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Author Topic:   Oppose Illegal Immigration---You're a Racist
jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 22, 2006 02:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Saturday, April 22, 2006 11:24 a.m. EDT
Poll: Mexicans Say U.S. is Racist

A new poll on Mexican attitudes towards the U.S. debate on illegal immigration has found that a large plurality of those surveyed say Americans who favor tighter border security are "racist."

The survey, co-sponsored by the Dallas Morning New and Mexico's El Universal newspaper, found that the largest segment of respondents - 43 percent - cited racism as the chief reason that Americans oppose illegal immigration.

A much smaller number - 16 percent - said U.S. citizens are most concerned about law enforcement. Just 14 percent think Americans are not racist, but fear being overrun by foreign cultures.

"Yes, it's true about racism," said Gloria Vázquez Solache, 59, a Mexico City resident who was among those polled. "They humiliate our countrymen and even burn Mexican flags. Fear of a 'foreign culture' is nonsense."
The same poll found that 76 percent of Mexicans think that crossing into the U.S. illegally should not be a crime.
79 percent of Mexicans want illegals already in the US to be legalized.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2006/4/22/112611.shtml?s=ic

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lotusheartone
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posted April 22, 2006 02:54 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Silly nonsense..are they nuts..bananas???

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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 22, 2006 03:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well, let's see lotus. In this article it is seen how Mexicans treat their own illegal and legal immigrants.

Quite a contrast to how they think the US should treat illegal immigrants.

Good word..bananas...also hypocrisy!

The USA - Love It or Head South
Michael Reagan
Friday, April 7, 2006


There's a constant drone about the "Nation of Immigrants" America has always proudly claimed to be, but now it's being used as a slogan for those who believe we should accept absolutely anybody - even if they have absolutely no legal right to be here.

Yes, we are a nation of immigrants - all our ancestors came here from someplace else - but the difference is they all came here legally and came to be American citizens.

The illegals that come here for a job or for some other reason don't come to become American citizens.

In 1919 Theodore Roosevelt said it best: "In the first place we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the man's becoming in very fact an American, and nothing but an American," Roosevelt said...

"There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag, and this excludes the red flag, which symbolizes all wars against liberty and civilization, just as much as it excludes any foreign flag of a nation to which we are hostile...We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language...and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."

As far as the kind of treatment illegal immigrants from Mexico deserve, let's treat them as Mexico treats all immigrants. According to the Center for Security Policy's J. Michael Waller, "Mexico deals harshly not only with illegal immigrants. It treats even legal immigrants, naturalized citizens and foreign investors in ways that would, by the standards of those who carp about U.S. immigration policy, have to be called ‘racist' and ‘xenophobic.'

"If you think these critics are mad about U.S. immigration policy now, imagine how upset they would be if we adopted an approach far more radical than the bill they rail against which was adopted last year by the House of Representatives - namely, the way Mexico treats illegal aliens."

For example, according to an official translation published by the Organization of American States, the Mexican constitution includes the following restrictions:

Pursuant to Article 33, "Foreigners may not in any way participate in the political affairs of the country."

Equal employment rights are denied to immigrants, even legal ones. Article 32: "Mexicans shall have priority over foreigners under equality of circumstances for all classes of concessions and for all employment, positions, or commissions of the Government in which the status of citizenship is not indispensable."

Jobs for which Mexican citizenship is considered "indispensable" include, pursuant to Article 32, bans on foreigners, immigrants, and even naturalized citizens of Mexico serving as military officers, Mexican-flagged ship and airline crew, and chiefs of seaports and airports.

Article 55 denies immigrants the right to become federal lawmakers. A Mexican congressman or senator must be "a Mexican citizen by birth."

Article 91 further stipulates that immigrants may never aspire to become cabinet officers as they are required to be Mexican by birth. Article 95 says the same about Supreme Court justices.

In accordance with Article 130, immigrants - even legal ones - may not become members of the clergy, either.

Article 27 states, "Only Mexicans by birth or naturalization and Mexican companies have the right to acquire ownership of lands, waters, and their appurtenances, or to obtain concessions for the exploitation of mines or of waters."

Article 11 guarantees federal protection against "undesirable aliens resident in the country." What is more, private individuals are authorized to make citizen's arrests.

Article 16 states, "In cases of flagrante delicto, any person may arrest the offender and his accomplices, turning them over without delay to the nearest authorities."

