posted March 10, 2015 01:57 PM            

Meanwhile I got inspired to check the part of Karmas in our chart, and noticed this:

my PoKarma 28°04 Gemini
--------------------------+
his IC 28°11 Gemini
his Moon 28°38 Sagittarius

his PoKarma 25°05 Sag
------------------------
my Mercury: 25.03 Sag
my Sun: 25.56 Sag

Does that mean anything? Astrologically I mean. And if it does how would I go about interpreting it.

I know it is outside the range of 30 minutes you named, but I found it interesting that we both have Part of Karma either conjunct or opposite each other`s luminary (well his Sun is also rather near, opposing my Part of Karma with an orb of 1°07, but this one is definitely out of the 30 minutes range)

I am just wondering what I am really looking at here.

(btw is it of importance for these parts, that there is some aspectual interconnection between ASC, Sun and Saturn, the ingredients of the Part, in synastry of some sort?

posted March 10, 2015 02:03 PM            

Damn, Ceri. Did you hear my call?

As I was writing that, I was thinking, 'man, I know I'VE got some crazy stuff up with the PoKARMA. I wonder if Ceri does, too?'

posted March 10, 2015 02:06 PM            

And also - what do you have got with that part?
(well I know the Part of Karma is actually the position of Saturn in the secondary chart, and Saturn is kinda important for both of us, for me it`s the handle of my bucket, and the only planet placed in relationship houses - the 8th for me; for him Saturn sits closely on his DESC.
For both of us Saturn conjuncts Vertex, though mine could be a tad too wide, at 4 degrees. his Saturn is conjunct APHRODITE on his Vertex exact - 28 Virgo. Mine is conjunct EROS on my Vertex - 21 Cancer - but anyway I disgress )

posted March 10, 2015 03:48 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Would you be weirded out when i tell you I actually did HEAR you?

---

These days? Actually ... no! Rather encouraged, really. Damned efficient form of communication. I do understand why it isn't the norm for humanity, though. There's a sense of 'long-range connexion' associated with telepathy (and I DO get what you mean; strange thing, 'hearing' while not hearing -- it becomes an important distinction when bringing in the DSM-V!). By having to physically produce noise that can be heard by another individual, we have to make some sort of physical, directing action, AND produce that noise. It demands a more focussed form of connexion -- at least by logical standards. Humanity ... we're here to learn TO connect on that level. TO make those directed actions.

But, goodness, is it more efficient to just 'communicate' with 'the group' and 'single out' a particular frequency now and then.

Years ago, just before our relationship began, my Guardian was literally calling my name, every time I closed my eyes and attempted sleep. Oh, of course, when I'd open my eyes, it would be a faint echo. I'm used to my mother doing this; all of my life, in fact. But, no, this was his voice. It's VERY distinctive.

This must've happened eight times, as I desperately attempted to go back to sleep. And it was barely 19:30. I was simply having an awful day, and decided it was just better to rest. Hah! Lot of good THAT did!

Upon the eighth or so time, I just sat up in bed and shouted (like a crazy person, no doubt) 'WHAT DO YOU WANT?' He wasn't physically contacting me, see. In fact, he was in San Francisco for the week. Oh, I wasn't mad enough to expect he'd answer. So, a few seconds later, I just threw myself back on my bed -- ohhh, yes, so dramatic that day! -- and just closed my eyes, hoping again for peace, quiet, and successful sleep.

Subtle light changes caught my attention, despite my eyes being closed. So, of course, they fly open. My lamp in the corner is flickering. Only slightly at first. Oh, the bulb is going, I think. Fantastic. (As California was on a 'switch everything to fluorescent' kick, meaning all incandescent were becoming persona non grata, and I love that semi-golden tint.) So I turn it off, expecting to not be able to turn it back on, (as that's a surefire way to get the bulb to go the rest of the way; the force of turning it back on requires just enough power to let it safely blow) and it DOES come back on.

I turn it on and off for another three or four times, thinking, WTF? None of the other lights are doing this. JUST this one lamp in the corner of my bedroom. The investigative mind whirs back into action, and I start looking at the area. Right nearby it, on my sideboard, is the paperback edition of Linda's 'Relationship Signs' (as I took it with me to LA and left my hardbound at home). It's bookmarked on the pages I last read as I was falling asleep the previous night, and blearily set aside.

