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Author Topic:   Evidence of Thermite on Core Columns at WTC
Johnny
Newflake

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From: Egypt
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posted April 24, 2006 03:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?noframes;read=87932

Interesting picture on the link. Didn't want to steal their bandwidth, though.

There is substantial evidence that thermite was used to cut the central support columns, which caused the towers to fall.

Evidence can be seen on photographs of the columns from the rubble of the World Trade Center.

In this photo, for example, the column directly above the fireman's helmet shows that it was cut with thermite. There is a substantial amount of hardened molten iron which can be seen on both the inside and outside of the box column. This is precisely what one would expect to find on a column which had been cut with thermite.

Experts who have viewed this photograph say that this column was not cut with a torch.

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Mirandee
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posted April 24, 2006 11:27 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for posting this, Johnny. I had not heard this before or seen those pictures.

I did not know exactly what thermite was so I got info on that from Wikipedia at the link below:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermite

The pictures shown at Wikipedia are similiar to those at the WTC. It shows a test of thermite in the Utah desert and the same flame and white smoke is there as was present at the WTC.

This would substantiate what some custodians at the WTC reported seeing around the towers in the week prior to the attack on more than one floor. They reported seeing devices that looked like bombs but nothing was done about their reports. No follow up to their report is real odd to me since the WTC was bombed before 9/11.

In the Wikipedia article on thermite it says that it is used in war in the form of bombs.

Many architectual experts have come out and said those towers would not have collapsed as the result of just being hit by a plane.

Another odd thing sticks in my mind, Johnny, and that is that on each of those hi-jacked jets the passenger load was very light for a weekday. It is almost as if those particular flights were selected based on "collateral damage" or lower kill numbers. Now, if it were al Queida (sp.?)terrorists who purportedly hate Americans it would seem the larger the kill the better.

Lots of unanswered questions about the events of that day and due to the cover-up and Bush's refusal to allow independent investigations we will probably never know. Which is odd too for a president. You would think he would want to get to the bottom of it all and be as thorough as possible. Just his reaction in that class room after being told what was taking place, the look on his face, tells me our government is involved in the murder of those innocent people. It was the "Pearl Harbor" they needed to launch a war with Iraq which they had already planned and to use fear to govern and grab more and more power.

Hard to believe our government would do such a thing and I don't think that prior to Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld it would have been possible. I do believe anything is possible with this group though because they have more than proven that. Even torture is fine with these men which truly shows their moral fiber and what they are capable of. Sociopaths all of them.

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Johnny
Newflake

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posted April 24, 2006 05:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting point about the passenger loads on the planes, Mirandee. I've never heard about that, but I suppose that isn't surprising. More reading to do, I guess.

Another point I remember being confused about even at the time was Building 7. Why did it fall down, allegedly? No planes hit it, after all. Weird. Or not so weird, depending on how you look at it.

You might find this article interesting, too. I sure did. Those who do not learn from history, and all that...
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ARTICLE5/

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Harpyr
Newflake

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From: Alaska
Registered: Jun 2010

posted April 24, 2006 10:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Harpyr     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
thanks johnny, I hadn't seen that info yet..

here:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...q=loose+change

anybody else seen this video yet? it's about an hour and a half long but very interesting. it doesn't mention the thermite exactly but has some other stuff about other skyscrapers that have been on fire for excessive amounts of time and yet did not collapse ...

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jwhop
Knowflake

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From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2006 10:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The Rumor Mill News Reading Room Johnny?

Ummmm, please have a look at that picture again Johnny. You will notice...or you should notice that's not a concrete support column. That's wood and it's a hollow structure...not a support column for supporting a building....which are not hollow and are definitely not wooden.

Look in the background. There you will see concrete support columns, columns which look very different from the one supposedly cut by thermite.

Perhaps that's why they call their site the Rumor Mill?

One wonders who those experts are who viewed the picture and declared that a support column?
http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?noframes;read=87932

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lotusheartone
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posted April 24, 2006 11:02 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
the voice of reason..Jwhop..

I don't know why..but people like to believe lies..and like to blame..and disrespect each other..what on earth..is going to happen..to balance this negative..bad nonsense?

Love is ALL

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Petron
unregistered
posted April 24, 2006 11:26 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
those skyscrapers were held up by concrete support columns eh jwhop??

