Posts: 97
From: sapulpa oklahoma united states
Registered: Jul 2007

posted June 26, 2008 02:18 PM         

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in someones chart what would indicate that they would commit suicide?

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Posts: 1032
From: Leeds
Registered: May 2008

posted June 26, 2008 02:30 PM         

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Someone has to go there

12th house is all about long term illness, crime, resting and also suicide. I guess an indication of the 8th house ruler in the 12th house seems logical. 8th and 12th involved.

So, looking at my natal...no not doing it this life.

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Posts: 97
From: sapulpa oklahoma united states
Registered: Jul 2007

posted June 26, 2008 05:24 PM         

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so someone with no planets in the 12th house probrably wouldnt commit suicide.Are there any aspects that would indicate commiting suicide?

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Posts: 7410
From: New Brighton, MN, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted June 26, 2008 05:33 PM         

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NO.

There are no for-sure aspects that indicate a free will choice like terminating one's life.

Astrology is a map of potentials only -- not a lottery where if you draw the wrong card (aspect), out you go regardless.....

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Posts: 4712
From: Calm Blue Ocean, Calm Blue Ocean
Registered: Jun 2003

posted June 26, 2008 05:56 PM         

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lol just give up Zala

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Posts: 2376
From: meet me in montauk
Registered: May 2006

posted June 26, 2008 06:12 PM         

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someone has to be the voice of reason.

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Posts: 1561
From: canada
Registered: Sep 2007

posted June 26, 2008 08:12 PM         

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can i be the voice of unreason?

my ex was suicidal (very) he's a pisces sun (which is rather afflicted) with scorpio pluto opposite mars and square venus. he had a 2 year run with attempting suicide as pluto was transiting over his saturn and uranus (conjunct). pluto was squaring his sun at this time and opposing his chiron. looking at these aspects and transits, it looks to ME like a possible compelling argument for certain things potentially triggering suicidal behaviour.

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Posts: 215
From: colorado
Registered: Sep 2007

posted June 26, 2008 09:53 PM         

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You could also see where your point of suicide falls there are two of them.

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Posts: 6677
From: Australia
Registered: May 2008

posted June 26, 2008 10:28 PM         

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edit.

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Posts: 2085
From: Arizona
Registered: Jul 2006

posted June 26, 2008 11:22 PM         

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There are several things in a persons natal chart that might indicate this(sometimes not)...to pin it on one particular placement is just silly. Besides this is kind of a touchy subject for some people

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Sun in Libra
Moon in Cancer
Jupiter in Cancer
Venus in Virgo
Mars in Cancer
Ascendant in Cancer

"I was born when she kissed me. I died when she left me. I lived a few weeks while she loved me"

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Posts: 442
From: In the æther
Registered: Mar 2006

posted June 27, 2008 04:26 AM         

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According to The Rulership Book by Rex E. Bills, suicide is ruled by Uranus, Pluto, Neptune, the 8th house and the 12th house.

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Posts: 1032
From: Leeds
Registered: May 2008

posted June 27, 2008 06:30 AM         

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Any reason you want to know, Kbug?

Azalaksh, agreed on the free-will bit, but maybe more who do it have similar aspects and configurations going on. 12th house can mean many more things apart from suicide.

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Posts: 1037
From: Mercury
Registered: Jul 2007

posted June 27, 2008 07:26 AM         

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Lemme tell you. I have Mars and I think Saturn in the 12th house and suicide is a not something I would EVER in infinity years consider. I'm sorry but I love life too much for that weak-minded nonsense. I dont care HOW bad it got, suicide is not happeneing for me.

If it ever got that bad, I'd drop everything and start over somewheres else. I'd go to a warm place, sit under a Palm tree and ask GOD where do go from there and what do I do from that point on.

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Virgo Asc & Mars
Gemini Sun
Libra Moon (conjunct Pluto 0º in 2nd house)
Gemini Mercury
Cancer Venus

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Posts: 7410
From: New Brighton, MN, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted June 27, 2008 08:26 AM         

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GG ~

quote:

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I'm sorry but I love life too much for that weak-minded nonsense.

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imho, that was a really intolerant and uncompassionate thing to say. Suicide has *NOTHING* to do with being "weak-minded." Suicide becomes a viable option when Life events exceed one's ability/skills to cope. There are a handful of threads here at LL on this subject, please search them and read what others have to say.

