posted September 22, 2007 05:19 AM              

As I always do Solar Return for me (I am not very good, to explain all), I look first of all those 4 angles:

AC: You, how do you look, how do you behave;
IC: Your home, family, relocation (it is
important, what planets are there);
DC: Your partner (sign shows, what kind of
partner you need);
MC: Your job (higher job), sign shows, what
kind of job or career you are looking
for.

Natasha

posted September 22, 2007 09:54 AM              

Asc in Sag:Is how people see me, how I act but if I was true to myself I would act by who I am , which it is my sun, which for me would be in Cancer.
Because your sun is who you are , correct?

So if my sun is who I am, then what roll is my moon playing, which in my case is also in Cancer?
I like to think from my "non-book" point of view that my moon is how I use my intuition, it helps me make decisions when being rational is not working.But as I said that is my own theory...

posted September 22, 2007 10:38 AM              

I think the whole chart shows who or how you ARE.

ASC: how you present yourself to the world instinctively, how you look, what others see of you, your body in the widest sense, but you don`t need to be necessarily conscious about all this. Sometimes we don`t even realize, what "impression" we leave on others.

Moon: the emotional side of your core personality, how you perceive the world, what leaves an emotional print in your soul

Sun: the outer side of your core personality, selfexpression, how you act

But that`s only my opinion; and regarding the meaning of Sun, Moon and ASC there might be as many opinions as there are astrologers.

posted September 22, 2007 12:40 PM            

AC - Your personality and the characteristics you identify with

IC - Your home/family/upbringing, lessons learned in youth that are carried through the rest of your life

DC - Other people, and traits you project onto other people

MC - Your career, reputation, and outer self

For example:

I'm a Sagittarius AC - I identify myself with indulgence, optimism, good-will, making the best of what's around, faith (in general), culture and philosophies.

My IC is in Aries - My home/family always has been very active, combative, and high-energy. I come from a family that "gets things done", and doesn't spend too much time on the emotional stuff. A family whose most important lesson to me was to keep fighting and never give up or back down from a challenge..to be fierce and fearless...as if surrender was the ultimate sin (Aries).

My DC is in Gemini - I'm attracted to people with exceptional intelligence. But I also feel many people are generally too fickle in their belief systems, and readily believe anything they hear without question...(A play on Gemini/rumors). I know this is projected from my Sag AC, because I know I challenge everything...and sometimes, I can be fickle in MY belief systems, and can be far too quick to take on a new philosophy just for the sake of adopting one.

My MC is Libra - Because I'd been taught to be so aggressive and fearless at home (IC in Aries), I'm very laid back when it comes to acheiving goals and aspirations (Libra MC). This comes from a perceived lack of competition, and knowing that giving up is never an option. Therefore, I don't feel challenged enough to push as hard/quickly as I should be...cuz I know I'll get there at some point. (All products of my opposing IC in Aries). Therefore people see me as a very balanced, charming, relaxed, and easy-going person. This is my outer self and reputation according to others...a.k.a. my MC.

Hope that helped a little

posted September 22, 2007 01:01 PM            

The Sun is YOU. This is who you are. This is the type of self-expression you "pack".

The Moon is your emotions. This is how you perceive any/all situations around you. It's your first response to your environment at any given time.

The Ascendant is the filter in which you express yourself through.

For example:

A Cancer sun is always going to be emotional, sensitive, intuitive, to some extent.

If their Moon is in Aquarius, their first reaction is almost always going to be one that favors logic and detachment from the emotions. They perceive their environment around them to be one that needs rationalizing.

This alters the Cancerian emotional approach to the world but doesn't cancel it out all together.

If their Ascendant is in Aries, they will filter their Sun/Moon combo through the lens of Mars.

As a Scorpio...I am passionate and intense by nature. With the Moon in Leo, I tend to respond to every situation/environment I face with a proud, dramatic, sometimes arrogant demeanor/attitude.

