posted October 15, 2007 01:45 PM            

You can die while you're waiting to see a primary care physician...let alone a specialist who could actually treat your medical problem.

English 'pull own teeth' as dental service decays

Oct 15 12:09 PM US/Eastern

Falling numbers of state dentists in England has led to some people taking extreme measures, including extracting their own teeth, according to a new study released Monday.
Falling numbers of state dentists in England has led to some people taking extreme measures, including extracting their own teeth, according to a new study released Monday.

Others have used superglue to stick crowns back on, rather than stumping up for private treatment, said the study. One person spoke of carrying out 14 separate extractions on himself with pliers.

More typically, a lack of publicly-funded dentists means that growing numbers go private: 78 percent of private patients said they were there because they could not find a National Health Service (NHS) dentist, and only 15 percent because of better treatment.

"This is an uncomfortable read for all of us, and poses serious questions to politicians from patients," said Sharon Grant of the Commission for Patient and Public Involvement in Health.

Overall, six percent of patients had resorted to self-treatment, according to the survey of 5,000 patients in England, which found that one in five had decided against dental work because of the cost.

One researcher involved in compiling the study -- carried out by members of England's Patient and Public Involvement Forums -- came across three people in one morning who had pulled out teeth themselves.

Dentists are also concerned about the trend.

Fifty-eight percent said new dentists' contracts introduced last year had made the quality of care worse, while 84 percent thought they had failed to make it easier for patients to find care.

Almost half of all dentists -- 45 percent -- said they no longer take NHS patients, while 41 percent said they had an "excessive" workload. Twenty-nine percent said their clinic had problems recruiting or retaining dentists.

"These findings indicate that the NHS dental system is letting many patients down very badly," said Grant.

"It appears many are being forced to go private because they don't want to lose their current trusted and respected dentist or because they just can't find a local NHS dentist."

posted October 15, 2007 04:57 PM              

Where did they get this information?

Note: I almost did'nt even respond to this post, for fear of being publically bashed and labeled "a leftist" so I ask in advance that you know that I am not.

I am weary of assuming something to be fact based on an article with no one claiming it's words and it's making statistical statements within it, without a way to validate it.

This being said, I'll respond in this manner:
If the article is actually based on reality- this is a very sad situation, Not to mention dangerous!
If the article is fictional- There are still bound to be plenty of sick people out there doing this- people are sometimes known to act stupid.

People here in America act the same way without even the issue of healthcare program coverage. Many people completely fear the dentist and would try alternate methods to fix the issues themselves. Superglue? Why not... LOL!

ps If you want to know how I feel about Hillary see this thread:politicians and their BS

posted October 17, 2007 01:29 PM            

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There have been other posts on the subject of socialist healthcare...and the long waits for medical services, the unavailability of some medical services, the shortages of qualified physicians, nurses and needed medical equipment and the attempts by those running socialist healthcare systems to change behaviors by withholding medical services to some who do not get in line with their social programs.

Smokers have been stricken from lists of those who could and should receive life saving heart and lung treatments.

Overweight persons have been refused knee and hip replacements.

The little socialist planners are using the socialist healthcare systems to penalize those who do not subscribe to their own personal beliefs by withholding medical services to those who have paid into the system(s) most of their lives.

Socialist healthcare is a gigantic failure and the systems are breaking down all over the world.

Why the hell should we go down a road we already know is a deadend?

Patients from other nations with socialist healthcare systems come to America for medical treatment yet, the little socialist planners...which would include Hillary Clinton, John Edwards, Algore and other socialists, communists and Progressives are in the process of attempting to destroy the best healthcare system in the world. Since they don't and can't control it, they are attempting to destroy it.

posted October 19, 2007 02:18 PM            

By law, no one in America can be refused medical treatment for injury or disease because of an inability to pay for medical services.

The fact you may not be able to choose your own doctor for medical services you must be rendered by law is tough shiiit.

Under HillaryCare or any other form of socialist healthcare you sure as hell will not be able to choose your own doctor or much of anything else.

posted October 20, 2007 10:45 AM            

quote:

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Heathcare in the hands of the government scares the bejesus out of me. Scares me almost as much as the sway the pharmaceutical industry appears to have over said government. *sigh* It's all about money, I suppose.

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quote:

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What is it that some people seem intellectually incapable of understanding about the difference between healthcare and health insurance?

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Thanks for that.

Why anyone would want the government, of all institutions, telling them what kind of medical treatment they are allowed to get and where and when and why and how is beyond me. Have you not met the government? Do you not see how inept most governmental bureaucracies generally are? And how darn stingy and greedy they can be?

So, let's see ... some people want the government telling their children what to believe (education), what kinds of foods to eat and drugs to take(USDA and FDA), and now what kinds of medical treatment they can have? Because we can always trust our govermental officials to always put our best interests first, right? They'll make sure everyone gets the treatments they need and also make sure everyone is paid accordingly, right?

Seriously, have I missed the part where the anti-government and/or anti-this-adminstration bunch decided giving precisely those people MORE control over us was a good idea?