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Petron
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posted April 24, 2006 11:33 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Columns

The core columns were steel box-columns that were continuous for their entire height, going from their bedrock anchors in the sub-basements to near the towers' tops, where they transitioned to H-beams. Apparently the box columns, more than 1000 feet long, were built as the towers rose by welding together sections several stories tall. The sections were fabricated by mills in Japan that were uniquely equipped to produce the large pieces. 2


Some of the core columns apparently had outside dimensions of 36 inches by 16 inches.
http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/arch/core.html

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Petron
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posted April 24, 2006 11:37 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
however, speaking as an expert myself....those steel columns do look like they were cut with a plasma torch......

* at least the one in the center with the melted slag around it

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Harpyr
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posted April 24, 2006 11:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Harpyr     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
the voice of reason... Petron.

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lotusheartone
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posted April 24, 2006 11:49 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I know an artist who uses a plasma torch for steel sculpture..awesome tool!

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Mirandee
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posted April 25, 2006 12:38 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Lotus, you are free to believe Bush's lies and we are free to believe as we choose. You are also free to not read our "negative nonsense" if it upsets your looking at the world through rose colored glasses and denying any reality that does not fit into your neat little box.

The voice of reason, hmmmmm.

Jwhop, if that was wood it would have been disintegrated by the intense flames and heat in the WTC that day. All you would have seen were ashes. What it actually looks like to me is burnt and twisted metal. Wood does not melt like that Jwhop. Anyone with common sense would know that. In a fire wood chars and becomes blackened if not burnt to ashes. Have you ever seen a house that burnt down?

Thanks for your post Petron. No way would a structure the size of the WTC have wooden columns supporting it. Nice try, Jwhop.

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jwhop
Knowflake

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From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
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posted April 25, 2006 01:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
First, that so called support beam in the center of the picture behind the fireman is not a metal beam. It's obviously wood and probably had nothing to do with supporting anything. Further, it's obviously hollow.

Second, you're looking at ground level, not the fire area so there's no reason to think anything there would be charred...except some debris which might have fallen from above where the fire actually was.

Third Petron, I never said the concrete beams were the main anchor supports for the superstructure around which the building was built.

Fourth Petron, those are obvious concrete support beams in the background and those would be found at ground level. You can drive into any underground or street level parking area in hi-rise buildings and find concrete beams exactly like those.

Fifth Petron, there is a beam which looks like steel and perhaps with a poured concrete center that appears on the right side in the foreground. That beam looks like it was cut but there isn't any slag.

Lastly, none of the beams or supports in the picture are in any way twisted, bent, melted or blackened by smoke or heat.

None of them show any signs of an explosion at ground level.

Just more BS conspiracy theory to which some are addicted.

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jwhop
Knowflake

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From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
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posted April 25, 2006 01:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Another thing.

Those fireman aren't wearing masks and the dust and smoke is minimal. So, that picture was not taken immediately after the building came down. That picture could have been taken days after the fact.

Further, it's entirely possible some of the steel support beams were still upright...perhaps not all the way to the top but still tall enough to be a hazard if they toppled.

It's entirely possible a crane had been brought in, cables hooked the steel beams and then a construction crew cut them off with a torch..plasma or otherwise.

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Petron
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posted April 25, 2006 01:32 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
jwhop, that certainly is a hollow steel box column, 36x16, after the twisted ends have been torched off.......


and even more definitive evidence the fbi missed, if you blow up the image, you can make out one of the hijackers passports laying on top of the wreckage near the column.....

now if that doesnt convince jwhop i dont think anything will.....

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jwhop
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From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
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posted April 25, 2006 01:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Doctored photos don't move me Petron. A nice clean passport laying right next to a support beam at the former WTC is laughable.

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Johnny
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posted April 25, 2006 01:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
That's a good point about the picture being obviously taken some days after the event, Jwhop - that beam could certainly have been cut with a torch of some sort after the building collapsed. I'd actually considered that, too. Supposedly some experts say that this isn't what happened, but who knows.

I disagree that the beams are wood, though. They don't look like wood to me. I think they're all remarkably metallic looking, but I could be wrong. Wouldn't it make sense for them to be hollow, though? I've always heard that hollow beams are structurally stronger than solid ones, and every documentary on 9/11 that I've read or seen, including the ones that cite the official story, say the support beams were hollow, like the ones in the photograph.

Regardless, I think saying that all of this is just a BS conspiracy theory is too simple an explanation. If you've looked into this matter to any degree at all, you've seen just how much evidence there is out there to suggest that there is more to the events of that day than the official story would have the public believe. I'm not saying that every last bit of the information floating around is valid - some is, as you say, undoubtedly concocted by people who don't know what they're talking about. But certainly not all of it is, and if even a tenth of it has any weight at all, I think we need to stop and think about what its implications might be.

For myself, I'd prefer to keep an open mind.

