posted August 09, 2015 04:19 AM            

You know what i mean? A girl who wants fun in the summer time, meets a man and thinks "no flirting with you. Either we date or we won't see each other again". Or a player meets a girl and thinks "no, no affair with you - either we'll be in a relationship or nothing is going to happen between the 2 of us"

What aspects could indicate that an "all or nothing" attitude is being triggered?

posted August 09, 2015 05:54 AM            

But behind this, there is a gruesome "life and death" and it was felt from the beginning, like someone hitting your head. I've been told: "you are my dream, but how can I hope to be with you? I fear you will get tired of me and leave and I know I would die" (I can't replicate the words and the context, but it was serious, not a line, not poetry). It's the reason we separated when we did: it can be perfect or nothing, all or nothing. I feel the same. It's a life or death connection. From this same feeling, I told him he was dead to me. I felt he should be flawless for us to be together.

Moon conj Pluto in the composite indeed. My first Moon/Pluto in a romantic relationship. Moon novile and septile Pluto in synastry, exact DW.
But I think the strongest is that at the core of the BQ Yod, there is a quindecile Yod: Sun opp Sun, with his Sun quindecile our Pluto and my Venus. This one is the life and death feeling behind the flying BQ.

But we also have:

- Venus/Pluto DW
-Mars/Pluto DW
- Sun/Saturn DW
-Moon/Saturn DW
- Mars/Saturn DW
- my Pluto stellium conj his ASC overlaying his 1st; his Pluto/ASC falling in my 8th.
- Composite ASC/Venus in Scorpio

It's interesting the composite reflects this antagonism: Sun in Gem/7th opp Mercury, Jupiter conj IC exact in Pisces, but Moon conj Pluto and the ASC/Venus in Sc and Saturn/Amor in the 8th etc etc

You can't ignore the natals though. We are both strong Pluto and Saturn, and he has Sun sq Saturn, Pluto conj ASC and Scorpio Moon which makes one say what he did; and I am an 8th house, I totally understand it.

However, I have never felt this so strongly before, and I'm pretty sure he didn't either.

------------------
I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted August 09, 2015 06:01 AM            

And your case with PM proves it: Moon/Pluto in synastry + strong Moon/Pluto in DW and on top of that strong Saturn aspects in DW

No wonder it is binding and moon/pluto does not allow any compromise

But what about Saturn in synastry? Are your Saturns heavily aspected by each other in synastry?

posted August 09, 2015 06:04 AM            

I guess this is most interesting if the natals are predominatly playful or freedom oriented (Sagittarius, Aquarius-emphasis for example) and then you stumble across someone with whom you have PlutoSaturn-synastry.
Might make you go into uncharacteristic mode for you.

posted August 09, 2015 06:12 AM            

Especially PLUTO-MOON aspects; hard ones. EROS isn't light-hearted, either, and nor is VALENTINE. These tend to be very invested or not.

But I'd have to say PLUTO's the biggest culprit there. I can find myself (as PLUTO) entertaining thoughts of bolting due to the rising intensity, and fearing severe damage as a result of playing it too loose. But when URANUS is involved, that's a part of the picture, too. It can become very complicated.

And so, with so much 8H involvement, along with hard VERTEX aspects, and PLUTO opposite MOON, PLUTO conjunct MARS, PLUTO sextile VENUS --- there's quite a bit of that.

posted August 09, 2015 06:17 AM            

Our Saturn aspects:

Sun/Saturn DW (trine and square)
Moon/Saturn DW ( exact trine and semisquare)
Mars/Saturn DW (oos sq (1) and exact novile)
Chiron/Saturn DW (square and sextile)
Vesta/Saturn DW (square and sesquis)
Priapus/Saturn DW
His Saturn with my Amor Lust Union Psyche, exact aspects (0)
Saturn angles DW: Saturn Q ASC (0), Saturn novile IC (0)
Uranus trine Saturn, Vertex sextile Saturn, Saturn/Lilith, Saturn/Ceres, etc.

Composite Moon sq Saturn, on top of that Moon/Pluto, and Saturn trine Jupiter/IC (0), Saturn sesquis Venus (0)

I don't think you can change a person ( a player as you say), you can only bring out this energy in them if they have it in their natal. Otherwise, he will reject this energy.

