posted November 28, 2015 12:37 PM            

Jupiter. Overly optimistic. Expansive. Thinks they can handle more than is realistic for them. Has a feeling of "I can handle anything" which is obviously not true. Mars can be sort of this way too I guess.

Also prominent Pisces or Sagittarius.

I have sun square Neptune, Venus trine Neptune, and Mars, Chiron, and SN in 12H. Also Sagittarius moon and Mercury square Jupiter. Idealism and the shattering of my delusions seems to be my life's theme.

posted November 28, 2015 07:14 PM            

It was around my 5th birthday, and just a few (maybe even only 1 or 2) prior, my mother took me from my grandmother who had been raising me as Mom wanted to hurt Granny. This was upsetting enough for me (though I only had a vague awareness at the time of what was going on), and more so when I learned not to disturb the alcoholic 'rents when they're sleeping in with hangovers. In this case I woke up late in the morning starving and went to them to feed me, and getting knocked across the room (as in my feet came off the floor and I wasn't on the floor again until I bounced off the wall).

The next time I woke up like that, I was torn between starving (I was 5, not a little adult) and fear of waking the hungover 'rents. So I went into the kitchen and looked around, but making my own breakfast didn't seem an option, we were out of almost everything. But I finally used a chair, spatula, and wooden spoon to open the cereal cabinet (up high) and pry out a box of Cheerios and the milk was easy. As I ate it, a feeling of accomplishment filled me, and I knew that no matter how capricious (and worse) the world of adults were, I could take care of myself.

I was fully aware of the abuse in my home, and that they were more powerful than me, and the reason some parents didn't want their kids around me was fear that I'd expose them to uncomfortable realities. I liked writing stories of little kids lost in fairy tale woods who outsmarted the monsters and witches much more powerful than them which reflected my fears of the adult world, but also my faith in myself to handle it. I also knew quite a bit about sex...growing up on a farm, and in various homes with thin walls, it was hard not to, and the songs and jokes we kids took part in among ourselves ranged from the amusing to raunchy. So I don't think I was naive, but I was positive.

Of course all that would get refined as I got older. I do have an amusing memory of when I, at age 15, called a Runaway Hotline before running away thinking they were former runaways who would give us helpful advice. Nevertheless, I learned fast, and didn't forget.

I witnessed a terrible old folks home when I was 13-14 and took part in a scam to help people in that hell on earth get better treatment, so I know about them (something many adults don't know of, or perhaps won't let themselves think about so they can place their own inconvenient parents there without guilt), but it didn't ruin my childhood. Evil was real, I already knew that, but also that I was not powerless (well, not all the time).

And one thing I learned as a runaway in a krew of criminals was just how naive and easily fooled the vast majority of the public is. The naive aren't the exception, they're the rule, even the ones with some paranoid tendencies can be easily tricked into trusting the wrong people through very simple methods. My naivete was one of inexperience, but once experienced then I was no longer naive, and that's more than I can say for many people.

posted November 28, 2015 07:14 PM            

Furthermore, people keep telling me I'm too cynical...even though more often than not, when I'm wrong it's because I'm not cynical enough (though as I grow increasingly more experienced and cynical, that is not as much the case as it used to be). I take precautions and I try to stay alert, but many who don't know me well consider me happy go lucky just because I do what I can to prepare for the worst, but still have that attitude that I can handle it.

And with that said, I'll end with the attitude my Sag stellium imparts onto me (and doubles as a VERY MILD manifestation of my gallows humor):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1p7s5eu90Y

posted November 28, 2015 09:41 PM            

Heh...I just recalled two cats. When the dog got a flea dip (which the cats would get next), one cat instantly went to be let out to escape...that cat had a Pisces or Scorpio vibe to me (not sure which), and in any case realized what was happening fast. Meanwhile, a cat with a Leo vibe (definitely thought of himself as royalty) just watched (from high above, of course) the wet the dog and then wet cat with bemusement, and as it was his turn, he (unlike the other cat) had no clue he was about to get a flea dip until it was happening.

Scorpios and Cancers are a mystery to me on this. Both can be surprisingly naive at times, yet I wonder just how much is just loyalty. Like one Cancer I used to be closed to was fine about talking about the dark side of the military when it was discrete (and his ideas for reforming that), but in public he had only the most glowing praise and would turn against any politician who showed anything less than total support for the military (btw, this includes Republicans, just because they glorify the military doesn't mean he doesn't notice when they cut costs that deprive soldiers in the field the gear and body armor they need, as just one example of what I recall him spitting nails over). That is he could come off as very naive, but privately he was well aware, he just refused to air the dirty laundry publicly as party of his loyalty. And people can be the same way about their families, churches, and other affiliations, especially Scorpio and Cancer, but that's not being naive...I just don't know how often this applies. (And knowingly accepting abuse out of "loyalty/unconditional love" is a gray area...I guess that depends on whether or not they think it will get better.)

Another thing to consider is that plenty (especially women) consider being naive and shy a desirable trait, that if they're naive/trusting enough that the bad is less likely to intrude, that it's sexy, and it will encourage men to be their shining white knights (rather than rakes). Others think "this is what I'm supposed to do, and if I do then things will work out for me...eventually." This could get some to act naive without actually being that way (though if fixed enough they could stay the course even when it dooms them).

posted November 29, 2015 02:31 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by PixieJane:
I thought about this a bit more, and I don't think any are especially prone to being naive. Yet the fixed signs can be very resistant to learning/adapting, which could contribute to it.

Heh...I just recalled two cats. When the dog got a flea dip (which the cats would get next), one cat instantly went to be let out to escape...that cat had a Pisces or Scorpio vibe to me (not sure which), and in any case realized what was happening fast. Meanwhile, a cat with a Leo vibe (definitely thought of himself as royalty) just watched (from high above, of course) the wet the dog and then wet cat with bemusement, and as it was his turn, he (unlike the other cat) had no clue he was about to get a flea dip until it was happening.

Scorpios and Cancers are a mystery to me on this. Both can be surprisingly naive at times, yet I wonder just how much is just loyalty. Like one Cancer I used to be closed to was fine about talking about the dark side of the military when it was discrete (and his ideas for reforming that), but in public he had only the most glowing praise and would turn against any politician who showed anything less than total support for the military (btw, this includes Republicans, just because they glorify the military doesn't mean he doesn't notice when they cut costs that deprive soldiers in the field the gear and body armor they need, as just one example of what I recall him spitting nails over). That is he could come off as very naive, but privately he was well aware, he just refused to air the dirty laundry publicly as party of his loyalty. And people can be the same way about their families, churches, and other affiliations, especially Scorpio and Cancer, but that's not being naive...I just don't know how often this applies. (And knowingly accepting abuse out of "loyalty/unconditional love" is a gray area...I guess that depends on whether or not they think it will get better.)

Another thing to consider is that plenty (especially women) consider being naive and shy a desirable trait, that if they're naive/trusting enough that the bad is less likely to intrude, that it's sexy, and it will encourage men to be their shining white knights (rather than rakes). Others think "this is what I'm supposed to do, and if I do then things will work out for me...eventually." This could get some to act naive without actually being that way (though if fixed enough they could stay the course even when it dooms them).

And then love chemicals in the brain can also blind people (men as well as women) to the faults of their current obsession as well, but that's not what I'd call naive, more momentarily delusional caused by brain chemistry. Granted, all those romances of beauty taming the beast with her love don't help.

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