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Author Topic:   jwhop - advise
sunshine_lion
unregistered
posted March 31, 2009 08:50 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ok say someone bought a house two years ago for 100,000. the market valeue assesment and taxes were set at the house being 150,000. two years later, the market falls apart and the actual sellable value of the home is 50,000. the taxes are being paid on the value of 150,000. not fair. ok. so the lady in the story write to the city and they lower the tax value to 125,000 and then pass some mills and raise it anyway. so the nice lady gets p!ssed off and decides she wants to appeal. she finds over 100 homes that sold in the last quarter of the year and asks again with proof of market true value to lower said taxes. in the paperwork for an appeal it states, don't bring your financial standing or issues to this board, it has nothing to do with the value of your home, type wording. so the nice lady waits for her letter to say when she can come talk to this city council. whom of course the school board sits on. the nice lady thinks, hhhmmmm, if this were business it would be a conflict of interest to have school board members who stand to profit from my tax assessment serving on this council that is supposed to give fair market value assessments. everyday on thenews she hears how broke the city is. before she bends over and grabs her ankles, she wants to kindly let the council members know that since we aren't considering her financial situation, she would like them not to consider thier financail situation when judging the market value of her home. she knows this will p!ss them off. she so badly wants her market value split in half as that is fair, and then she can keep paying the same amount apply it to the principal and take 10 years off her loan. so she really would like a fair assessment, and she doesnt want to tick them off, and yet she wants them to consider that to be totally fair the school board members shouldnt have a voice. how can this nice lady deal with this board to her greatest benefit tactfully within 15 minutes.
1. stick to the facts and hope they are fair?
2. stick to the facts and ask them not to consider thier finacncial situation as much as they dont want to consider hers?
3. tell them that if they were in a business, it would be a conflict of interest to have school board, who gains, on this council. whose salary is paid with her taxes.

please advise nice lady.

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sunshine_lion
unregistered
posted March 31, 2009 10:03 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
heres a joke while i wait:

Rich Lawyer



A rich lawyer was going down the street in his limo when he saw a hobo kneeling in a park, eating the grass. The lawyer asked his chauffeur to stop and rolled down the window to talk to the poor fellow. The lawyer asked, "How come you are eating this grass?"

The hobo replied, "I have no money and no house, so my family and I live in this park, eat the grass, and drink out of the drinking fountain."


The lawyer said, "Well, I'm rich. Go get your family and friends, and you can all come to my house and I'll feed you."


ventually the hobo, his family, his friends, and his friends' families all piled into the limo. As they were driving down the road, the lawyer broke the silence. "You know, you guys are really going to like it at my house. The grass is at least a foot long in the back."

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sunshine_lion
unregistered
posted March 31, 2009 01:53 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ooohhhhhhhh ..... jwhop....... where are you?

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Node
Knowflake

Posts: 1123
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted March 31, 2009 06:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Node     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
SL if you are the Nice Lady...well you are that
    If this is your situation, I just sent a virtual "help, success, fortitude" message [out there] And that was a funny ^ your sense of humor is wonderful. ~N

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Mannu
Knowflake

Posts: 45
From: always here and no where
Registered: Apr 2009

posted March 31, 2009 09:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mannu     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hehe..nice joke.

Assuming the tax rate is 2 percent of sale price ...you are talking of a value between $1000 and $3000 ...
to me its not a lot of difference so i won't lose sleep over it. But if someones making 35k/yr ofcourse that difference is high.

I have not seen such a drastic drop in market value in such a short time. 30 percent drop in home price seems realistic.

Also remember the value of the home consists of land cost plus building cost..those are fixed costs, the owner already paid for it.

Now the variable or hype part per capitalism is the demand of the homes and supply of homes in the area, how much more the owner paid than the assessed cost (land + bldg). In metro areas the home ultimately ends up as 3 times up to 10 times and even higher in places like new york city.


Technically even land assment cost is really not fixed , building I am not sure. I just used those words to give you an idea. If i was that lady , I would use inflation calculator (available online) to see the dollar value between the year of purchase and now. I heard that for the first time in 2009 , the inflation dropped. Not sure if this will continue.


My advice: be polite in demanding things from the government.

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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 01, 2009 11:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hmmm, I'm having a problem with a house bought at market value of $100,000 being assessed for tax purposes at $150,000. Market value is the price a willing buyer would pay and a willing seller would accept...providing there were no other issues to the sale...like an emergency forcing the sale. One of the components of an appraisal is the sale of comparable properties sold in the near past...either within a subdivision or nearby...say within half a mile to a mile. Same subdivision provide the best "Comps".

