posted September 26, 2021 05:32 PM            

I hope this isn't redundant (my other thread didn't go anywhere unfortunately!) but I would really really really appreciate your help on this relationship! It's new, and it feels strong. I have assessed it myself, but I am so close to it all that I would love some perspective. This is a new relationship.

Both birth times are correct! And I will add my input as well. Thank you all so much!

His natal:

Mine:

Composite:

posted September 28, 2021 05:29 PM            

I have yet to have a relationship without the Saturn Uranus troubles. And I have Uranus opposed Chiron natal, as does he, and it shows up always in my composites. It is indeed emotional and passionate and we aren’t even beyond friendship yet. It’s disheartening to think it’s short lived.

posted September 29, 2021 12:27 PM            

'Tis better to have loved and lost, than never to have loved at all.

We always risk the chance of losing. It can hurt so much, and run so deep.

But love runs just as deep or deeper, I believe.

posted October 24, 2021 09:36 AM            

We met Friday and we laid many things out on the table. We have spent the last two months talking and talking and having fun, and he said he feels attraction and desire, but also just having come out of a long term relationship, he wants to put physical aside and build a foundation first. He confirmed his interest on all levels, and that building this connection is first and foremost.

So seriously committed I don't know, but investing in the potential yes.

Stoika I really appreciate all that you do here. You have helped me several times. And this update is for you so you can see how your readings turn out.

posted October 24, 2021 12:26 PM            

If I was dating/involved with a predominant Saturnian, I would keep my eye on them and watch for any red flags of such issues. This is provided that the physical and spiritual birth times are relatively close and the chart is relatively accurate. It may be there is some difference and the chart is not accurate, and another Planet could be predominant.

I know this is not a popular opinion here or in most astrological circles, but I've seen it too often to ignore. There had to be some symbol in the astrological lexicon that had to represent the worst/lowest in human nature, and Saturn is often the symbol that most aligns to that for whatever reason. Again, I'm not talking about the Signs of Capricorn or Aquarius. (And Signs are more about earthly and/or personality archetypes, whereas highlighted Planets more directly connect to Soul patterns).

The Universal Saturn (i.e. Saturn for everyone) is a much more positive symbol. It represents that part of our Expanded self and the larger consciousness system that really wants us to grow spiritually and will put us through tests, challenge, stress, etc to get there. A very necessary and important archetype. I'm not talking about that Saturn here, but I'm talking of the personal Saturn, and which gets noticed when its the first or sometimes the second strongest symbol in the natal. In that case, there is no symbol that is more potentially socio to psychopathic, and remember, these types can be charming and attractive AF to our bodies and ego parts of us.

There is a very interesting Cayce reading given for a man in the military who came in straight from the dimension/consciousness level that Saturn corresponds to, and the source talks about this person's unusual and great personality magnetism, and then also lambastes them for their lack of scruples/ethics/conscience and they were warned about this and where it was leading karmically/spiritually.

These types mimic and study normal human behavior as to fit in (and the more clever and/or self controlled of them can seem quite normal, friendly, and even "nice" when they want), but they are not like us in the core ways that matter. They may as well be a different sub species, because our felt empathy and our conscience is what really makes humans, human/humane.

posted October 24, 2021 01:32 PM            

I can't say my gut tells me anything like that with this man. But then again right now I feel the physical connection quite strongly. I have spent the last several years working on myself, and I believe in "what you be, is what comes". That said, I may have to spend time in meditation on this.

posted October 24, 2021 02:47 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by StoneMoon:
Well that is very dark GCE! Surely all individuals with prominent Saturn won't fit that profile. Interestingly there is another man with Saturn rising in Sag that has pursued me for years. He is nice, generous, passionate... but I am very leery of spending time with him. Mostly because he doesn't take no for an answer and will double his efforts to pursue me, despite me telling him in no uncertain terms I am not interested in a romantic relationship.

I can't say my gut tells me anything like that with this man. But then again right now I feel the physical connection quite strongly. I have spent the last several years working on myself, and I believe in "what you be, is what comes". That said, I may have to spend time in meditation on this.

Can you tell me what I would be looking for by looking deeply into them?

---

Yes, it is, and I'm somewhat sorry for that, but figure I should mention in case it is a possibility. As mentioned, I have come to believe in the Cayce concept of potential difference in time between physical and spiritual birth times, and that the latter is the accurate chart. Hence why I mentioned, it could be that this chart is not accurate for him, and thus he is not a predominant Saturnian.

Also, we have freewill, and that can change things as well in some cases. That's why I spoke to tendencies, averages, and the like. No one, not even the Source/prime Creator itself can, ahead of time, fully predict how a Soul/consciousness will choose to exercise its freewill. There are redemptions and changes that do and can happen, even for dark souls (otherwise, helpers like myself, wouldn't be going into these lacking in light levels during sleep state to try to retrieve such folks).

