Lindaland
  Astrology
  Does the chart tell you anything? (Page 1)

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

UBBFriend: Email This Page to Someone!
This topic is 2 pages long:   1  2 
next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Does the chart tell you anything?
Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 21, 2005 07:07 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
http://www.astro.com/cgi/showgif.cgi?lang=e&gif=achart_hj8filefh7bsr-u1104878950.86369.15725.gif&res=63&va=


what can you tell from this chart---i hope the link works...

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 22, 2005 01:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You have a pretty complex chart. I wish I could cut and paste this for you, but the program won't allow it. Yours is quite long due to your myriad of aspects.

I believe you will be quite successful in the end, but there will be quite a bit of change and quite a few trials to mold your mind into the eventual success it will be.

One part that stood out is:

quote:

Saturn Conjunct (uniting with) Neptune
Like it or not, you have some kind of social or spiritual obligation to fulfill. Until you have accepted this, discovered what it is, and begun to act upon it, you feel dogged by vague feelings of insecurity, or threats of material collapse. Indeed, ambitions or positions that you hold and that are doing nothing for the common welfare are doomed to eventual failure.

Behind all of this lies the fact that you do have the makings of the practical idealist.


This too:

quote:

Neptune Opposite (confronting) Jupiter
You yaw back and forth between high hopes and disappointments. And it will go on until you devise a philosophy of life, which takes human failing into account as a meaningful reality rather than as something to overlook or avoid altogether. You have a big, soft heart that can make dreams come true when tempered with some hard thinking.

quote:

Pluto Conjunct (uniting with) Venus
These pressures to transform and reach a deeper sense of involvement with life are hampered by your possibly unconscious desire to keep the peace and have a pleasant lifestyle. Ironically though, it is just these predelictions that draw you to someone who changes your life for you. The issue is really one of your being challenged to use your grace and charm to facilitate that transformation. There is something darkly, but beautifully compelling about you or anything that you have created. So rather than being afraid of what you might lose, concentrate on what you have to give.

quote:

Pluto Conjunct (uniting with) Ascendant and in the 12th House
That powerful feeling that you possibly feel is lurking somewhere in the depths of your being is actually quite noticeable on the outside. Bear in mind that others can be automatically moved and influenced by this. It is up to you whether this is in a provocative or beneficial way.

-from the Instant Astrologer.

You got some really interesting things going on, and I doubt your life will be dull.

IP: Logged

wilsontc
unregistered
posted November 22, 2005 01:55 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Christina,

Since you have more planets at the top of your chart than the bottom you live more in the outer world than in your inner world. Since you have more planets on the left than on the right you focus more on your self than on others. Since you have the most planets in the top left of your chart, you take things from the outer world and use them for yourself. You have focuses on the physical, transformation, friends, and spiritual.

You have an Easy Opposition focused on Pluto (transformation, also power) conjunct (energy is combined with) Venus (physical, also desires/relationships) so you have powerful desires in your relationships. You also have a T-square focused on Sun (self-expression) conjunct Mars (being, also action) conjunct Mercury (thinking/daily work), so you may strongly focused on actively expressing yourself through active, daily writing.

For a simplified approach to astrology see: http://www.geocities.com/wilsontctc

Telling,

Tim

IP: Logged

astro junkie
unregistered
posted November 23, 2005 02:16 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Christinaeavynwarner -

That image of your Chart expired.

Another thing you can do is -

>astro.com
>PORTRAIT
>Cut & Paste Tables at the bottom into your post here

------------------
... it's better to light a candle than curse the darkness

IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 23, 2005 05:29 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
AcousticGod--where did you find that? There's more? CAn you tell me the website. Is it free, though? I cna't...pay for anything. Giggles, thanks for the information, by the way. I loved it! Its pretty true too...I think.

Wilsontc--thanks! lol...I'll look up on that site. And its true too what you said.

