posted February 19, 2016 11:41 AM            

In the study I did, ten out of ten pairs (I wouldn't call them "couples") had the same IC-MC axis in Davison and composite, only sometimes it was reversed (still the same signs and degrees.)

Waiting for mar-delta to help me here...

And if anyone else can help us figure this out, I would appreciate it.

posted February 19, 2016 12:02 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
First, does anyone know if there is a handy, simple explanation for how and why these two usually have either similar, reversed, or the exact same angles?

In the study I did, ten out of ten pairs (I wouldn't call them "couples") had the same IC-MC axis in Davison and composite, only sometimes it was reversed (still the same signs and degrees.)

Waiting for mar-delta to help me here...

And if anyone else can help us figure this out, I would appreciate it.

We'd like to know how and why this happens, and what it means, if anything.

---

posted February 19, 2016 12:18 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by mar1982delta:

Oh Faith, I am so glad you did a post for this!
I have made the comparisons about 15 or more composites-davison!
I ll get back to you in a while, I m searching my notes!

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There are 20 composites, but I can get some more if you like! lol

My friend and me
Davison MC/IC 18 03' Gem/Sag
composite Mc/IC 17 37' Sag/Gem
= reversed

Davison Asc/Dsc 19 33' Virgo/Pisces
composite Asc/Dsc 11 10' Pisces/Virgo
= no connection, just reversed signs

My brother and me
Davison MC/IC 2 02' Libra/Aries
Composite MC/IC 1 51' Libra/Aries
= conjunct

Davison Asc/Dsc 12 41' Sag/Gem
Compo Asc/Dsc 16 45' Sag/gem
= no connection, just the same sign

Another friend of mine and me
Davison MC/IC 25 09' Sco/Tau
compo MC/IC 25 07' Sco/Tau
= conjunct, rather tight!

Davison Asc/Dsc 3 49' Aqua/Leo
compo asc/dsc 3 52' aqua/leo
- rather tight conjunction again

= this case above is the ONLY case that I found a so tight conjunction in both angles!! And this is a dear friend, with whom I have a rather psychic bond, you could say!

Me and my father
Davison MC/IC 17 51' Sag/gem
compo mc/ic 17 26' sag/gem
= conjunct

Davison asc/dsc 8 04' virgo/pisces
compo asc/dsc 10 50' pisces/virgo
= pretty close, I don't know if they are considered conjunct, but reversed

Me and my strongest love <3
Davison mc/ic 4 19' cancer/cap
compo mc/ic 4 42' cap/cancer
=reversed

davison asc/dsc 3 47' libra/aries
compo asc/dsc 4 17' aries/libra
= this is the ONLY case of all 20 that I found both angles reversed!

I am coming back with more comparisons, they are really a lot!

posted February 19, 2016 12:37 PM            

Davison MC/IC 10 18' Tau/scorp
compo mc/ic 6 15' Sco/tau

= NO CONJUNCTION, which I found rather weird! (I think the 4 orb is a bit wide for this case, considering they are almost 35 years married!)

Davison asc/dsc 18 23' leo/aqua
compo asc/dsc 5 52' aqua/leo
= no conjunction, which I found weird again, just reversed signs

A friend of mine with her ex

davison mc/ic 22 46' leo/aqua
compo mc/ic 24 46' aqua/leo
=conjunct and reversed

davison asc/dsc 14 29' sco/tau
compo asc/dsc 7 53' gem/sag
= no connection

A friend of mine and her current boyfriend of one-year

davison mc/ic 13 28' virgo/pisces
compo mc/ic 15 24' pisces/virgo
= conjunct

davisn asc/dsc 29 50' tau/sco
compo asc/dsc 23 58' gem/sag
= no connection

Me and a random moment chart

davison mc/ic 20 26' can/cap
compo mc/ic 10 40' lib/ar
= no connection!

davison asc/dsc 17 45' lib/ar
compo asc/dsc 24 05 sag/gem
= again no connection

Me and my friend's ex, whom I have never met

davison mc/ic 25 13' cap/can
compo mc/ic 28 38' cap/can
= wide conjunction

davison asc/dsc 12 57' tau/sco
compo asc/dsc 24' 56' aries/libra

= no conjunction, BUT interestingly Faith, like in one of your examples our composite Asc falls exactly on my friend's Sun, who is the person that could have introduced us, if ever! Lol

posted February 19, 2016 12:50 PM            

Davison is calculated by taking both births and divide them by 2.

Now composite Suns just takes both suns and divide them by 2. However the Sun relates DIRECTLY to the day you were born. For example Sun on 26 Sagittarius always means a 18th/ 19th december birth, and so on, so the Sun placements are defined through the day of birth.

Of course this is true for DAvison as well, which is why the Suns are usually close to either ocnjunct or opposite (opositie happens with an inequal agedifference usually, if you are born 5 years apart for example).

Now your MC(and ASC) is defined by the day you were born, the hour and the place.
if you were born at a specific day at a specific time only one MC corresponds to that.

Your birthtime defines your MC, now it actually dos not matter much if you make a sum of the TIMES or actual DEGREES of your birthtimes, because the time directly corresponds to the degree.
The difference can only be made because of the location being a bit different (and hence the ASC may vary sometimes), and in case when the Suns are opposite, there might also be differences, have not thought it through to the end though.

posted February 19, 2016 12:56 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by mar1982delta:

davison mc/ic 20 26' can/cap
compo mc/ic 10 40' lib/ar
= no connection!

d

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posted February 19, 2016 12:56 PM            

Davison mc/ic 28 55' virgo/pisces
compo mc/ic 29 01' virgo/pisces
= conjunct

davison asc/dsc 10 28' sag/gem
compo asc/dsc 14 33' gem/sag
= reversed, but a bit wide conjunction, considering..

