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Author Topic:   opinions about 2 kites and t squares in composite?
thedoctorisIN5c
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posted November 04, 2015 09:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for thedoctorisIN5c     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
would anybody be willing to give their opinion about this composite? I've heard/read that kites and t squares are binding, but also can bring about challenges. I've never loved someone more,or felt more drawn to another human being. why???
ugh, how do I post the chart??

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Randall
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posted November 04, 2015 12:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Moving to Interpersonal Astrology.

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yungang_grotto
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posted November 04, 2015 01:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Right click to save it. Go to tinypic.com, upload it. Use the message board image code. Copy and paste. Voila!

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yungang_grotto
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posted November 04, 2015 01:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Haha... ugh! I just love them so much! Ugh! Sounds about right!

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thedoctorisIN5c
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posted November 04, 2015 02:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thedoctorisIN5c     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

ok, here it is! thank you for your help! now if someone could tell me what they think about this chart? should i also post the two natal charts? is that helpful?

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thedoctorisIN5c
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posted November 04, 2015 02:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thedoctorisIN5c     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
yungang, you crack me up!! haha. tell me more though!! is it three kites?? and lord knows how many t squares there are. what does it all meeeean??? is there any generous soul out there who knows and is willing to give some insight?

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thedoctorisIN5c
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posted November 04, 2015 02:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thedoctorisIN5c     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here's the synastry......

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thedoctorisIN5c
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posted November 04, 2015 03:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thedoctorisIN5c     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

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todd
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posted November 04, 2015 04:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for todd     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
hi doctor.
here the nature of the planets really define this compsite more thasn the nature of the aspects. generally hard aspects over ride trines and sextile. this composite has extremely hard aspect of planets that are polar opposites.
the pluto/mars/Uranus opposition to Saturn and chiron is unstable explosive and contrary. A relationship with this dynamic has virtually no chance of lasting. this is more pronounc3ed because of the mercury tsquare. there is a kite formantio0n but explosive nature of the opposition is way to strong to be balanced by the trine/sextile in the kite formation.
with venus square to pluto ,the emotional connection is based on selfish carnal desire . there is no real love or desire for emotional intimacy, so there is no emotions cohesion to counter the divisive opposition either.
with moon square to Neptune, the real feelings and motivating for this relationship are hidden, there is no true emotional sharing.

the polar opposites of Saturn and Uranus are just too much to overcome.

todd

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thedoctorisIN5c
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posted November 04, 2015 06:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thedoctorisIN5c     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you so much for your response Todd!

Welllll....thats really unhappy....

Whats strange is that i have known this man for 35 years, and we are anything BUT explosive with each other. We seem to "get" each other. We are kind to one another, tease each other, have the same sense of humor, and seem to be drawn to each other. its unfathomable to be out of touch or apart from each other.

There is emotional intimacy and a friendship and fondness that has lasted all these years.
I most definitely love him. it is not carnal. Perhaps his love for me IS??? It certainly seems to go much deeper than that...in fact, we have never "been" with each other like that. but hey, how does one truly gage love? i can't argue....
I'm just thinking the nature of our relationship over the years easily evidences genuine love, appreciation, and friendship.

Just wondering....Is it possible to have hard aspects like this and not ever experience the challenges? what about a progressed composite? Maybe our maturity and the things we have learned over time have seasoned us, which, in turn, has made us more wise, aware....more sensitive and reasonable?

Open to anything...just trying to understand why this says something so completely different than what years of relating to this man have proven to be. Don't get me wrong, he CAN be difficult and aloof at times....and I know Im a pain in the hiney too...We just don't handle misunderstandings or disappointments/upsets in a volatile manner.

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todd
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posted November 04, 2015 06:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for todd     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
hi ya

I would think that your natal charts must have a bearing on the composite. with the mercury tsquare to mars-Uranus/Saturn the even temper you describe is quite unusual.
so it is not romantic but rather a friendship? do you have the same professions?

todd

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yungang_grotto
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posted November 04, 2015 07:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The opposition is one they each have natally and they've both got Venus on either end... This could make for powerful attraction/appreciation and a sense of being able to appreciate these qualities in one another which they share..

there's only one t-square in the composite involving Mercury. Natally we see Ceres is there to relieve the tension; probably an auspicious grand cross with Ceres' fruitfulness understanding etc. participating...

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yungang_grotto
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posted November 04, 2015 07:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You've got so much in common having been born close together, and your ascendants aren't far off a conjunction. That could all play into this best friend ever vibe. I wouldn't have known if you hadn't said so, it's very interesting to see a case like this

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todd
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posted November 04, 2015 07:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for todd     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by yungang_grotto:
The opposition is one they each have natally and they've both got Venus on either end... This could make for powerful attraction/appreciation and a sense of being able to appreciate these qualities in one another which they share..

there's only one t-square in the composite involving Mercury. Natally we see Ceres is there to relieve the tension; probably an auspicious grand cross with Ceres' fruitfulness understanding etc. participating...