And astro junkie..thanks! lol...well, here's the table/chart.

for Christina (female)
born on 23 Sep 1989 local time 10:39 am
in Elk Grove Village, IL (US) U.T. 15:39
87w58, 42n00 sid. time 09:56:59

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Planetary positions
planet sign degree house motion
Sun Libra 00°35'03 11 direct
Moon Cancer 19°46'15 08/9 direct
Moon is technically near the end of house 8 and is interpreted in house 9.
Mercury Libra 03°13'32 11 retrograde
Venus Scorpio 12°54'22 12 direct
Mars Libra 02°37'04 11 direct
Jupiter Cancer 08°53'53 08 direct
Saturn Capricorn 07°25'32 02 direct
Uranus Capricorn 01°24'57 02 direct
Neptune Capricorn 09°36'36 02 stationary (D)
Pluto Scorpio 13°25'39 12/1 direct
Pluto is technically near the end of house 12 and is interpreted in house 1.
True Node Aquarius 25°22'14 03/4 direct
True Node is technically near the end of house 3 and is interpreted in house 4.


House positions (Placidus)
Ascendant Scorpio 16°05'19
2nd House Sagittarius 15°44'12
3rd House Capricorn 20°30'36
Imum Coeli Aquarius 27°02'08
5th House Pisces 29°16'27
6th House Aries 25°10'02
Descendant Taurus 16°05'19
8th House Gemini 15°44'12
9th House Cancer 20°30'36
Medium Coeli Leo 27°02'08
11th House Virgo 29°16'27
12th House Libra 25°10'02

Major aspects
Sun Conjunction Mercury 2°38
Sun Conjunction Mars 2°02
Sun Square Saturn 6°50
Sun Square Uranus 0°50
Moon Trine Venus 6°52
Moon Trine Pluto 6°21
Moon Trine Ascendant 3°41
Mercury Conjunction Mars 0°36
Mercury Square Jupiter 5°40
Mercury Square Saturn 4°12
Mercury Square Uranus 1°49
Venus Trine Jupiter 4°00
Venus Sextile Saturn 5°29
Venus Sextile Neptune 3°18
Venus Conjunction Pluto 0°31
Venus Conjunction Ascendant 3°11
Mars Square Saturn 4°48
Mars Square Uranus 1°12
Jupiter Opposition Saturn 1°28
Jupiter Opposition Neptune 0°43
Jupiter Trine Pluto 4°32
Saturn Conjunction Neptune 2°11
Neptune Sextile Pluto 3°49
Pluto Conjunction Ascendant 2°40
Numbers indicate orb (deviation from the exact aspect angle).


IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 23, 2005 05:42 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
AG--reading over what you had...do you think thats a bad thing? It all sound so very complicated now. I love it! lol..I'll be thinking about what you and w. wrote all day! But, what do you guys think about that thigns you've told me? Is it good?

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 23, 2005 08:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well, I think you're certainly going to have a complex life.

I got that info from a program I got in a book titled The Instant Astrologer. It's quite good. The program won't let me cut and paste, though, so I had to type those sections for you. I'm not for typing the whole thing in one go, but I'll try to help you out. Any aspects in particular you want to hear about?

I'm gonna skip your sun and ascendant, as that info is pretty readily available all over the internet.

You should compile the ones I type for you (copy and paste them into a document you can save), so that you always have them available. As you go through life different things in your chart will stand out to offer you lessons and direction.

quote:

Sun conjunct (Uniting with) Mercury
To assist you in these matters you do have a particularly active mind, and you take pride in making good use of it. Your powers of reason are therefore higher than average. However, this can incline you to worrying as you try to work everything out in your head. So every so often remind yourself that there is far more to life than just what you are thinking. Be that as it may, your bright intellect is a more or less constant source of information and stimulation to others, and so you attract interest fairly easily.

Sun Conjunct (uniting with) Mars
You have quite a strong and resilient nature. You are built for action, and as a rule you have no trouble getting on with the job in hand. You are decisive, forthright and competitive, and other people pick up on this and respond to it - although not necessarily that favorably. You need to know what you want, otherwise what could be a mixture of desire and aimlessness or sheer wilfulness will create far more enemies than allies. Bear in mind that your undeniable drive and energy is ultimately only as good as what you are directing it towards. Your primary requirement is finding a worthwhile cause to promote.

Sun Square (challenging) Saturn
You either have an unshakeable discipline about you, or an impenetrable wall around you - or both. Yours is a life where your will is having to be built and tested, tested and built some more, in order to achieve the goals described by your Sun profile as a whole. You therefore have, or need to construct, a highly objective attitude to life situations, and adopt conventionally laid down, tried and true, methods in order to achieve those ends. In the process though, take yourself less seriously, or else your innate sense of duty can amount to nothing more than a lonely twenty-four-hour-a-day guard around your fragile ego.