My father and my brother

davison mc/ic 1 46' sco/tau
compo mc/ic 27 47' lib/aries
= wide conjunction/reversal, don't know if it counts

davison asc/dsc 8 21' cap/can
compo asc/dsc 29 22' cap/can
= no conjunction

Me and an acquaintance

davison mc/ic 22 51 cap/can
compo mc/ic 25 53' cap/can
= conjunction

davison asc/dsc 13 52' tau/sco
compo asc/dsc 26 45' ar/lib
= no connection

Me and a person I have met only once

davison mc/ic 1 32' leo/aqua
compo mc/ic 5 45' aqua/leo
= still a bit too wide conjunction/reversal imo

davison asc/dsc 27 04' lib/ar
compo asc/dsc 0 18' tau/sco
= a bit wide conjunction?

Another friend of mine and me

davison mc/ic 8 04 leo/aqua
compo mc/ic 12 54' aqua/leo
=wide reversal

davison asc/dsc 2 03' sco/tau
compo asc/dsc 6 17' sco/tau
= again a wide reversal

Me and my mother
davison mc/ic 11 03' ar/lib
compo mc/ic 10 18' lib/ar
= reversed

davison asc/dsc 27 03' can/cap
compo asc/dsc 23 16' sag/gem
= no connection

And I have some more examples to share later!
So, from what I have observed MC/ic axis is NOT always conjunct, though they are almost always in the same sign. And this happens even in close connections, such as family relationships or even married couples
As for the asc/dsc they are not always conjunct in romantic relationships, though I haven't found a pattern involving them. I am thinking perhaps this is random?
Both axis reversed and conjunct I found only in one case and I still wonder if it means anything.
Both axis conjunct almost to the minute I found only in one case. I feel rather close to this person.

I am looking forward to your observations, opinions etc. I am probably missing something!

posted February 19, 2016 12:58 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Yes, connection. They are on each other`s antiscion.

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posted February 19, 2016 01:02 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Yes, it is pretty normal though having those in uncorrected Davison, too.

Davison is calculated by taking both births and divide them by 2.

Now composite Suns just takes both suns and divide them by 2. However the Sun relates DIRECTLY to the day you were born. For example Sun on 26 Sagittarius always means a 18th/ 19th december birth, and so on, so the Sun placements are defined through the day of birth.

Of course this is true for DAvison as well, which is why the Suns are usually close to either ocnjunct or opposite (opositie happens with an inequal agedifference usually, if you are born 5 years apart for example).

Now your MC(and ASC) is defined by the day you were born, the hour and the place.
if you were born at a specific day at a specific time only one MC corresponds to that.

Your birthtime defines your MC, now it actually dos not matter much if you make a sum of the TIMES or actual DEGREES of your birthtimes, because the time directly corresponds to the degree.
The difference can only be made because of the location being a bit different (and hence the ASC may vary sometimes), and in case when the Suns are opposite, there might also be differences, have not thought it through to the end though.

BTW it is the MC-IC axis that is most stable in this regard, the ASC`DESC might vary a sign or so, especially if you have a quick rising sign at the ASC (like Pisces or Aries)

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Thank you so much for your observations!
So, if I understood well, both angles reversed and conjunct actually doesn't mean anything, is this right?
Or both angles conjunct? Like the ones I have with a dear friend.
It's a bit mathematical to my understanding, correct?

posted February 19, 2016 01:09 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Aunt Anomalia:
And the magic was killed

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posted February 19, 2016 03:18 PM            

And thanks also, mar-delta! I should have clarified at the top of this thread that all my "research" was done using corrected Davison.

I need to spend more time thinking about what Ceri said, and see if I come up with any additional insights or questions.

Frankly I still don't perfectly understand it.

posted February 19, 2016 03:44 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith:
First, does anyone know if there is a handy, simple explanation for how and why these two usually have either similar, reversed, or the exact same angles?

In the study I did, ten out of ten pairs (I wouldn't call them "couples") had the same IC-MC axis in Davison and composite, only sometimes it was reversed (still the same signs and degrees.)

Waiting for mar-delta to help me here...

And if anyone else can help us figure this out, I would appreciate it.

We'd like to know how and why this happens, and what it means, if anything.

---

the angles of both the davison composite and the midpoint composite are both calculated from sidereal time.so they must be same.

the differences are that davison does not use astrological data in it's calculation. davison uses calendric numbering. this does not affect the sidereal calculations .
but for the astrological calculations only the sun ,moon will be the same or close to the midpoint composite symbols, as all other planets show retrograde movement,which is not captured in a davison.

midpoint composite using real positions,and will be different from the davison.

the reverse position of the angles has to due with the difference in latitudes. if the mean latitude in a davison chart is south then the angles are reversed.
the composite would follow,if the mean lat. of the 2 natals was south then th eangles would reverse.

to understand why they could be reverse, one must visualize the calculation of two points opposed to each other.
say you have one midpoint a 0ar0 and one at 0lib0.whats the midpoint? it could be 9cap0 or 0can0. as both would be equal distant to the original 2.

but if the 2 davison points were at 29pis580 at 0lib0 the midpoint would be 29sag59. and if the2 point are at 0ar2 and 0lib0 then the midpoint is 0can1.
the point is when the 2 points are opposed, just a single arc minute difference can change the signs 180 degrees.