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T O P I C R E V I E WMeili Zhiwei*Deleted*Meili Zhiwei*Deleted*N_wEvilwell i just hope i manage to recognise it !Thanks, Meili Zhiwei AphroditeWhen will we “see” that disagreements with others are arguments within our own soul?I believe this is true.lioneye68That's an absolute truth. And the more stongly one argues, the more they wish to be shown otherwise.They WANT to believe, but they're afraid of being disappointed at a profound level.StarLover33We all need to speak for ourselves, don't you think Lioneye? -StarLovertrillianRespectfully...truth is never absolute. Truth...is. RaThank you Meili. OxychickTo the top!dafremenI wanted to add something to this, if I might. It is something I wrote to explain to folks that words and the people behind them are two different things. quote:And so you see folks..there is only free_expression where two or more people agree that what is expressed will be interpreted as an entity separate from the person expressing it. Elsewise, the tyranny of differing opinions and perspectives imposed will inevitably cause the majority to persecute those whose expression differs from their own. Personal biases against individuals will be FORCED upon a stand-alone piece of expression. The interpretation of the piece tainted by personal bias against the artist? Yup, you heard me. It´s another justification for artistic snobbery and it´s so damned common amongst artists it´s not funny. I mean when the value of your chosen career field (poet, author, actor, sculptor) to society is questionable at best, you look for shields to hide that fact from the rest of the world. So they turn their noses in the air to hide the fact that they aren´t anymore capable of artistic expression than the average joe. ¨Yea Shut Up Average Joe...what do you know about art? You´re a crude neanderthal who´s looking for attention.¨ And you´re not?! If you speak your mind, they´ll try to shut you up, but when you finally give in, you´ve silenced yourself. Express yourself.....freely. Don´t shut up. Oh and no matter how many times they try to force their point of view on your interpretation, tell them to _____ off! Interpret it for yourself.My opinions on certain things have changed since this was first posted, but the basic premise is the same. Too many people don't hear the message through their impressions of the messenger.dafP.S. trillian..I couldn't help but notice the inconsistency of this comment: quote:Truth is never absolute.Since never is an absolute condition, that statement cannot, by your definition ever be true. There is Truth which is absolute, regardless of what we have been led to or would prefer to believe.ozonefiller to you Daf and thank you for not only pointing that out,but to come around just to point that out!Nice seeing you again! trillianAin't the meanings of words fun?Nothing like a good oxymoron. Just for giggles. But really daf, with all due respect, I do not believe in absolute truth, per se. Not by the kinds of definitions that seem dear to you. Well.I believe in this as pretty close to absolute truth: Life Is.Beyond that, define it as you like, because, you will. Peace.taharielThat all completely confused me, what is a sage ? What is the post about ? I have a feeling that once put into simple terms, I will have an opinion !! :0)dafremenA sage is a wise man.What the story attempts to point out is that sometimes people will hear the exact same message from one person and like it, but hear it from another person and NOT like it. The difference isn't the message, because the message is the same, the difference has to do with the person delivering the message, and how the message is delivered.That seems quite ridiculous, since Truth is Truth is Truth. Wisdom is wisdom whether it is spoken by a sage or a drunken fool.Truth number one trillian: All things return to their source.You seem to think that I am opinionated. I would like to suggest that you are basing your perception of who I am and how I think upon your experience with other people. That's normally a very helpful way to get around in the world, but I'm afraid it's not going to get you any closer to understanding how my mind works or why it is that I do things.I don't cling to beliefs, love. They have proved themselves to be a breeding ground for inconsistency. I don't cling to a "my truth" nor do I find a "your truth" which disagrees with whatever notion I happen to be entertaining at any given time, to be disagreeable. I like to learn what I can from the "your truth"s that pop up and discard what DOESN'T hold water. A perfect example would be your statement that there is no absolute Truth. Without BELIEVING anything, (and hopefully without going into another of those long-winded engagements of ego) that notion is KNOWN (as opposed to "believed") by quite a few to be