posted September 08, 2008 07:28 PM         

I have looked for the thread discussing how the rulership of the angles works in synastry, but I have failed to find it.

I am wondering, do the angles have to be contacted each way, by both people in synastry for it to be felt by both people?

For example:

* Ruler of Boy's Ascendant conjuncts Girl's Descendant (2 degree orb)
* Ruler of Boy's IC conjuncts Girl's Descendant (0 degree orb)
* Ruler of Boy's Descendant conjuncts Girl's Descendant (0 degree orb)

* Ruler of Girl's Ascendant conjuncts Boy's IC, but the orb is 6 degrees, and is therefore technically out of orb.

*Boy's Ascendant squares Girl's Descendant and Girls's Ascendant then squares Boy's Descendant (1 degree orb).

I'm not really clear on how this would play out between two people. I would have to guess that Girl would see Boy as a serious partner while Boy, who is not receiving any of the same conjunctions (at least not with a tight orb) might not see Girl in quite the same way.

Am I understanding this correctly?

posted September 09, 2008 02:55 AM         

the angles do not necessarily have to be activated both ways. One way will work, too.

Everyone experience the nature of the angle that is triggered in his or her own chart.

The 5th house and 7th house relate to what we seek outside of ourselves in a partner, what we are attracted to.
The 5th house is a bit of a mixed bag though, since it also represents our romantic, creative and sexual expression. But it also shows what you feel drawn to in a more erotic way.

The ASC and IC are very personal points. The ASC is our physical identity so to speak, whereas the IC shows our deepest emotional core (body and soul, you could say).
Of course if something hits your IC you will be emotionally affected, so you won´t stay unimpressed, unless you are in denial of your emotional nature. Then you probably would hate having your IC activated.

NOw, usually aspects work both ways, for example if someone`s DC is aspecting your ASC. He will be drawn to you very strongly (his DC shows what he is drawn and attracted to). And his attraction to you will probably triggert some good feelings inside you, too, as we like to be desired, don`t we? Exception might be he is astrologically completely "not your type".

BUT if only one`s person`s DSC and 5th house and Venus are activating the other person`s Sun or ASC, but not the other way round, this might lead to an unrequited love.

In your case girl may be attracted more strongly to boy.
BUT you also have a connection between IC and DC - that is the one connection I ahve found almost always in relationships we like to call "soulmates".
The IC, even though a very personal point, is very sensitive to others too. It means that his deepest core is wwhat girl is attracted to in a partner.
But since his IC is triggered, she may evoke some very deep feelings inside him (think of how it feels if his Moon was involved - a more soulful than romantic emotional connection, but nevertheless deep).

Also ruler of DSC conjunct each other shows that they both are attracted to the same.
In this case it is really important to see, if they fit each other`s type natally.
Example:
His DSC in Pisces, her Neptune conjunct ASC - she would fit his type, because what he needs and is drawn to (DSC in Pisces) is part of her identity (ASC conjunct Neptune resemples PiscesASC).

The squares will trigger some energetic exchange, too, even though not so smoothly I guess. It might be more the attraction between different qualities. Even though the mode (fix or cardinale or mobile) will be the same.

you can also see if the ruler of boy`s DSC is aspecting girl`s Sun, Moon or Venus, as the planets also relate to her identity.

posted September 09, 2008 05:02 AM         

Okay, so, just to throw it all out there clearly, with planets:

Ruler of Boy's Ascendant is Neptune, which conjuncts Girls' Descendant. Although the ruler of Girl's Descendant is Jupiter, Neptune is the only planet in her seventh house. Girl's Neptune conjuncts Boy's MC.

Ruler of Boy's IC *and* Descendant is Mercury. His Mercury conjuncts Girl's Descendant as well as his own Neptune.

Ruler of Girl's Ascendant is Mercury and in addition to this, Mercury conjuncts her Ascendant, and with a wide orb, also conjuncts Boy's IC.

As mentioned above, ruler of Boy's Descendant is Mercury. His Mercury also quincunxes Girl's Sun and Venus (0,1 orb) and also trines her Saturn (0 orb) which is conjunct her IC.

Ruler of Girl's 5th house is Mercury. Ruler of Boy's 5th house is Moon. Boy's Moon is in his 7th house and falls into Girl's 5th house.

As mentioned above, Girl's 7th house is ruled by Jupiter. Girl has Moon widely conjunct Jupiter in her 12th house. Boy's Moon trines Girl's Jupiter (1 deg orb).