VENUS conjunct, sextile, or trine PLUTO. Y'know, the part where it's talking about Twin Souls and Soul Mates? That one.

And the light starts flickering AGAIN, and my brain is just freaked out enough to begin looking for patterns and connexions. Someone outside takes THAT moment to shout, 'what planet are YOU from?' and it ALL just makes my head spin. As if, in that moment, I know nothing.

You can imagine, though, how it ultimately affected me. I ended up finally blurting out the following week, 'if circumstances were different, would WE be different?' to which he responded, 'oh, without question. As WE are largely a constellation of our experiences, WE therefore MUST be different, if our circumstances are.' It was a perfectly reasoned response, and I appreciated it. Didn't quite answer the question, though.

And so, I tried again.

This time, he said, 'had we met under circumstances in which you were not engaged, I'm not sure you would have left my sight before I'd secured a future meeting. And by that, I would have snatched you up and made you mine without a second thought. Does that answer your question?'

I know. I know! What took me so long? Ethics. Preparation. 'Doing the right thing'. All VERY important. But you can see why my head was spinning!

So, had he not 'let me sleep' that afternoon, who can say if I'D have reached a point of SUCH frustration, that I HAD to -- just HAD to. I DID ask him about it, unbelievably, weeks later. He paused for a moment, and said, 'you know, I recall that I was driving to San Francisco, and a certain song had played on the album I was listening to. I thought of you.' Then he mused, 'apparently rather loudly.'

Loudly, indeed!

What lives we lead, Ceri. What lives.

posted March 10, 2015 03:59 PM            

In our case it coincides with actual aspects, as for him it is my Sun being conjunct his Sun, square his ASC and square his Saturn. (so a 4th harmonic pattern for him).

For me it would rather be a 9th harmonic pattern, as
his Sun is binovile my DESC and Saturn, which are novile each other.

Or in angular distances:

his side
-------------------

my Sun conjunct his Sun 1°01
my Sun square his ASC 0°35
my Sun square his Saturn 0°46

with his natal aspects of
Sun square Saturn 0°15
Saturn opposite ASC 1°22
Sun square ASC 1°37

my side
---------

his Sun conjunct my Sun 1°01
his Sun quadranovile my Saturn 0.00 (and binovile my Juno, by 0.00 but that falls out of the resonance)
his Sun quadranovile my DESC 0°07

with my natal aspects of

Sun quadranovile Saturn 1°01
Sun quadranovile DESC 1°07
Saturn novile DESC 0°06

Which creates the midpoint pictures of

his Sun opposite my Saturn/DESC 0°03
my Sun conjunct his Saturn/ASC 0°05

posted March 10, 2015 04:19 PM            

WEll for me I can or could hear my mom as well, especially when being away. In fact the first times I was racing down the stairs, when it happened, insisting she had called me, when she hadn`t but, apparently had been thinking if she should call for me or not. so I must have picked JUST the moment before this intention became manifest in producing real noise. (Not sure why I remember htat now but my mom and me have Sumeria conjunct Sumeria. lol)

Later then I Sometimes would pick up the phone and call her, when I had heard her calling me in my mind, and most of the time it was just when she either had been thinking of me intensely or talking about me. Ironically neither of us was even really surprised about that communication link, as unreliable as it relaly is.
Maybe it helps having a brother with the Down syndrome, sometimes I am not sure him and me are actually talking or communicating on a different level. Well at least he is an amazing receptor, he seems to rather react to our thoughts than the spoken word. You get used to it over time.
Nothing reliable of course, nothing that is there all the time, but so often, jeez, so very often.

But nothing, not even THAT, prepared me to the noise Mr Sag tends to produce in my mind occasionally. The first time it happened, when it got so loud I could not ignore, it was after we first met, and I thought I was going crazy and most probably having a stroke and witness my own death.

(oh funny random detail his Vesta is conjunct my Part of Death by 0.00. as solar fire just informed me.
though this one makes sense in a different kind of way, and certainly fit to that feeling I got when seeing him perform in "Aida" - different topic though).