------------------
I seem to have loved you in numberless forms...

AstroMandala

posted August 09, 2015 06:28 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Enneline:
And it was striking and fascinating to watch that guys of a certain generation are never willing to start any light-hearted things with me: my moon would opposite their plutos and my sun/asc would trine their saturns

They feel too much of a transformation and committment/responsibility vibe to consider me to be a flirt only

---

posted August 09, 2015 06:29 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:

I don't think you can change a person ( a player as you say), you can only bring this energy in them if they have it in their natal. Otherwise, he will reject this energy.

---

posted August 09, 2015 06:32 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
so you`d say it were the ones contributing the Pluto/Saturn feeling the heaviness/ intensity/sincerity of it?

---

I'd say so, yes. Well, at least my observations prove that but all could be coincidences

posted August 09, 2015 06:34 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Aubyanne:
PLUTO, indeed. SATURN, too.

Especially PLUTO-MOON aspects; hard ones. EROS isn't light-hearted, either, and nor is VALENTINE. These tend to be very invested or not.

---

posted August 09, 2015 06:38 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Enneline:
I'd say so, yes. Well, at least my observations prove that but all could be coincidences

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posted August 09, 2015 06:46 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:

Our Saturn aspects:....

I don't think you can change a person ( a player as you say), you can only bring out this energy in them if they have it in their natal. Otherwise, he will reject this energy.

---

wow, LeeLoo. With those pluto and saturn aspects it is definitely about all or nothing. No way out
Was it obvious from the very first second that you won't flirt only?

I need to think what pluto and saturn do in the charts of that generation that opposite my moon with their pluto and trine my asc/sun with their saturn

posted August 09, 2015 06:52 AM            

his Eros quinkunx my Pluto 0°44
his Pluto square my Eros 0°24
composite Eros quinkunx Pluto 0°25 (one leg of a Yod, pointing at Eros on the IC)

it sneaked up on me when I least aspected it, sort of fitting with the quinkunx I suppose.

But I guess, generally speaking, I am a candidate for walking into that "trap", thinking something will just be fun and games and playful and nice and friendly, and when I get closer, it turns out I may have gotten myself into a spider`s web.

I blame the contradictory elemtns in my chart, relating to my relationshp profile

DESC in Gemini, ruler of DESC in Sagittarius in 1st house conjunct Sun
plus
Sun conj. Mercury of course; Mars in Sagittarius conjunct Neptune and square Jupiter
Moon in Aquarius for the emotional detachment.

that`s for the friendly, communicative, playful, curious, slightly detached and spiritualized vibe I am expecting (of course Mars-Neptune already introduces an element of seeing things not always as they really are, in my case it means usually downplaying the more demanding or even physical side of something - it is all so nicely intellectual right there).

But getting closer, some other constellations raise their (slightly darker) head:

Venus, ruler of 5th house, in Capricorn square angular Pluto (though Venus ALSO is on the Jupiter/Uranus-mp, which contributes to the fun and games, too).

Saturn, rule of 2nd house, in 8th house, handle of my bucket configuration; singleton in the people-oriented-side of my chart. lol all my encounters and connections are being channelled through that Saturn, it is sort of the entry into my personal space, everything has to go through this one.

Moon, ruler of 8th house in 2nd house, quinkunx Saturn; also parallel Uranus and Pluto and being in Aquarius (nothing expresses the dichotomy of my chart better than the simultaneous parallels of Moon to Uranus and Pluto, along with that Aquarius-Moon being disposited by scorpio-Uranus; you think I am Jupiter-Neptune? I htought so for many years myself, but that is just the ME-side of my personality, introduce other people to the equation, especially in a more romantic/ erotic sense and Uranus-Pluto is right there! along with Saturn. lol)

Moon, ruler of the 8th house, is also squared the Mercury/Pluto and Sun/Pluto-mp, while Venus, ruler of 5th house is also squared Sun/Saturn and Mercury/Saturn. and conj. Jupiter/Uranus.

and I can`t discount Eros in my 8th house either, especially on my Vertex and Sun/Moon-mp.

