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Author
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Topic: Venus-Pluto synastry
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Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 2395
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 05, 2009 07:31 PM
  
In the thread on aspects you hate in your partner's chart, MyVirgoMask wrote, very astutely, that Venus square Pluto natally leads the person to feel: quote:
'I love you, but I can't help it, I also want to really hurt you and keep hurting you'.
I found this quadruply true of an exact Venus-Pluto square in synastry (I was the Venus--the Pluto person acted this way toward me.) What are your experiences with Venus-Pluto synastry? And how does it feel to be the Venus versus to be the Pluto? IP: Logged |
MyVirgoMask
Knowflake Posts: 3671
From: Bay Area, CA
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 05, 2009 07:54 PM
I forgot to mention that I was the Pluto person here in the synastry with the ex too (exact square), so maybe that set him into a tailspin? I don't know. It's his Venus in Capricorn that would make a square with any Libra Pluto - but this was too close.
Pluto's my 7th house ruler and connected to a couple of personal planets for me too, so it's like an extra sensitive point.
I actually didn't want to get too close in the beginning and he fought me tooth and nail on it (seducing me with Venusian promises maybe?). Once I surrendered, it was like a call for the games to begin, and his own Venus square Pluto kicked in full gear. The anger, the tears, the apologies, the anger again, etc. etc. etc...... This other guy I went out with a couple of years earlier we had Pluto square Venus in composite. Oh my god, that was painful. He just kind of kept holding onto me but wouldn't commit ( he was a double Sagittarius with Scorpio moon). Worse, his Saturn was conjunct my Mercury exactly in synastry and I felt tongue-tied around him and couldn't even talk to him about anything. And he was activating all this 7th house stuff in my chart so pleasantly (nice trines and sextiles to my Pluto, etc), so it was just a little bit like hell...yuck...very bad ending. I got all Saturn Cancer on him and just shut down completely, which drove him crazy lol How was it for you, Lucia? Anything similar? IP: Logged |
Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 2395
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 05, 2009 09:11 PM
We barely even managed to get involved, despite real feelings on both sides. Whenever I (Cancer Venus, 7th)feel fragile, guarded, or shy, he (Scorpio Pluto, 1st--I know Cancer-Scorp should be a trine, but degreewise its an exact square) starts forcibly trying to knock down my wall by POUNDING ON IT till he gets a reaction. It's like serious emotional warfare.When he opens up to me, it's like taking the thorn out of a wild animal's paw--the animal is all the more snarly afterwards for having been vulnerable. He's jealous, but yet sets out to hurt by making me jealous. There was lots of good stuff with us too, but the pain-causing made it impossible to make it work. IP: Logged |
gorgeousbutterfly
unregistered
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posted April 05, 2009 09:46 PM
in my experience, obsessive love. the pluto person is obsessed with the venus person. and usually the square, the sextile and trine aren't so bad. IP: Logged |
lovegoblin
Knowflake Posts: 28
From: miami
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 05, 2009 09:55 PM
i have venus/pluto both ways.
one is conjunct and one trine.its hard to say who feels what. i have heard that venus is obsessed, at least that is what i have read. i think it would depend. i was wondering though, if pluto is the one obsessed, would it work for other planets as well (ex: moon square pluto-would pluto be obsessed). I think it depends on if you are plutonian or have lots of 8th house stuff. In a way I think you have to be plutonian to deal with lots of pluto aspects. If pluto is inherent in your nature, you don't mind all the obsessive stuff because it is already your nature. Its just been triggered. IP: Logged |
MyVirgoMask
Knowflake Posts: 3671
From: Bay Area, CA
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 05, 2009 10:12 PM
Lucia, your situation sounds like it was painful 
Yikes...yeah, I know exactly what you mean about this: "When he opens up to me, it's like taking the thorn out of a wild animal's paw--the animal is all the more snarly afterwards for having been vulnerable." That's exactly it, I think. It's like punishment for showing that vulnerability. I associate the negative part of Pluto with forced surrender in a way, like it does demand it, but it wants it too for itself yet won't open. It's going to make sure you're down on your knees first, surrendered before offering you a little insight, and then will pummel into you for making you see. Ugh. Painful stuff. IP: Logged |
gorgeousbutterfly
unregistered
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posted April 05, 2009 11:03 PM
actually i wonder why i always have aspects going both ways in synastry charts with people i dated/liked/been with. always both ways. the last one had his pluto square my venus and he was obsessed and stalkerish, he also his moon in scorpio and a strong pluto,8th house influence. he was scary. my pluto sextiled his venus, and i was really enthralled, but not obsessive like he was. IP: Logged |
scrappydog
Knowflake Posts: 1061
From: Texas
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 06, 2009 11:22 AM