According to Article 33, "the Federal Executive shall have the exclusive power to compel any foreigner whose remaining he may deem inexpedient to abandon the national territory immediately and without the necessity of previous legal action."
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2006/4/7/82641.shtml

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lotusheartone
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posted April 22, 2006 03:13 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
the way the majority of the people think today..is very scary..I think I'm still in shock at how American's are talking about the President..perhaps aim it at the government as a whole..but your disrespect towards the President shows me the state of the human condition..is **** poor. ...

everyone continue's to blame..and use their ego..thinking they deseerve better or more..without making any changes..
negative behaviour brings negative outcomes..think about that? what do you think will happen?

Sorry..ranting on wrong thread. ...

I have to be legal to be here in New Hampshire..and I hope everyone else is legal too! The Law is the Law..plain and simple..

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DayDreamer
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posted April 22, 2006 03:54 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I can tell you this new generation coming up (and future generations to come will) have a different take on "authority." They're not like people of the past. So no worries. Laws will be changed. Racism will be history.

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TINK
unregistered
posted April 22, 2006 07:57 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Chalk me up as a rascist 'cause I still firmly believe that immigrants should enter this country legally and should give their allegiance to the USA only. Assuming those two all-important prerequisites are met, I say the more the merrier! Assimilate and contribute - it's the American way, baby.

Now excuse me while I order a little take out Mexican food.

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Johnny
Newflake

Posts: 0
From: Egypt
Registered: Apr 2010

posted April 22, 2006 09:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
(I thought this was hilarious. Don't know the author, but (s)he's dead on.)

Dear President Bush:

I'm about to plan a little trip with my family and extended family, and I would like to ask you to assist me. I'm going to walk across the border from the U.S. into Mexico, and I need to make a few arrangements. I know you can help with this.

I plan to skip all the legal stuff like visas, passports, immigration quotas and laws. I'm sure they handle those things the same way you do here.

So, would you mind telling your buddy, President Vicente Fox, that I'm on my way over? Please let him know that I will be expecting the following:

1. Free medical care for my entire family.

2. English-speaking government bureaucrats for all services I might need, whether I use them or not.

3. All government forms need to be printed in English.

4. I want my kids to be taught by English-speaking teachers.

5. Schools need to include classes on American culture and history.

6. I want my kids to see the American flag flying on the top of the flag pole at their school with the Mexican flag flying lower down.

7 Please plan to feed my kids at school for both breakfast and lunch.

8. I will need a local Mexican driver's license so I can get easy access to government services.

9. I do not plan to have any car insurance, and I won't make any effort to learn local traffic laws.

10. In case one of the Mexican police officers does not get the memo from Pres. Fox to leave me alone, please be sure that all police officers speak English.

11. I plan to fly the U.S. flag from my house top, put flag decals on my car, and have a gigantic celebration on July 4th. I do not want any complaints or negative comments from the locals.

12. I would also like to have a nice job without paying any taxes, and don't enforce any labor laws or tax laws.

13. Please tell all the people in the country to be extremely nice and never say a critical word about me, or about the strain I might place on the economy.

I know this is an easy request because you already do all these things for all the people who come to the U.S. from Mexico. I am sure that President Fox won't mind returning the favor if you ask him nicely. However, if he gives you any trouble, just invite him to go quail hunting with Dick Cheney.

Thank you so much for your kind help.

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TINK
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posted April 22, 2006 09:51 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Some of that's funny and some of it is painfully accurate, but I still think Cinco De Mayo is fun and, although I'm not a beer drinker, a little Corona w/ lime is sometimes yummy.

Big smooches to our Mexican neighbors for keeping the dasterdly French at bay!

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Mirandee
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posted April 23, 2006 12:18 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My only concern is that if we keep illegal aliens out of the U.S. who is going to work for Halliburton?

Gulf Coast Slaves

By Roberto Lovato in New Orleans and Gulfport, Miss.

Halliburton and its subcontractors hired hundreds of undocumented Latino workers to clean up after Katrina -- only to mistreat them and throw them out without pay.

Arnulfo Martinez recalls seeing lots of hombres del ejercito standing at attention. Though he was living on the Belle Chasse Naval Base near New Orleans when President Bush spoke there on Oct. 11, he didn't understand anything the ruddy man in the rolled-up sleeves was saying to the troops. Martinez, 16, speaks no English; his mother tongue is Zapotec. He had left the cornfields of Oaxaca, Mexico, four weeks earlier for the promise that he would make $8 an hour, plus room and board, while working for a subcontractor of KBR, a wholly owned subsidiary of Halliburton that was awarded a major contract by the Bush administration for disaster relief work. The job was helping to clean up a Gulf Coast naval base in the region devastated by Hurricane Katrina. "I was cleaning up the base, picking up branches and doing other work," Martinez said, speaking to me in broken Spanish.

