into my car and left him at the Spectrum to drive his own butt home. I didn't even care that we didn't see the movie, I just had to get away and never look back. It also didn't help that he kept trying to touch me and kiss me!

Speaking of back, now I am back in Maryland and there is another guy that I am no longer friends with. He and I have known each other for over 4 years. He is a Virgo with a Cancer moon and like me he has his Pluto conjuncting his Ascendent. At any rate, I know that he was trying to start a relationship with me, but I had already told him that 1) I am involved and 2) We would have to really get to know each other first. Although I had accepted him as a friend, I never accepted his bigoted behavior. We had many talks about it, but he would go from being somewhat nice, to blurting out racial slurs that just turned my stomach.

Finally, I had enough of that. When I had called to say hi while I was out of town, he was either drunk, angry or bragging about getting the racially biased boardgame that made fun of African Americans, Hispanics and Asians. I decided that there was no way to change this part of him. At 37 it will always be in his personality. So I told him that I couldn't continue our friendship with his racial bias and his drinking habits. Now, of course, he totally hates me.

In my heart I know that I didn't really lose much, but it still makes me blue. It is so sad to see the bitterness in people and how ignorance can cause them to hate on such profound levels. It did make me realize that I had a great family that was open to people and concepts and the friends that I have made that are open-minded mean all the more to me.

posted October 14, 2003 12:57 PM              

Just speaking from my own exerience and some of my GF's past experiences:

It is hard to be just friends with people who are romantically inclined toward you - most especially when you aren't feeling the same way back. Even if these friends were the nicest and most decent people you had ever met - if they felt the "spark" and you didn't - friendship is just tough.

posted October 14, 2003 01:07 PM            

Thanks for your response. I supposed it's the nature of male and female relationships. I have always had male friends and seem to get along with them so well (Could be my Sag Sun and Aries moon along with the rest of the fire).

posted October 14, 2003 01:39 PM            

That makes so much sense. I have been neglecting my "reading" and "meditation" times for almost a month now. Usually, I spend 3-4 nights a week doing Yoga and meditating, but this has been such a social 45 days that it really threw me off.

I can usually sense the phases and maybe I did see this coming. I don't feel has hurt though, because I know things change. It's funny that you pointed out that Pluto conjunct Ascendent can also be a catyst of change for others. I have often felt that I come in and out of so many peoples lives, almost like as a reminder to put them on a path. The same holds true for me. People come in to remind me of what I need to get done and where I need to go.

Losing these two friends made me see just how much I love those who are still in my life. I do feel so sorry for them, for their bitterness and for the ignorance of the racist. What he never realized was that since I am a mixture of American Indian, Spanish and German, his words affected me as well.

FishKitten,

posted October 14, 2003 02:18 PM              

I am sure there are many silent women readers who relate to your distress, myself included

The fact that you are true to yourself, regardless of what anybody thinks, is an admirable quality. Three cheers for the Archer Sun and Ramdass Moon

The answer to the title of this thread belongs entirely up to you.

posted October 15, 2003 04:41 AM              

letting people go will leave an empty space in your heart ... and open for new and better people to come!

With those kind of friends, you really did not lose much. You did say that you were already in a relationship? You did mention the things that were upsetting you? They did not listen? A true friendship consists of trust, loyalty, honesty and not "I have been in love for 10 years ..." (read: hidden motives). You set the terms and they did not like it? They can either leave the battle field or accept those terms. Being rude is beneath any comment. No reason to feel sad; in my eyes you did the right thing.

posted October 15, 2003 10:27 AM            

Aphrodite,

Thank you for your compliment. I think as I have gotten older I have found that the only way to be is up front and honest about when it comes to a relationship or the desire not to have one with another. It is totally unfair to take anothers time if I am not truly interested in them. I am trying, as hard as possible, to be true to myself and others. There is a part of me that wants to hold on because I hate to cause pain in another, but I know that would be worse in the end.