I've seen venus pluto aspects work both ways in synastry, sometimes pluto is obsessed/enthralled/abusive with venus who sometimes becomes overwhemed/afraid and sometimes it's venus that acts like that to pluto while pluto remains ambivalent. My best friends venus squares her husbands pluto and they are both obsessed and sickingly co-dependant, but he is abusive to her and she just puts up with it. She has tried to kill herself 3 times while in a relationship with him. She cheats and he leaves her so she cuts her wrists and gets put in a hospital, he takes her back, even hunts her down. Continues to stay with her while getting some kind of perverse pleasure from emotionally tormenting her every day. His pluto is also extremely afflicted. Its square his sun and moon in gemini and square his cancer mercury. Can you say mentally abusive?IP: Logged |
Love
Knowflake Posts: 63
From: Canada
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 06, 2009 03:12 PM
I actually think that the level of both people's personal evolution makes a big difference when dealing with any type of Pluto aspect. Pluto is about change and transformation so if *both* parties are willing and able to go there, it makes a huge difference as to what is experienced.I do think that obsessive/co-dependency issues are triggered with this aspect, however it's up to both people to work with the transformational energies. All my serious relationships have Venus/Pluto double whammies, but I will admit that both people need to live a little more consciously to get the most of these aspects. IP: Logged |
Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 2395
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 06, 2009 04:10 PM
I think double-whammy contacts between planets are profoundly important in synastry.It's interesting--in the relationship I was writing about in this thread, I notice that as well as us having my Venus exactly squared his Pluto (0 degrees), we also have his Venus conjunct my Pluto at a wide orb (8 degrees)...although I don't use orbs that wide in synastry, I do feel like (maybe?) the double-contacts increase the mutual Venus-Pluto hard-aspect atmosphere of the relationship. I feel like he SEES me as Venus (girly) and I SEE him as Pluto (powerful), though. We also have his Lust (in his 8th house) conjunct my Sun (in my 8th) at 0 degrees...and his Mars-Venus conjunction falling into my 8th house...and mutual Mars-Eros aspects (my Mars is in my 8th house), and and my Eros conjunct his Lust in my 4th house/his 8th house. Natally, I have Venus sextile Pluto (5 degrees), my Moon/Asc/Pluto squared (with Pluto-Asc exact...I feel it!), Pluto aspecting Psyche, and my Sun/Mars/Merc in my 8th house. Natally, his Venus doesn't aspect Pluto, but his Sun-Merc-Saturn-Pluto are in Scorpio (widely conjunct), and his Eros and Chiron fall in his 8th house. The last time I saw him, we actually got into a PHYSICAL tussle--it was playful, and not violent, but at the same time it was serious and not sexual/affectionate. It was like there was so much pent-up frustration between us. IP: Logged |
matt
Knowflake Posts: 192
From:
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted April 08, 2009 08:06 AM
unfortunately i have a venus/pluto square nataly. its not nice to be perfectly honest. its definately a controling thing with me, i always need the upperhand. i try so hard not to show my vulnerability but my feelings for someone always run very deep, then i explode and start to feel that i have lost control and thats when the hurting comes into play. i suppose u could say that im in internal conflict so to speak.in all my serious relationships i have had major pluto aspects and i think that what MVM said is very true. i have had venus/pluto square and opposition in one relationship me being the pluto in the opposition and the venus in the square. haha! fook me! it wasnt nice, i can tell u! if there was a prize for mind games, i would have been the world champ! then i had a pluto/moon opposition and pluto/venus square me being the pluto. i feel that i have let her down and will never forgive myself. the longest of my relationships so far. she would have done anything for me and would have let her. in one i have had venus/pluto square and conjunction, me being the pluto square and her being the venus conj. all i can say is that if we was to die together and knowing that she was going to be my last lover; i would have been very happy.( i mean that very affectionately by the way!) now i have met someone older and we have pluto/venus trine (no fooking square! WOOOO!) it is very nice i have to say! it feels good and i very rarely try to hurt her when feeling insecure and i am very honest about my feelings. i love her but without pain if thats makes any sence? id love to be able to put a conclusion to this but i am still learning and still learning from my feelings this is my longest post! IP: Logged |
Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 2395
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 08, 2009 09:50 AM
I definitely agree that both party's level of maturity makes a huge difference in how Venus-Pluto plays out.Sometimes with him (Pluto), I feel like he just came on WAY too strong. I don't mean sexual or romantic energy, just his whole Plutonic thing. I'm not a person who normally gets overpowered by people, but with him sometimes I just felt like retreating. IP: Logged |
CrabbyFish
unregistered
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posted April 09, 2009 11:14 PM