Even if the Oaxacan teenager had understood Bush when he urged Americans that day to "help somebody find shelter or help somebody find food," he couldn't have known that he'd soon need similar help himself. But three weeks after arriving at the naval base from Texas, Martinez's boss, Karen Tovar, a job broker from North Carolina who hired workers for a KBR subcontractor called United Disaster Relief, booted him from the base and left him homeless, hungry and without money.

"They gave us two meals a day and sometimes only one," Martinez said.

"60 Minutes" also exposed this on one of it's shows in which the illegal aliens from not only Mexico but Central America and other places were interviewed.

Since Bush is the one who chose Halliburton to do the clean up in the aftermath of hurricane Katrina he is party to this because he knows Halliburton's practices of hiring illegal aliens. The reason those illegal aliens were hired instead of New Orleans residents who were licensed carpenters is because Halliburton would have to pay higher wages, benefits and answer to OSHA if they did not provide safe working conditions. In the 60's minute show there were illegal aliens working in very unsafe conditions with materials that are hazardous and without the proper equipment to protect them from those materials. You cannot tell me that Bush did not know that Halliburton was recruiting illegal aliens to work for them. If he didn't it further shows he is not fit to run this country. I mean, the guy can't claim ignorance all the time for everything and expect people to not think of him as being ignorant now can he?

The Immigration Act is nothing more than smoke and mirrors in a Republican run Congress and a White House of hypocrites who while at the same time they are talking of putting up fences along the southwestern border are allowing illegal aliens to work in the New Orleans and gulf coast clean up instead of American citizens whose homes are in those states just so Halliburton can make a huge profit and exploit the illegal aliens and their pockets can be lined for looking the other way.

The Republicans always say one thing while behind the scenes they are doing exactly the opposite.

Unless you are a full blooded Native American everyone is in this country is here illegally because the country itself was stolen from the Native American peoples. At least by ancestory I am part legal. Another thing, Africans were brought to this country against their will for the purpose of slavery. They didn't even want to come here. The Irish and Chinese immigrants were targets of both racism and slavery. American has a history of racism and we might as well admit it. You only have to visit any large city in America to see that. Black people are all American born citizens who have fought the wars of this country, contributed greatly to this country's culture,and yet even after having had to fight for their civil rights they are still treated with inequality to whites on the most part. They don't get equality in education or anything else. So stop the bs and flag waving about our "legal immigrants" and how wanting to keep illegal Mexicans out of the U.S is not racially motivated.

It's going to be interesting to find out who is going to build that fence if they don't hire illegal aliens. :laughing"

Another point. Ronald Reagan's famous line was "tear down that wall" and all the Republicans like to think that the Berlin wall came down just because Ronnie said that, now after the Berlin wall finally came down, another Republican wants to build a wall in the U.S. and all those the Republican Bush supporters who thought Ronnie was so great for saying that support Bush' wall.

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Mirandee
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posted April 23, 2006 12:27 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yeah and I also think we should prohibit the flying of the Confederate flag in the south.


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Johnny
Newflake

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From: Egypt
Registered: Apr 2010

posted April 23, 2006 01:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Pfft. The Confederate flag is a symbol *of* the South. Just like the Mexican flag is a symbol of... Mexico. I have nothing against the Mexican flag (except for its awful color scheme), but I still think it is rather poor etiquette to fly a foreign national flag above the flag of the country you reside in. Common courtesy is all.

Besides, it doesn't make sense. If Mexico is so great, why are Mexicans emigrating?

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TINK
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posted April 23, 2006 12:24 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Why does anyone leave? My grandparents never gave up their love of English culture, they were just looking for a new life in what they thought would be a better economical and social situation. Of course, I agree wholeheartedly that another national flag should never be flown above the American. That's traitor territory. But my Irish-American friend wears her Irish flag t-shirt on St Patrick's Day and my Italian-American husband loves nothing better than to walk endlessly down Mulberry St in NYC for the San Gennaro feast(I think he's just secretly reliving the Godfather movies ) My point being ... what's wrong with remembering and celebrating the culture of the old country?

Incidentaly, there's a guy on my block flying a confederate flag on his backyard shed. He's never lived in the south. Gee, I wonder why it's there?

cute point about the Berlin Wall, Mirandee.

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Johnny
Newflake

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From: Egypt
Registered: Apr 2010

posted April 23, 2006 04:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ok, that's a pretty good point, Tink. Like you say, there's nothing wrong with celebrating your culture. I happen to like Mexican food, too.