I think some people think Free means better or good, somehow. Well, it really won't be FREE at all, will it? Think about it.

posted October 20, 2007 08:15 PM              

quote:

---

So, let's see ... some people want the government telling their children what to believe (education), what kinds of foods to eat and drugs to take(USDA and FDA), and now what kinds of medical treatment they can have? Because we can always trust our govermental officials to always put our best interests first, right? They'll make sure everyone gets the treatments they need and also make sure everyone is paid accordingly, right?

---

posted October 20, 2007 08:30 PM            

Nobody wants to see a poor/rich divide in healthcare...but how anyone can think that giving that power over to the government is going to fix anything always baffles me.

Has anyone involved in this discussion who's advocating socialized healthcare, ever lived in a country with socialized medicine? Experienced their systems first hand? Had to watch a loved one get in line for treatment because of limited resources, only to die before it's "their turn"?

posted October 20, 2007 09:22 PM            

I don't have a problem w/ the govt subsidizing med for the poor...problem is..define poor?

The government, actually, already subsidizes medical for the "poor" (ie; those below the poverty line)...the problem here really isn't the "poor"...it's the "middle class" that works and makes more than the federal poverty level, but still can't afford healthcare...

Limiting prices on meds...while it sounds good ideally, who decides how much is too much? At what point do they just stop researching new meds cause it's just not profitable enough...and who decides what consitutes "too much profit"...

posted October 20, 2007 09:27 PM            

Secondly, the middle class is shrinking and growing poorer.

posted October 20, 2007 09:32 PM            

Since we're playing that game, it's "first off, it's spelled orifice".... Proper tense is as important as spelling, moreso I'd say. But I love the irony of you making a mistake in grammar while correcting my spelling.

Whether the middle class is shrinking or not is not the issue here, and nobody claimed that wasn't the case. But nice try w/ another diversion.

Don't try that slippery slope argument that government can cure all your woes...

posted October 20, 2007 09:40 PM            

I think this war money would be better spent on education and health care. I'm sorry if that makes me a big communist.

posted October 21, 2007 03:02 AM            

There is a difference between the government regulating to prevent exploitation, and the government providing...or attempting to provide poorly as would be the case, a service.

I think the state of healthcare in the US, in many ways, needs fixing.

posted October 21, 2007 07:57 AM            

I don't think our system is perfect. I think it has a lot of potential as far as being able to provide more opportunities for state of the art treatments ... in theory. Does that mean that all people receive or can afford adequate treatment? No. I haven't read a single person saying otherwise here.

One of the biggest problems is the lack of affordable health insurance. Affordable. Not "free". (What services are really 100% free in the US, really? That is, no one is paying for them?)

But if the government can't even find a way to handle insurance companies how does the idea that they'll be able to handle the entire health care system even pass for a logical idea? It's insanity.

You don't trust the government to behave morally regarding warfare or financial decisions but somehow, when it comes to people's health, you assume they'll do the right thing? Because the education system in the US is something to brag about, right? And the number of people that have died using FDA approved drugs is a drop in the ocean, right?

I just can't wrap my brain around the inconsistencies.

Yeah, I've lived without health insurance ... most of my life, truth be told. Yeah, I've had to pay thousands of dollars over the years for health care because of that. Was I happy about that? No. Do I wish I'd had insurance? Yes. Am I going to blame the "rich" man or the "white" man or any other man for "keeping" me poor? Uh, no. I know why I couldn't afford health insurance. And I worked my own way out of that situation. (No, I am not suggesting that just because I did it that everyone else can do it, too ... in case anyone was going to assume that.)

I don't care that rich people can afford health care. Good. Everyone who works a full time job*, imo, should be able to afford healthcare for themselves and their families ... yes, including those fortunate rich people who were probably "born" into wealth and don't "work hard" for their money. Oy.

posted October 22, 2007 01:16 PM            

The charges are true and are not subject to leftist spin or manipulation. The systems are breaking down and leaving those who have paid in out of luck..or waiting in long lines to get needed medical services. Not only that but socialist planners are attempting to us the system to alter citizens behavior...not provide needed medical services but rather refusing medical services to those whose lifestyle choices they do not agree with.

As for the leftist press of Europe...where you get your daily ration of leftist bullshiiit; why would you want to get your news second hand?

You could have gone right to the source of all leftist truth TASS and or Pravda...that is until Ronald Reagan brought about the destruction of the communist Soviet Union.

You're still not completely out of luck though. There's still China's Xinhua News Agency. Why get your Marxist, Leninist, Maoist news from the BBC or other leftist news sources? It's second hand and clearly inferior to the real Marxist, Maoist, Leninist news.

I do hope the British...and the rest of Europe will forgive the United States...and we uninformed redneck citizens as well...for saving their as$es twice in the 20th Century. Not to mention keeping them safe for 40 years of a cold war brought on by the desire of the Soviet Union to spread it's tenacles into Western Europe.

No good deed ever goes unpunished..so they say.

posted October 23, 2007 01:24 PM            

There has been a great deal published about the system as well as the Canadian system.

If you want to see more "truth" in America, you will need to get some duct tape for the mouths of Hillary, Kerry, Kennedy, Durbin, Leahey, Schumer, Pelosi, Murtha, Reid, Michael Moore, George Soros, Media Matters, Move on dot org, daily kos, democrat underground and the rest of the leftist liars infesting the United States. It wouldn't hurt if you could also manage to break the fingers of the lying leftist American press...if your goal is "more truth".