In my experience as the Pluto person...i didnt necessarily out-of-nowhere want to hurt them. The root cause was Jealousy...and the root cause of that is that the relationship tends to be obsessive on the part of the Pluto person. Really consuming. Its deep as well...Anyway...if it isnt as consuming to the venus person (it usually isnt) it baffles and frustrates the pluto person. Eventually, becuase this relationship touched them on such a deep soul level...they must retaliate. They are hurt and confused by the "apparent " indefference of the venus person. Not to say that the venus person actually is indifferent...its simply a matter of degrees. Comp[ared to Pluto...it may seem that way. And of course Pluto cant just walk away. IP: Logged |
Maire31
Newflake Posts: 10
From: here there and everywhere
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 12, 2009 02:54 PM
Two significant relationships - MY Pluto conjunct their Venus. Instantaneous, highly obsessive love on both sides. Both men were at the tail end of highly unhappy relationships and somewhat stuck. Ultimately and unbeknownst to me, I believe my role was that of transformer. They left me once their 'transformation' was complete. Very painful for me in the moment, however in hindsight I can not imagine how we could've ever stayed together! I did not feel I was my 'true self' while with them...rather I was what they needed me to be. After the pain dissipated I was happy to be without them as lovers...yet remain very close friends to this day. IP: Logged |
jacque
Knowflake Posts: 285
From:
Registered: Dec 2009
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posted May 29, 2011 05:56 AM
how do you get the Pluto person to understand that there was/is no need to be jealous? I (Venus) love Pluto. How do you make them understand especially after they've played numerous games out of jealousy & brought you to the point where you don't know how to talk to Pluto anymore? I have never seen anyone play as many games as this person & for what? just because I made a new new friend, who they seem to consider a big threat. It's the strangest thing I've ever experienced. Pluto punished me for my new friendship.IP: Logged |
Betty Boop
Knowflake Posts: 3377
From: Betty Boop Land
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted May 29, 2011 06:16 AM
quote:
how do you get the Pluto person to understand that there was/is no need to be jealous?
Basically - you can't. If this is a square or an opposition, Pluto will always see in you a strong person who is able to manipulate them, cheat on them, make them feel powerless and hurt them through what Pluto sees as "superficiality". As a defence mechanism they can throw a lot of heartache and negativity your way.
I have found no way to "reason" this out... Although, I guess in charts where the people also have some close Mercury aspects - and other positive aspects - they may be able to "talk things out". If this is not the case, it just feels like - there is nothing to be said, in the end. It feels dead. Seldom gets resurected. IP: Logged |
jacque
Knowflake Posts: 285
From:
Registered: Dec 2009
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posted May 29, 2011 06:45 AM
Thank you for your reply Betty.Here r our synastry aspects: Them Me Orb
Mercury Trine Saturn 0.05
Saturn Sextile Saturn 0.06
Mars Trine Mars 0.31
Pluto Square Jupiter 0.48 Pluto Sextile Venus 1.39
Sun Conjunction Neptune 1.45
Jupiter Conjunction Neptune 1.56 Mars Trine Mercury 2.54
Saturn Square Mars 2.08 Venus Trine Moon 3.50
Mars Trine Sun 3.46
Pluto Trine Moon 3.43
Mars Conjunction Pluto 4.12
Neptune Conjunction Venus 4.19 Please let me know what you think. Thank you again. IP: Logged |
foxyvilla
Knowflake Posts: 39
From:
Registered: Jan 2010
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posted May 29, 2011 03:09 PM
l had this with my ex. His pluto was opp my venus. Well once we were in a crowded pub with friends and he whispered in my ear to give him a kiss. So as l leant in to kiss him he turned away and put his hand up to stop me. He did this deliberately to humiliate me. When we split up after 5 years of problems he kept coming back asking if l'd found someone else. He did this for a year and a half. l had to tell him a few times to leave me alone.IP: Logged |
tuxedoMask
Knowflake Posts: 1234
From:
Registered: May 2011
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posted May 29, 2011 03:59 PM
i've experienced this once in synastry with someone that i was not at all interested in. at first, it started off in a sexual way, where something inside me was on the hunt for it unknowingly and then my radar just honed in on something and from there it went but i never did anything about it. i was the pluto, they were the venus. we started talking and not long after, they started getting flirty and talking about things i didn't much want to, so whatever, long story short, i never budged. i played the game and let them think whatever they wanted because i had the power. i was hot. i was sexy, still am. they wanted me and i loved it. it would've been mutual had the venus not tried to play games. that set off *alarms* right away that they'd b.s./play games, whatever. so i played the pluto even more. they had some material things that i enjoyed because we had mutual tastes when it came to art. the venus tried to keep them as collateral to assure that i keep coming back. it happened, for a while. things cooled off for a bit and since i wasn't caving or giving to the venus whatever it was that it wanted, the venus person resulted to playing more game and started using means of manipulation.
