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Author Topic:   Friend's Wedding chart
Elysia
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posted January 18, 2017 07:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Honestly, I'm scared to post this.
Context: Umm. It's one of "those" relationships. You know. He cheats on her all the time. People tell her, show her proof, she doesn't believe it (or he talks himself out of it). Well -- on the one hand, I understand. You love who you love, no matter what they do. But I'm not sure she's going into this with that ^ awareness.
I've been watching this for a year, hoping she'll see. Or at least, confide in me. *sigh*
Feel really guilty saying all this. I mean, he's my friend's fiance and I should respect him. But he's pulled so much crap with her and many others that it's hard to watch.
Anywayyy...
Can you guys give me an objective PoV about their marriage chart? (They're getting married in a few hours, in a different time zone than moi). Astro-analysis will probably get me out of my own head.

If you want to see the aspect grid closely:

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Faith
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posted January 18, 2017 10:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
So hard to tell what it's about without the other charts.

SN-Nessus in the 11H in Pisces, stellium in Pisces including Venus (chart ruler) conjunct Neptune: Big party with people wondering what she is thinking. NN in the festive 5H, but in critical Virgo. Maybe they know they have to straighten up?

Moon-Jupiter in the 6H, another mix of that party/optimism/criticism.

Saturn-Juno in the 8th looks serious. It's trine wild card 12H Uranus-Ceres...mmm, it's hard to say how that will play out, assuming the wedding chart continues to have an effect. Seems they are weird together (Uranus) in ways others don't understand (12H) and they are fine with it (trine to Juno).

The sun will progress into Aqua during the day, maybe at the reception? While the moon moves into a square with the sun...

Well it could look better. But I wish them well. 'Hate to see anyone making a great big start...down a road to pain.

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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 12:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks, Faith.! That..people wondering part, has been happening in the office. Although the way they go about it is hurtful. I was going to post their composite/synastry (synastry was nice, I think) - but I forgot his birth year! Was just checking now. Will post, in case anyone wants to take a peek.

I liked the Venus-Neptune conjunction in this chart, was baffled by the Sun-Moon square. The astrologers who decided this time & date use Vedic, not Western - not sure if I should factor that in? Maybe that chart looks better in Vedic.

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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 12:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
For more info -
Their synastry:
She is on the outside, her birth time is known. His birth time not known.

Composite: Oh wow, they have a Juno-Jupiter conjunction !

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Ceridwen
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posted January 19, 2017 01:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Honestly, no matter the wedding chart, that doesnīt sound good, with him cheating and all.

Funny eneough my parents have a wedding chart that other people probably would have deemed "doomed" and unstable.


Venus 22 Aries
Chiron 24 Aries

opposite

uranus 24 Libra

square

Mars 20 Cancer

square

Atropos 22 Capricorn


But they made it work quite superbly for over 40 years (Mercury was on 22 Gemini though, and hence sextile/ trine the Venus-Chiron-uranus bit.


they also had no really nasty applying Moon aspects and I ehard that should be avoided as you might run into problems in the course of the marriage. Their Moon was in Cancer and separating from a conjunction to Saturn (they are both highly Saturnian people anyway. Saturn and Uranus and Pluto, all in one. lol)

Anyway going to have a look later at your friends.


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Ceridwen
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posted January 19, 2017 01:47 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Honestly, no matter the wedding chart, that doesnīt sound good, with him cheating and all.

Funny eneough my parents have a wedding chart that other people probably would have deemed "doomed" and unstable.


Venus 22 Aries
Chiron 24 Aries

opposite

uranus 24 Libra

square

Mars 20 Cancer

square

Atropos 22 Capricorn


But they made it work quite superbly for over 40 years (Mercury was on 22 Gemini though, and hence sextile/ trine the Venus-Chiron-uranus bit.


they also had no really nasty applying Moon aspects and I ehard that should be avoided as you might run into problems in the course of the marriage. Their Moon was in Cancer and separating from a conjunction to Saturn (they are both highly Saturnian people anyway. Saturn and Uranus and Pluto, all in one. lol)

Anyway going to have a look later at your friends.


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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 08:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Honestly, no matter the wedding chart, that doesnīt sound good, with him cheating and all.

Yeah. But I was thinking, now - married and all, he'll stop, right?

quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Funny eneough my parents have a wedding chart that other people probably would have deemed "doomed" and unstable.

