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Author
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Topic: i cant stand my dad...
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rumbard1981
Newflake Posts: 3
From: Orlando
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted May 31, 2005 09:28 PM
  
i visit my dad usually every weekend. i live in orlando- he lives in melb bchhes pretty much an alcoholic-most of my life- i lost my mom a yr ago to cancer and moved back to help her and him with everything- im back in orlando and my lease expires in sept. i thought of moving back to be closer to him and to help out but he doesnt apprecitate anything hes an as@hole to say the least- we argue all the time- why should i put myself in that state again? i often ask myself why i keep going to see him- i tell him at times i love him but he just ignores it. hes like a mystery or a drug sometimes. his birthday is 1924 may 15 any insight to this feller? IP: Logged |
lalalinda
Moderator Posts: 1120
From: nevada
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted May 31, 2005 09:59 PM
as my mother continuously reminds me
the 5th commandment is to honor your mother and father  I know its rough now and again sweetie, Taures is soooo stubborn.
but this is part of your karma (always with parents and children)
and how you work through this tells alot about you. Thats why its hard but think of it like this,
You're lucky to have a father.
Oh what I wouldn't do to see my daddy  IP: Logged |
26taurus
unregistered
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posted May 31, 2005 10:02 PM
Couldnt have said it better lala.  IP: Logged |
themeanreds
Newflake Posts: 0
From:
Registered: Jun 2010
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posted May 31, 2005 11:40 PM
I have to respectfully disagree with the people who posted above me.
I don't care if it's your father, your mother, your neighbor, the guy who makes your coffee, the other mothers at the playground ... whom-ever. If someone doesn't show you the respect that you as a human being deserve, is a constant source of pain and negativity, hurts you on a regular basis ... cut them out of your life.
Now I don't know ALL the details of yours and your father's relationship but speaking as the child of an alcoholic, you can't fix him. You can't. It's not your fault, and no matter how much you love him and are there for him, he needs professional help for whatever is plaguing him. That doesn't mean you have to abandon him, but it does mean that you may need to distance yourself a bit while he works out his own demons. It doesn't make you a bad person or a bad daughter, it just makes you someone who deserves to be treated well and loved and someone who isn't going to be a dumping ground for someone else's negativity.
Remember, the only person you can control, is yourself. If you want to stay with him, that's fine. I admire your strength. but don't get mad later when he rebuffs your attempts at bonding/getting closer because that's his right and his choice. and even though I don't know your father, Im sure he loves you very much and wants a good relationship with you, it's just that right now there is something stronger in the way blocking him. IP: Logged |
lalalinda
Moderator Posts: 1120
From: nevada
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted June 01, 2005 12:32 AM
"distance yourself a bit while he works out his demons"what?? come on, the man isn't going to be working anything out, hes 81 years old and a Taures!
I'd say hes pretty set in his ways and not about to change at this stage of his life. Why throw precious time away? the evolved thing to do would be to continue caring for him in spite of his temper, look deeper and help him come to terms with whatever it is that sent him to the bottle in the first place. Help to ease his pain a little even if its just by being there. Show him that you love him.
This you can live with. T26 IP: Logged |
Isis
Newflake Posts: 1
From: Brisbane, Australia
Registered: May 2009
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posted June 01, 2005 12:45 AM
If he were younger, I would agree w/ the "distance yourself" idea, but because of his age, I would have to agree w/ lalinda. At that age, it is so unlikely that he's going to confront any demons. My grandmother is technically an alcoholic, and it bugs the heck out of my mother. But my view is this (and I tell my Mom this as well): while it certainly isn't a good thing, at that age you're not going to change them, and, providing they're not being abusive, violent, or are a danger to themself or others, at that age IMO, they've pretty much earned the right to do whatever they want, and they're going to do whatever they want anyway. They've fought wars, raised families, had careers, lived through depressions, recessions, assasinations, civil strife, you name it. If it makes 'em feel better to live out the remainder of their lives having a bottle of wine every night, yes it's sad, but hey, so long as they're not destructive and/or abusive, trying to change them will only make their final years a pain in the arse for them, and neither of you will enjoy what little time you have left with one another. Elderly people can be worse than teenagers IMO...especially if they're related to you. You can't tell them anything, so IMHO it's better to let it go, avoid them if they get too ornery, and try to enjoy what time you have left w/ them. Drinking or not, they often still have a lot of beneficial wisdom to impart. And I've never heard a person say ten years after a parent/grandparent died, "wow, I wish I had spent less time with them before they died"... IP: Logged |
themeanreds
Newflake Posts: 0
From:
Registered: Jun 2010
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posted June 01, 2005 01:06 AM
Are either of you a child of an alcoholic? And deal with them on a regular basis?
and honestly, I think the whole, "stand by him no matter what" thing is crap. It's not selfless and it isn't the evolved thing to do. It's being a martyr.
