posted September 16, 2010 04:58 PM         

I, for example, have it conjunct my Sun/Moon conjunction in Scorpio.

posted September 16, 2010 06:24 PM         

Anyway, I just discovered: HIS Narcissus is at 4° Leo - oppose his Juno and BM Lilith (4°/5° Aqua).

And - very spooky for me!!! - my Mercury at 4° Leo is exatly conjunct his Narcissus > so I REALLY had the capacity to "analyze" his problem in a way. (And, as a side effect, I've really studied narcissism thoroughly, have learned a lot, by reading - for whatever reason, haha.)

My own Narcissus sits exactly on my Moon/Pluto-Midpoint and right on my 12th house-cusp. Which is interesting ... on Moon/Pluto and all. Because I've also got a tight square between my Moon in 1st house and my Pluto in 10th > quite a hunger for "power" and "control", placed in my most prominent houses (1 & 10) . Obviously this has to do with some narcisstic need - that is quite "subconscious" or "hidden", with one foot in my 12th house already.

posted September 16, 2010 06:41 PM         

They have a definite feel which involves not looking inward and having a false self which is perfect.
They do not admit to flaws and imperfections.

posted September 16, 2010 06:51 PM         

Narcissistic Personality Disorder = When narcissism goes wrong.
The person is unable to self-love. They only love their public image. This is reminiscent of Narcissus who was cursed to fall in love with his own image and hence never be able to have the object of his affection.

But there are many traits in Narcissistic Personality Disorder that are in no way connected to the myth.
Here is a link to the personal blog of a man diagnosed with this disorder, if you want to know more about it.
http://samvak.tripod.com/index.html

--- Check these 'journal entries' in particular: http://samvak.tripod.com/journal1.html ---

On the other hand there are also many things about the Narcissus story that the asteroid may be connected to - entirely unrelated to the disorder.

posted September 16, 2010 07:10 PM         

quote:

---

What contributed most to his narcissm, atsrologically speaking, might have been his 1st-house-Venus squaring his 10th-house-Jupiter ("never enough"), and also his Pluto & Uranus cj. his ASC - opposing his Saturn on his DSC. Futhermore he had his 1st-house-Venus exactly oppose his Chiron & Eros in his 7th > so loooooaaads of problems on the "you & me"-axis

---

posted September 16, 2010 10:53 PM         

So that makes me a lone wolf, better off alone than with crowds.

Narcissus was a hunter who fell in love with his image. I consider myths to be more symbolic in nature and believe they should be interpreted as such. SO, in my opinion, the image in the lake may refer to:

1) An idealised vision of oneself or,
2) An idealised mate

Narcissus was unable to attain his ideal and in desperation ended up committing suicide.

This is true in my case. From the beginning, I have been very sensitive about 'My Mission' on Earth. It has taken me a long time(20 years to be precise) to know what that is. Fulfilling this is very important to me and at times when I feel it to be unattainable, I do contemplate suicide and almost killed myself some three months back.

I will now interpret my Narcissus aspects. I am only describing the conjunctions within a 3 degree orb.

Narcissus conjuncts my Sun/Moon:
My ideal is strongly aligned with both my Ego and Id. Achieving my goal is emotionally and egoistically fulfilling.

Narcissus conjuncts my IC:
My sense of security depends on my achieving my ideal.

Narcissus conjunct Adonis:
On another thread, we discussed how Adonis conjuncting the IC can make one see the world to be full of beauty rather than cruel and ugly. With a Narcissus conjunction, the world appears more beautiful to me when I'm aligned with my goals than when I'm not.

There are other aspects to my chart as well but I believe conjunctions are the strongest, hence, most valuable aspects in interpretive astrology. Adonis also aspects other planets and points like
Inconjuct Mars
Semisquare Saturn
Trine Asc and POF
Sextile Lilith
Opposition MC

But I'll still put my money on the conjunctions

How about other Knowflakes post where their Narcissus is and the conjunctions it makes so I can test the validity of my hypothesis?

posted September 16, 2010 10:56 PM         

if this is true then in my case im glad i have this, in my version i'll never "have" anything outside myself.

which makes me relieved to know ill never be swept away with all that nonsense and be forced to carry its weight.

posted September 16, 2010 10:57 PM         

So my hypothesis is that:
In a person's chart, Narcissus represents their Idealised image of themselves, who they would like to see themselves as being

Time to roll on the testing...Beam me up, Scottie

posted September 16, 2010 11:16 PM         

quote:

---

In a person's chart, Narcissus represents their Idealised image of themselves, who they would like to see themselves as being

---

Frozen - I really like your hypothesis.

When it comes to your mission on earth - I guess that is a two-fold goal:

Goal 1: Achieving an idealized image of yourself as a person who has accomplished this mission and received public praise for it.