There has to be a connect between "market value" and "assessed value"...a factor, a percentage, and that percentage of assessed value for tax purposes should never at any time exceed 100% of "market value". Your friend should find out what that factor is. If your taxing authority is making the actual property appraisals then your friend should find out what factors they considered in appraising her property....and, "ask for the comps" they used in appraising her property. She might find that the city/county/state appraiser used the nicest/largest/most expensive home in the subdivision as THE Comp for all homes in the subdivision or within the "comp" area.

As for the millage applied, there can be no argument so long as the same millage is applied to all residential properties in the same taxing district. Millage is more a political issue best settled by elections of city and county council members.

In most, if not all cities and counties, there is a stated method to appeal property tax assessments. Generally, those are found on the website of the city or county under the Property Appraisers page...generally by a link to the information. Usually, elected city and county council members do not rule on individual cases. Has your friend followed the stated procedures for appealing the property tax assessment? Beyond the appeal to a board of appeals, there is generally a resort to the courts.

Generally, there are 4 parts to the tax applied to a given piece of real estate.

Tax Appraisal value...Just Value...set by state or local city/county appraisal personnel; Tax Exemption applied to "Just Value" ...Homestead exemption, age exemption etc., Taxable Value and Millage to be applied...uniform throughout the taxing district.

Just Value/Assessed Value= 150,000
Exemptions= 25,000
Taxable Value= 125,000
Millage= .01287
Tax= 1608.75

This is all complicated by state laws limiting the upward amount a piece of real property can be assessed for tax purposes to no more than 2%,.. 3% or whatever...per year. But, when that property is sold, then the full market value/assessed value or whatever method of taxation has been adopted by the taxing authority in your state is applied. Property taxes can easily double or triple for a new buyer for a home owned for a long time by the previous owner in states where there is a property tax limitation in effect.

If the board/city council/appeals board or whatever is comprised of elected officials....and unelected persons who directly benefit from collection of property taxes, then there is a conflict of interest as a matter of law.

This should be considered as an overview. I don't know what may or may not apply in your area. But, it would seem to me that a sale of real estate at $100,000 established the "Market Value" at $100,000. Any tax assessment...amount of taxable value...above the actual Market Value should be challenged vigorously and every effort to get "Comps" should be made.

2 good places to get those "Comps" are a local Realtor who can run a "Comp list" of recent sales of like properties in the immediate area of your friends home and this website which is not affilliated with any state/county/city or the National Board of Realtors or their local affiliates.
www.zillow.com

Type in the street address, zip code or city and state and a vast amount of information is available...including a "comp" list, the amount this property has appreciated/depreciated in the last year, 5 years, 10 years, the current "Market Value" or range of values High/Low and the price per square foot of this house and others in the immediate area.

If your friend wants to fight, it might be worthwhile to get the names of those elected council/appeals board members, go to the property appraiser's on line data base, enter those names in the format required, find their homes in the database, find out what their appraised value for tax purposes is....then go to zillow.com and enter those addresses to see what the "market value" is and what the "comps" are in their area. For some strange reason sometimes appraisers undervalue the homes of elected officials...for some strange reason. It's the very same reason you will generally find the streets, city landscaping, streetlights and other ammentities are all top flight in elected officials neighborhoods.

Tell your friend I said "good luck" and that many homeowners who challenge their property tax appraisals frequently win...if they have followed the procedures and are armed with the facts.


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sunshine_lion
unregistered
posted April 01, 2009 11:21 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
the homework has been done in her zip code. and i think that ticked her off in the first place, when they did not adjut the value to the amount she paid for the house, which was significantly lower than assessed value, no short sale. of course mills can't be changed. it is what it is for everyone. great idea on the board members assessed values and comps. i, i mean, she will be looking into that. thanks for your time.

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jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 2787
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 01, 2009 12:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Market value by zip code is not a good measure of value for residential real estate.

For instance, my zip code takes in a very large irregular area of at least 3 different incorporated cities and unincorporated county areas where there are multi million dollar homes down to 600 square foot 1br, 1ba wood frame homes. An average price within zip code is also no indicator of "market value" for any particular home.

Comps are the very best indicator of "market value" since you're comparing like to like within a highly restricted search area very near the property to be "comped".

zillow.com will provide the list of comps by street address, prices of recent sales, square footage of comparable homes, price per square foot and the distance from the target home to be "comped".

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sunshine_lion
unregistered
posted April 01, 2009 01:37 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
i will try zillow .com. i dont intendto walk out of the meeting without the assessed value at least being the dollar amount i bought the house for though. 30 percent due to market downturn would also be nice. i pay enough taxes. i mean, she pays enough taxes.

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