The opposition is one they each have natally and they've both got Venus on either end... This could make for powerful attraction/appreciation and a sense of being able to appreciate these qualities in one another which they share..
this makes complete sense to me, in fact I recently did a composite here(ican't remember whose) where there was a unstable oppsotion in the composite which wasn't reflected in the nature of the relationship, but they bot had the same natal opposition

I was going to comment on resonance of aspects but I didn't so i'll comment know. in the past I have seen what i call resonance .sometimes there can be a direct connection but no aspects connect the two charts except that they have the same pattern. it is as if the pattern itself regardless of the aspects between them resonates a connection.
how do I check my past posts ,as it seems this composite the the other one both exhibit resoanance?

todd

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thedoctorisIN5c
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posted November 04, 2015 10:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thedoctorisIN5c     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
aw, thanks y'all! all i know is there is something unexplainable between us--and its good ...feels like home. you two are SO knowledgable! Im so impressed! Lots to look into with what you've given me here....very VERY cool. and so grateful that you were willing to take time out of your day to help me and offer your insight...it warms my <3
THANK YOU BUNCHES!!!!!
Todd, I wish i could answer your question...but alas, i have no idea ...haha
maybe yungang or someone else could guide you? Id definitely be curious to know what you find!

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yungang_grotto
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posted November 05, 2015 01:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by todd:

this makes complete sense to me, in fact I recently did a composite here(ican't remember whose) where there was a unstable oppsotion in the composite which wasn't reflected in the nature of the relationship, but they bot had the same natal opposition

I was going to comment on resonance of aspects but I didn't so i'll comment know. in the past I have seen what i call resonance .sometimes there can be a direct connection but no aspects connect the two charts except that they have the same pattern. it is as if the pattern itself regardless of the aspects between them resonates a connection.
how do I check my past posts ,as it seems this composite the the other one both exhibit resoanance?

todd


I wish there were a way to check past posts. Would be incredibly useful for reference...

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todd
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posted November 05, 2015 03:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for todd     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by yungang_grotto:
I wish there were a way to check past posts. Would be incredibly useful for reference...

well there is someway because I was taken to task awhile back by leeloo2014(as I recall) and she made reference to going over my past posts and pointing out my perennially negativity.but then again she mi9ght have just scanned the recent posts I guess.
todd

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todd
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posted November 05, 2015 04:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for todd     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by todd:
The opposition is one they each have natally and they've both got Venus on either end... This could make for powerful attraction/appreciation and a sense of being able to appreciate these qualities in one another which they share..
this makes complete sense to me, in fact I recently did a composite here(ican't remember whose) where there was a unstable oppsotion in the composite which wasn't reflected in the nature of the relationship, but they bot had the same natal opposition

I was going to comment on resonance of aspects but I didn't so i'll comment know. in the past I have seen what i call resonance .sometimes there can be a direct connection but no aspects connect the two charts except that they have the same pattern. it is as if the pattern itself regardless of the aspects between them resonates a connection.
how do I check my past posts ,as it seems this composite the the other one both exhibit resoanance?
here's the other compiste with a resonance factor potentially http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum35/HTML/003869.html

todd


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yungang_grotto
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posted November 05, 2015 04:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by todd:
well there is someway because I was taken to task awhile back by leeloo2014(as I recall) and she made reference to going over my past posts and pointing out my perennially negativity.but then again she mi9ght have just scanned the recent posts I guess.
todd


She may too have been simply recalling and referencing her own memories/impressions of your posts? I remember that exchange... I can't speak to her impressions, in part because I didn't see the posts she was referencing, but I believe there's room for everyone here and that we can respect one another and be as supportive and kind as possible while still maintaining healthy boundaries and speaking up when we feel something needs to be addressed (kindly as possible)..

It seems to me that it's important to be as conservative and careful as possible in our astrological readings, as evidenced by this thread (there are always exceptions--or--the exception is the rule, and we must look at the situation holistically, requesting more information if the picture is incomplete, and constructing our view of the situation with everything available). The mission of every relationship is different and subtle and intricate, and it's unlikely we can ever sum up the complexity of the lessons and teachings and opportunities available, though we can get a feel for the vibe and point out potential tensions, challenges, and difficulties, it's probably best not to speak in absolutes if we can help it; we are more likely to be totally wrong if we make sweeping statements--and worse than being wrong, we may cause damage by not respecting the multitude of possibilities represented by an aspect which in some charts may indeed spell disaster but in others is potent medicine and an endless source of strength and inspiration... and cause the querant to become unduly discouraged and not see the potential in the relationship until/unless their negative impression lessens or is forgotten...