Sun Square (challenging) Uranus
However, in respect of much of all this you take up a decidedly radical position, and aim to introduce the world a strong sense of the original and innovative. This could well involve science and technology or metaphysics. You are heavily challenged in all the areas described here with regard to this revolutionary stance that you adopt, especially by the more conservative elements of society, or even your own personality. You can be quirky and cranky, and at times downright rebellious, but you are certainly your own person. At an evolved level you become quite a leading light.

Sun in the 11th House
All of this is most likely to center upon some kind of goal or social ideal. You innately believe John Donne's line that, "No man is an island," and so you gravitate or strive towards groups or teams that share the same aspirations. For the same reason, friendships are very important to you. In addition, you often delay an interest, or passion even, for freedom and reform in some field of activity.

You tend to get buried in the group you belong to; or sensing this possible loss of your individuality, you rebel against the group you initially rebelled with! But then splinter groups and sudden endings to friendships and associations are all part of your life's course of development. Today's radical is tomorrow's conservative. In the end, it is all part of your striving to uphold some humanitarian cause, through campaigns, inventions or programs that aim to help mankind. You greatly appreciate people-power.


IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 24, 2005 12:05 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wow..thanks so much AG. If you want, you can always ask Randall my email...so you can type it there? I really don't care, whichever is easiest for you, thank you so much for having it all. Um...Any particular aspects? Well, everything else? Except the Moon. I think I've got something on the moons already. Thank you again so much!

IP: Logged

Iqhunk
unregistered
posted November 24, 2005 01:47 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Christina,
You do seem to have a very complex chart. Since you are very young, you may not grasp all the nuances of the aspects or house positions but it would be very useful to know them. Tim Wilson's site will give the basic understanding. Then you can use astrology-numerology.com [free site] and MAP out the ramification of a planet in a sign and house. For instance, Venus in Scorpio will imply a certain characteristic. Venus in 12th House will imply something else. The trick is to combine the two with very honest introspection to learnt the most about you.

In a nutshell though, your life will be good. Libra Sun and Cancer Moon makes for a very empathetic soul and your True Node is Aquarius meaning your life goals should be oriented to being Aquarian.
A Scorpio Ascendant conjuncting Pluto in Pluto's own Sign is the stuff of once in a century group of mentally strong champions.
Jupiter in Cancer pours prosperity, Saturn is in it's own sign of Capricorn so wont exactly cause mayhem.

The challenges are all related to learning and education. You may not like studies or libraries or working hard at maths/comprehension/analysis. This is the Mercury [intelligence/communication/learning] squaring up with Jupiter [Mental/Spiritual Expansion], Saturn [caution, restrictions] and Uranus [Electrifying ideas, inventions, unconventionality, out of the box thinking].

The mental strengths include Mars conjuncting Moon [Mars = Energy, Moon = Psyche/Emotions/Imagination/Memory] and Moon trining Pluto/Venus/Ascednant.
Thus, a powerful imagination exists. However, Neptune, the planet of fantasizing/dreams/spiritual expereiences is restricted by Saturn. You may have a strong urge to be lost in the dream fantasy land but will feel guilty about it or limit yourself, even though the strength is in that area.

Thus, you have to use the Pluto Will Power to kill guilt of dreaming/fantasy/imaginative thinking and at the same time learn to focus on both left brain intellectual and educational advancement to become exceptionally successful.

------------------
Sun-Cancer, Moon-Libra, Asc-ARIES, Mars-Taurus, Venus-Taurus, NorthNode-Libra.

IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 24, 2005 12:15 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks Iqunk! That was really awesome! I'm going to be saving everything you or anyone writes on this post! Its espeically true with the maths part...grr! Thanks a lot, too, by the way. All of you, this is really really nice, and I'm really glad to be having everything that you've all told me, or are going to.

IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 24, 2005 12:45 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Um...does the chart say that I will have wealth? Like, I won't ever be bankrupted and all? I mean, I guess its the whole Saturn in my 2nd house, because I'm always afraid that I won't have enough money, and money is stability.

Will I find true love? giggles..it sounds so cheesy.

Oh, with the true node, thats your ah..destiny, right? So my destiny, or...purpose, is to help others. Hmm...good enough. Lol...at least I know I'm on the right path...hey, whast the medium Coeli? And its in leo..is that good?