patently false. There IS absolute Truth. Will I embrace those things which appear to be true today? No. Will I believe those things which I know to be true? For now. But see, that's the crazy thing; I only KNOW one thing to be absolutely true. Everything else is just a snapshot in time and understanding. Everything else which attempts to lay claim to being "my belief" has been summarily discarded when it proved useless or detrimental to my understanding of Truth. Truth has no need for beliefs.As always, your intellect is outweighed only by your charm.Love,dafP.S. Right back atcha OZ.trilliandaf, quote:As always, your intellect is outweighed only by your charm.Uh oh. Me thinks perhaps a wee bit of a dig? No worries, I don't mind, I may even deserve it.You're likely right, I probably don't understand you. Hmmm, I can't seem to recall any of your astrological make up, are you a Cancer?But any opinion I have of you is based solely on your posts here, and my perception of them, of course.I agree; "knowing" and "believing" are often confused. I know very little, if anything at all.I believe almost everything.I have opinions on nearly everything, opinions that I'm not afraid to change.Now, I suppose that's my ego talking, at least in part. But you'll please pardon me if I don't subscribe to your absolute belief in an absolute truth.There are many paths to walk, and I can only walk and know my own. I may have an opinion about yours, but I will do my best not to judge it too harshly, because they are one, if not the same. dafremenNo dig intended, just a flip-flop half-full half-empty quip custom made for you. I have another that came out that way...I think it was:"Your concern is as appreciated as it is misguided." dafjuniperb Happy Days,I FINALLY SEE the smilie sequence ..... ------------------If having a soul means being able to feel love and loyalty and gratitude, then animals are better off than a lot of humans. ~James HerriotquiksilverWhat do you mean by this, Juniperb? Is there something in the smilie sequence that you couldn't see before? If so, what? Or am I just reading ridiculously into all of this??juniperbHi quiksilver, and congratulations on your modship Yes, I see something I was unable to see before. Rereading Meili`s words from a different perspective and applying them to the smilies filled in the puzzle. ------------------If having a soul means being able to feel love and loyalty and gratitude, then animals are better off than a lot of humans. ~James HerriotorchidspiritSorry deleted this
Thanks, Meili Zhiwei
I believe this is true.
-StarLover
quote:And so you see folks..there is only free_expression where two or more people agree that what is expressed will be interpreted as an entity separate from the person expressing it. Elsewise, the tyranny of differing opinions and perspectives imposed will inevitably cause the majority to persecute those whose expression differs from their own. Personal biases against individuals will be FORCED upon a stand-alone piece of expression. The interpretation of the piece tainted by personal bias against the artist? Yup, you heard me. It´s another justification for artistic snobbery and it´s so damned common amongst artists it´s not funny. I mean when the value of your chosen career field (poet, author, actor, sculptor) to society is questionable at best, you look for shields to hide that fact from the rest of the world. So they turn their noses in the air to hide the fact that they aren´t anymore capable of artistic expression than the average joe. ¨Yea Shut Up Average Joe...what do you know about art? You´re a crude neanderthal who´s looking for attention.¨ And you´re not?! If you speak your mind, they´ll try to shut you up, but when you finally give in, you´ve silenced yourself. Express yourself.....freely. Don´t shut up. Oh and no matter how many times they try to force their point of view on your interpretation, tell them to _____ off! Interpret it for yourself.
Elsewise, the tyranny of differing opinions and perspectives imposed will inevitably cause the majority to persecute those whose expression differs from their own.
Personal biases against individuals will be FORCED upon a stand-alone piece of expression.
The interpretation of the piece tainted by personal bias against the artist? Yup, you heard me. It´s another justification for artistic snobbery and it´s so damned common amongst artists it´s not funny.
I mean when the value of your chosen career field (poet, author, actor, sculptor) to society is questionable at best, you look for shields to hide that fact from the rest of the world. So they turn their noses in the air to hide the fact that they aren´t anymore capable of artistic expression than the average joe. ¨Yea Shut Up Average Joe...what do you know about art? You´re a crude neanderthal who´s looking for attention.¨
And you´re not?!