As to things to watch for, it's not easy to sum up years of reading about NPD and ASPD spectrum and people within same. I would recommend doing your own research into the subject. ASPD folks are particularly tricky because they tend to be so much more covert. A malignant narcissist like Trump can be spotted from miles away, but a subtle, covert psychopath like Hillary Clinton much harder to see for what they really are.

But common patterns with men that are on an NPD or ASPD spectrum, are a lot of love bombing at the beginning. They can seem like the most romantic, "giving", "generous", passionate men around until they get their hooks in their prey (and make no mistake, these type of men are predators and the women that fall for them are prey).

But after some initial intense love bombing, they tend to run very hot and cold. Tend to be highly materialistic--care a lot about stuff, status, money, etc. However, if they have a particular "cover" that is religious or spiritual, they will try to act the part at least in public. Often highly sexed. If they are clever and self controlled, then they are highly manipulative, but in subtle, hard to detect ways.

Watch how they treat so called less important or lower status people like people in serving positions (like wait staff etc), homeless, etc if they show arrogance, impatience, unkindness, intolerance or the like to such folks, that is a big red flag.

Highly sensitive egos, don't mind dishing out criticism (after the initial honeymoon/romance/love bombing phase), but can't take it whatsoever and easily become defensive or angry over anything even remotely resembling criticism of themselves. Can't take responsibility for anything, always someone else fault or problem.

More theoretical, but there is some research which suggests that wider than average faces (proportionally for the length of the face), can be an indicator of increased egotism and decreased empathy, conscience, etc. (Hypothesized to be related to above average levels of androgen hormones like testosterone during formative years).

Just keep your eyes fully open.

posted October 24, 2021 03:40 PM            

I don’t see any of those behaviors in this new man. But narcissistic tendencies are different than the NPD/ASPD. That I know. The guy I dated was classic as you listed above. I dated him for six months and the love bombing was insane and then one day the truth came out.

posted October 24, 2021 04:27 PM            

I don’t see any of those behaviors in this new man. But narcissistic tendencies are different than the NPD/ASPD. That I know. The guy I dated was classic as you listed above. I dated him for six months and the love bombing was insane and then one day the truth came out.

posted October 25, 2021 09:13 PM            

We can do so through more traditional means of chart rectification like through major life events in relation to transits (and to lesser extent progressions). Personally, I like to apply a very holistic approach to this, and consider everything from the above, to the person's looks/appearance, their closest relationships and synastry of same, their personality, and their deeper character.

For me, it all has to fit together, but I pay most attention to the transits/events and synastry connections since these are the least changeable all in all (personality and even deeper character can change due to freewill, and as seen on another thread, even physical influences like head or spine trauma can affect such).

posted October 25, 2021 09:18 PM            

Powerful Mars, Pluto, and/or Mercury will contribute to the slow vibratory side of Saturn.

Conversely, very powerful Venus, Neptune, Jupiter, and/or Sun can counterbalance a predominant Saturnian's tendency towards selfishness, base materialism, and separativeness.

posted November 04, 2021 07:49 AM            

That said... here's something I was thinking about simply for educational purposes. You are noticing a potential detriment in a person's chart due to Saturn conjunct ASC. And watching other slow vibratory planets in relation to the chart. So you see his is conjunct, and he does have a strong Mars, and Moon in 3rd gives a Mercurial influence...

Well look at my chart. I have Saturn square my ASC, just as closely as his conjunction. I have a lot of Virgo, which some argue is Mercurial, though I argue Chiron. I do have Neptune in first, but that has given me more problems than help. My true Mercury is widely conjunct my Saturn, and inconjunct my Moon. And Pluto and Mars are both strong in my chart as well as his.

I am not slow vibratory, I am not narcissistic or sociopathic or psychopathic... actually my Venus at MC is pretty strong. So what makes the difference here? Is this what you mean by spiritual birth? I don't know how to line those up- spiritual vs physical birth- as you do, but I do feel my chart resonates with me.

posted November 04, 2021 04:49 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosionV2:

Watch how they treat so called less important or lower status people like people in serving positions (like wait staff etc), homeless, etc if they show arrogance, impatience, unkindness, intolerance or the like to such folks, that is a big red flag.

Highly sensitive egos, don't mind dishing out criticism (after the initial honeymoon/romance/love bombing phase), but can't take it whatsoever and easily become defensive or angry over anything even remotely resembling criticism of themselves. Can't take responsibility for anything, always someone else fault or problem.

More theoretical, but there is some research which suggests that wider than average faces (proportionally for the length of the face), can be an indicator of increased egotism and decreased empathy, conscience, etc. (Hypothesized to be related to above average levels of androgen hormones like testosterone during formative years).

Just keep your eyes fully open.

---

posted November 04, 2021 06:22 PM            

I have dated someone before that I suspect had this. He didn't know his birth time, but he came out of the gates as this amazing man, sweeping me off my feet. Over time (when he felt he had won me over) he let his true colors show. He underestimated me, and I left.