I think that in many cases, the flag is taken as more a symbol of a refusal to integrate than as an expression of heritage. Not that I'm a fan of American culture, but I can see where the resentment at this would come from. The fact that more and more jobs are requiring applicants to speak Spanish as well as English and all isn't helping, I'm sure.

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Johnny
Newflake

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From: Egypt
Registered: Apr 2010

posted April 23, 2006 05:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
And that is a good comparison to the Berlin wall. Not that our politicians will ever put such a thing in place, though.

More and more, I begin to suspect that this whole illegal immigration issue is just a clever blind to cover the real issues. Paranoid, I know, but I can't shake the feeling...

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pidaua
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Posts: 67
From: Back in AZ with Bear the Leo
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2006 12:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for pidaua     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There is nothing wrong, in my mind, with loving the culture you came from and celebrating it. That said, The AMERICAN flag should always fly the highest or have the more predominant position.

Holding your former countries flag and saying "USA owes us" and "DOWN with the USA" is not an example of loving your new country and still celebrating the traditions of the old country.

Far too often we give people the benefit of the doubt and yet they take from us again and again.

I am so tired of the out-dated argument that "If it weren't for illegals who would work for the big corporations and who would pick up the horrible jobs".

I would like for everyone to take a look at the real statistics and see HOW MUCH it costs for each illegal to come here and go on the system.

How much are we spending in emergency welfare or social security?

How much are we spending with free medical / dental for illegals?

How much are we paying each year to educate illegal immigrant children?

How much are we spending trying to clean up the bags of trash, human waste, clothes, etc... left on our borders and in our homes?


Who reimburses the home owners that come back from vacation to find their windows blown out, feces in their living room and their house treated like a dump? Oh yeah, HOME-OWNERS insurance... once again, it is left to US to clean up ANOTHERS mess.

I would implore anyone that thinks it isn't a problem to come down here to Cochise County, Arizona and spend a week watching what we go through.

I'd love for you to buy a home in Naco, AZ and go on vacation for a week or two and see how pristine it is when you come back.

Hey, better yet, let's see all the environmental peace lovers build a commune out here in Nogales, AZ with crops, animals..etc.. and see how frustrated you get when you find your crops damaged, animals slaugthered and fence cut. That's not all, you'd likely find you're missing clothes you hung on the line because illegals needed a change, meanwhile, they have left you a present of trash, dirty clothes, and most likely cholera carrying feces.

Do I think we have a big problem with corporations aiding illegals? HELL YES!!!! But we need to fix the problem on all ends and not just attack the companies with this pollyanna attitude that it is all their fault and the illegals just want to come over for work.

Sure.. they work AND collect SSI / Welfare. I lived in OC, California where it was nothing to see 25 illegals in a 4 bedroom house working off their payment for coming into the US.. this was in LAGUNA HILLS.

The scam is HUGE and people need to start giving a crap about our financial system and what we are losing everyday.

In this county you CANNOT have a baby in any hospital other than Sierra Vista Regional. My county is over 6200 square miles of land, but because of the burden the hospitals carried with delivering babies born to illegals, they had to shut down the programs in Benson, Douglas and Bisbee.

When Naco, Mexico decides gas is too expensive, they fail to use their composting equipment on their dump that lines the border. It catches on fire, pours out toxic fumes, and low and behold... the US comes over to put out the fire, give them gas for all their vehicles and picks up the tab. Why? Because we are down wind of Mexico and we breathe their pollution.

It will get worse as we force more companies out of the US and into other countries where the EPA doesn't exist.

Yep... come on out people - we'd love to have ya along our borders.

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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2006 02:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't think many people know how much damage illegal aliens are doing in the border areas Pid.

The great American giveaway
Posted: April 24, 2006
1:00 a.m. Eastern
WorldNetDaily.com

Barbara Simpson

Ever get so frustrated with a problem that you have to do something?

Then you know how Chris Simcox and the volunteer Minuteman Civil Defense Corps feel, to say nothing of U.S. citizen property owners along the Mexican border in Arizona, California New Mexico and Texas.

While our elected representatives are off in their home districts or on vacation – and while our president is busy smoothing the way for China and making political amends with California Republicans – citizens of this country who are fed up with the illegal-alien problem, decided to do something!

Simcox sent an ultimatum to the president via the news media that the Mexican border needs to have the National Guard or the reserves on duty by May 25 to control the flow of illegals. If not, volunteers and property owners in four states will build border fences on their own property. They're dead serious.


They've had it with illegal aliens trespassing their land, theft of property, vehicles and animals, vandalism, destruction of fences, barns and trails, litter that includes human waste, plus threats and increasing violence.