IP: Logged

jkxx
unregistered
posted November 24, 2005 01:04 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Christina,

looks like you have some interesting placements indeed!

Saturn in the 2nd house doesn't really mean you'll go bankrupt. It just shows a more careful and controlled attitude toward the way resources are managed. It could eventually mean that you'll accumulate physical wealth past the age of 29 (Saturn return). The fears are there just to prevent you from overextending yourself financially. Saturn could also mean a serious attitude toward what you consider to be your values, although I'll let the more experienced people from the forum expand on that.

As for

quote:
Will I find true love?

Sounds like a Venus in Scorp question to ask! The cool thing about astrology is that it shows that there's always people whose planets will align with yours (in a good way). So ultimately, yes!

And last but not least, you asked about your destiny. You have your true node in Aquarius. North-Node has this to say about it:

quote:
With South Node in Leo, ego drives are very powerful, as the soul craves recognition and respect. Thus, at times you can be dominating, demanding, and willful. The North Node in Aquarius indicates that you find the respect and approval you want only when you work from a sense of equality with all creatures, inspiring rather than dominating. Because you, more than anyone, understand the value of appreciation, you are a natural born appreciator of others and can motivate others to achieve their best, especially when you work together for a common cause. Being involved in groups and humanitarian causes is very good for you.

IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 24, 2005 03:56 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
hmm...thats true. Very cool! lol..but I am so NOT domineering! Thanks so much.

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 25, 2005 07:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Your love life may be rocky, though. Hopefully I'll get to that part for you.


I think I'll slip back over to Universal Codes for a second and retrieve what I had written for you there.

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 25, 2005 07:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Venus Conjunct (uniting with) Ascendant and in the 12th House
These qualities of love and beauty also express themselves in your actual physical presence, appearance or manner of expression. You are either lovely to look at or pleasant to be with - or both. If you are the former, your looks could take you far in one respect, but hold you back in another, simply because you haven't had to do anything other than just be there. This can be very much the case if you are a female who is past her prime. Essentially you have the great asset of being attractive - which is just that, i.e. others are drawn to you. If you have some inner quality to deliver too, then you have the best of both worlds. Your art is the way you are.
- The Instant Astrologer

IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 25, 2005 08:26 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hehe..a lady past her prime...I hope I'm not! lol...hmm...thats interesting. How will my love life be rocky...sigh.

oh, I found something on my birth date, can you read it and see whats its about. Grr...I had it all typed out, but then something happened and it all disappeared, so I'll just type out the first paragraph or so. Its the one most unsettling.

quote:
A recurring theme in the lives of Sept 23 people is that of breaking through restrictions. the expansive individuals born on this day are not free to develop and unfold their personalities until they have struggled with and overcome either physical or formal difficulates. this struggle is usually extremely intense, and in fact goes on even after successive breakthroughs. indeed life for those born on this day is a series of ongoing challenges which must each be met and conquered. in this respect, september 23 people may well be described as spiritual warriors.

end of quote:

great. so much for hoping for a nice, easy, blessed, simple, un challenging life. Thanks a lot!

hehe...but hey, spiritual warriors? Sounds nice.

and you guys did say that I have very strong will, right? You know, I've been thinking, ever since I've read that, and everything else you guys gave me (which I really can't say enough, thank you) and I think I've realized something.

Everything, all the challenges in your life, its all given to you because they know that you can handle it. Like, you are born with all the gifts and strenths and different qualities you'll ever need plus more!

That's a good thing ...I still wish it won't be so challenging. I guess it'll feel nicer once one challenge is over?

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 25, 2005 09:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yeah, life won't be a bed of roses, unfortunately, but you are pretty well equipped.

Maybe this would go faster if I just cut and pasted from the web.

Moon in Cancer
This is the most subjective position of the Moon. The Moon is "at home" in the sign of Cancer, as the Moon is the natural ruler of the sign.

Moon in Cancer natives have a large potential to be able to get in touch with the feelings and moods of others. Often, they are quite wrapped up in themselves. Their memories of the past are outstanding, especially for all things emotional. Moon in Cancer people are never detached -- they cling to things, their home, and people they care for. They seek out security and familiarity in all they do. They look for peace and quiet. Their attachment to all that is safe means they are a little leery of change.

These peace-loving souls dislike superficiality in all of its forms. They are devoted and accommodating. The insecure ones accumulate things in an attempt to feel secure.