Venus 22 Aries
Chiron 24 Aries

opposite

uranus 24 Libra

square

Mars 20 Cancer

square

Atropos 22 Capricorn


But they made it work quite superbly for over 40 years (Mercury was on 22 Gemini though, and hence sextile/ trine the Venus-Chiron-uranus bit.


they also had no really nasty applying Moon aspects and I ehard that should be avoided as you might run into problems in the course of the marriage. Their Moon was in Cancer and separating from a conjunction to Saturn (they are both highly Saturnian people anyway. Saturn and Uranus and Pluto, all in one. lol)

Anyway going to have a look later at your friends.


That's nice to hear! It is, after all their internal dynamic that counts more than a chart for one day.
Yeah, the applying square to the moon from the sun is worrisome.

Thanks for looking, I'd love to have your opinions on the charts.

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Faith
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posted January 19, 2017 09:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I thought, "She sounds like a Pisces moon. "

They have some mirroring: his moon-Neptune matches her Pisces moon. Both have their suns as part of a stellium, including Venus conjunct Mercury, both in fire signs. NN trine NN in earth signs.

One strong binding factor is that ASC/DSC reverse conjunction.

With all that I can see why there is a feeling of Meaning between them.

I think her Pluto on his SN might be the culprit for why she won't let him go even though he cheats. Also her Leo Venus-Jupiter trine his sun.

Composite chart has Venus squaring the NN in Pisces. I guess it's just something they have to work out.

Sun opposing Saturn-Uranus, widely squaring the Vertex axis. Mars on the IC. I think most people who know astrology would not be eager to get into a marriage with all that going on. But still....I can see the binding factors.

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Faith
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posted January 19, 2017 09:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Her Lilith-Uranus conjunct his moon: unsettling

But this is widely trine his Mars-NN: so he likes it?

His Scorpio Saturn square her Leo stellium. Maybe she feels like all she has to do is try a little harder, be a little more perfect (Virgo sun) and it will fix that feeling of disapproval.

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Ceridwen
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posted January 19, 2017 09:37 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Elysia,

maybe this sounds cynical, but my first thought was:

Why would he (stop)?


Marriage does not change people`s personality, not overnight at least. And if he has never gotten caught or she did not say anything about it, why would he stop? I mean why would he cheat on her in the first place?


Sorry, I really don`t get it, why people get married, why HE gets married, when he is not really feeling committed to her, and he isn`t, as his behaviour shows.

Maybe I am too rigid in that, and it really is up to the two people in question, if both agree with that scenario, I am the last one to object, but for now it sounds to me like an absolute disrespect of your friend and their relationship.

And while he might not have been caught YET, the whole thing will simply blow up right into their face, and it will be even worse with the knot they tied.
I really feel for your friend. It`s such a sad situation.


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Ceridwen
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posted January 19, 2017 09:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Is the time of the weddingchart right?

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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 09:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Is the time of the weddingchart right?

^Yes, the time is right.

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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 10:01 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Faith:
I thought, "She sounds like a Pisces moon. "

Haha.. I thought so too, at first. And I get the whole acceptance thing. But it's not that that's keeping her with him - umm, nvm.. I dunno quite how to explain it without going into the whole thing.

quote:
Originally posted by Faith:
They have some mirroring: his moon-Neptune matches her Pisces moon. Both have their suns as part of a stellium, including Venus conjunct Mercury, both in fire signs. NN trine NN in earth signs.

One strong binding factor is that ASC/DSC reverse conjunction.

With all that I can see why there is a feeling of Meaning between them.

I think her Pluto on his SN might be the culprit for why she won't let him go even though he cheats. Also her Leo Venus-Jupiter trine his sun.

Composite chart has Venus squaring the NN in Pisces. I guess it's just something they have to work out.

Sun opposing Saturn-Uranus, widely squaring the Vertex axis. Mars on the IC. I think most people who know astrology would not be eager to get into a marriage with all that going on. But still....I can see the binding factors.


Yes, bingo! Thanks for laying those out. Those are a lot of the binding factors. Venus square NN in composite is a biggie - their skipped step is their own Venus? Wow!
(Although I don't know his birth time, so this asc/dsc overlay might not be there - nevertheless, all those other aspects do give them a sense of something good between them).

