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lechien
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posted January 22, 2012 04:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
i just have one (and half) question. in my progression below, i would like to know how the near exact Sun/Venus and Mars opposition in the 1st and 7th house might be manifesting. and for the half question, that Chiron, what is it doing? thank you so much in advance!

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lechien
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posted January 23, 2012 07:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
i appreciate any interpretations. i just would like an insight into that T-square. or the Sun/Venus & Mars dynamic. thank you!

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SaggiMC
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posted January 23, 2012 08:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SaggiMC     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
progressed charts are not meant to be read as stand alones, they need to be around the outside of natal chart...

progressed planets/charts are more 'internal' changes, evolvements rather than 'events or external' matters. I don't read prog charts as stand alones it's more important to see where these planets are moving in the natal chart

Your natal chart is like a photograph as unique as your fingerprint, BUT the 10planets in the sky have not stayed where they were in your natal chart, they have all moved. Predictive astrology is mostly maths where those 10planets are now and the mathematical aspects they make to your natal charts ie: 180'=opposition, 90'=square, 60'=sextile and 120'=trine.

So your personality, grows, develops, changes, matures as we get older, this is reflected by your sun sign changing from it's natal position to the next sign along, so does your Asc and MC sign change. In fact from sun to mars especially are important, as the outer planets really don't move much, using a 'day for a year' secondary progressions.

What's the difference between Transits and Progressions?
“Transits are the planets currently orbiting in the sky and the relationships they form to each other and additionally, to your chart. Transits happen for everyone. They're important and effect you personally when they contact a planet or point in your chart. Transits represent outside energy, things happening outside yourself. They describe external events and your responses to them. Progressions, however, move very slowly and are a natural progression of your original birth chart. The events and emotions they describe are part of you, deeply ingrained in your psyche, internal, and psychological. And as they form aspects, these inner feelings start to become more important and central to your life” http://www.artcharts.com/learn_astrology/progressed.html

If you want to research more into Secondary progressions try here http://cafeastrology.com/secondaryprogressions.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrological_progression http://www.aquamoonlight.co.uk/progressions.html http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=67 http://www.khaldea.com/rudhyar/astroarticles/progressionsinastrology.php http://astrolmass.com/progressions.htm http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_transits_e.htm http://skywriter.wordpress.com/2011/01/27/the-progressed-moon-through-the-12-houses/

solar arcs & secondary progressions http://www.kepler.edu/videos/0902SolarArc/Stathis_SolarArc_Feb09.pdf

“2) The aspects formed by the progressed MC, ASC, Sun, and the planets (other than the Moon). These will indicate major trends for a year or more surrounding the date on which they become exact.” http://www.astrologymatch.com/progressed-chart.htm

The most important of progressed planets is of course, sun & moon and then upto mars, as the outer planets hardly move by progression. Now like with transits, solar arcs --- it's what these progressed planets are doing NOW by mathematical aspect to your natal planets and Angles that is ultimately important.

------------------
I love the parable, “If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, BUT if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for life.”

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lechien
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From: in a giant room with 2 little furry friends
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posted January 24, 2012 08:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
hi SaggiMC, thanks so much for the info. i understand that Progression isn't supposed to be interpreted as stand alone, but i wanted a clue about the relations of the Progressed planets to each other to better understand their positions in my Natal chart. i'm wondering, is it better if i just ignore their aspects to each other? i thought it may have a significance since it's a very tight T-square. maybe it's not important to look at it this way, and rather focus on the each planets' positions to Natal strictly?

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anongrl10
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posted January 24, 2012 09:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anongrl10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Lechien, if you bring up your Natal+Transits+Porgressions chart, I will look into this for you.

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lechien
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From: in a giant room with 2 little furry friends
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posted January 24, 2012 11:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
thanks anongrl, i'm mainly interested in that Sun/Venus & Mars, so no need to get too deep into the rest, for you must be quite busy. if you can spare a minute or two for it, it'll be super! i'll go get the chart now then.

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lechien
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Posts: 1980
From: in a giant room with 2 little furry friends
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posted January 24, 2012 11:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
that said, i know it won't be like you can extract this one particular aspect and focus only on this, because it's in relation to all other aspects and positions. but you know what i wanted to mean...

