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Author
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Topic: Saturn or Pluto ...more powerful...
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4lifephrases
Knowflake Posts: 42
From:
Registered: Nov 2010
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posted April 07, 2011 09:48 AM
  
Hi everyone !Firstly I would like to know what Saturn and Pluto stand for and how they work together or opposite to each other. How both planets are similar/opposite? Is there anyone who is more powerful than other one ? (If there is anything like more powerful) I would also like to know whose ways are right? ( If there is anything like right or wrong) I had read that Saturn had eaten his sons and later Jupiter happened to save all of them.I do not know if he was ever sorry about his deeds or not.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturn_(mythology) Do you guys know anything more?
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MertSerimer
Knowflake Posts: 91
From: where the fun is
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted April 07, 2011 10:01 AM
First of all, there is nothing like "Father always being stronger than his sons" in theory. If you want to refer to mythology, with this knowledge you can easily understand Saturn's power. In every chart their power of influence changes. For example, in my chart, Pluto is in Scorpio in 8th house. This is the strongest PLuto position that can ever be. Lets consider Saturn. In my chart it is in capricorn in 11th house. Since generally saturn rules 10th and secondly 11th, it is still the strongest Saturn position that can ever be.(dignify is more powerful than exaltation). And aspects to these two planets are also important about their influence. If these planets in your natal chart are getting -especially hard- aspects from personal planets, their influence on you will increase as well. Pluto is about underworld. it is about hiddens,taboos, obsession, possession. Saturn is just a hard teacher, your challenges and problems. Saturn tests first then teaches. Pluto just finishes you off. But in indian astrology, Jupiter and Saturn are the strongest planets. So saturn can be more powerful but in saturn transits, just work harder and you are done, you get your reward. But in pluto transits things are much harder. So it is hard to say whether if one is stronger than other.IP: Logged |
abcd efg
Knowflake Posts: 121
From: Mumbai,Maharashtra,India
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted April 07, 2011 10:19 AM
quote:
Originally posted by MertSerimer:
. . . . For example, in my chart, Pluto is in Scorpio in 8th house. This is the strongest PLuto position that can ever be. . . . . . . Pluto is about underworld. it is about hiddens,taboos, obsession, possession. Saturn is just a hard teacher, your challenges and problems. Saturn tests first then teaches. Pluto just finishes you off. But in indian astrology, Jupiter and Saturn are the strongest planets. So saturn can be more powerful but in saturn transits, just work harder and you are done, you get your reward. But in pluto transits things are much harder. So it is hard to say whether if one is stronger than other.
I got the saturn part but didn't exactly catch on Pluto explanation. Could u give in more detail? Besides, how does such a strong position help/challenge you? I thought Pluto triple effect must make one terribly strong. How is it hard? I expected it to be hard for others and not the person who has it. Can you throw some light please. IP: Logged |
MertSerimer
Knowflake Posts: 91
From: where the fun is
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted April 07, 2011 10:26 AM
quote:
Originally posted by abcd efg:
I got the saturn part but didn't exactly catch on Pluto explanation. Could u give in more detail? Besides, how does such a strong position help/challenge you? I thought Pluto triple effect must make one terribly strong. How is it hard? I expected it to be hard for others and not the person who has it. Can you throw some light please.
You said "I expected it to be hard for others and not the person who has it". This is not true. Until transformation occurs you die and rebirth. Once you have the knowledge and strenght of it, then it can be hard for other people. Pluto helps you to find hidden things under one's motives or ideals and reasons. When Pluto touches a planet, it finds its weakness and brings it to surface and waits you to find the solution and make it stronger. So natal Jupiter-Pluto aspects CAN make you pessimistic instead of optimistic. In natal chart any planet aspects to Pluto will be transformed in a way that you will have more control. If there are a lot of Planet getting aspect from Pluto, and if you are able to get through challenges in A GOOD WAY, you will have a really strong personality and will power and also ability to change others. But you can use your power in a bad way too, to manipulate or dominate people, it is up to you whether if you use it bad or not. IP: Logged |
4lifephrases
Knowflake Posts: 42
From:
Registered: Nov 2010
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posted April 07, 2011 10:27 AM
Thanks ! Mert...for your wonderful answer.Maybe it must be Pluto in Capricorn makes me think this all. I was thinking say for instance one had opposition between Saturn and Pluto what would happen ? This is for USA...Roles Saturn and Pluto would have.
http://www.stariq.com/Main/Articles/P0003861.htm IP: Logged |
abcd efg
Knowflake Posts: 121
From: Mumbai,Maharashtra,India
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted April 07, 2011 11:04 AM
quote:
Originally posted by MertSerimer:
You said "I expected it to be hard for others and not the person who has it". This is not true. . . . . . .But you can use your power in a bad way too, to manipulate or dominate people, it is up to you whether if you use it bad or not.