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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 10:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Elysia,

maybe this sounds cynical, but my first thought was:

Why would he (stop)?

Marriage does not change people`s personality, not overnight at least. And if he has never gotten caught or she did not say anything about it, why would he stop? I mean why would he cheat on her in the first place?



Well, he simply IS like that. He isn't quite, but considers himself very much the playboy. You know the type? Umm. He even got warnings from HR for his conduct with women (two of them actually did complain).
Okay, why I think he'll change is - my guess is, he's the type to only need the bragging rights (I can get any girl). But now that he's done all that, he'll be ready to settle down ?

Actually, I might be wrong. I thought this when they were getting engaged. But it didn't stop him.

He is committed to her, in his own way. He needs a stable, loving presence at home.

quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Maybe I am too rigid in that, and it really is up to the two people in question, if both agree with that scenario, I am the last one to object, but for now it sounds to me like an absolute disrespect of your friend and their relationship.

And while he might not have been caught YET, the whole thing will simply blow up right into their face, and it will be even worse with the knot they tied.
I really feel for your friend. It`s such a sad situation.


Aah this brings back so many memories!
:edit:
(Ignore my ramblings here, I guess I'd just rest easier if I could be there in person. In person support is different from thousands of miles away, in some things.) tMoon hitting my sun almost exactly now, making me all emotional. Gahh.

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Ceridwen
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posted January 19, 2017 10:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks.

Well actually that - within a frame of course- is a nice one.

Stable warm Taurus on the ASC - though would you really want to make a disrespectful relationship permanent? Hu?

But anyway Taurus on ASC is a nice thing. Some astrologers would see the ruler of ASC as one person and ruler of DESC as the other.

In this instance the rulers, Venus and Pluto are in a closely applying sextile. That is actually rather nice. and might give them the feelin this can work.

Venus and the old ruler Mars are in an applying conjunction, but this one will never happen in Pisces.
It`s like reaching for something that is dangling in the air, but you can never quite get it.

In fact, Mars, is placed quite difficult.

If for a moment we imagine the usual roles (I don`t know if that is really the way this can be done though, just hypothizing), then she would be signified by the Pisces Venus and he by Pisces-Mars.


Well Venus has just separated from a conjunction to Neptune possibly giving her the feeling this is it, my soulmate, my knight in shining armour, and my personal fairytale. Problem is it could be, or she could be pursuing an illusion.


Mars on the other hand is quite difficult here. Conjunct Chiron, square Saturn exact. Might be even the tightest aspect. That does not bode too well imo. But then again my parents had some harsh aspects too and made it work, right? always keep that in the back of our mind.

Saturn conjunct Juno could be the attempt and wish to want to make it all lasting, but as I know from looking at other eventcharts in this timeframe, this Saturn-Juno is currently and persistently opposed by Atropos.
Not sure if I would say divorce is already inbuilt into that scenario. Maybe it just means that there will be a profound shift in their relationship through marriage. Yes, maybe it would even be him stopping to cheat.
Well with Mars squaring that ATropos-Saturn/Juno-thing, the change and shift would have to do with him, either he REALLY changes and seriously commits, as Saturn-Juno is asking him, too, or I don`t think this will last.


The really good thing here is of course the Moon-Jupiter-conjunction in Libra, applying to sextile Saturn-Juno. I think they genuinely feel for each other and want to make this work, and there is a lot of feelings there.


I donīt know abou the upcoming square to Sun though. Well Sun is on the MC - of course a public event here. And in 7 months or 7 years when pr or solar Moon will be exactly square, there will be an important choice to make I guess. Maybe they willl come out of it stronger than before, but maybe not.

Sun and MC are on the very last degree of a sign, I read in wedding chart it can sometimes points to divorces, if important planets are on 29 degrees - I would take it with a grain of salt of course.

here it is a critical degree with the flavour of Saturn/Uranus - once again the decision: shall I stay or shall I go?

They will really have towork on that. And turning a blind eye will only erode their marriage. I think the only chance they have, is facing their issues and talk them out and decide honestly what each of them wants and if they can bring it into agreement.

Also Venus, her, is on the Mars/Neptune-mp, I guess she really doesn`t see too clear, though this is of course very imaginative and romantic and erotic as well.

On the other hand it could also simply mean that the love and harmony will get eroded.