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anongrl10
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posted January 24, 2012 11:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anongrl10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
No it's fine. I will only focus on that particular t-square. I just can't do it in the chat above. I need the natal+transits+progressions chart for checking rulerships etc.

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lechien
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posted January 24, 2012 11:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
here it is. i'm curious because although the Venus/Sun and Mars don't conjunct any planets and points, they fall into 2nd and 8th house. finance/money are the most important aspect in my life right now. how do you think the fact that these planets are in opposition come into play, or does it matter? also, would you count the houses in Progression, because in the Progression chart above they fall in 1st and 7th houses, which i think might be important to keep in mind in relation to the Natal chart? or not?

they form a Yod with my Natal Jupiter and Saturn, which are also very important planets for me. Jupiter is my chart ruler, Saturn rules my 2nd house, while it's also in the chart ruler's ruling house (9th) and at the top of my chart. and interestingly, the Transit Jupiter and Saturn are in opposition right now, creating a funny geometric tension with them in my Natal. and i feel like they bring into focus the Sun/Venus & Mars aspect in the progression. just don't know how to put it together. i appreciate your insight.

i'm on and off, haven't been able to be on LL very often lately. but i'll try to check back when i can!

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anongrl10
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posted January 24, 2012 01:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for anongrl10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
OK, well you can see that your P AC has moved to 8 Cap which is why what was the 2-8 axis in the natal has become the 1-7 axis in the progressed chart. The point about progressions is to check them against the natal chart, so to me what's important is the fact that the opposition affects your financial axis (2-8) and Chiron in your natal 5th house of fun and creativity. Neither Venus-Sun nor Mars aspect something in your empty 2-8 houses but they do form an inconjunct to Jup in your natal 7th, which is as you said ruler of your 1st and your chart. So I'm not sure what you're asking since you've already analyzed the situation?? LOL
It's clear that this t-sq activates some painful issues regarding resources (2-8 axis) and creative projects (5th house).
Although it looks like it's a direct involvement of your financial axis, you have good reasons to believe that your are also affected in your 1-7 axis of who you are to others and how the others see you.
Notice that Mars right now forms a square to Saturn AND progressed MC in the 11th house of friends, groups, organizations, and wishes/dreams. As you already said, all this squares Sun-Venus and so on so forth.
So you see the pattern. I don't see many aspects to natal planets though so basically your houses are activated ("highlighted") and you already know the issues implied (your new business, money issues, etc.)
The only natal point in your chart that is immediately affected is Chiron. So yes it's a touchy matter but you already knew that?
Hmm, I guess I don't feel I added anything to your analysis in the previous. LOL
The most important thing to remember is that Saturn conjunct TIGHTLY your P MC so career matters are on the forefront and are activated by this yod. But you already knew that (what with the new business and stuff), right?

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lechien
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posted January 24, 2012 06:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
cool, thanks or making sense of that for me. it sounds much clearer coming from someone else because i cannot detach from my own situations. do you think that Sun/Venus and Mars aspect being very tight have more than the effect of simply "highlighting" the 2nd/8th house matters, than when they were in a looser aspect?

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anongrl10
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posted January 24, 2012 06:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for anongrl10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
OK! I really didn't feel I added anything to your last post! LOL
About your q, the thing is that Venus/Sun and Mars and Saturn are where they are for all of us. Where they hit *you* in your chart though makes a difference for you. I looked for personal "touches" in the previous, and I see very few as I said. So it seems it's basically a house "highlighting" right now (with the exception of Chiron/Jup/P MC).

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lechien
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posted January 25, 2012 11:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ok, maybe i was confusing, but i meant the Sun/Venus and Mars in my progression, not the current transit. i just wondered if this gives an extra significance that they are in a tight aspect between themselves. but ok, i don't want to take up too much of your time, i'll manage. thanks so much!

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anongrl10
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posted January 25, 2012 11:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anongrl10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lechien:
ok, maybe i was confusing, but i meant the Sun/Venus and Mars in my progression, not the current transit. i just wondered if this gives an extra significance that they are in a tight aspect between themselves. but ok, i don't want to take up too much of your time, i'll manage. thanks so much!

I think you confuse the two charts as different. The only difference is that the second shows progressions in relation to the natal chart. Apart from that, I have nothing new to add.

