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Author Topic:   Sun conjunct Pluto vs asc conjunct Pluto
DopGang
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posted May 10, 2016 01:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I've read about these two. They seem so similar when I read about them.

Anyone care to share your thoughts about the differences?

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diamondbaby
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posted May 10, 2016 03:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for diamondbaby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
In my opinion it's all about appearing/wanting to appear "plutonic" by even overcompensating in certain cases (Ascendant conjunct Pluto) and being naturally "plutonic" to the bone (Sun conjunct Pluto).

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DopGang
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posted May 10, 2016 04:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ok, I could see that. I'm the asc and I, "deal" with a sun conjunct.

The only modification to it that I would add is that at least in my case it doesn't feel at all forced or on purpose. I don't feel as if I set out to appear a certain way or behave a certain way.
Plutonic to the core, certainly I don't feel that either. However, plutonic on the surface I definitely feel. I hate talking to strangers, or anyone really who isn't in my close circle of people. Obviously I give people chances based on how genuine they seem, pretty much. If they seem fake and smiley for appearances then I'm completely turned off from any interaction. Once a person knows me and passed the scrutiny test, then I'm not plutonic. Well, maybe here and there.

Your statement did help to clear some things up though. I never thought of it that way. When I'm in public, I feel extremely plutonic. It doesn't feel forced. It's a very real feeling. With my friends and loved ones whom I trust, then it's very different.

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Faith
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posted May 10, 2016 04:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
=

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hypatia238
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posted May 10, 2016 04:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DopGang:
Ok, I could see that. I'm the asc and I, "deal" with a sun conjunct.

The only modification to it that I would add is that at least in my case it doesn't feel at all forced or on purpose. I don't feel as if I set out to appear a certain way or behave a certain way.
Plutonic to the core, certainly I don't feel that either. However, plutonic on the surface I definitely feel. I hate talking to strangers, or anyone really who isn't in my close circle of people. Obviously I give people chances based on how genuine they seem, pretty much. If they seem fake and smiley for appearances then I'm completely turned off from any interaction. Once a person knows me and passed the scrutiny test, then I'm not plutonic. Well, maybe here and there.

Your statement did help to clear some things up though. I never thought of it that way. When I'm in public, I feel extremely plutonic. It doesn't feel forced. It's a very real feeling. With my friends and loved ones whom I trust, then it's very different.


Interesting. I have AC conjunct Jupiter and Uranus and even before I got into astrology my best friend back in high school would describe me as blunt and crazy, she would say jokingly 'Laura are you on crack?' and then I would crack up. There is nothing forced about planets on the AC, I don't buy that all. Planets on your angles come extremely natural to you and the Jupiter influence in me is not just a social persona, I am pretty blunt in general, just ask my family and husband but then again Jupiter conjuncts my AC but also Co rules my IC so maybe that is why.

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athenegoddess
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posted May 10, 2016 04:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for athenegoddess     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Anything aspecting the Sun is who you are. Anything aspecting the ascendant is just how you look.

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hypatia238
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posted May 10, 2016 04:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Definitely not Athene, that is a huge oversimplification. All the angles are very powerful and personal points that impact your personality and not just superficially. This article below I will copy and paste goes into the importance of the ascendant and makes my point:

While the Sun-sign is always important in the horoscope, neither Moon sign nor ascendant should be treated as much less significant—all three matter, in different ways. The ascendant in particular is inclined to be treated too lightly, partly because any lack of information about the time of birth makes it difficult to determine.

However, the ascendant is extremely important, as everything else in the horoscope has to manifest through it. Indian astrologers have always considered that the precise position of the ascendant in the zodiac holds the key to the incarnation. While we may approach astrology a little differently from our Indian brethren, they have a point. The ascendant matters a lot!

All these things are related to the ascendant:
Outer personality, face we present to the world
Physical body in general, and its appearance
Overall health and wellbeing
Basic attitude to life
General nature of day-to-day existence
The manner in which we meet life’s lessons
(as opposed to the nature of the lessons themselves, which are of course shown by the Sun)
The self and sense of identity
Ability to maintain physical life.

This is an impressive list, and while we should remember that other factors in the horoscope also influence these matters, we should give the ascendant its due.

Interactions between the ascendant and other chart features should always be studied closely.

In particular, elemental conflicts between the ascendant and the basic balance of the chart or between ascendant and major significators such as Sun or Moon will always have important results and can explain many of the problems in a life.

Naturally, these will often be for karmic reasons. Provided the ascendant is accurately known, aspects to it should also be carefully looked at; they have smaller orbs but that is not a licence to ignore them!

Rising planets, i.e. those within a few degrees of the ascendant, are always significant and can sometimes be more important in the life than the ‘official’ ruling planet (which is the planet that rules the ascendant sign)..

Do not underestimate the power of planets conjuncting your AC and chart ruler.