Because of their strong attachment to, and memory of, the past, others may complain that Moon in Cancer natives tend to whip a dead horse. They may dwell on hurts long after everyone else has moved on. When they feel they have been taken for granted (which may be often!), they don't always confront others directly. This is when they can use roundabout ways to get your attention. In fact, these natives, when they are insecure, can become quite manipulative. They can also be victims of habit.

These people can have a hard time compartmentalizing their lives, simply because their watery Moon tends to know no boundaries. Sometimes, as a result, they may act irrationally.

One of the most delightful characteristics of Moon in Cancer people is their loony sense of humor. These people can be extraordinarily funny. Their moodiness can baffle others, but their unique outlook on life is something most people can appreciate.

When treated with tenderness and understanding, Moon in Cancer natives return the favor with warmth and protection. Give them security, and you'll take the crabbiness out of the Crab, at least for awhile.

These people are wonderfully dependable overall, despite their occasional mood swings. Make a friend of Moon in Cancer, and you will be taken care of for life.
http://www.cafeastrology.com/articles/mooninsigns.html

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 25, 2005 10:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Moon trine Venus
What comes to the rescue in all your emotional interactions is a certain softness you have about you - whether you are male or female. Others find it easy to bathe in your pleasingly familiar aura. This talent of yours for soothing and making people feel good has many uses and can take many forms.
- The Instant Astrologer

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 25, 2005 10:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Moon trine Pluto
The favorable aspect formed between the Moon and Pluto strengthens your will to handle emotional problems in your life. This aspect provides you the talent to improve domestic and business matters by uncluttering your life. You're able to relinquish old emotional habits. You know your capabilities and you know your limits. You can neither be forced into doing what you don't wish to do, nor deterred from gaining your intended objectives. You are well respected because of your character and your ability to hold important issues in confidence when this is required of you. You have much energy which is well regulated and controlled. http://www.astrology-numerology.com/aspects-moon.html

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 25, 2005 10:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Moon Trine Ascendant
You find it relatively easy to express your feeling states spontaneously,
for your natural way of organising your experiences is in tune with the way
you behave in order to feel emotionally secure. You are probably able to
understand why others feel the way they do fairly easily, and this is likely
to lead to your being popular. You also feel that it is important for you
to be able to share your own feelings with other people, and you will look
for emotional support from other people, as well as being able to provide
emotional support yourself for other people. You can use your ability to
express your feelings to further your creative talents: you really need to
do this, otherwise you could become rather lazy. http://www.achernar.btinternet.co.uk/moonaspects.html

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 25, 2005 10:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The Moon in the 8th House is an indication that in past lives the emotional needs of others were denied as a result of an overly self-centered, materialistic, or cerebral reality. The sign of the Moon will indicate which. People with the Moon in 8th House are commonly born to parents who cannot function at an emotional level. With other planetary factors, this placement of the Moon can indicate the loss of a parent early in life in which the child is burdened by the bereaved parent’s emotional needs. Although acutely sensitive to the emotional states of others, people with the Moon in H8, who have had little practice in emotional expression early in their lives, tend to be inhibited and emotionally insecure in adult life. Unlike the Sun in this House, the Moon in H8 does not feel at ease in emotionally charged situations and although he may drive his own ill-defined needs underground and focus on those of partners and associates, he is more likely to attempt to evade emotional confrontation by concentrating on impersonal, outer-directed activities and go through life with his own emotional needs unrecognised and unacknowledged. http://www.dkfoundation.co.uk/BookKarmaHouse8.htm

IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 25, 2005 10:51 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The moon in 8th house is true. Well, at least the parent thing is. But I am lucky, so that condition didn't last too long. thanks a lot AG. You rock!

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 25, 2005 11:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You're welcome! I'll do more some time soon.

IP: Logged

Christinaeavynwarner
unregistered
posted November 26, 2005 11:42 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I was wondering, does face reading...is it real? And is there anything more? Hmm

IP: Logged

AcousticGod
Knowflake

Posts: 4416
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted November 28, 2005 11:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm not sure what you're asking.

IP: Logged


This topic is 2 pages long:   1  2 

All times are Eastern Standard Time

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | Linda-Goodman.com

Copyright © 2011

Powered by Infopop www.infopop.com © 2000
Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.46a