And Lotus, as George Lichtenberg put it, "With most men, unbelief in one thing springs from blind belief in another." I wonder if that applies here?

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Johnny
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posted April 25, 2006 02:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Johnny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
But Petron, how do you know that passport belongs to one of the highjackers that hated our freedoms? I can't make out any names on it.

I almost get the feeling you're trying to pull a fast-one on us. Do *you* hate our freedoms, too?

Nice try, Osama.

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Petron
unregistered
posted April 25, 2006 02:43 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
well johnny, my imaging software can zoom in even further if you wish.....

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Harpyr
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posted April 25, 2006 03:40 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Harpyr     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
this thread is funny.

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Petron
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posted April 25, 2006 03:44 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Four days after the attacks, the FBI claimed to have found al-Suqami's passport among the rubble on Vesey Street. (This was mistakenly reported by many news outlets to be Mohammed Atta's passport) Some news organizations openly doubted this report, questioning the idea that his passport had escaped from the inferno relatively unsinged. According to testimony before the 9/11 Commission by lead counsel Susan Ginsburg, his passport had been "manipulated in a fraudulent manner". [3]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satam_al-Suqami

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lotusheartone
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posted April 25, 2006 09:17 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
the terrorists are very happy with the way the lot is thinking. ...

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Mirandee
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posted April 25, 2006 10:23 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Quote: "the terrorists are very happy with the way the lot is thinking. ..."

Are you in communication with the terrorists that you know this for a fact, lotus? If not how do you know what the terrorists think?

I agree with Jwhop about that passport in the picture. Everything around that passport is a mess but it is not even dirty and it came through a fire. Which brings us to two, not one possibilites:

1. the picture is indeed doctored as Jwhop suggested

2. the passport was planted and there have been accusations that the passports of the terrorists found at the WTC were planted there as they would not have made it so intact through the crash and intense fire and heat.

Regarding the picture that Johnny orginally posted, I just assumed the picture was taken during the clean-up efforts. It was my understanding, I could be wrong, that it is the white residue found on the steel structures that lead some to the conclusion that thermite was used, also the white flames during the attack and subsequent fire. It is entirely possible that thermite bombs were on the planes with the terrorists.

Any number of things are possible. But the fact remains that there are an enormous amount of unanswered and uninvestigated questions regarding the events and aftermath of 9/11. The fact that Bush did not allow any independent investigations and squelched the questions themselves that were brought up by experts leads one to believe he and his administration were covering up something. The fact that Bush selected his own 9/11 Commission and picked those who would serve on it leads people to suspicion too. The questions are more than just conspiracy theories. They were legitmate questions but because those questions were ignored and not addressed by our government people suspect that something is amiss. Any thinking person is going to get suspicious of these things. Those people who just believe what the government tells them without question will of course resent anyone who dares to question the government and it has more to do with their egos and the fear they have of being proven wrong than loyalty to the government.

In an open and honest government conspiracy theories are not born. In a secretive and dishonest government they are born.

Regarding the firemen not wearing masks, even days later, the Bush administration put pressure on the EPA to lie about the air quality in the aftermath of the attacks. As a result many firemen, policemen and others involved in the clean-up effort were exposed to toxic conditions, some have subsequently developed medical conditions even this early after 9/11. That has been in all the news for years. That was another issue not addressed by Bush's 9/11 Commission.

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lotusheartone
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posted April 25, 2006 11:48 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Mirandee..asked..are you in communication with the terrorists, lotus?

No..but I am in communication with God source. ...

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jwhop
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From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
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posted April 25, 2006 12:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Bush did not pick the members of the 9/11 Commission. Congressional Republicans picked theirs and democrats picked theirs. Committee Chair and Co-Chair may have been selected by Bush...not something I'm sure about. The Committee...democrats and Republicans picked their own investigative staffs.

Neither did Bush direct or control the questions or issues to be explored by the Committee. Bush testified before the Committee....same for Cheney and answered their questions. Additionally, reams of documents were provided to the Committee by the White House, including some classified documents which the President de-classified so the Committee could examine them.

Of course, lotus is correct. Leftist radicals are playing straight into the hands of terrorists...by choice, not by accident. By questioning every action and motive of the President, radical leftists ARE giving aid and comfort to the enemy who have gotten the mistaken idea they can wait until political pressure on the President becomes so great he will have to withdraw from both Iraq and the overall war on terrorism.

Treasonous radical leftists and Saddam Hussein made the same miscalculation before Bush went after Saddam and toppled his murderous regime.

Treasonous radical leftists suk.....big time. Their constant barrage of lies suk even worse.

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