We must always recall the fact that an astrologer's words can be taken very seriously indeed. I don't always succeed in giving balanced readings, and I think on these boards people post and inquire and take the risk knowingly that somebody may say something negative and everybody will try to maintain their center and not take negative readings too much to heart (because there are infinite variables in any situation)..

The greatest danger of astrology is paranoid delusion of catastrophe, and guarding against this is pretty important imo.

However I want to note that I really do appreciate many of your insights; you're clearly an experienced and in depth astrologer. I would guard against and take into consideration these things I've mentioned (I need to take my own advice; everybody is served by remembering the very real impacts of their assessments and interpretations! Not just you and I).

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todd
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posted November 05, 2015 06:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for todd     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
thanks for your input yungang-grotto, your analysis of some of my replies are welcomed and insightful.
though I am not a traditional astrologer , I do believe that there are good and bad aspects as traditionalist believe. that is I do not adhere to sugar coating. as I already mentioned 50% of marriages fail and probably 90% of relationship fail to achieve commitment .coupled with the fact that most people who come to a forum with questions about their relationships are having trouble with these relationship.my point is ,it more realistic to paint the pros and cons than adhere to the humanistic astrological model of only emphasizing the "good". .after interpreting over 2000 composite over the last 8 or 9 years on this and other forums, I have a good idea about what aspects are favorable and those that are unfavorable.

I do enjoy the many very good astrologers here, and I am always trying to improve my craft. the case in point about the resonance idea has been with me a long time and never resolved. I have always realized that if say both partners have a Saturn/moon square then the composite will have a Saturn/moon square. but it is more common for a composite Saturn/moon square to be purely mathematical, that is the partners both don't have this aspect. so I am very grateful for these 2 threads showing that even a hard aspect in a composite can work out if the individual have both dealt with these difficult aspect throughout their lives.
I also like to give exact periods of time so the poster can judge for themselves the meaning and validity of my words.
philosophical discussions are great but i am focused on those who are looking for real answers, as a consequence i am more incline to respond to new members .

todd

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yungang_grotto
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posted November 05, 2015 07:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by todd:
thanks for your input yungang-grotto, your analysis of some of my replies are welcomed and insightful.
though I am not a traditional astrologer , I do believe that there are good and bad aspects as traditionalist believe. that is I do not adhere to sugar coating. as I already mentioned 50% of marriages fail and probably 90% of relationship fail to achieve commitment .coupled with the fact that most people who come to a forum with questions about their relationships are having trouble with these relationship.my point is ,it more realistic to paint the pros and cons than adhere to the humanistic astrological model of only emphasizing the "good". .after interpreting over 2000 composite over the last 8 or 9 years on this and other forums, I have a good idea about what aspects are favorable and those that are unfavorable.

I do enjoy the many very good astrologers here, and I am always trying to improve my craft. the case in point about the resonance idea has been with me a long time and never resolved. I have always realized that if say both partners have a Saturn/moon square then the composite will have a Saturn/moon square. but it is more common for a composite Saturn/moon square to be purely mathematical, that is the partners both don't have this aspect. so I am very grateful for these 2 threads showing that even a hard aspect in a composite can work out if the individual have both dealt with these difficult aspect throughout their lives.
I also like to give exact periods of time so the poster can judge for themselves the meaning and validity of my words.
philosophical discussions are great but i am focused on those who are looking for real answers, as a consequence i am more incline to respond to new members .

todd


I consulted with a Vedic astrologer about my last relationship as it was ending and he is of the mind that two people either can or can't make it work for a marriage. That they will either be miserable and waste a lot of their lives, and then divorce (or possibly stay together and be miserable--but most likely divorce, maybe 10 or even 20 years later).. or they can choose a different partner and avoid considerable pain and expense... not to mention spending half of their lives trying to make something untenable work.

He is trained by a master with lineage in Vedic astrology, has been practising 30 years, and frankly I really appreciated his approach. I had avoided consulting with him earlier in the relationship because honestly--I knew the prognosis wasn't good but my modern Western mind wanted to give it a chance.

No good. As i came to realize on my own, Saturn conjunct Ascendant in synastry is basically totally unworkable. So I was pleased to hear him citing the exact aspect I had identified as the deal breaker in my reading. I had thought that it was his Saturn on our composite Ascendant/South Node/Pluto which did it--and that sure did give it a good kick!--but the simple fact of his Saturn on my Ascendant so elegantly described the bulk of the difficulty I faced living with that guy. He was tyrranical--and unfit to be the leader (the Vedic astrologer believes that the man is supposed to be the wise and caring leader of the couple, the boss--the benevolent dictator. If he isn't fit to do so/abuses his power... that's bad. There's something i like about that perspective, I'll sheepishly admit. I don't take kindly to taming though and it would take quite a lot of mutual respect to be able to adhere to another person's directives! I'm not the Vedic astrologer exactly )

The thing about our culture and society is that we have this deeply ingrained notion that one of the very most important things in life is to find 'the one' and keep them--at all costs. In Vedic philosophy, guess what is sought at all costs? Krsna consciousness... The husband, in worshipping the wife, worships the Supreme Godhead as manifest in her. And vice versa. Everything we do is fine as an offering to god. We own nothing, we are not our bodies. The illusion that we are, that we do, that we have control--only leads to suffering. Even if a relationship lasts until death--still, we die. So look beyond this! Find the peace in service...