But well please take it with a lot of grains of salt, maybe they wil just make a wonderful married couple. Let`s hope so.

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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 10:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Mind-blowing analysis, Ceri!
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:

Stable warm Taurus on the ASC - though would you really want to make a disrespectful relationship permanent? Hu?

But anyway Taurus on ASC is a nice thing. Some astrologers would see the ruler of ASC as one person and ruler of DESC as the other.

In this instance the rulers, Venus and Pluto are in a closely applying sextile. That is actually rather nice. and might give them the feelin this can work.

Venus and the old ruler Mars are in an applying conjunction, but this one will never happen in Pisces.
It`s like reaching for something that is dangling in the air, but you can never quite get it.



Slightly evasive but also romantic tone, I sees.
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
In fact, Mars, is placed quite difficult.

If for a moment we imagine the usual roles (I don`t know if that is really the way this can be done though, just hypothizing), then she would be signified by the Pisces Venus and he by Pisces-Mars.


Well Venus has just separated from a conjunction to Neptune possibly giving her the feeling this is it, my soulmate, my knight in shining armour, and my personal fairytale. Problem is it could be, or she could be pursuing an illusion.
Mars on the other hand is quite difficult here. Conjunct Chiron, square Saturn exact. Might be even the tightest aspect. That does not bode too well imo. But then again my parents had some harsh aspects too and made it work, right? always keep that in the back of our mind.



Yeah, I figured, at least it's not mars sq uranus, right? And he has a Cap moon, so Saturn aspects, even the harsh ones, might not be so bad.
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Saturn conjunct Juno could be the attempt and wish to want to make it all lasting, but as I know from looking at other eventcharts in this timeframe, this Saturn-Juno is currently and persistently opposed by Atropos.
Not sure if I would say divorce is already inbuilt into that scenario. Maybe it just means that there will be a profound shift in their relationship through marriage. Yes, maybe it would even be him stopping to cheat.
Well with Mars squaring that ATropos-Saturn/Juno-thing, the change and shift would have to do with him, either he REALLY changes and seriously commits, as Saturn-Juno is asking him, too, or I don`t think this will last.


Atropos as major shift in energies - aha! Okay, fingers crossed here.
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
The really good thing here is of course the Moon-Jupiter-conjunction in Libra, applying to sextile Saturn-Juno. I think they genuinely feel for each other and want to make this work, and there is a lot of feelings there.

I donīt know abou the upcoming square to Sun though. Well Sun is on the MC - of course a public event here. And in 7 months or 7 years when pr or solar Moon will be exactly square, there will be an important choice to make I guess. Maybe they willl come out of it stronger than before, but maybe not.



It's interesting you mention that cycle. Is it the pr Sun of the wedding chart you mean?
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Sun and MC are on the very last degree of a sign, I read in wedding chart it can sometimes points to divorces, if important planets are on 29 degrees - I would take it with a grain of salt of course.

here it is a critical degree with the flavour of Saturn/Uranus - once again the decision: shall I stay or shall I go?

They will really have towork on that. And turning a blind eye will only erode their marriage. I think the only chance they have, is facing their issues and talk them out and decide honestly what each of them wants and if they can bring it into agreement.

Also Venus, her, is on the Mars/Neptune-mp, I guess she really doesn`t see too clear, though this is of course very imaginative and romantic and erotic as well.

On the other hand it could also simply mean that the love and harmony will get eroded.

But well please take it with a lot of grains of salt, maybe they wil just make a wonderful married couple. Let`s hope so.


Yes - I think the theme here is, eventually they'll have to confront it and work on it, right?
Well, either way, whatever happens, I'm there for her. Well, not physically, but in spirit.

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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 10:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Faith:
Her Lilith-Uranus conjunct his moon: unsettling

But this is widely trine his Mars-NN: so he likes it?

His Scorpio Saturn square her Leo stellium. Maybe she feels like all she has to do is try a little harder, be a little more perfect (Virgo sun) and it will fix that feeling of disapproval.


Oh, oh.. Did not see the Saturn square! Yeah, and Saturn being her chart ruler as well, gives an extra dose of patience perhaps.

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Ceridwen
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posted January 19, 2017 11:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
"Mind-blowing analysis, Ceri! "
Thank you.