And then it was so reliably there, after seeing him at least. When I was in my hotelroom trying to sleep, I mean REALLY trying to sleep, I was hearing shreds of words, fragments really. Interestingly not only in his voice, but sometimes almost as if I was hearing something "THROUGH" him. It was weird. But I am used to be the weird one.

Nevertheless one night somewhere last year or even before that, it really was too much. I mean I wanted to sleep, had to get rather early the sunday after that to get my train. And he Would.Not.Shut.Up.
Constant mumbling, constant hearing of pacing around somewhere. instead of getting better it got worse, until I suddenly heard myself call out (hopefully noone heard that. lol): "It`s 3 a.m.. For Gods`sake, GO TO SLEEP. I need to get up early tomorrow."

Just minutes later it got quiet inside my mind and I could sleep.

Either that was a real telepathic link or one of the weird ways my mind likes to use to keep me entertained.

posted March 10, 2015 04:37 PM            

The reason I started looking into the Parts again is funny, actually. Of course, PoKARMA remains one of my favourites, because when it hits, it hits.

And, for a very long time, the fact that mine is 23ºLEO'57 didn't mean much. It's 2º from my mother's ASC, and 4º from my husband's, so ... nope.

My Guardian's KARMA is 21ºLEO'45. Huh. It's closER, but still too far to hit. And these need to HIT.

Then I remembered his VENUS is at 23ºLEO'32. Okay! 0º25, I will count.

Naturally, I had to see what his PoKARMA is ...

08ºVIR'57

Yeah. My VENUS is 08ºVIR'36!

So, his VENUS is conjunct 0º25 my PoKARMA, and my VENUS is conjunct 0º21 his PoKARMA.

posted March 10, 2015 06:07 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Nevertheless I think for you it must mean that there must be a resonance created of your Venus to each other`s Sun, Saturn, ASC, in some form at least. Maybe not actual aspects, but just the same angular distance between some of them. Plus I wonder if ther is also a midpoint picture attachd to that. Venus to some combo of Saturn, ASC, Sun.

---

Oh, yeah, because 'all the fun' is happening with our SATURNS and SUNS. And by 'fun', I mean his SATURN in my 8H, his SUN on my TISIPHONE/LACHESIS, my SUN quincunx his TISIPHONE conjunct my CHIRON, and my SATURN opposite his ATROPOS-CHIRON. Oh, yeah, it's a party!

The involvement of VENUS is interesting, though, surely. Mine is already 12H, and his is 9H. My VENUS is also my 2R and 9R, intriguingly enough, whereas his is 11R and 6R.

The link between them is 9H, which DOES have great importance 'karmically' speaking, is his TISIPHONE conjoins my CHIRON in my 9H, as well as my stellium in LEO (NNODE-OSIRIS-VESTA and ISIS) overlays his 9H, with his JUPITER, VENUS-KARMA and JUNO.

posted March 10, 2015 06:40 PM            

SUN-PoK
MERCURY-URANUS-KARMA

posted March 10, 2015 09:35 PM            

My PoASSASSINATION conjunct his SUN (0º28)
His PoASSASSINATION conjunct my SATURN (0º26)

Yeah. And while I know that Midpoints don't count with Parts, it's more that it's 'infused' with the point it's conjunct. In this case, my TISIPHONE is 11ºCAN'10, which is 2.5º his SUN -- but still 2º the PoASSASSINATION, which I consider out-of-orb. So it simply 'infuses' his SUN with my TISIPHONE (given the 2.5º synastric conjunction) which is approximately 0º30 conjunct the Part.

posted March 10, 2015 10:05 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Blind writer:
I like the concept of the PoKarma, and the asteroid KARMA, but like everything else in my chart, it's conjunct something, and thusly fused into a chimera beast.

SUN-PoK
MERCURY-URANUS-KARMA

No pulled punches, and no black and white. It's like trying to find a tiny scratch on a super-smooth mirror.