That's a side of those little Mexican farmers who are just coming here for a better life that the media neglect to report. You'd never know there was ever more of a problem than just people coming into the country illegally.

As if that weren't bad enough.

In fact, that alone is enough, because for them to get here, they cross public and private property violating the border of a sovereign nation. It isn't a stretch to say that many of them simply don't have a sense that they should not steal, litter, vandalize and destroy property that doesn't belong to them, much less violate the border.

Why should they? They clearly don't have a sense of "ownership" whether you're talking about someone else's property or someone else's country.

Apparently, they believe – and indeed have been taught to believe – that the United States is there and they have a right to it.

How about that!

Apparently this country agrees. Let's face it, if we didn't agree, something would have been done long ago to put a stop to it.

Somewhere along the line, the people elected to represent the citizens of this country, to uphold the laws of this country and to respect the Constitution and how it protects the sovereignty of the nation, have lost their way. Instead of doing their job, they're engrossed with devising a way to forgive these people for boldly breaching our borders, provide them jobs and give them citizenship as a reward!

What a deal!

They'll be rewarded for jumping the border, working cheap for cash to avoid taxes, using false identification, driving without licenses or insurance, milking the welfare system, crowding our schools, lowering the graduation rate because of language deficiencies, clogging the courts, filling our jails and prisons, bankrupting our hospitals and medical support system and ultimately sending most of the money they earn to Mexico to such a degree that it's the main source of income for that country, second only to its oil production.

Congress went home for vacation without dealing with the illegal-alien problem, but nobody told the illegals it's vacation time.

Easter or not, the crowds storming the border have increased. They want to get here to take advantage of what they see as a free pass to the States.

Isn't that nice? Everything stops for the lawmakers when it's a holiday. They're the same people who were carrying on in Washington as though their very lives depended on finding a solution to the immigration problem. But then, it was holiday time.

Don't they know Easter is a religious holiday? I thought that was off limits.

Yes, they call it a "recess," but never mind. Any excuse will do. It means the work of elected representatives stops. Even, in an emergency.

And this is an emergency.

This invasion of our country continues. Every single week, like clockwork, thousands of people illegally cross our borders, primarily from Mexico, and disappear into our country.

But, hey: Why let threats to our sovereignty – to say nothing of leaving the door open to terrorists – get in the way of some time on the home front for lawmakers to schmooze the media and the money bags for the upcoming election and, of course, the people whose votes they want.

Elections come first and that means telling people what they want to hear. Honesty of intent is not their strong point.

Can't you just hear them telling those suckers how much they want to do something about the border problems, but that other party puts up roadblocks.

That's a line easily used by both Democrats and Republicans. Because once they realized that illegal immigration would be a hot election issue, they all jumped on their own bandwagon and aim to be the anointed ones to solve the problem.

The reality is, the "problem" is a monster that's out of control because of the complicity of politicians and bureaucrats on both sides of the aisle and quite frankly, their dereliction of duty.

Not only did they enable the last amnesty – which never should have happened – but they've made it possible for employers, from small businesses to national corporations, to hire illegals with impunity.

We're constantly told illegals do work Americans won't. Please. These same companies are quick to move operations offshore for even cheaper labor. Americans be damned.

As for those who won't work? Who did those jobs before we had millions of illegals with fake ID, illegal drivers licenses and stolen Social Security numbers? Why do we countenance their continued illegal status and support their drain on our social services, schools, health care, jails and prisons?

Why have we gone mad?

And speaking of mad – in the angry sense – U.S. citizens are beginning to speak out and now, with the plan to build private fences, they're taking action.

It's just the beginning. Americans are not that stupid. They see the sham of the guest-worker program with no border enforcement. They see through proposals that don't include a plan to coordinate the new program, no money to fund it, or how the massive new bureaucracy would operate.

And bottom line: These American citizens value their citizenship and the benefits of their country. They don't want it all cheapened by giving it all away to millions of people who break laws with no compunction, and who want to be here but not to become real Americans.

If the government won't fix it, the people will. Talk about a sleeping giant.

I hope President Bush and Congress are listening.
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=49873


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pidaua
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Back in AZ with Bear the Leo
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2006 02:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for pidaua     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
jwhop,

That is an excellent article and captures the sentiment of most people where I live and people I have spoken with from other border counties.

People here, regardless of race - and many of which are legal born hispanics - are sick and tired of not being properly represented. Southern California, Southern Arizona and Texas have all voted to repeal aid to illegals (I am not sure about NM they are usually in their own weird world). Every time it is called unconstitutional by some liberal judge in the northern regions.