Zala

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Posts: 116
From:
Registered: May 2008

posted June 27, 2008 10:23 AM         

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Zala, *hearts*

depression (whether leading to suicide/suicidal thoughts or not) is a DISEASE that needs to be treated. be careful when your loved ones get caught..never SAY: " you are weak. get over it" your loved ones cannot simply get over it overnight. instead encourage, keep encouraging and showing love

from my experience, PLUTO opposing MARS and/or either of those having bad aspects with VENUS. PLUTO in 8th house ...coupled with dominant water signs

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Posts: 919
From: ann arbor mi
Registered: Apr 2008

posted June 27, 2008 10:41 AM         

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I hope this posts the chart. This kid I worry about like that. He just doesnt have the skills to cope with life sometimes, he is introverted and sensitive and since he was small, just can't seem to, I don't even know how to say it,I guess, cope. He quit trying a long time ago and escapes with drugs and I just don't know how to get through and help him. It''s so hard to get through. It isn't a weakness nor a glib thing to talk about, It is sad and devastaing to families. I hope he never goes this route, but I pray for him and hope he can find his way...I just wish I knew how to help him more because I love him very much, he is my son.

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Posts: 919
From: ann arbor mi
Registered: Apr 2008

posted June 27, 2008 10:45 AM         

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i guess it didn't post, 4/26/89 8:32am ann arbor, mi....he has a pile up of planets in both the 12th and the 8th houses.

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Posts: 4700
From: U.K
Registered: Dec 2007

posted June 27, 2008 10:49 AM         

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Posts: 6677
From: Australia
Registered: May 2008

posted June 27, 2008 10:54 AM         

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thanks for posting it blue moon - i was just looking at it too.

i added chiron and vertex when i did it. he has a grand trine - vertex, north node and chiron.

what i see here is a highly spiritual being, sweetie. his north node is in pisces. this child is very sensitive to the world. where most people are learning to be a spiritual being in a human body, he's learning to be a human being as an already matured spiritual soul.

i think the drugs are his way of coping with being in such a harsh reality. he's very sensitive to external energies. he picks things up that others don't but he doesn't quite understand it.

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Posts: 919
From: ann arbor mi
Registered: Apr 2008

posted June 27, 2008 11:01 AM         

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It just seems like he can't process life stuff and has a hard time dealing with stuff and I look in his eyes and see he hurts and it is hard to know how to help him. I wnat to help him. He has a baby coming in november, never had a job, has been incarcereated for stupid stuff, and I think he just doesnt know where to start, where to try. But yes he is very sensitive, although to the world he comes off as a total jerk, he just doesnt have the social skills, and so he adopted this bad attiude with everyone except me, his mother. It breaks my heart, he has a twin sister also and I have to say, it has not been as easy road. I don't know that my best is good enough.

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Posts: 6677
From: Australia
Registered: May 2008

posted June 27, 2008 11:03 AM         

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as a parent you never think your best is good enough. trust me.

you know with suicide it's not just astrology. if he comes off as being a jerk - he just hasn't learnt to nurture himself. he hasn't learnt to love himself. and that's not a reflection of you as his mother. it's something deep within someone that they have to find themselves.

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Posts: 6677
From: Australia
Registered: May 2008

posted June 27, 2008 11:05 AM         

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he has chiron in 1st house - which gives the appearance of being wounded in some way as well.

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Posts: 6677
From: Australia
Registered: May 2008

posted June 27, 2008 11:14 AM         

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sunshine_lion you really broke my heart with your post. my son is the same, but he is only eight so we haven't gotten so far yet. he's enormously sensitive. and i'm the same so i can feel it from that angle as well.

the truth is that no-one can tell you whether someone will or won't do anything based on their charts because it's a guide and as stated above, we have free will.

i think you're in need of as much love as he is, sweetheart.

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Posts: 6677
From: Australia
Registered: May 2008

posted June 27, 2008 11:15 AM         

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just prayers and love to you both.

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Posts: 919
From: ann arbor mi
Registered: Apr 2008

posted June 27, 2008 11:34 AM         

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thank you peace angel, I felt like when he was little if he just had some sucesses to build on. School was always a struggle, and both of his sisters were popular and performed well, so there seemed like he always felt like he couldn't measure up. Like you said, he has to find it in himself. Somewhere he quit trying, and the further he goes away the harder it is to make good things happen. Anyway, thank you peace for oyur kindness. I just try not to worry excessivly, because it really doesn't change anything, I just wish I knew how to help him..I guess, adjust to the demands of this world. Everyone is not cut from the same cloth and he just needs to find HIS way.

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