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lechien
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From: in a giant room with 2 little furry friends
Registered: May 2009

posted January 25, 2012 01:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for lechien     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by anongrl10:
I think you confuse the two charts as different. The only difference is that the second shows progressions in relation to the natal chart. Apart from that, I have nothing new to add.

i'm not confusing the 2 charts. you said below in the previous post.

quote:
About your q, the thing is that Venus/Sun and Mars and Saturn are where they are for all of us.

so i just made it clear that i was speaking of the progression, which is the main reason for the initial question. the second chart shows transits and progression (which is what you wanted to see), and the Sun/Venus & Mars opposition is not the transit that is affecting all of us, it's just an aspect in my progression which doesn't apply to anyone else. it's ok, as i said, i'll manage. just wanted to clarify. thanks for what you've told me.

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SaggiMC
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posted January 26, 2012 11:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SaggiMC     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
prog sun and venus are indeed forming a temporary Yod with saturn and jupiter.
Now like transits, all prog and transits act as background influences until they make an aspect to another planet or Angle..as I'm sure you already know..

Sometimes these quincunxs (aka Inconjuncts 150’) are obvious and recognised in personality, other times it can take a lot of self examination to identify with the planets energies and of course they (like all aspects) don't operate 100% of the time, they are simply a facet of your personality. Some say they cause health issues that are unresolved, underlying, dormant waiting to be triggered.... some say you stay at one end, to the detriment of the other, OR end up see-sawing between the two until you learn balance, integration of two unlikely pairings.

Next look at the signs, then houses and then aspects. Now the *others aspects* from these quincunxs/Yods as they can act like escape routes, that can help or hinder the expressions. A chart with lots of Yods (Finger of God) will always be *searching* for the divine answers to the meaning of life, to find synthesis
What tends to happen with quincunxs is that with progessions and transits will create temporary Yods aka 'Finger of god' configurations. Like with common TSquares, they create a temp Grand Square...

So if I were to delinate as IF a natal aspect, I'm sure you can adapt...

Sun Quincunx Saturn
“shows you are somewhat careless about your health and you tend to take abuse from others. You seem determined to allow others to take advantage of your inability to say NO when they ask favours. Perhaps in your early years you did more household tasks than other members of your family, because you felt it was your duty. You have a subtle fear of others and the power they seem to have over you. Psychologically, this may be referred to as latent ¬masochism, which means you are seeking ways to be punished for what you consider to be past mistakes”
From the book ‘Aspects and Personality’ by Karen Hamaker-Zondag

“Sun Quincunx Saturn
It is easy for you to take on responsibilities that aren't yours while ignoring ones that are. Because you work hard and aren't always recognized or compensated for it, you often "run out of steam" before your work is done. Your life works best when you learn to take care of your most important responsibilities first” http://www.cafeastrology.com/natal/quincunxinterpretations.html

Venus Quincunx Saturn
“You have difficulty seeing what you are actually responsible for in relationships. Consequently, you take on more responsibilities than necessary in order to insure the continuation of your relationships. Do people like you for you or because of what you do for them? You are easily confused on this point. If you are busy doing things for people, they never get a chance to know the real you.” http://www.cafeastrology.com/natal/quincunxinterpretations.html

Father, males and/or (saturn) authority figure may not understand what brings you pleasure (venus)

Venus Quincunx Jupiter
You easily overextend yourself. Overindulgence and exhaustion can come from feeling over-optimistic about yourself and what the world will do for you. You take on obligations that are other people's responsibilities because you feel so good about yourself. You are happy and healthy when you learn how to set real limits without being talked or coerced into overdoing it, in some area of your life. http://www.cafeastrology.com/natal/quincunxinterpretations.html

Venus Inconjunct Jupiter
“shows that you overreact in making adjustments to other people's expectations. Because you are insufficiently aware of your own needs, you generously offer to serve the needs of others. But people are inclined to take advantage of your generosity to the point of abusing it. You are not at all selective in choosing those whom you submit to, which invites all kinds of problems. Evidently you were trained in early years to take an inferior position to others. It is one thing to be accommodating, but being a dormat is something else. There are many occupational functions you can do well.”