Sometimes you have to put your own happiness and well being above other people. it DOESN'T make you a bad person, and it doesn't mean you love your parent any less.
You can stand back and say, "oh stand by him, he won't change, he's too old. it's the right thing to do" because you aren't the one dealing with it.
"at that age you're not going to change them, and, providing they're not being abusive, violent, or are a danger to themselves or others, at that age IMO, they've pretty much earned the right to do whatever they want"
I agree.
"come on, the man isn't going to be working anything out, hes 81 years old and a Taures!"
You're right. he ISN'T going to change. And she is obviously unhappy (why would she have made this post if she was?) and if he is going to stay the way he is and she can't deal with that for the rest of her life, she should cut him out or set strict boundries as to what she is going to take and what she will and will not deal with.
I'm not saying she should move away in the middle of the night and never speak to him again, but setting up boundaries and not being a door mat is perfectly acceptable.
and just for some back info on my situation: My father has battled alcoholism and severe depression all my life. When I was younger I had to limit his contact with me due to the emotional strain. Now that I'm older and he is working on getting treated we are building a stronger, more involved relationship. In the beginning I thought the right thing to do was to stand by him no matter what, and I tried. But after a while I realized that the healthy thing for MYSELF was to back off. Just because Im not standing beside him the entire time doesn't mean I'm down for the whole journey. and that goes for anyone. IP: Logged |
lalalinda
Moderator Posts: 1120
From: nevada
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted June 01, 2005 02:05 AM
martyr my eye
its being mature enough to recognize a potential pitfall in life called guilt.IP: Logged |
sue g
unregistered
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posted June 01, 2005 04:32 AM
Hi Rumbard, I am sorry to read your story, I have friends who have alcoholic parents and their lives have been severly affected, to say the least. It is easy for us to judge and say what others should do, but the feeling I got when reading your post was that you can still love him, but it is so important to look after YOUR own health, after all what use would you be to your Dad, if you got sick. I am the daugther of a depressed father, he rings me sometimes crying, he is 78. Most of the time I can help him, other times I have to distance myself but I have to mind my health first. As for honour your parents, there is also the thing about fathers do not chastise your children. I dont believe that we should allow anyone, be it parents, siblings or friends to abuse us in anyway. I am not saying cut them out of your life, but be honest and with love stand your ground. I would be mortified if I thought my son, when he grows into a man, only visited me out of duty, it HAS to be for love and want only. I have seen children crucified by parents who have abused them in whatever way and several of my clients, in the past (especially the males) have been broken by domineering mothers and abusive fathers. As for your father never changing at 81,never say never, my 78 yr old dad has decided to go for counselling, he was always stubborn and egotistical, but it appears only now is the healing process beginning! I feel I played some part in this, but it was a long road, and in the past I felt anger and resentment towards him. I will send you and your dad love and hope you find a solution to your dilemna. Just be kind to yourself and be healthy and happy, love to you Sue xxx IP: Logged |
fayte.m
unregistered
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posted June 01, 2005 09:01 AM
themeanreds.....I have to agree with you. And Sue, yes...things can change, but there often comes a point where one HAS to just back away from the abuse and or lack of appreciation. Blood is NOT thicker than water! It can indeed become clotted and sluggish, even poisonous when their is guilt imposed by these so called loved ones and or obligation....just because they are family...that is never a good reason to let oneself be walked on and taken for granted, or worse! I see so many adults still trying to win the love and appreciation of their parent(s), and the reverse is also true. To my utter amazement and bewilderment...My only child is trying to "play me". He is getting married out of state. I was ORDERED by him and his wife to be...to BE THERE..no matter what...or they would NEVER speak to me again! The strange thing is that he has even heard the doctors tell me to not travel on long trips. For reasons besides the financial, which is also a problem, I cannot fly either. I could get doctor's excuses to prove I can not attend his celebration. But it would not help. He has DEMANDED that I be there even if I am strapped to a hospital bed and wheeled in. He knows about my problems and knows from previous experience that there is a very likely chance that I would not be able to attend even if it were taking place across the road. I take things as they come, he knows that. He has seen me blind, semiparalyzed and knows I had a small stroke.