I can be an unbearably spoiled, patronizing, and jealous drama queen at times...but I always filter my individuality (positive & negative traits) through the humorous and good-natured filter of Sagittarius. So even though bad is bad, it often never comes off as "bad" as it could be...

posted September 25, 2007 05:04 AM            

Something I noticed a while ago is that a Moon sign's description often applied to people who have that sign on the IC. I have an Aquarius IC & I relate a lot to that sign's moon description. My fiance has a Gemini IC, and likewise, the description for Moon in Gemini describes him. The sign on the IC accurately describes the emotional disposition of most of the people I know. This makes sense if you think of the 4th house as someone's inner persona. Their private, quiet self is colored by the sign on their IC. That sign will reveal their basic emotional temperament & needs.

I know you didn't want a book, but I just wanted to give a brief explanation for why I think of the angles in this way. I like to think of the signs on the angles as similar to having planets in those signs.
asc = Mars (& Mercury)
dsc = Venus
IC = Moon
MC = Sun (with some slight Saturn undertones, b/c it's how the person believes he "should" behave in public. It's the public persona he aspires to have, feels compelled to present to the world).

I'm a Sag Sun; when performing or interacting with a large group, my Sag Sun is filtered through my Leo MC.
I have a Capricorn Venus, which is filtered through my Taurus descendant.
Leo Moon, filtered through my aquarius IC.
Virgo Mars (Scorpio Mercury), filtered through my Scorpio asc.

You could do the same with your chart & see if it makes sense for you. If you have a Sag asc, you probably have a Virgo mc. Do you think that in large groups your Cancer Sun gets filtered through your Virgo MC (analytical, cerebral, emotionally detached)?

posted September 25, 2007 05:53 AM              

So... according to your theory, which I think seems to be an excellent one, I could be described by:
Mars/Mercury in Sagittarius
Venus in Gemini
Moon in Aquarius
Sun in Leo.

All of these things do seem to ring true to an extent. With Aquarius on my IC (described also by moon in Aquarius) it's at home that I am more unconventional; in the privacy of my own home or with the people who know me most closely, they see that I am unconventional and a bit Uranian (sun opposite Uranus); I'm not sure, honestly, whether or not this is how I come across to others but I have suspicions that my public image is more of the 'pretty girl who you don't approach' than the intelligent, open-minded thinker with a love for all things unconventional. My Uranus is retrograde so this may explain it. lol

I'm a fifth house sun, so the Leo sun description feels comfortable for me. I love Leo's! I do have a strange need for attention and admiration. And as for Mercury and Mars in Sagittarius, I talk a hell of a lot more than you would expect of a Taurus sun/Mercury.

posted September 25, 2007 06:29 AM            

Now with the 7th house...yours is the same as your Venus so the distinction is harder to see. So I'll use myself as an example. My DC is in Taurus. So with one-to-one relationships, I behave a lot like a Taurus. I value & am attracted to Taurus behavior in a partnership & display that type of behavior myself. In that specific area of my life, it's like I have Venus in Taurus. But, I have Venus in Capricorn so that is what I bring to all of my chart. They're compatible signs, so they're pretty similar influences, but I think Capricorn makes me less hedonistic & indulgent than Venus in Taurus would. Before I enter a committed relationship, I'm more like a Venus in Cap. Once I'm in one, I act more like a Venus in Taurus.

posted September 25, 2007 06:41 AM              

But yes I love your description of the angles as a filter. It makes a lot of sense.

posted September 25, 2007 06:45 AM            

Your Gemini Venus & DC, rather than making you emotionally detached, probably make a mental connection with your partner extremely important for you.

posted September 25, 2007 07:19 AM            

I related a lot to what you said about mentally detaching yourself in a relationship & needing a strong intellectual connection with a partner. I have Venus in the 3rd, maybe that's why I'm the same way.

I'm a Sag Sun, but I do have a Scorpio asc.

Hmm, I have Pluto square Venus & it still makes me say "yikes." Maybe b/c it's wide. I remember once reading that the narrow aspects are such fundamental parts of our personality that we're not even conscious of them. They're just, to us, the way life is. But the wider ones we feel as an aspect influencing us. They're not our basic self, but more like transits that sometimes kick in.

posted September 25, 2007 07:43 AM            

quote:

---

But do you think that to the Pluto square native, because it's their natural energy, it's not really all that alarming?