Goal 2: Accomplishing the mission itself with the aim of providing benefits for many other people (e.g. These benefits could be artistic & intellectual as a result of your creations: novels/films/plays etc - I know you're into that!)

Only no.1 is narcissistic.

posted September 16, 2010 11:29 PM         

Then again this asteroid would be expressed like other planets correct? and therefor subject to being focused through our own individual lenses.

posted September 17, 2010 12:35 AM         

But I'm discussing the disorder, not the word narcissism.

It is the strangest thing to encounter another human - no - another life form - that really has no empathy and that is convinced that all other beings are extensions of itself.

It's really a strange experience.
I think the 'lack of empathy' is a core and very significant part of the "traits" psychology attributes to this disorder.
I mean - it would barely even be a "disorder" without this trait.

All people are narcissistic to some degree. Wanting to have achieve certain things, have a positive public image etc A lot of people may have that desire.
But in NPD that is the *only* desire they have.
They simply don't connect with others on any level. They don't have a desire to buy a cat because they love cats - for example.
They would only have a desire to buy a cat - because of the love the cat would give *them*... or because they want to enter an elite "cat owners club" where they can be voted "best owner of the year" -- something along those lines.
All others are seen as "narcissist supply" and not people (or beings) in their own right. So the NPD person uses them.

PS. FrozenQueen - I know this is not exactly the topic of your thread. I'll stick to discussing NPD on my thread - BUT - The reason I've brought it up here, again -- is that I hope you do not see yourself as an NPD.

I am quite confident based on the things I've been reading lately - and having known two NPDs - that you don't have this.

One big *huge* reason - is that you don't always agree to people. NPDs are extremely nice and never cause ripples socially. They never go against the grain.
They do everything to preserve the image.

You do not come across this way at all.
For instance in your thread you said you'd like to quit your degree etc - That would be a rebellious action, almost anti-social for your family and social circle. But you would still do it.
An NPD does not go against the grain.
They are often over-achievers. They sometimes have two or more degrees just to make the point of how "special" they are.

Based on the two men I think had/have this - they are the MOST agreeable people. All of their energy goes into getting *others* to give them emotion and affection. This is a false kindness basically - aimed at acquiring narcissist supply. In the NPD's perfect world - thousands of people would gather 'round saying "you are perfect" "you are beautiful" "oh hail the beauty of you" every day.

posted September 17, 2010 09:09 AM         

quote:

---

One big *huge* reason - is that you don't always agree to people. NPDs are extremely nice and never cause ripples socially. They never go against the grain. They do everything to preserve the image.

---

That's quite correct. My goal it seems is doing what I want to do and I have no care how many feathers I end up disturbing

quote:

---

You definitely do not come across in this manner.

---

Thanks Dyna

Keep posting everyone!

posted September 17, 2010 09:18 AM         

A real self is essential in the world if you are to have any solid ,sense of being grounded.

When you are the child of a Narcissist, you can become what is called a "little voice".

They are very afraid of criticism, afraid they won't be accepted and liked.

They take their identity from the outside to a large degree, too, but NOT as severe as the N(Narsissist)

I have this. This could be called "beaten down" syndrome lol

I diagnosed myself cuz I don't go to therapists lol

However, the little voice person can heal cuz they have enough self to heal with.

The Narcissist can heal, in theory, but in practice, it is rare.

My mother is healing, but, still, I don't know lol

posted September 17, 2010 11:05 AM         

Also, she does not SEE herself as N.

Guess what? Narcissus conjuncts her Neptune.

posted September 17, 2010 12:46 PM         

and it is cj his NN and Neptune.rules his 3rd the Neptune and it is a fact that he acts more unreasonable towards his family/siblings.and all that pertains his surroundings.

Narcisus squares his venus/ruler5th/6th/10th and squars his jupiter ruler asc.

posted September 17, 2010 02:12 PM         

I grew out of this, very much like that though.

I personally do care how many feathers i ruffle due to the most likely event of those feathers coming back to ruffle me.

Then again, depends on your definition of "disturbing".

Now, here is where i grew more subtle. I do what i want anyway... Just so happens many dont notice it or its insignificant enough to them that they ignore me.

**I found people's acceptance to be.. constrictive in its embrace.

And ODD, im uncomfortable in direct contact with others, I much prefer to be around other people but work/live/ and just be alone.

posted September 17, 2010 02:57 PM         

Diandra:
That could very well be it.

MBlake:
I find people draining as well.
My definition of disturbing feathers is that I do not want someone to live through me. I have my own dreams which are more than enough to try to fulfill without the added burden of living upto someone else's ideal of me. I am me and that's it.