---

That can actually be a good thing, though. It makes your SUN a karmic operator. (Heh, welcome to the club. Being my 12R bestowed that lovely 'honour' on my SUN, too.) So having the SUN there at least allows you to focus your efforts. What's affecting the SUN also affects the PoKARMA.

Oh, and SURPRISE! It pretty much shows the principles of karma are inextricable from the core of your being.

As to MERC/URA=KARMA, that Midpoint (and the energies contained within) are also karmic operators. Again, no surprise, anything that hits your MERC/URA is going to be incredibly karmic.

:: waving dramatically :: Hi! 24º SCO MOON. Wazzup? Yeah. You already know.

Naturally, we choose our PoKARMA intentionally, and Fixed Stars in close proximity can be rather indicative of the sort of karma you're dealing with. You're right on the line there, as it jumps rather dramatically from ZUBEN (23º) and MARFIK (24º) to TOLIMON (28º).

posted March 11, 2015 03:10 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Aubyanne:
and Fixed Stars in close proximity can be rather indicative of the sort of karma you're dealing with.

---

That`s an interesting thought!

My PoKarma is on BETELGEUSE (0°21).

What I forgot to mention (forgot, ) - My NESSUS is there as well.
Conjunct my PoKarma (0°09)
conjunct Betelgeuse (0°12)

And well naturally that means my NESSUS falls onto his IC (0°01)

It`s a most weird thing, my Nessus on his IC. I certainly do not intend to harm or abuse him in any way. But nevertheless it looks significant.

(branching out to the other dimensions

my Dr CERES is conjunct it by one degree
my helio EROS is being there by one degree as well
as his is helio EARTH (also one degree, just to the other side)

Well of course this means it is all opposing the conjunction on 27-28 Sagittarius of my CIRCE, SEKHMET, REIKI, TESLA (and yes all on the same degree), falling onto his Sun-Moon-MC-conjunction, and most noteably on his Sun/Moon-mp which is on 27°48 Sagittarius.

posted March 11, 2015 01:00 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Aubyanne:
That can actually be a good thing, though. It makes your SUN a karmic operator. (Heh, welcome to the club. Being my 12R bestowed that lovely 'honour' on my SUN, too.) So having the SUN there at least allows you to focus your efforts. What's affecting the SUN also affects the PoKARMA.

Oh, and SURPRISE! It pretty much shows the principles of karma are inextricable from the core of your being.

As to MERC/URA=KARMA, that Midpoint (and the energies contained within) are also karmic operators. Again, no surprise, anything that hits your MERC/URA is going to be incredibly karmic.

:: waving dramatically :: Hi! 24º SCO MOON. Wazzup? Yeah. You already know.

Naturally, we choose our PoKARMA intentionally, and Fixed Stars in close proximity can be rather indicative of the sort of karma you're dealing with. You're right on the line there, as it jumps rather dramatically from ZUBEN (23º) and MARFIK (24º) to TOLIMON (28º).

That and also the fact that your most pressing karma in this lifeline could be seen as MERC/URA themed, and having special resonance with 24º-26º SCO. Not to mention 10º SAG.

---

Aside from his general symbolism, SATURN is a karmic vehicle for me too, as my 12R. My SUN sits on the midpoint of my AC and SATURN (hence why conjunct the PoK). Then SATURN conjuncts the ruler of my SUN (JUPITER), making for a massive heavy-hitter duo. And then my chart ruler (URANUS) conjuncts KARMA.

It's like - "here, have all the eggs, and the basket too", while trying to figure out the shape of the chicken. The significator and trigger are multi-layered. The relevance has never been in doubt - it's trying to cut to the heart that's tough. Kind of like uncovering one neon sign to reveal another. I mean, c'mon, give me the actual message already.

ANTARES on my PoK has always been interesting though, given its royal nature.

Looking at draconic, I've got dSUN conjunct nCERES, and dMC-URA-MERC-KARMA are saying hello to SIRIUS.

posted March 11, 2015 06:34 PM            

Vertex conjunct: PoEros 36 minutes, PoVictory 10 minutes
PoEros conjunct PoEros 1.13
PoSpirit conjunct Sun 1.04
PoNecessity square IC 28 minutes
PoNecessity conjunct Pholus 1.25c