---

Yes. When you deal with Pluto energy from...birth, as with any aspect in the natal chart, you grow with it. It's not like you wake up one morning and say OMG Pluto's here! lol.

And Pluto is a pretty strong planet, it leaves a distinct "mark" on someone who has a lot of influence in their chart.

It's prob why people with strong Pluto find it hard to understand why they evoke such strong reactions in other people.

I've got more than my share of Pluto influence in my chart, social issues with it showed up mainly when I was a young child through the high school years.

posted September 25, 2007 07:59 AM            

quote:

---

It's not like you wake up one morning and say OMG Pluto's here! lol

---

posted September 25, 2007 08:16 AM            

quote:

---

Apparently I give off the impression of being very confident and I can unnerve people with my stare - but I'm not doing anything, I'm just being natural!

---

Sounds like you're a Scorpio asc. I'm with your bf on this one. I don't care what astro.com says.

I connected with your quote, being a Scorpio asc myself. I've gotten comments like that a lot. My favorite was when an old college boyfriend said that while he was giving a presentation in a class we had together a year earlier, I looked at him as if I was probing his psyche. At the time of his presentation, we had never spoken. People seem to peg me as a Scorpio (too Scorpio, more than I am), if I haven't spoken with them & they've just seen me around. Once I speak with them, they learn what a warm, goof I am at heart (Leo Moon).

posted September 25, 2007 08:29 AM              

a very interesting theory!
I have had the same thoughts about IC, AC and DC, but MC never was a real good fit with Saturn as the ruler of it.
But your system, it`s symmetry is breathtakingly beautiful.

AC = Mars
DC = Venus
the complimentary energies being on opposite sides of the zodiac

IC=Moon
MC=Sun
again complimentary energies in opposition.

I like your system a lot.

So, let`s see

My Moon in Aquarius would be filtered through my ARies-IC
my Sun in Sagittarius would be filtered through my Libra-MC
my Venus in Capricorn would be filtered through Gemini-DC
my Mars in Sagittarius would be filtered through Sagittarius - AC

Hmm, I have to think about what this could mean.

Well, in the case of the Moon in Aquarius, IC in Aries it could indicate that I am not as detached as you should expect with Aquarius-Moon, because my ARies-IC takes everything so personal.

posted September 25, 2007 11:22 PM              

Interestingly, my bf strikes me very much as being a Scorpio - even now. Just something about his look. Yet that's not what he's really like, and in fact he's a water singleton in Scorpio, with Pluto squaring his sun. And when you know him, he's a total Gemini/Aries. Yet I keep getting this 'Scorpio' vibe that's somehow not really *him*. It must be the Pluto square sun getting in there. Or... maybe I'm just feeling our Pluto aspects (synastry and composite).

... I think I've kind of hijacked this thread. Oops...

posted September 26, 2007 05:16 AM            

He's the reason I started thinking of the MC that way, actually. He's a professor & over the years I've sat in on some of his lectures. His "performing" personality is very Sagittarius, which is the sign on his MC. One on one, his asc filtering his Sun is more noticeable, but when in a large group, he displays a Sag personality. So that's what made me start thinking of the MC as a "Sun" filter. It's also something I noticed in myself from a young age. Not that I knew much about astrology then (certainly didn't know what the MC was), but when put in front of a crowd--for a presentation, play, debate, anything--my Leo MC would kick into full gear. Granted, I do have my Moon in that sign, but I don't think that explains the personality shift. I've always appeared completely at ease in front of a crowd, & internally felt pretty comfortable too. I would much rather perform in front of a crowd of strangers than mingle in a room of 10 strangers.

Good take on your IC & Moon. I think my Aqua IC tones down my Leo Moon, making me more emotionally detached. It's pretty easy for me to step back & view a situation rationally. There are exceptions though...when I'm really hurt, everything looks very bleak to me. But I think my Aqua IC explains why this happens less frequently for me than you would expect it to happen with a Leo Moon. I'm not nearly as dramatic emotionally as Leo Moon descriptions state. Of course, my Moon's aspects could explain this: my Moon-Pluto sextile gives me strong feelings but inner strength; I'm not easily rattled. My Moon-Uranus square gives me aqua traits. But even so, I very much feel the Aqua IC as filtering my Leo Moon.