People out East, up North and in the Midwest only see the 10% of hardworking immigrants that want to get their citizenship instead of the other 90% that are here for illegal reasons (meaning, collection aid AND working under the table- double dipping). Not to mention crossing over at 9 months pregnant to have the child here to guarantee status.

I know people want to do what they feel is right, but they just don't understand until they open their eyes and see the real problem. Even most residents of Phoenix / Tucson don't understand the problem.

On a health note, we have doctors along the border being paid to allow immigrants over with antibiotic resistant tuberculosis along with other communicable diseases. Some of these illegals are NOT Mexican, but come from China, Iran, El Salvador..etc...

When I drive from Sierra Vista to Benson along HWY 90 / 92 I see hundreds of backpacks stuck on barb wire fences, along with water bottles, clothes and other goods. They run along almost the entire 30 mile stretch and have been put out there as a way to show us how HUGE the problem is.

We are told to be careful driving down Double Adobe road because of the washes where the illegals hide. Careful if you go to the grocery store in Bisbee (about 5 miles away from Naco, Mexico) because we have had people car-jacked by illegals.

If you see a water jug on the side of the road, be careful and look for runners, because that is an indication of a "pick up" zone.

So maybe it makes me a racist that I don't want people coming here illegally, but then so be it.

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Mirandee
unregistered
posted April 24, 2006 03:01 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:

"the way the majority of the people think today..is very scary..I think I'm still in shock at how American's are talking about the President..perhaps aim it at the government as a whole..but your disrespect towards the President shows me the state of the human condition..is **** poor. ...
everyone continue's to blame..and use their ego..thinking they deseerve better or more..without making any changes..
negative behaviour brings negative outcomes..think about that? what do you think will happen?"

Respect doesn't come with a title, lotus. It has to be earned. Pres. Bush has done nothing to earn the respect of the American people and blind alliegiance is not patriotism nor a positive thing.

People's negative thoughts regarding this adminstration are the result of things Bush and his administration have done. NOT the cause of the things he has done. Now who is blaming who? Bush has created nearly 1 million more poor Americans for every year that he has been president. He has taken away just about everything he can from the working class people of this country who ARE the majority and given it to the wealthy who are the minority. Yet we are supposed to, in your mind, be positive about that? Get Real!!!! The man advocates torture. Will that produce positive outcomes in your mind?

So, lotus, if negative outcomes come from negative behavior ( and I agree with you on that ) then the negative behavior of Bush and his policies has produced the negative outcomes that he is seeing in the polls and in his unpopularity with American citizens. Not vice versa. Cause and effect. We are the effect, Bush is the cause. You have it twisted around the other way.

There are some things that you have all said regarding immigrants that I do agree with. I agree that they should make more of an effort to assimilate into their new society by learning the language instead of expecting us to learn their language. Though it wouldn't hurt Americans to learn new languages and schools are now teaching other languages beginning in grade school. My grand daughters are learning Japanese in grade school and love it. It is also going to be part of the high school graduation requirements beginning next year in Michigan. We live in a different America than the one we grew up in. A different world. We cannot stubbornly hold to old ways any more than the immigrants can. We have to learn to assimilate too. We have to assimilate into a whole different world and a whole different society in America than the one we knew in the past.

In the work place the reason companies want their employees to learn other languages is because most companies are no longer run by American owners as they were. Companies deal more internationally now and it is important to know a language other than English if you want a good job in any company these days.

We can hardly be angry that immigrants don't seem to care to assimilate if we refuse to assimilate to new ways ourselves.

The flag is just a symbol. It would do Americans well to worry more about what this country is truly based on...the constitution...then spend all their time worrying over the flag. I have noticed that the people who present themselves as the true patriots and make such a fuss over the flag will fly their flags on their porches and car antennae in all kinds of weather to the point it becomes faded and ragged and then get ticked off because they feel someone else is being disrespectful of the flag.

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Mirandee
unregistered
posted April 24, 2006 03:05 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Pidaua, I would wager that with Bush in office we are not spending a whole lot of tax money on welfare for immigrants or anyone else as he has cut all social programs drastically.

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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2006 03:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As usual Mirandee, lots of allegations but not one iota of proof anything you said is true.

To the contrary, everything you said is an outright leftist lie. Where are the lies you post here hatched Mirandee?

The record is replete with the lies posted here by leftists and the record here also reflects the proof they were nothing but lies.

Where does "Thou Shalt Not Bear False Witness Against Thy Neighbor" fall into the religious beliefs you say you have? Or, have we examined different Bibles?

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lotusheartone
unregistered
posted April 24, 2006 03:33 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Mirandee..said..respect doesn't come with a title, lotus..

respect is something that all should be given.