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athenegoddess
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posted May 10, 2016 05:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for athenegoddess     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
If the Sun is equal to other planets than why do we need the Sun's light to even exist at all? We don't need the Moon's light to exist or the Ascendant to exist.

And I don't agree with that list of things, health is not my Ascendant the sixth house is my health. Self is my Sun sign.. The only things the Asc rules are things of face value nothing more. Bottom line is Sun conjunct Pluto is much deeper than Ascendant conjunct Pluto.. call it what you want I don't need to give more information than that.

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DopGang
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posted May 10, 2016 05:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There's a similarly aged guy who is my boss really, though we don't use that term. We say, "leader". (Yeah right)

He's always power tripping and talking about expectations and discipline, excuse me, "coaching".
He's sun conjunct Pluto (and Aries moon!)
I don't doubt that other things factor in but I definitely don't mind questioning him, pointing out where he's falling short as our leader, and overall challenging him you might say.
It's just weird. I sense his intensity but it doesn't put me off. I feel more comfortable around him in that I can be straight with him without him being put off by me either.

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hypatia238
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posted May 10, 2016 05:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Every guy I attract has strong uranus placements. That is the only type of guy that I attract. I am an Aquarius uranius magnet, Aquarius people adore me and is not bc I look uraniun bc I have posted my pic here a bunch of times and nobody picks up on Uranus energy, it's my personality, behaviour, how I carry myself, how I communicate and think. Well the strongest aspect in my chart is Jupiter conjunct Uranus exact approaching and Jupiter and Uranus conjunct my AC and Jupiter is my chart ruler which fuels and lights on fire my Uranus and Uranus rules my 3rd house and Jupiter rules my chart and IC. That aspect has a huge influence in my personality, behavior, who I am and think.

So you cant just say the AC is how you look.

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hypatia238
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posted May 10, 2016 05:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by athenegoddess:
If the Sun is equal to other planets than why do we need the Sun's light to even exist at all? We don't need the Moon's light to exist or the Ascendant to exist.

And I don't agree with that list of things, health is not my Ascendant the sixth house is my health. Self is my Sun sign.. The only things the Asc rules are things of face value nothing more. Bottom line is Sun conjunct Pluto is much deeper than Ascendant conjunct Pluto.. call it what you want I don't need to give more information than that.



OMG Athene, the way you reason things always blows my mind and I will leave it at that. Health is a sixth house matter but the AC also plays a role.

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athenegoddess
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posted May 10, 2016 05:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for athenegoddess     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Your opinion isn't based on facts so I cannot really comment. What I can say is that if more than one planet conjuncts the Ascendant that means multiple qualities from the certain houses are being acted out in your looks which gives more importance to the ascendant.

So you may have ruler of the seventh house in the first house.

Ruler of the fifth house in the first house.

etc.

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athenegoddess
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posted May 10, 2016 05:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for athenegoddess     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by hypatia238:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by athenegoddess:
[b]If the Sun is equal to other planets than why do we need the Sun's light to even exist at all? We don't need the Moon's light to exist or the Ascendant to exist.

And I don't agree with that list of things, health is not my Ascendant the sixth house is my health. Self is my Sun sign.. The only things the Asc rules are things of face value nothing more. Bottom line is Sun conjunct Pluto is much deeper than Ascendant conjunct Pluto.. call it what you want I don't need to give more information than that.



OMG Athene, the way you reason things always blows my mind and I will leave it at that. Health is a sixth house matter but the AC also plays a role. [/B][/QUOTE]

The way I reason things? And where did you get this information? From the internet?

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hypatia238
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posted May 10, 2016 05:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My opinion is based on facts lol. You are the only person who thinks the ascendant just affects how you look and BTW who you are is not just the sun, you have to look at the entire chart.

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hypatia238
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posted May 10, 2016 05:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by athenegoddess:
The way I reason things? And where did you get this information? From the internet?

There are plenty of astrological books that talk about the importance of the rising sign and how is part of the big three and just as important as the sun and moon but that article specifically I got from a school of astrology site: http://www.whiteagleastrology.org/m2studynote1.htm

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Faith
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posted May 10, 2016 05:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by athenegoddess:
Anything aspecting the Sun is who you are. Anything aspecting the ascendant is just how you look.

So if your sun aspects your ASC, your sun is rendered shallow.

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hannaramaa
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posted May 11, 2016 02:14 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for hannaramaa     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Uhm, ditto to DopGang about bosses with this aspect! My shift leader has Sun conj. Pluto. I have Moon opp Pluto. Talk about hate stares, haha! He was so frustrated with me being a slow learner and not paying attention (I have ADD, unmedicated) he did things to antagonize me. Definite power struggles. I nearly quit because I hated him breathing down my neck about everything! And all the while everyone else telling me "Oh he's such a good guy!" BS! He has them snowed. NOT ME!

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Yanmorg
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posted May 11, 2016 08:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Yanmorg     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have Sun conjunct Pluto in Scorpio and an ASC- Pluto opposition.

After coming across your post, I'm wondering how this would affect my personality.