In a culture largely divorced from spirituality, this seeking of another individual to fill the primal void can obviously be very destructive on a number of levels, especially given that one other person is very unlikely to be able to provide all that we truly require in a devoted partnership. In a tribal close knit society this problem would not be so huge. As it is.. we need all the help we can get in match making.

I'm not here to go on a huge tangent though... My point is that within this context we need to find a truly suitable person or long term monogamy is going to suuuuck. So I appreciate a no nonsense no bullsh*t approach to relationship astrology because at the end of the day it is an astrologer's job to advise the client to the best of their ability and to take into account all the factors which are at play. To do so accurately takes great skill and is a huge responsibility. To be able to confidently state that a relationship is or is not fit for commitment--this takes a lifetime of study and a serious set of skills, ethics, and really good credibility for the sources of your information.

Vedic astrologers (the reputable ones) have this background. Vedic *astrology* lends itself to this...

Tropical, Western astrology... in some ways perhaps it's still in the testing phases, as far as I can tell (and I say that as a Western astrologer). If there is a chance I am wrong, I think taking the middle road and advising conservatively is always wise and a responsible course.. Because to be totally certain I would need a stronger background... personally. That said, I don't like to shy away from identifying difficult aspects, but rounding off a cursory reading of a chart with a pronouncement about whether it will ultimately work or not isn't my personal style, that's all ... I feel like the distinct observations can stand on their own and pricier guidance without such a pronouncement, but I see how such advice could be construed as helpful and merciful. Still, i adhere to the importance of sophrosyne as an antidote to hubris, and apply it when i can...

Many of the people who post to this forum do not come with pre-existing relationship problems--many of them only have a notion to begin a relationship--or, as in this case, a long standing positive bond which has stood the test of time. Perhaps they do have a complicated relationship and in that case I agree that pointing out the issues can be beneficial, so long as it's done in a balanced way. Personally I prefer to acknowledge the factors which might have brought two people together as well as pointing out the potential pitfalls, and encourage clarity of vision and creative problem solving in the querant if I can. This is humanistic i suppose? I have humanistic tendencies perhaps--and some tendency towards a karmic viewpoint which recognizes that even hard relationships can be teachers and very valuable to the querant, despite not "panning out" or ending in undying love.

i agree that few relationships do. But there's likely a reason few do.... It's because people need to live out the difficult ones to show them to themselves. That's the karmic perspective anyway.

the Vedic approach is more merciful in many ways. Arranged marriages, checked into by an astrologer and given the OK, have a high success rate! In a place like India, where suffering is rampant enough, why go through an awful marriage too?

there are so many perspectives... they are all valid and useful for different people at different times

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yungang_grotto
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posted November 05, 2015 11:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for taking a little time to philosophize with me here todd

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yungang_grotto
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posted November 06, 2015 04:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for yungang_grotto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh... and I figured out tonight that if I Google my LL username that's a pretty good way of pulling up my past comments... maybe googling Lindaland and todd will work

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Aqua27
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posted November 09, 2015 02:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Aqua27     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hello, everyone, if you got to the Lindaland search engine
https://cse.google.com/cse/home?cx=008618649001241799762:gzvuymx7vjg

and put in your username -eg Todd or yungang_grotto
you`ll get a lot of results

I find your discussion fascinating as I have a kite pattern and share the same aspects as the opening poster has presented. I`m probably born some days later as the Aquarius in the above example.
I am in a very happy relationship with another Aqua, born in Jan same year and we share these same aspects with him, also both our kites blend in composite into one.
Yes, we have Saturn-Uranus-Pluto opposition in composite and natals and lots of other opposing aspects as the spine of the kite (Uranus-Pluto opposite Chiron, Uranus-Pluto ppposite Venus etc), but I would also decribe the relationship as mellow, caretaking and caregiving mature love (with elements of sweet childisness), if I had to choose one world as a core element, it would be “tenderness”.

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todd
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posted November 09, 2015 05:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for todd     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
thank you for the information in how to find past posts.

also thanks for adding your information about your kite and it's similarities to the other posters. it has bee a long time since I learned so much in one thread about composite dynamics.
rahu

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