Thanks a lot. I am begining to understand the whole thing now. I have several planets in aspect to Pluto. Phewww! It must be difficult to handle power indeed with your triple effect. I can understand now how hard it must be and why. Thanks again for the clarification.
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Lonake
Moderator Posts: 3769
From: U.S.
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 07, 2011 05:16 PM
quote:
Originally posted by MertSerimer:
For example, in my chart, Pluto is in Scorpio in 8th house. This is the strongest PLuto position that can ever be.
Wrong.
The strongest Pluto position is conj a luminary or an angle.IP: Logged |
dysfunctionalmystic
Knowflake Posts: 232
From:
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 07, 2011 05:49 PM
Lol @ Lonake - that really did make me smile. It was the power in the simplicity.but I agree with the pluto thing being strongest on angles and luminaires...I'd extend that to the other personal planets as well, house placements refer to the area of life the energy plays out in, it doesn't make the planet energy stronger but it will have an easier time being expressed if it is comfortable in that house. neither saturn or pluto is stronger...it depends on the individual chart and they have slightly different roles to play. If they are in hard aspect then sometimes one will be favoured over the other and you'll act out either saturn or pluto but again it depends on the individual. IP: Logged |
MertSerimer
Knowflake Posts: 91
From: where the fun is
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted April 07, 2011 07:21 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Lonake:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MertSerimer:
[b]For example, in my chart, Pluto is in Scorpio in 8th house. This is the strongest PLuto position that can ever be.
Wrong.
The strongest Pluto position is conj a luminary or an angle.[/B][/QUOTE] İ said "position". Lets assume your pluto is in some position other than mine. If your moon gets trine from your pluto and if you get affected by factor 5, with my pluto i get affected by 8 with the same aspect. So when i meant by "position", i tried to say that these area of chart is where pluto radiates most able avaible energy in natal chart. Maybe just because this pluto is not aspecting my sun, it's power will not be directed to my identity so its power stays hidden in itself. this pluto gets trine from My moon, and square from Jupiter. I am sag guy but many pluto traits are visible on me. IP: Logged |
Circe InThe Dark
Newflake Posts: 5
From:
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted April 08, 2011 01:31 AM
This reminds me of a discussion my boyfriend once had ad nauseum with a friend... Ninja or Pirate? In a fight who would win? (And yes, he was very mature, thank you very much  )Interestingly, I read Linda Goodman's love signs about scorpio and taurus, and she claimed Taurus was the only sign that could destroy Scorpio. W hich kind of suggests Venus is stronger pluto! Something to think about! IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 3769
From: U.S.
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 08, 2011 01:57 AM
I agree d_mystic, there is something special about having Pluto conj a personal planet.
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4lifephrases,
Saturn and Pluto are best friends, they both do the dirty work in life and others hate em for it equally, so they go to the bar, get drunk, and commiserate. It's all fun and games cos they know they'll be having the last laugh, but in the interim they both feel misunderstood unless they're with each other. IP: Logged |
Redstar
Knowflake Posts: 210
From: Over the hills and far away
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 08, 2011 04:40 AM
Yep what Lonake said - by themselves neither is stronger, but in the context of someone's chart, through position and aspects one or the other can be deemed to be stronger (stronger as a player in that specific chart, to be exact).Lol mine are best friends (conjunct) in a bar always drunk (12th house) but Pluto is the one commiserating being misunderstood (Libra) while Saturn is busy plotting revenge (Scorpio) against the rest of the chart.
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4lifephrases
Knowflake Posts: 42
From:
Registered: Nov 2010
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posted April 12, 2011 04:51 PM
Lonake & Red Star...That helps...Thanks :-)IP: Logged |
Lindaland
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