He has seen worse than that also. He has been bamboozled and buttered up by my family and his father and stepmother. These people range from well off to extremely wealthy...as are his future in-laws. They gift him and flatter him and tell him that I must not love him. They tell him that all the bad things that he has heard about them is a lie. And of course he never saw them being nasty to me...they are just all so sweet! Well...they made sure he never saw the abuse personally. Which is even stranger because before I walked away from them all, they would call or visit me just to tell or gossip maliciously about other family members. Or just out and out ignored me because they did not believe I am disabled. They see the cane, and I look ok when I am out...so therefore nothing could possibly be wrong. But what they do not see is the daily agony I go through, and the adaptations I must make in my life to just live like a normal person. Of course they never see me when I am at my worse! I am in bed or whatever! Or I am up and doing things but the neurological problems are making my face look melted on one side and I slur my speech.
At those time I must take great caution to not fall or burn myself. I have hurt or burned myself so many times because on the worse days, of the up and moving ones...I may well be moving around, but I can not always feel things in all parts of my body, and can get hurt/injured and not discover it until later. Well the point I am trying to make is that my son should know better! But they(my family) are buying his loyalty and he has always wanted to have a big family...as he is an only child. I have told him how proud I am of him, and how I feel his fiancee will make him a fine partner/wife...and that I would be there for his wedding if I could...but I can not. Even if I suddenly became a millionaire I still could not have any guarrantee that on the day of his wedding that I would be able to be there...it is more likely that I would still be unable to be there. In fact it would be a very long shot...especially that early in the day...and definitely no way after a long trip. He has also invited my mother who is a rabid Christian who has threatened to kill my husband and I because we are evil witches(we are neither witches or evil!) because he has only seen her once since he was a child and has never seen her when she if drinking or off her meds. My family is a mess! I had no choice but to walk away and be myself. And if my son chooses to never speak to me again..that is his choice. I will not play the game back and try to guilt trip him. I am not going to grovel and cry and BEG him to love me and speak to me, or badmouth the others who have bought him so to speak. If this is what wealth does to people...they can all keep it!
The one thing that helps me is this: When family is dysfunctional and so forth...think for a moment...if they were not family..one or all, would you choose them for friends? Would you let your non blood friends or boss or neighbor treat you with such disrespect and play head games? If you would, well you have bigger problems.
I am here...I have made it quite clear that they have made their choices(the ones who say they won't talk to me ever again if I do not do what they demand, that if they should ever change their mind(s), I will listen...but until then I will not be ORDERED.
Oh besides my son's threat...the other deamands of my family are(some , there are more)...Ditch all that psychic spiritual crap...dump those queer faggy people you have for friends! We can't be around you because you might have AIDS or some other queer infection...Believe in Jesus Christ as your personal savior or as God is my witness, I gave you life and I can take it away and your heathen husband too!There is more... but enough of the dirty laundry...I am tired of trying to fit in as myself and being buried in their garbage! I will write about this more later, but I need a break. Hand going goofy. But Sue wanted my opinion..so I felt it was important.
I must be me and my husband never makes such demands of me...he only demands that I be true to myself and thanks me for sharing my life with him. I do the same towards him.
Hey! Later!
Love
Fayte 
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sue g
unregistered
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posted June 01, 2005 09:25 AM
mmmmmm....... "honour thy mother and father" doesnt seem to carry as much weight after reading fayte's story does it folks? As always thanks for your wisdom fayte, I am sure we can all learn from your words. For those of you out there who have been burdened by abusive families, just remember it may be your "karma" but that doesnt mean you have to be a victim of it - God bless all xxxx IP: Logged |
26taurus
unregistered
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posted June 01, 2005 04:39 PM
I'm at work and didnt have time to read all of this. Just skimmed through, but, it looks like you have gotten some great advice Rumbard. I hope things get better with you and your dad. As usual, I can see both sides of the coin here. There are points that I agree with on all sides. And yes, the meanreds, as a matter of fact, I am the child of an alcoholic. tyvm. IP: Logged |
Yang
unregistered
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posted June 01, 2005 05:03 PM
My heart goes out to you rumbard 1981. I can't really say i know what you are going through as my relationship with my dad is fine. I can only imagine what you are going through.Let me just say this: I see you dad has lived his life (he is 81 after all) and he will be going any time now( I know that sounds harsh but it is true). Make peace with him now before it is too late. Even if he doesn't accept it at least you can walk away knowing you have no hard feelings towards your dad.
