posted January 06, 2009 11:18 AM           

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What happens when a relationship is Saturn-ruled, but the personal planet has more power than Saturn? The personal planet is more accomplished, seemingly smarter (quick wit, good thinker), and is able to carry herself quite well.
Does Saturn back off? It's interesting because Saturn is supposed to be the teacher.

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posted January 06, 2009 11:21 AM           

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does it bother you that your not smarter than the woman?

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posted January 06, 2009 11:22 AM           

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I'm speaking theories here.

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posted January 06, 2009 11:25 AM         

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most often saturn feels like a burden in synastry so no wonder they want to escape

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posted January 06, 2009 11:29 AM           

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quote:

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most often saturn feels like a burden in synastry so no wonder they want to escape

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The Saturn person or the personal planet?

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posted January 06, 2009 11:33 AM         

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the personal planet person

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posted January 06, 2009 11:33 AM           

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but the personal planet person (if i get it right) must have a saturn too isn't it? so what do you mean exactly?

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posted January 06, 2009 11:34 AM           

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can u elaborate?

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posted January 06, 2009 11:36 AM         

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The personal planet feels a control factor placed on it. Whether it's too many rules, a fear factor, regimentation, any of that. Yes, Saturn is a teacher but he's not the Jupiterian fun professor, he's the nun with the ruler or the minister. He's mundane, too much reality and brutally honest.

Which personal planet are you talking about? If it's Mercury, then Saturn can depress the mind or just plain bore Mercury. If it's Venus the person can be afraid to love the Saturn person, there may be too many social rules for the Venus person to deal with. If it's the Moon, emotions can be cooled off considerably. If it's Mars, be careful. The sexual nature may die at some point and it's a classic signature of a controlling spouse and possible domestic violence. I see it in my practice all the time.

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posted January 06, 2009 11:43 AM           

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^Are you talking to me?

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posted January 06, 2009 11:46 AM           

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wouldn't it feel more like a wet blanket over a fire?

I just think it is disproval feeling associated with it somehow. not so much a I don't need you...more of a why can't anything I do be good enough for you. I keep trying to make you happy and you are never satisfied, you are sucking the life out of me and soon I may have to take anti depressants kind of feeling...no?

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posted January 06, 2009 11:47 AM           

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That's not the point of my post. I'm asking what Saturn would do if he perceived the person planet was in some way stronger than he was.

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posted January 06, 2009 11:55 AM           

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probobly resort to passive aggressive behaviors.

intellegence and sucess don't matter to saturn....sometimes very intellegent sucessful persons are low self esteem and will seek a saturn relationship subconsiously because it feels like home to them. disproval has gotten them where they are to PROVE their worth to disproving family members. WHen we are past that we will not attract that kind of relationship into our lives. Heavy saturn, heavy mars.

just my two cents, which may not make sense.

relationships are very complex.

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posted January 06, 2009 12:02 PM           

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i mean it all has to be taken into account. I love someone very much whose saturn opposes my sun and moon, mine squares his sun, there are many other factors in our chart that are good and wonderful, and you know it isn't all trines and conj in life. I think we are better together than separate and accomplish many things. But sometimes I feel that saturn and it just makes me sad and sucks my spark out.I am pretty sure he feels sometimes like you said, as I am more educated and white collar worker, he is blue collar worker. He thinks I am smarter than him, he has said that before.

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posted January 06, 2009 12:06 PM           

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I think Saturn will want to have some of that success. As in, make himself the manager, or the parent. Like if mercury contacts Saturn, Saturn will restrict mercury's thinking. If it contacts Venus, Saturn will try to restrict the happiness of Venus.

They may be smarter, prettier, more successful, but Saturn is the boss of all of it.

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posted January 06, 2009 12:10 PM           

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i think there is a saturn balance when like us: my saturn square his sun, his saturn oppses my sun. balance. All things must be taken into account.

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posted January 06, 2009 12:11 PM           

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Some say a two-way tie like that is very difficult.