I sort of don`t get (8th house) what I expect when first encountering someone (7th house).
If it gets deep, it gets like Pluto`s underworld deep.

posted August 09, 2015 06:58 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Enneline:

Was it obvious from the very first second that you

---

posted August 09, 2015 07:19 AM            

But my chart is the same as yours, a combination of chirpy chirpy lol and deep stuff. The deep stuff: saturn, Pluto stellium in the 8th, Sun Venus in the 8th, Mercury sq Saturn, Venus Pluto exact parallel and decile, etc etc.

But then I have that "player" mutable cross plus Venus on 8th cusp, Moon in Leo 7th, Sun conj draco Eros, Draco Moon at 0 Sag and especially Sun/Venus opp Jupiter in Pisces in the natal (part of the said cross). Libra stellium starting on 0 Libra. Uranus peregrine true chart ruler. Duplicated 5th in Gemini with Eros there.

posted August 09, 2015 07:41 AM            

Mr Sag "suffers" from the same dichotomy as well, which does not come as a surprise to me. I think it`s at least partly the reason for why he affects me the way he does. It is some sort of reflection/mirroring going on.

His lighthearted one including:

Sun-Moon-MC in Sagittarius
ruler of 5th house is Moon conj. Sun and MC

Mars-Jupiter-conjunction, squaring Mercury in Sagittarius; mutual reception of Mercury-Jupiter

Neptune widely conjunct Sun-Moon

Venus sextile Uranus, sesisquare Mars-Jupiter, semisquare Mercury

ruler of 7th house in Sagittarius squared by Mars-Jupiter

ASC trine Uranus and sextile Venus

Uranus in 8th house

some midpoints like:

Mars= Sun/Uranus = Moon/Uranus = MC/Uranus
Jupiter in the same midpoints

ASC = Venus/Uranus = Juno/Uranus

Venus = Mercury/Jupiter = Mars/Jupiter = Vertex/Uranus

------------------------------------

But then there is also

Saturn conjunct DESC and Vertex and from ther squaring Sun and the 5th house ruler Moon

Pluto in 7th house (intercepted) as ruler of 8th house, and squaring Venus in 11th house

intercepted 7th house ruler Venus in Capricorn trine Saturn and also square Pluto of course

plus

Mercury (r7) = Venus/Pluto = Juno/Pluto
ASC = Moon/Neptune = Lilith/Pluto = NN/Pluto
Sun= ASC/Saturn = NN/Pluto = Vertex/Saturn
Moon=MC= Vertex/Saturn = Sun/Moon

and

Uranus= Sun/Pluto = MC/Pluto =Moon/Pluto
Saturn = NN/Pluto = Juno/uranus = ASC/Vertex

posted August 09, 2015 07:47 AM            

I asked: is PM a "player"? (just for fun, I know he isn't)
I got:

Knight of Sw Death 9 of Swords 4 of Swords

poor fellow, he is not very good at conquering (knight of sw) he is like the anti-player here

then I asked: how is he then?

9 of Wands + 2 of Cups aww

but now watch this: I asked: am I a player?

posted August 09, 2015 07:51 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:
Enneline, funny thing for you

I asked: is PM a "player"? (just for fun, I know he isn't)
I got:

Knight of Sw Death 9 of Swords 4 of Swords

poor fellow, he is not very good at conquering (knight of sw) he is like the anti-player here

then I asked: how is he then?

9 of Wands + 2 of Cups aww

but now watch this: I asked: am I a player?

Magician Lovers (Justice) Ace of Cups
I guess I could be but too much into true love and truth (Lovers + Ace of Cups + Justice)

---

Knight of swords and no player? I think he could be it's like he wouldn't make the 2nd step (death and all those swords cards)

AND

you are the same: you could as well (magician) but there is too much of sensivity in you (cups cards)

posted August 09, 2015 07:59 AM            

Good point about me there's only one cup though but the big one

posted August 09, 2015 08:09 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by LeeLoo2014:
Oh my, oh my, what an awesome idea! To describe and understand synastric and composite aspects better. Would you do it? Eclectic synastry

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posted August 09, 2015 08:25 AM            

6 of swords - 5 of pentacles - Moon

I guess not.

leno sais:

cross - key - letter