From the book ‘Aspects and Personality’ by Karen Hamaker-Zondag

"Sun Quincunx (Inconjunct) Jupiter
Laziness or overextension is a big problem for you at certain points in your life. Any personality difficulties you have (including issues of value) are cleared up through ever deepening self appraisal and honest reflection on how past expectations match your history."
http://www.cafeastrology.com/natal/quincunxinterpretations.html

now venus rules 6th of work and 11th hopes and wishes, friendships and large organisations. so the sun/venus to jupiter in 7th connects to relationships and 2nd house matters like, self esteem, values, beliefs and material possessions as well as earning capacity...

Venus/sun quincunx saturn connects to 9th house matters (saturn indicates where we lack confidence and have to work a bit harder at things)
Basic astrology forum discussing Saturn in houses http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum12/private-jjLYZw161/HTML/000660.html

So prog venus opp prog mars will have a very similar feel as if to natal mars.

"Progressed Venus conjunct Mars When you do it, you like it, and the more you put out, the more you want to do it some more. That applies to about any kind of energy you expend, but especially to energy that is appetite-driven and pleasure-intensive. If you could eat yourself for breakfast, you might -- but why not let someone else do that?

Annie's Note: Your desire nature is strongly stimulated, and the urge to experience new sensations can dominate now. Be careful that you don't ignore your deeper emotions, needs, and wants in your pursuit of pleasure and the latest sensation. Enjoyment of life in the moment is a strong potential now. Heightened needs to express yourself creatively and through romantic/sexual relationships are experienced. Life becomes more colorful and animated." http://cafeastrology.com/progressedplanetsaspects.html

So has your hmmm desire nature been ignited lately??

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I love the parable, “If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, BUT if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for life.”

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SaggiMC
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posted January 26, 2012 11:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SaggiMC     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Money & you http://www.astrotheme.com/files/money_and_you.php http://www.cafeastrology.com/astrologytopics/astrology_of_money_wealth.html
career significators http://www.librarising.com/astrology/misc/significators.html http://www.janetboyer.com/Midheaven_in_Sagittarius.html

planets conj MC http://rugdeeaustralia.tripod.com/id18.html http://www.skyviewzone.com/articles/asrticle3sc.htm

Professional & Destiny http://www.astrotheme.com/files/astrology_professional_destiny.php
sticky in vocational astrology forum http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32775
Astro’s vocation section http://www.babybirthchart.com/zodiac-signs/midheaven/ http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_vocation2_n.htm?lang=z

Career options are assessed by MC any planets conjunct, where the ruler of MC is placed, it’s aspects, then 2nd house ‘how you earn your money’ and planets there, ruler of cusp and where it’s placed, then 6th house of ‘type of work you do’ any planets there and how they are aspected.

Researching rulers of houses will help you understand more where I joining the dots so to speak http://www.cafeastrology.com/natal/rulersofhousesinhouses.html http://www.trans4mind.com/personal_development/astrology/LearningAstrology/housesDerived.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derivative_house http://www.skyviewzone.com/astrology/houserulerships.htm
http://aliceportman.com/?p=1310

So next, I was looking for a link between the MC, 2nd and 6th house rulers and we see a nice mercury trine saturn aspect

------------------
I love the parable, “If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, BUT if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for life.”

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SaggiMC
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posted January 26, 2012 11:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SaggiMC     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
on the down side, T Saturn is squaring your prog venus/sun aspect and temp T Square with jupiter n 7th. T saturn to venus/sun shows low energy vitality levels and being short in finances and having to economise..

Keep an eye on when T Saturn gets at least 1' off prog sun/venus for things to improve.

T Saturn through 11th house shows friends disappearing and evaluating which are true friends and which are 'fair weather friends'
and of course hopes and wishes may shrink and become more realistic and practical due to this saturn influence.

Now on a more positive note T Jupiter is currently squareing prog sun/venus which *could help* also conj chiron may either cause a wound or help heal one connected to children, lovers or 5th house matters. T Jupiter is also trining natal saturn, showing easy caustious expansion related to 5th and 9th house matters. What we 'really need' is T Jupiter aspecting ruler of MC mercury and 6th Feb will be exact and should/could bring some good news. http://www.khaldea.com/kldaephem/2000/feb2012gmt.shtml

also currently T mars is retro over MC has it brought any action at all?? It will be 3rd week in June for it's last direct pass..

hope this helps?

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I love the parable, “If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, BUT if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for life.”

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