Not sure if this is relevant, but the ruler of Girl's 8th house is also Jupiter, and Boy's Jupiter falls into her 8th house. Boy's 8th house ruler is Venus. Girl's Venus falls into his 4th house

That's all I think you mentioned I should look for in regards to angles. I wanted to mention that they also have Lust conjunct Ascendant double whammy (0,2 degree orbs). And another interesting thing is that Boy and Girl each have Saturn conjunct their own IC. Boy's Isis conjuncts girl's IC and Girl's Osiris conjuncts Boy's IC, 5 degree orb each, but worth mentioning due to the symmetry.

posted September 09, 2008 07:33 AM         

Actually I chose this, because first I am a Jupiter-ASC myself, and I realized that there are often cross connection between Sagittarius / Gemini and Pisces / Virgo - the JUpiter / Mercury / Neptune`s are just drawn to each other i guess.

So the physical appearance of the boy is attracting the girl (ASC is more than mere physical appearance though; it`s almost like the genetical makeup, identity).

" Although the ruler of Girl's Descendant is Jupiter, Neptune is the only planet in her seventh house."
If Neptune is in her 7th house, then she will be drawn to Neptunian people natally, and he with Pisces ASC is highly Neptunian.

So he fits her type natally AND there is a channel for this attraction to find actual expression through the synastry contact. So a very strong connection. Probably an attraction in a Neptunian way, whatever that is. (as Neptune makes the connection)

" Girl's Neptune conjuncts Boy's MC."
So boy`s MC falls into her DSC? Is it conjunct?
Always a strong interplay, if the angles are touching each other. Happens quite a lot.

"Ruler of Boy's IC *and* Descendant is Mercury. His Mercury conjuncts Girl's Descendant as well as his own Neptune."
I guess the ruler of IC and DSC being the same means relationships always hit deeply, but of course it is over Mercury, so he could try to rationalize it.

However, it`s a deep interconnection, even though maybe it would be stronger if girl`s ASC or Sun would be activated, too. This way it`s her again who is drawn to his depth.

"Ruler of Girl's Ascendant is Mercury and in addition to this, M
ercury conjuncts her Ascendant,"
Well, he had the ruler of DSC conjunct the ruler of ASC - she has the ruler of ASC conjunct ASC natally. I suppose that would be the ground for a strong attraction from him to her, too.
Of course this depends also on the sign. For example I guess all of this happens in Sagittarius, as his Mercury and Neptune are in Sag,r ight?
Now her ruler of ASC is Mercury conjunct ASC, so therefore falls into Gemini, right?
So he seeks Sag energy, and she provides Gemini, complimentary opposites. Magnetic attraction.

posted September 09, 2008 07:33 AM         

Trines can be awfully nice, as the same element is triggered. There is basic compatibility. But it`s not so much pointing to the ONE. It`s more like being part of the same family, very close, but not a one on one connection.

Squares now have something in common, too - the mode, but elements are incompatible. Those are good for sparks, chemistry, and growth, but also contain an element of animosity and competition. Constantly arguing, up and down, but also producing a lot of heat and energy.

Sextile, quinkunx and semisextile I wouldn`t count, as they have just NOTHING in common, neither mode nor element. Very different energies, and often don`t see each other very well.
Sextile is the better of those, because at least the elements are compatible, they could support each other, but there is no real deep inner sense of familiarity or being related to each other.

"Ruler of Girl's 5th house is Mercury. Ruler of Boy's 5th house is Moon. Boy's Moon is in his 7th house and falls into Girl's 5th house. "
So, his 5th house ruler in her 5th house seems to be good for romance.

"I wanted to mention that they also have Lust conjunct Ascendant double whammy (0,2 degree orbs)."
That sounds juicy.

"And another interesting thing is that Boy "and Girl each have Saturn conjunct their own IC."
That gives them a similiarity regarding their inner core and emotional being, and should either make them understand each other or hate each other`s guts, because they see an unloved part of themselves reflected in the other. It depends on the rest of the chart what will happen, and on how Saturn is intervowen into it all.