Believing Lies is the wrong thing to do..don't you think?

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Isis
Newflake

Posts: 1
From: Brisbane, Australia
Registered: May 2009

posted April 24, 2006 05:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Isis     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My mother is an immigrant. When she came into this country LEGALLY in 1961, she had to jump through so many hoops prior to being given the green light by the embassy to come here, it wasn't even funny .

She had to get a police report from every city she had ever lived in, verifying that she had no criminal record. She had to have a series of medical exams and immunizations. She had to check in w/ immigration once/year. If you didn't check in, they came and found you and deported you.

She is from New Zealand. NZ is not a 3rd world country with known problems with TB, Cholera, etc...and it is predominantly white.

So does that mean that our immigration policies were racist against white folk back in 1961? If so, that's the first I've ever heard of it.

So why then, if we want to reimplement some of the immigration policies and enforcement that we had in place easily from 1900 to at least 1961, are we considered to be racist - we weren't racist when the exact same policies were applied to predominantly white European immigrants.

Oh that's right, because if you disagree with a pro-illegal immigration leftist, they just slap a nasty monniker on you, like racist - I mean, hell it's much easier than engaging in intelligent debate on the subject.

Ask just about ANYONE who emigrated to the US LEGALLY, who had to go through the whole rigmarole, what they think about amnesty and the current state of immigration. Remember, the operative word there is LEGALLY.

I have yet to meet someone who isn't a card carrying member of a white supremacist group who thinks IMMIGRATION is bad... You'll have a hell of a time finding an American who doesn't know that we're a nation of immigrants.

But ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION...and the chaos that ensues as a result...

It's very true that Mexico has a problem with Central and South American illegal immigrants, not just those going through Mexico to reach the US, but many of them whose goal is to stay in Mexico. They are treated shamefully - murdered and subject to bribes by the police and military, the women raped, I mean, really, I challenge someone to find an article online from a reputable source that can argue that Mexico has this wonderful track record of treating their illegal immigrants humanely.

I mean, doesn't it defy logic that THEY want US to treat their illegal immigrants better than they have EVER CONSIDERED treating their own illegals.

What I find most amusing is that people who for years viewed illegal Mexican immigration as a problem of "other" states, are now screaming bloody murder as illegals start moving in on their towns and jobs in Tennesee, Kentucky, etc.

I also don't think that anyone would argue that we don't need to crack down on the use of illegal immigrants by businesses both big and small. I see that as the single biggest hurdle to implementing sound immigration policy.

I'm all for LEGAL, regulated immigration, and I don't really care if the immigrants come from Uganda, Guatemala, or France (ok well, maybe not France...LOL)(that was a joke for those who take themselves and the French too seriously).

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Johnny
Newflake

Posts: 0
From: Egypt
Registered: Apr 2010

posted April 24, 2006 05:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Pidaua and Isis. Great posts.

Of course, I might have to report you for hate-crimes, but they're still great.

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pidaua
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Back in AZ with Bear the Leo
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2006 06:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for pidaua     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Mirandee,

I absolutely have to disagree. I am the grants administrator for my county schools. Basically, I see the money pouring in for the education of immigrants in our state (I am also the ed services director of my county and meeting with all the other county director). We receive more money these days in grants allocated for the education of non-English speaking children than ever before. In fact, you can thank the Bush administration for increasing that budget and carrying it down to the teachers.

Not to mention the millions going into Border health (also bioterrorism on the borders) not only from CDC but also from Homeland Security and our states.

Welfare here has skyrocketed and the reason our hospitals closed the baby wards is because we couldn't keep up with the costs.

I also worked for Bioterrorism for this county and I know the Millions we received as well as the county health department for WIC / immigrant health care (again, not even a slight decrease AFTER the constituents of AZ voted to stop the funding).

Monies will get pulled if not properly spent and if there is too much carryover. At this time, we are still putting out too much for supporting those illegals and it is breaking our backs.

You should see the line at the PO boxes in Naco, Douglas, Nogales and elsewhere when the welfare checks come through. The good people of Mexico get days passes to come over, pick up their checks from the US post office and then shop here in our stores. LOL...


If you have concrete facts to the contrary (and they have to be specific to the funding of illegal immigrants) then I would love to see them. Telling me we are getting more and more people off welfare doesn't cut it.

As far as the working class? Hmmm.... I am still considered working class as are my friends (we all make less that $50,000 and most make around the $30,000 to $40,000) I feel life has gotten better.

When I was considered wealthy I got killed with taxes and pretty much took home what I am making now lOl... Try explaining this to someone that has been on welfare most of their lives.