in the end, i checked out, never got in touch again, never returned the calls of venus, ever, and i think it resulted in the venus person losing their job once i took action because of it. IP: Logged |
blugrey
Knowflake Posts: 1006
From: Nowhere
Registered: Nov 2010
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posted May 29, 2011 04:46 PM
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Alma Sun
Moderator Posts: 2221
From: The East Coast
Registered: Mar 2011
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posted May 29, 2011 05:31 PM
Ouch foxyvilla, what a class act that guy..You should of dumped him that night. ------------------
"Cynicism, like gullibility, is a symptom of underdeveloped critical faculties." — Jamie Whyte IP: Logged |
foxyvilla
Knowflake Posts: 39
From:
Registered: Jan 2010
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posted May 30, 2011 03:08 PM
l wish l had. lt would've saved me years of heartache and misery.IP: Logged |
RunAroundScreaming
Moderator Posts: 7833
From:
Registered: Oct 2010
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posted February 05, 2012 12:02 PM
quote:
Originally posted by blugrey:
Ugh the one person I cannot figure out a way to end my feelings for and I have this.My Venus is Qx his Pluto (a really tight conjunction)
His Venus in trine my Pluto (also just like a degree).
I would do almost anything for him - more than anyone else is this world besides my family. If he needed me, I'd drop everything, pack up, and go to his side as soon as I could drive to the airport. He got into a motorcycle accident and I started to cry even though he was relatively okay. I just cannot detach. It's more than just something sexual, it's like a psychological-intuitive connection. That is sometimes uncomfortable and sometimes breathtaking.
Oroginally posted by matt:
quote:
in one i have had venus/pluto square and conjunction, me being the pluto square and her being the venus conj. all i can say is that if we was to die together and knowing that she was going to be my last lover; i would have been very happy.( i mean that very affectionately by the way!)
I had the DW venus pluto with a guy. Venus sextile pluto and venus square pluto. He was born the exact same day as my best friend (female) from elementary who I still miss. Let's just say, I would do almost anything to be with either of them today. But especially him, since he was a guy, so I was romantically in love with him. That was the most chemistry i ever had with someone. I never felt so loved. If we had ever gone out I think i wouldve just spent the entire relationship crying, just from tears of joy bc I loved him so much. I definitely wouldve moved halfway accross the world to be with him. After experiencing this, I actually looked up using software how many people i had the DW venus pluto with, and most of the birthdates I had it with i wasnt very compatible with other than the DW being there. It was just his birthdate and another one. But even his birthdate was a lot more compatible than that other one. Oh well. IP: Logged |
mintgirl123
Knowflake Posts: 2400
From:
Registered: Nov 2009
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posted February 05, 2012 01:53 PM
quote:
Originally posted by foxyvilla:
l had this with my ex. His pluto was opp my venus. Well once we were in a crowded pub with friends and he whispered in my ear to give him a kiss. So as l leant in to kiss him he turned away and put his hand up to stop me. He did this deliberately to humiliate me. When we split up after 5 years of problems he kept coming back asking if l'd found someone else. He did this for a year and a half. l had to tell him a few times to leave me alone.
Wow that's messed up.
What are your placements? Just wanna know cos I'm an aries rising and Virgo sun and if somebody could humiliate me like that deliberately, I'd be furious. And I'd definitely dump them. What are his placements? He sounds like an ex who was screwed up in the head lol.
IP: Logged |
Doux Rêve
Moderator Posts: 7723
From:
Registered: Dec 2010
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posted February 05, 2012 03:08 PM
Mintgirl, I doubt foxyvilla will reply, given that she posted her story in May 2011.* Back to the topic, Venus-Pluto hard aspects in synastry sound really problematic.
They definitely require a lot of maturity from both people. IP: Logged |
Lindaland
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