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posted January 06, 2009 12:15 PM           

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Ya, the balance is the best, so it's equal.

I think Saturn always perceives the other to be better than them. It's the innate inferiority complex of Saturn.. whether true or not. but Saturn knows he wields the power.

Edit: Its definitely difficult for the 2 way tie, but probably essential for a balanced relationship. The lighter planet person won't then feel like a slave all the time.

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posted January 06, 2009 12:22 PM         

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I don't think planets have a sense of logic (like Saturn wouldn't be able to tell if the personal planet is more accomplished and better than it). Saturn will try to "teach" the personal planet, regardless of who the individual is and the personal planet will be dampened.

Like my boyfriend and I. I'm in college, he is not. His Saturn is right on my Mars and his Sun on my NN. He tries his HARDEST to teach me lessons lol.

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posted January 06, 2009 12:47 PM         

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Hi FistOfLegend,

I was speaking to you, but I think I'm more clear on what you were asking. If you are only taking planets into account and not the whole chart or the whole persons in question, Saturn is always stronger and more wise than the personal planets except for the Sun.

For example: Mars is the climber, Saturn is the mountain. Mars is the explosive, Saturn in the...um...mountain. Or Saturn is the iceburg, the avalanche, etc.

Does that fit your question?

I think the only time Saturn backs off is with Uranus or Pluto. With Neptune I think he gets too seduced, spellbound or intoxicated and forgets to back off. LOL!!! But Neptune dissolves Saturn.

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posted January 06, 2009 01:19 PM           

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I think Saturn is smarter, he/she does indeed teach the personal planet person a lesson. Saturn is the teacher.

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posted January 06, 2009 02:51 PM           

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First of Legend,

I'd also be interested in your question, whether in some case it is saturn and not the planet person which backs off. I have my venus and mercury in harsh aspect with s.o. saturn and he does intimidate me and I know I intimidate him as well but it is him (saturn) that seems to always keep his distance. not me.....however, one might say in the end saturn does have the upper hand because my planets feel they are not 'good enough' for him. If that makes sense.

Edit* FirstoLe., where is saturn in your natal chart?

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posted January 06, 2009 06:01 PM         

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So, I realize that Saturn is the teacher whether it's a soft or hard aspect. But how might that change the experience for both the planet person as well as Saturn?

Would the lessons just happen more harmoniously and/or organically when there is a trine as opposed to a square?

And would you say that soft or hard aspects feel more binding to the planet person?

And finally, with an orb of 9 degrees, just how potent, really, is the connection between Saturn and the other planet person? I never feel overly concerned when I see an orb of 8 or 9 degrees between Saturn and Sun. I believe it has an effect but, I suppose the level of effect would also depend on the planet person's other natal placements.

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posted January 06, 2009 06:23 PM         

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Saturn's not always the teacher. Saturn's often terrified.
Doesn't back off so much as brood and become somber when in hard aspect to a personal planet. It gets quietly clingy and disapproving. It's got insecurities toward the essence of the other planet, and often has a jealousy complex, because Saturn rarely voices that it needs approval and is lonely. It swallows its insecurities, I think.

I think maybe the planet person could be nicer to Saturn and reassure him that he is needed because the old codger at heart needs to feel needed and is just too shy to express it.
Maybe that's part of the the lesson? The planet person becoming less selfish?
Of course Saturn can also sometimes be too overbearing as well.

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posted January 06, 2009 06:40 PM         

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MVM ~ I definitely agree with that. But my experience with someone's Saturn all up in my grill is that sometimes Saturn teaches to dispel the fear. It's like by taking control of someone's else's destiny in some way, they alleviate their own fears. I guess it's projection in action. I'm just wondering how this might manifest with a Sun/Saturn trine versus a Sun/Saturn square, for example.

And which is more binding? The soft or the hard?

Also, while I'm here, I'm also curious - who is teaching what to whom when you see a Saturn conjunct Vertex aspect in synastry?

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