Wouldn't you say those aspects contradict themselves in a way?

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Electro DGX
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posted May 11, 2016 09:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Electro DGX     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thinking about these two aspects, I'm thinking that Sun conj. Pluto is a personal manifestation whereas Asc conj. Pluto would be the vibe one leeks to others.

Sun Conj. Pluto would probably have a better chance at winning power plays because they wouldn't unknowingly give off this dark vibe that would naturally put others on edge. It is part of their sun, which is naturally masked by their ascendant, so it would be easier for them to naturally cause someone to believe they are so great when they're really not.

Asc conj. Pluto would just be like a more potent Scorpio ascendant, in the matter that they most likely receive less struggles when it comes to power-plays because people aren't as willing to shoot them down. It could be the other way around however.

I've got a Scorpio Ascendant with Moon in 8th Opposite Pluto. Sun sextile Pluto, not conjunct. A teacher once tried to force me to retake a test on my own time after school after getting an 85% on it. Didn't last long

------------------
Aquarius Sun, Merc, Venus, Uranus, Neptune
Scorpio Mars conj. Asc in First
8th House Moon opposite Pluto, Trine Uranus
Have you caught onto the predicament I'm in yet?

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Seimei
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posted May 11, 2016 10:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Seimei     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This is very amusing.

My Sun is nearly 7 degrees from my Pluto but I feel it. It is a huge part of me, my depth.
My Pluto is half-square my asc within a 1d orb..

Athene,,
you don't need an ascendant? I stand on the earth,my asc is the where,, are you out in space?
This Mercury and Mars RX bit has its shelf life and low value,Hypatia!

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hypatia238
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posted May 11, 2016 11:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Seimei:
This is very amusing.

My Sun is nearly 7 degrees from my Pluto but I feel it. It is a huge part of me, my depth.
My Pluto is half-square my asc within a 1d orb..

Athene,,
you don't need an ascendant? I stand on the earth,my asc is the where,, are you out in space?
This Mercury and Mars RX bit has its shelf life and low value,Hypatia!



Haha

Where have you been??? Nice to see you pop in .

I bet you feel that conjunction yes, I have read natal conjunctions to the sun can be felt up to 10d but of course the tighter the more it can be felt for better and for worse, sometimes wider orbs perhaps are a blessing.

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hypatia238
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posted May 11, 2016 11:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for hypatia238     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Electro DGX:
Thinking about these two aspects, I'm thinking that Sun conj. Pluto is a personal manifestation whereas Asc conj. Pluto would be the vibe one leeks to others.

Sun Conj. Pluto would probably have a better chance at winning power plays because they wouldn't unknowingly give off this dark vibe that would naturally put others on edge. It is part of their sun, which is naturally masked by their ascendant, so it would be easier for them to naturally cause someone to believe they are so great when they're really not.

Asc conj. Pluto would just be like a more potent Scorpio ascendant, in the matter that they most likely receive less struggles when it comes to power-plays because people aren't as willing to shoot them down. It could be the other way around however.

I've got a Scorpio Ascendant with Moon in 8th Opposite Pluto. Sun sextile Pluto, not conjunct. A teacher once tried to force me to retake a test on my own time after school after getting an 85% on it. Didn't last long


Interesting analysis.

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DopGang
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posted May 11, 2016 11:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by hypatia238:
Interesting analysis.

Yes!

That actually resonates extremely well with our personalities and relationship dynamic.
He likes to be social, everybody's friend, and fun bit those of us who knows him well know that it's a different story. He's using those traits as power plays. (Not just my opinion but all of us that work with him). It's a running joke.

Then me. Yeah. It's a vibe. I can be watching television or reading and I look like I'm about to snap on someone.

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Gabby
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posted May 11, 2016 11:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gabby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dop what aspects do you have to pluto?

As you know, i have AC/Pluto...i feel plutonian quite often, not just in public or how i think about the world and relate to others....its even in my personal thinking and feeling. Its not a projection its part of my core person.
Maybe im different though with Pluto being conjunct my Venus also and Venus being my chart ruler....
Pluto is also widely sextile my Sun...
Pluto opposes Jupiter
Pluto sextiles Neptune
Pluto intertwines alot in my chart and touches all my angles in hard aspect.
Sometimes i wonder what does it mean for us libra Pluto/AC ppl...we have our 8th house(Pluto owned) in taurus(Venus ruled) and we have Pluto sitting on our AC with Venus as our chart ruler.
Because Venus is co-ruling our 8th house, Pluto/Venus is brought together 2x's in our charts through houses, 1st & 8th.
Then i have my Venus conjunct Pluto in my 1st, lol!! Ive wondered before what affect that might have on us if any?!


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DopGang
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posted May 11, 2016 11:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DopGang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gabby:
Dop what aspects do you have to pluto?


Conjunct asc
Sextile Neptune and Saturn which is quite a few people.

That's about it unless you want minor aspects and declination.

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