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Isis
Newflake Posts: 1
From: Brisbane, Australia
Registered: May 2009
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posted June 01, 2005 07:17 PM
quote:
Are either of you a child of an alcoholic?
As a matter of fact, yes I am. My father is an alcoholic. I am fully aware of how they can be. Which is why, in my advice for tolerance I included the caveat, "so long as they're not being abusive, violent, or a danger to themselves or others". I have never heard someone say, "Gee I wish I had spent LESS time with my mother/father/grandmother/grandfather before they died" Of course you have to do what you feel is right, and you should not feel obligated to stick around if you're being abused, experiencing violence, etc. Your own health and peace-of-mind are paramount. However, living in the same town and making yourself available to stop in, is not the same trial as living with an alcoholic. BTW, I'm not Christian, my advice wasn't based on "Honor Thy Parents", it was based on the fact that parents are usually very dear to us, whether they sucked as parents or not, and as I said, people rarely express regret after the fact at having spent too much time with an elderly/dying loved one. IP: Logged |
themeanreds
Newflake Posts: 0
From:
Registered: Jun 2010
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posted June 02, 2005 12:44 AM
(For the record, I really wasn't trying to start a fight with anyone.) Rumbard, I think the best thing to do is to really sit down and think about what will be most benefitial to YOU. If that's moving to the same town and seeing him a few times a week, if that's staying where you are and only talking to him once a month, whatever. Do what is going to fufill you the most. And as you move along and decide that less or more contact is what you want, go with it. Don't feel guilty, it's your life and you are allowed to say who is in it and who isn't.
I really do wish you the best. I think the hardest part about having an alcoholic for a parent is all the confusion. Or at least, that's what was hard for me. Being so angry but having so much love for a person at the same time, it was really difficult to work through.
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astro junkie
unregistered
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posted June 04, 2005 11:14 AM
rumbard1981 -I'm sure you'll get more responses if you take a minute and register at astro.com. Once you've entered your dad's birth info, click on the site's logo, which will take you back to home page. Click on PERSONAL PORTRAIT. Scroll down to bottom, cut & paste those tables you see there into your post here. One of the very most stressful experiences in life is being a child of a parent who expects you to be THEIR parent. Quite common. ------------------
... it's better to light a candle than curse the darkness IP: Logged |
Aphrodite
unregistered
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posted June 04, 2005 12:23 PM
Were you born in 1981? The year is posted next to your screen name. If so, that would make you 23-24. You and your father have a wide age gap; several generations in-between. It's hard to know what the "right" thing to do is when the main people in our own lives don't live and provide examples of being a strong, healthy presence.And it's hard to get started on new practices, isn't it? There are so many books out there and well meaning people who give their hearts and advice. I always seem to notice that there is a different feel between the almost clinical sounding "way to do things" and the actual practice in the real world. It's like you practice one day, may be for a few hours, and then something comes along and breaks your will down. Then you have to muster up more energy to keep up and re-build. What you're asking for doesn't happen right off the bat and the deeds that have been going on (mistreatment, ignoring, selfishness) have gotten their way for so long . . . I don't have any advice, because I am still working on issues in my own life and truly believe there are many roads to each person's vision of what "healthy", "satisfaction", and "love" means. It's awesome that you are thinking about this because as long as it's on your mind, you'll eventually pick up something that reasonates to get going and motivated. Once you find it, hold on to it! And circle back to it when the times are low and you feel uninspired. Go back to this "thing" that reasonates and it will give you back your hope and motivation again. Ciao! and lots of warm wishes and luck to you Aphrodite ------------------
Love all, trust a few. Do wrong to none.