" Boy's Isis conjuncts girl's IC and Girl's Osiris conjuncts Boy's IC, 5 degree orb each, but worth mentioning due to the symmetry."
I wouldn`t count it. 5° is definitely too wide for an asteroid in my book.
But hey, there are as many opinions on orbs as astrologers on this earth.

posted September 09, 2008 04:19 PM         

I normally wouldn't count it either, however I love patterns ( I have Pallas conjunct Ascendant ) and when I see something like that in a synastry chart, I always get a feeling that I should sit up and take notice, really just based on the symmetry. I think I look at chart symmetry stuff the way someone else might look at mutual reception, or something.

As for the rest of it, thanks so much for your analysis of the angles/aspects DD!

<< So boy`s MC falls into her DSC? Is it conjunct?>> No, it's not conjunct the Descendant, however Girl's Neptune IS conjunct Boy's MC.

I feel like I learned a lot from this thread, but I'm still having a hard time in deciding who is theoretically more affected by the aspects. For example, Girl's Descendant is being aspected 3 times over by 2 of Boy's planets which rule his Ascendant, IC and Descendant. And yet it is Boy's IC ruler which is conjuncting both Girl's Descendant as well as the ruler of Boy's own Ascendant in each of their charts (Neptune).

And even though one of the planets is Mercury, I would think that since it holds rulership over Girl's Ascendant as well as Boy's IC and Descendant, it must have increased power within the chart. Like, maybe Mercury's role in this case might be deeper/less mundane? Just a thought.

Having said all that, this is an example of an unrequited love relationship. Boy ended things with Girl and I was curious to see if your work on house rulerships might be another window into how each person represented in a synastry chart might be feeling the energies of the contacts. And also what role the less personal/romantic planets have when they are responsible for ruling a personal house.

Again, thanks for your help here. I love being able to see charts in a new way and it's fascinating to boot!

posted September 09, 2008 04:41 PM         

Well, Mercury does play a very romantic role here, as he is responsible for the personal houses.

Also, yes, you could see that there might be some unbalanced attraction going on, as girl`s DSC was so strongly aspecting boy`s identity points.

To keep it easy you could look just if there is a conjunction / opposition of girl`s Descendant or ruler of Descendant or ruler of 5th house to ASC, chartruler, Sun, Moon or Mars of boy.

And the other way round you would check if boy`s DSC, ruler of DSC or ruler of 5th house makes such a connection to girl`s ASC, chartruler, Sun, Moon or Venus.

Those will be the most important ones. If you find here even one of these conjunctions, it might signify a magnetic attraction. If you`re lucky it will be both ways, if not, it COULD be a sign of unbalanced attraction.

EDIT:
Of course the planets play a role here, too.
Like Moon - Sun, Venus-Mars, Venus-Sun, Venus - ASC, Mars- DSC.

posted September 09, 2008 06:12 PM         

Ruler of Girl's Descendant is Jupiter and ruler of Boy's 8th house is Venus. But the aspect goes the other way - Boy's Jupiter opposes Girl's Venus (1 orb). Should this be taken into account?

And then I think this is somewhat of a repeat of what I've already said:

Girl's Ascendant (Merc) opposes ruler of Boy's Descendant (Merc) (0 orb) and ruler of Boy's Ascendant (Neptune)(2 orb).

Co-ruler of both Boy's and Girl's IC is Saturn, since it is conjunct the IC in both charts. Boy's Saturn widely opposes Girl's Neptune(which is Boy's chart ruler/Asc.) at a 7 deg orb.

Basically, it's a whole bunch of conjunctions and oppostions between the 2 major rulers of both Boy's and Girl's angles: Mercury and Neptune. There are only tight quincunxes and trines between the angle rulers and B and G's Sun, Moon and Venus.

There are a whole whack of tight trines between ruler of Girl's 7th (Jupiter) and Boy's Moon (Ruler of his 5th), North Node and Vertex. But I see what you mentioned about ignoring everything but conjunctions and oppositions in this excercise.

I guess the fact that Boy's actual Descendant is only being aspected by Girl with trines, squares and quincunxes is the reason for the unrequited nature of the relationship.

Obviously, Boy's IC and Ascendant being conjuncted and opposed by Girl's Mercury and Neptune, respectively, is a soul-binding experience, but not a partnership one.

Very cool experiment.

posted September 15, 2008 04:55 PM         

I have another question, if you don't mind. What is your opinion about having each and every angle in a synastry chart conjuncting each other?

Le Example:

Girl's AC conjunct Boy's IC
Girl's IC conjunct Boy's DSC
Girl's DSC conjunct Boy's MC
Girl's MC conjunct Boy's AC