"Yeah, I figured, at least it's not mars sq uranus, right? "
Not necessarily. Depends on the individuals involved. Some people can work with those energies.
Interestingly my parent`s wedding chart`s has Mars square Uranus (4 degres applying).
But no instability there.


I honestly have no clue why Mars-Uranus in their case did not behave like Mars-Uranus.
Though when pVenus was exact opposing Uranus and pMars was within 1-2 degrees of the square, my middle brother was born with Down syndrome.
And Down syndrome is actually a very Uranian manifestation (usually Venus-Uranus or a 2nd/ 11th house interconnection, which my brother actually has. lol)

"It's interesting you mention that cycle. Is it the pr Sun of the wedding chart you mean? "
pr Moon of the wedding chart actually, as it will trigger the wedding chart Sun

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Ceridwen
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posted January 19, 2017 11:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well in my parents wedding chart Mars is also parallel Saturn (and Venus parallel Jupiter) - maybe those should be taken into consideration as well.

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Elysia
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posted January 19, 2017 11:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
"Yeah, I figured, at least it's not mars sq uranus, right? "
Not necessarily. Depends on the individuals involved. Some people can work with those energies.
Interestingly my parent`s wedding chart`s has Mars square Uranus (4 degres applying).
But no instability there.


I honestly have no clue why Mars-Uranus in their case did not behave like Mars-Uranus.
Though when pVenus was exact opposing Uranus and pMars was within 1-2 degrees of the square, my middle brother was born with Down syndrome.
And Down syndrome is actually a very Uranian manifestation (usually Venus-Uranus or a 2nd/ 11th house interconnection, which my brother actually has. lol)


Oh! I'm so sorry..
Yeah, it can manifest in so many ways. Really eye-opening to see an example though!
Thank you so much, once again. I'm still mulling over what you've written.
It's certainly helping me feel less stressed out, in a way.

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Beautiful_Light
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posted January 20, 2017 02:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Beautiful_Light     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Synastry: Psyche conj Nessus doesn't look good

Composite: Moon conj Eros might blind them and cause them to behave based on emotions and feelings rather than logic. North Node in the 11th but with Dejaneira and BML doesn't look good either

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girlwiththerainysoul
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posted January 20, 2017 03:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for girlwiththerainysoul     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
more than her pisces moon, I think it is his sun/venus square her neptune making her so forgiving/blind towards his action.

what makes him cheat on her specifically? in my opinion, it's his mars square her venus.

what gives her hope that he'll change? his sun trine her jupiter.

If she wants to express any kind of complaint, he probably shushes her in the "don't be stupid babe" way, with his saturn square her mercury. She probably eats her words in his presence.

if they're born in the opposite chinese years, the sheep and the ox, it might explain their dynamics as well. because these two signs supposedly are natural enemies or something according to the chinese.

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Elysia
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posted January 23, 2017 09:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by girlwiththerainysoul:
more than her pisces moon, I think it is his sun/venus square her neptune making her so forgiving/blind towards his action.

what makes him cheat on her specifically? in my opinion, it's his mars square her venus.

what gives her hope that he'll change? his sun trine her jupiter.



Right, Neptune & Jupiter can sprinkle magic on things like that..
I'm not sure it's just with her specifically though, he's like that with everyone. Maybe he had a bad relationship or something? And perhaps this is their chance to work through both of their issues and find unconditional love & acceptance (NN in Pisces)?

quote:
Originally posted by girlwiththerainysoul:
If she wants to express any kind of complaint, he probably shushes her in the "don't be stupid babe" way, with his saturn square her mercury. She probably eats her words in his presence.

if they're born in the opposite chinese years, the sheep and the ox, it might explain their dynamics as well. because these two signs supposedly are natural enemies or something according to the chinese.


Wow, that is bang on about the Saturn-Mercury thing! Not only to her, he talks like that about her to other people too (like, "yeah, what can we do, she f***d up, as always" - even for something very minor, he's very harsh).

ETA: I didn't know that about the Chinese years! Interesting.

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Elysia
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posted January 23, 2017 09:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elysia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beautiful_Light:
Synastry: Psyche conj Nessus doesn't look good

Composite: Moon conj Eros might blind them and cause them to behave based on emotions and feelings rather than logic. North Node in the 11th but with Dejaneira and BML doesn't look good either


Thanks for your input, Beautiful_Light..
The moon-jupiter might add some really good vibes to that other configuration.

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