posted August 05, 2014 07:21 AM            

Sitting here in a cafe and this struck me:

Young girls are dressing VERY lightly nowadays. No news there. I just saw one that could not have been older than 13 and she wore a pair of hotpants, a black bra and a lowcut-back and front (yoga style) tanktop. Nothing overly sex I guess but she showed alot of skin and every single man stared. One almost walked into another person..

What I am trying to sort out in my head is following:

Why do men stare at this young girl? Do they have suppressed sexual desires? Is it the soft skin? Is it the age?

Why do young girls dress like this? I didn't when I was same age nor did any of my friends. I do now on occasion but am also fully aware I might stir controversy and thus won't complain.

Is it to provoke sexual equality?

Should girls, and boys, dress like this and assume no one will react? Do they have a right to be upset should someone comment? Are men disgusting for staring?

posted August 05, 2014 08:29 AM            

Is it something she does intentionally? It's hard to say, you would have to ask her. I don't think it is something she could easily or readily answer. A lot of people dress the way they dress unconciously, it makes me feel good about myself, I like the message, colours, combination.

Current fashion trends, are considered scandalous by some I am sure. These tank tops, hot pants, or yoga pants style in female fashion. I don't think there is as obvious a trend in male fashion.

To address the issue regarding Men, it wasn't that long ago, maybe a couple of hundred years when girls of that age were being courted by suitors, or even entering into marriages.
Society has changed, both sexes now have much longer and greater freedom to decide whom and when they want to enter a relationship with.
So by society's standards today, they are "wrong" for looking.

I am not going to excuse male behaviour, however nor do I want to tar all men with the same brush, but men will likely assess all women they meet instinctively, it may only be for a second or a few seconds, and again it may be something that they aren't really aware of.

I do not know, but I imagine women do the same, albeit in a different manner, and far more subtly than men.

A friend brought one of his friends down to play badminton at a club I am a member of. From the moment she hit a shuttle, it was clear that she was not the right standard for the section, however all the Men were incredibly supportive towards her, and extremely obvious in their attentions. Despite what she must have felt, that she didn't belong there skill wise, and all the support given on false grounds, the atmosphere must have been awful. That is one of those moments where I get an inkling of what it would feel like to be a woman.

I don't really understand why Men do this, maybe it's part of our biological makeup, maybe it's part social conditioning also. The message in society, is that being beautiful, both Male and Female, gets you things.

This is a difficult topic to discuss because it is complex, with a lot of different influencing factors.

posted August 05, 2014 09:57 AM            

Not to say that the men were "undressing them with their eyes." Some likely were in this specific scene you described, but others may have been concerned or offended. And there may have been other reasons that drew special attention as well (what they were doing, if they talked loudly or moved erratically, things said, etc).

Are men disgusted for staring? Depends on specifics, including what exactly you mean by stare. Actually, I'm not going to touch that right now, I may visit it later after I'm more awake. Anything said out of hand will be misunderstood by someone for various reasons, guaranteed. (Note to self: mention the movie a man made a surprising observation on.)

Is it to promote sexual equality? Of course not. It's entirely possible it was because it was simply a hot day. You said yourself they were dressed more lightly than provocatively so this may not be a factor at all. (Sure, some will see being dressed lightly at all as provocative, just as some see you not wearing a veil or burka as dressing provocative, but that's based on the viewer rather than the the desires or even awareness of the viewed.)

But say they were hoping for attention...girls learn early that their worth is being attractive. Women teach this to girls as much as men (and as a rhyme that's been used by tween girls for generations goes, "we must, we must, we must increase our bust, the boys depend on us"), and no matter what a female does her looks will be considered more important, and when she comes under any verbal attack it will almost certainly be to attack her appearance. Many equate attractiveness with sexiness and therefore dress the part. It's not about equality it's about personal power, or seeking validation, or even desperation for attention. Though in some cases they can thrive on the negative attention they receive from other girls (defiance) or by their parents (ie, rebellion). It can also give one the feeling of being more grown up (much as smoking used to do), after all anything sexy is considered "adult" so they see themselves as trespassing onto adult territory to declare themselves grown up.

There are some catch-22s and double standards (by that I mean between different types of girls) at work here as well, but it's too early for me to touch on those.

posted August 05, 2014 01:56 PM            

Also, the sexualisation of minors has been glamourised for a long time, with increasing regularly and popularity.

Think "Lolita". Think of the book.
Then the early film.
Then the later film.
Now look at music videos aimed at young teens.
Look at teen dramas.
Look at teen magazines.

Look at daddy's newspaper sensationalising rape, with "soft" porn on page No. 3.
Look at all the facebook copycats, aka, "normal" girls/women.

This has been happening for a long time.

Men and women are being controlled because of the material they consume through TV, print, and music.

And if everyone is doing it, it's rather affirming.

And this is not simply a benign method of making money by pushing the arousal button.

This has a direct effect on how men and women, and subsequent generations relate to each other.

It promotes the loss of heart and soul in relationships.

And we are weakest without each other.

posted August 05, 2014 06:50 PM            

Perhaps there are no coincidences, after all.
A carefully mastered web of events...

posted August 06, 2014 12:17 AM            

Great post!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Maka:
I've been working in retail for a year now. I see plenty of teenage girls buy yoga/sport gear either to train and exercise in or simply because it's almost 100 degrees outside and they want to feel comfortable. Some even buy it to lounge or run errands in.

It's very rare that I see a girl buy or wear that to entice men.

---

This too. I wore yoga pants a few months ago and got sexually harassed for no reason- nothing was overtly sexual about my outfit. I absolutely hate it when men use the excuse of being aroused or enticed to treat a woman like a sexual object.

Its a slippery slope (the topic, not sexual harassment), because there are several Catch-22's and many outside influences coming to play.

posted August 06, 2014 03:06 AM            

A man had posted a couple of stills from the movie I'd seen multiple times, including just recently on my new dvd of it, which showed a camel toe on a little girl. Neither I or any of the other women had noticed it. But as he swore it was there I did finally move it to the scene and froze it to see he spoke the truth. That was worse, I went from thinking he'd played a tasteless photoshop prank to a man who stared at the crotches of little girls. We hadn't noticed it as we'd been paying attention to her FACE and what they were doing (I like to think so was the camera crew, though surely they pay someone to carefully examine the kids in their clothes first...maybe it didn't show up until she'd moved around some so it was missed for that reason).

I shared with another guy who said I shouldn't be too harsh on the father who pointed it out. Guys are trained from an early age to prove their manhood by noticing females, particularly the hips (both sides). That reminded me of a joke (that he grudgingly chuckled at) about how guys will get up at dawn because they heard there was a crack there. In any case when you get into the habit of looking because it's expected and don't want to be thought of as gay then it becomes an automatic reaction done reflexively.

And thinking about it more I know men tend to be more visual, including as hunters and warriors which means looking for and in crevices and the like. Maybe he wasn't trying to share his perversion as some guys like to do, but felt the actress had been treated badly. That is, he wasn't looking because he wanted to bang the little girl, but because it was visual instinct encouraged by social programming done subconsciously that became conscious as he was shocked by the sight and he wanted to PROTECT the little girl (as he would, hopefully, his own little girl), and those who came after her, since he assumed it was just as obvious to everyone else and therefore the little girl had been knowingly exploited.