Great example is a woman that was paid by an illegal to carry his baby. She got automatic SSI / DES food stamps and has been on it for the past 5 years. She worked with us for about 4 weeks, never could finish a full day or work or even a full work week. Instead, she b1tched about not getting enough in aid and how DES caught her still receiving her checks AND getting paid by the county.

She decided to quit working here so that she could go back on full aid, child care, free computer training and foodstamps.

The father? He's here illegally and claims some kind of crap for being the father.

The thing is Mirandee, it is too easy to blame an administration or say that the illegals are poor victims. But live here - come here and deal with what we have to deal with and then tell me how happy you are when you see how much of your county budget goes to repairing the damage and aiding illegals.

I understand they are people too and my heart sinks every time I hear of deaths along the border from over-exposure, murder, etc...

I know that there are some that really want to work and they want the American dream, at the same time, procuring something illegally does not make it right.


johnny,


LOL... well a hate crime as to do criminal action taken against a person based on their color, race, ethnicity, gender or sexual orientation.

I have never comitted a hate crime (some may feel though that my speech against illegal immigration is 'hate speech' but again, there is no hateful intent).

Hee hee.... sorry, but that Sag side of me had to play 'legal' definition

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pidaua
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Back in AZ with Bear the Leo
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2006 06:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for pidaua     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
**** Keep in mind, this is because people out here are getting sick and tired of the illegals crossing and have become dedicated to protecting the borders**** The 50% decrease is a direct result of the minute men also protecting our borders.


ALSO... PLEASE really think about those numbers. Last year 2,000 people crossed over from Mexico in our county (http://www.willcoxaz.net/ccmap.html)

We only have 125,000 people in this county. This year in March the numbers dropped to about 10,000 (That is still 3.5 times the population here in old Bisbee)


BP, Fort: County seeing fewer illegal crossers

BY BILL HESS
Sunday, April 16, 2006 12:43 AM MDT



Herald/Review

TUCSON — Apprehensions of illegal immigrants in Cochise County in March is down by more than 50 percent, according to a spokeswoman for the U.S. Border Patrol’s Tucson Sector.

The reduction is about 7 percent sectorwide, Shannon Stevens said Thursday.

The emphasis in the county is paying off, she said, adding the number of agents, use of unmanned aerial systems and other technology also will be used to establish operational control in the Tucson Sector’s west desert area.

The West Desert Corridor is now absorbing the most illegal immigrant traffic.

“We’re concentrating as many assets as we can (in the western part of the sector),” she said.


The Tucson Sector covers most of Arizona, except the area around the state’s boundary with California, which is under control of the Yuma Sector.

Last month, 63,574 illegal immigrants were apprehended throughout the Tucson Sector, compared to 63,803 in March 2005, according to figures provided by Stevens.

In Cochise County, 10,230 illegal immigrants were taken into custody last month, versus 21,232 in March 2005, she said.

According to Fort Huachuca spokeswoman Tanja Linton, figures provided her by the post’s 18th Military Police Detachment indicate a reduction in illegal immigrants detained on the installation.

Illegal immigrants are not apprehended on the post by MPs, but are legally detained until they are turned over to the Border Patrol.

Last month 106 illegal immigrants were detained on the post, compared to slightly more than 500 in March of last year, according to the MP figures.

Stevens said that since Oct. 1, 2005, through the end of last month 207,869 illegal immigrants were apprehended in the sector, compared to 222,795 for the same six-month period in the previous federal fiscal year.

As for the number taken into custody by agents at the three stations in the county for the first half of this budget year compared to the same period the previous financial year, the numbers are down — 47,428 and 97,385 respectively, Stevens said. The three Border Patrol Stations are Douglas, Naco and Willcox.

Figures provided by the fort MP officials also show a downward trend for the six-month periods of illegal immigrants detained.

So far this fiscal year 649 have been detained by post officials, compared to nearly 1,500 from Oct. 1, 2004, through March 31, 2005.

Deaths in the sector in the first six months of the fiscal year are down slightly, compared to the previous time period — 57 versus 60.

However, there has been a 44 percent increase in marijuana in the sector from Oct. 1, 2005, to the end of last month with 381,806 pounds confiscated, Stevens said. The amount for the previous six months was 251,736 pounds.

Last month, 61,050 pounds of marijuana was seized throughout the sector compared to 40,495 pounds in March 2005.

Like the reduction in illegal immigrants apprehended in the county, the amount of marijuana seized was down. Stevens said 1,964 pounds were confiscated last month in the county versus 5,540 pounds in March 2005.

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