If you speak your mind, they´ll try to shut you up, but when you finally give in, you´ve silenced yourself.
Express yourself.....freely. Don´t shut up. Oh and no matter how many times they try to force their point of view on your interpretation, tell them to _____ off!
Interpret it for yourself.
My opinions on certain things have changed since this was first posted, but the basic premise is the same. Too many people don't hear the message through their impressions of the messenger.
daf
P.S. trillian..I couldn't help but notice the inconsistency of this comment:
quote:Truth is never absolute.
Since never is an absolute condition, that statement cannot, by your definition ever be true. There is Truth which is absolute, regardless of what we have been led to or would prefer to believe.
Nice seeing you again!
Nothing like a good oxymoron. Just for giggles.
But really daf, with all due respect, I do not believe in absolute truth, per se. Not by the kinds of definitions that seem dear to you.
Well.I believe in this as pretty close to absolute truth: Life Is.
Beyond that, define it as you like, because, you will.
Peace.
What the story attempts to point out is that sometimes people will hear the exact same message from one person and like it, but hear it from another person and NOT like it. The difference isn't the message, because the message is the same, the difference has to do with the person delivering the message, and how the message is delivered.
That seems quite ridiculous, since Truth is Truth is Truth. Wisdom is wisdom whether it is spoken by a sage or a drunken fool.
Truth number one trillian: All things return to their source.
You seem to think that I am opinionated. I would like to suggest that you are basing your perception of who I am and how I think upon your experience with other people. That's normally a very helpful way to get around in the world, but I'm afraid it's not going to get you any closer to understanding how my mind works or why it is that I do things.
I don't cling to beliefs, love. They have proved themselves to be a breeding ground for inconsistency. I don't cling to a "my truth" nor do I find a "your truth" which disagrees with whatever notion I happen to be entertaining at any given time, to be disagreeable. I like to learn what I can from the "your truth"s that pop up and discard what DOESN'T hold water. A perfect example would be your statement that there is no absolute Truth. Without BELIEVING anything, (and hopefully without going into another of those long-winded engagements of ego) that notion is KNOWN (as opposed to "believed") by quite a few to be patently false. There IS absolute Truth. Will I embrace those things which appear to be true today? No. Will I believe those things which I know to be true? For now. But see, that's the crazy thing; I only KNOW one thing to be absolutely true. Everything else is just a snapshot in time and understanding. Everything else which attempts to lay claim to being "my belief" has been summarily discarded when it proved useless or detrimental to my understanding of Truth. Truth has no need for beliefs.
As always, your intellect is outweighed only by your charm.
Love,
P.S. Right back atcha OZ.
quote:As always, your intellect is outweighed only by your charm.
Uh oh. Me thinks perhaps a wee bit of a dig? No worries, I don't mind, I may even deserve it.
You're likely right, I probably don't understand you. Hmmm, I can't seem to recall any of your astrological make up, are you a Cancer?But any opinion I have of you is based solely on your posts here, and my perception of them, of course.I agree; "knowing" and "believing" are often confused.
I know very little, if anything at all.
I believe almost everything.
I have opinions on nearly everything, opinions that I'm not afraid to change.
Now, I suppose that's my ego talking, at least in part. But you'll please pardon me if I don't subscribe to your absolute belief in an absolute truth.
There are many paths to walk, and I can only walk and know my own. I may have an opinion about yours, but I will do my best not to judge it too harshly, because they are one, if not the same.
"Your concern is as appreciated as it is misguided."
I FINALLY SEE the smilie sequence .....
------------------If having a soul means being able to feel love and loyalty and gratitude, then animals are better off than a lot of humans. ~James Herriot
Yes, I see something I was unable to see before.
Rereading Meili`s words from a different perspective and applying them to the smilies filled in the puzzle.
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