- William Shakespeare (1564 - 1616) IP: Logged |
rumbard1981
Newflake Posts: 3
From: Orlando
Registered: Jul 2009
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posted June 04, 2005 01:02 PM
no known time for him-
may 15 1924im 35yrs old march 9 1970
for Me (male)
born on 9 March 1970 local time 12:52 am
in San Bernardino, CA (US) U.T. 08:52
117w18, 34n07 sid. time 12:09:20 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Planetary positions
planet sign degree house motion
Sun Pisces 18°22'23 03 direct
Moon Aries 10°39'13 04 direct
Mercury Pisces 05°58'53 03 direct
Venus Pisces 28°56'01 03 direct
Mars Taurus 01°39'08 04/5 direct
Mars is technically near the end of house 4 and is interpreted in house 5.
Jupiter Scorpio 05°29'40 11 retrograde
Saturn Taurus 05°36'44 05 direct
Uranus Libra 07°32'21 10 retrograde
Neptune Sagittarius 00°52'51 12 retrograde
Pluto Virgo 26°16'15 09 retrograde
True Node Pisces 11°49'51 03 retrograde
House positions (Placidus)
Ascendant Sagittarius 16°55'02
2nd House Capricorn 20°07'48
3rd House Aquarius 27°16'08
Imum Coeli Aries 02°32'36
5th House Taurus 01°43'12
6th House Taurus 25°35'27
Descendant Gemini 16°55'02
8th House Cancer 20°07'48
9th House Leo 27°16'08
Medium Coeli Libra 02°32'36
11th House Scorpio 01°43'12
12th House Scorpio 25°35'27
Major aspects
Sun Opposition Pluto 7°54
Sun Square Ascendant 1°27
Moon Opposition Uranus 3°07
Moon Trine Ascendant 6°16
Mercury Sextile Mars 4°20
Mercury Trine Jupiter 0°29
Mercury Sextile Saturn 0°22
Mercury Quincunx Uranus 1°33
Mercury Square Neptune 5°06
Venus Trine Neptune 1°57
Venus Opposition Pluto 2°40
Mars Opposition Jupiter 3°51
Mars Conjunction Saturn 3°58
Mars Quincunx Neptune 0°46
Jupiter Opposition Saturn 0°07
Saturn Quincunx Uranus 1°56
Neptune Sextile Pluto 4°37
wish i knew his time of birth
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taurean_scorpion
unregistered
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posted June 04, 2005 06:07 PM
themeanreds, i really needed to hear this quote:
"I don't care if it's your father, your mother, your neighbor, the guy who makes your coffee, the other mothers at the playground ... whom-ever. If someone doesn't show you the respect that you as a human being deserve, is a constant source of pain and negativity, hurts you on a regular basis ... cut them out of your life."
thanks IP: Logged |
aries-chick
unregistered
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posted June 05, 2005 02:00 AM
Hey Rumbard His chart at 1am that day Planetary positions
planet sign degree house motion
Sun Taurus 24°14'22 03 direct
Moon Libra 05°00'16 07 direct
Mercury Taurus 13°13'07 02 retrograde
Venus Cancer 07°14'14 05 direct
Mars Aquarius 11°42'33 12 direct
Jupiter Sagittarius 17°38'17 10 retrograde
Saturn Libra 27°08'48 08 retrograde
Uranus Pisces 20°48'44 01 direct
Neptune Leo 17°39'59 06 direct
Pluto Cancer 10°44'44 05 direct
True Node Leo 28°03'55 06/7 retrograde His chart at 11.59 pm Planetary positions
planet sign degree house motion
Sun Taurus 25°09'43 03 direct
Moon Libra 18°47'42 08 direct
Mercury Taurus 12°52'13 03 retrograde
Venus Cancer 07°54'25 05 direct
Mars Aquarius 12°13'30 01 direct
Jupiter Sagittarius 17°32'06 10 retrograde
Saturn Libra 27°05'11 08 retrograde
Uranus Pisces 20°50'34 01 direct
Neptune Leo 17°40'32 07 direct
Pluto Cancer 10°45'48 05 direct
True Node Leo 27°58'14 07 retrograde The only thing that changes is the degree of the moon sign.. not much else. So you can still have a look at other aspects - that don't invlove moon sign.. The moon is deffinetly Libra though (it was in Libra that whole day) IP: Logged |
sd09
unregistered
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posted June 05, 2005 08:02 PM
So i am I cant stand my dad IP: Logged | |
Lindaland
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