Lioneye,

You definetly have experienced the two sides of a Virgo. I am still best friends with my Virgo Ex and he was always very open to me traveling and spending time with my family. He wasn't too critical. The other Virgo is just crazy and so is Mr. Virgo Moon. Did you feel smothered by the negativity of your old friend? It's like a black cloud for me. I think it might be the fact that the current position of Neptune in sextile with my Moon is really making me more preceptive of others thoughts and feelings. I have noticed more than ever I will say something right before someone else regarding their feelings or I pick up on their emotions. It has been a while since I felt the dire need to run off from someone.

Zoka,

Yes, you are right, I am in a relationship and I am happy in it. We are moving to a more serious stage and he has been great in giving me my space. As Lioneye knows, I have a fear of commitment and have finally faced that fear. I am not sure if Mr. Leo will be the 'one' but I have learned to be more open and receptive to the love and all that goes with it, instead of over analyzing it and running away from it.

posted October 15, 2003 11:25 AM              

There really is a thing called negativity and it's just affecting you now, we all want to be good people but hey..call me the devil if that's the kind of friend I have to kiss up to! I'd rather have someone around with some sympathy, compassion, taste and restraint. If that's wrong then I don't want to be right. A liar is someone who lies with their entire life and lies to you. In any friendship or bed there is a promise made not to lie to that person. By being a hypocrite, showing your evil face to your friends and your good side to the world, you are going back on your promise to be a good friend, it's a lie. It's not in the nature of that kind of person to ever be truthful or honest.

If a person wants friendship and you hang around and act negative, then you are out of bounds, a liar and a hypocrite. Good bye "friend" A friend is either in or out.

I've said this before, if people like that are my friends, then where are my enemies? If that's being bad then I don't want to be "good".

We all have a right to live our lives in peace, with compassion, but have compassion for me, myself and I first, and then your friend.

A garden can only have so many weeds before they choke out the flowers.

I know a lot of Sags who put up with crap from their friends. Compassion only goes so far, there has to be respect too. I do know a happy Virgo/Sag couple but they both work really long hours away from eachother.

posted October 15, 2003 12:29 PM            

Yes, you are exactly right. Saturn is in my 10th house and is squaring my 7th house Aries moon, my 1st house Uranus in Libra and opposing Mercury in my 4th house.

Pluto is also conjuncting my Venus, but starting to move more towards my sun and into my 4th house. Major changes.

Yeah, I can see Saturn snipping up the loose ends. That was a great point. Thanks!!!

Natasha,

posted October 15, 2003 01:00 PM            

I've had my share of good-byes too...and I have to concur with those here who say it's part of our own evolution. Doesn't always make it easy though, does it? But I love the thought of "Reasons, Seasons, or Lifetimes" that someone posted here on LL, to illustrate the roles that some share in our lives.

pidaua, like you, I can not abide prejudice, and would find it impossible to have a maaningful relationship with one so bigoted.

posted October 15, 2003 01:48 PM            

I also loved what was posted about the Seasons, Reasons or Lifetimes. I think it may have been Juniperb that wrote it. I need to copy and paste it into my documents. It really is beautiful.

One of the things I do want to share is that when I left my goofy friend, I drove out to my old house in Laguna Hills. I hadn't been there since my mother and grandmother moved and since my grandmother had passed away.

When I drove into the neighborhood, I could almost feel my grandmother in the car with me. I remember her standing out in front of the house whenever I would drive up and she was always the busy little red hen. She knew all the neighbors and kids. My heart broke, but I could hear her voice telling me that it was time to move on.

A year ago I had a dream about that house. It was about a horse and the TV was playing a clip about things to come regarding Gray Davis (which turned out to be true). But the man / horse in the dream told me it was okay to hold on to the memories, that it was okay to remember, but to still move on. I had no plans to visit the house on that trip. I just needed to say goodbye to my old memories (but still keep them close to my heart). I have two cats and my favorite dog buried at that house. I celebrated many birthdays and Christmas days with my family there. My bro and I used to travel around and gather oranges, kumquats, guavas and raspberries from around the neighborhood and play football in the park.