posted July 29, 2005 08:30 PM              

It strikes me that the Geminis I know seem to have permanent high self-esteem, they always seem confident and assured and generally seem to bounce back from anything

Whereas virgos have the lowest,myself a case in point. But I wonder if this is probably becuase self-criticism is built into the sign 's nature so that might explain why.

posted July 29, 2005 09:19 PM              

quote:

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It strikes me that the Geminis I know seem to have permanent high self-esteem, they always seem confident and assured and generally seem to bounce back from anything

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Uh, no. You're going by appearence. In fact Gems tend to struggle a lot with self-esteem. We have a nervous, high-strung nature and tend to have fragile egos (sense of self) that are highly sensitive to criticsm and rejection. Most commonly we seek out other people to boost our sense of self and to validate ourselves, and that makes us often too eager for approval and acceptence. Self-possession can be very hard for a Gem, which being the sign of the Twins, inherently yearns for their other "half."

I can't remember which astrologer said it, it may have been our Linda, but it is sadly common that Gem children, being precocious and ahead of the game, get "beaten down" very early on by adults and peers who don't understand their precociousness or are jealous of them. This mean a lot of Gem go into adult pretty damaged and insecure about themselves. The irony is we are so youthful and optimistic by nature, most people do not recognize how wounded we Gem are underneath the surface. SInce Gems aren't the most reflective sign by nature, we Gem tend to not realize this about ourselves as well!

posted July 29, 2005 09:27 PM              

Gem+8th house/water planets+saturn on asc=low esteem....
Had a prob with that when I was in my early teens,that was a bad phase,but now my esteem is just too big...

posted July 29, 2005 09:37 PM              

Not all.but the majority. I'd have to agree with the gemini thing also.

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Gemini sun, Cancer rising, mercury in Gemini, moon in Taurus, venus in Taurus, mars in Libra

"You must live in the infinite blackness that exists when I close my eyes. I see you when I fall asleep, I see you when I dream."

posted July 29, 2005 09:46 PM              

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Gemini sun, Cancer rising, mercury in Gemini, moon in Taurus, venus in Taurus, mars in Libra

"You must live in the infinite blackness that exists when I close my eyes. I see you when I fall asleep, I see you when I dream."

posted July 29, 2005 10:05 PM              

LOL.

I kind of, I'd say. To me, I just think I am protective- hahhaha!

But I am realizing that I am like that with possessions also, so I need to learn to be more laid back with people and things.

posted July 29, 2005 10:54 PM              

yeah it also sucks because My venus is in taurus and so is my chiron. LOL

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Gemini sun, Cancer rising, mercury in Gemini, moon in Taurus, venus in Taurus, mars in Libra

"You must live in the infinite blackness that exists when I close my eyes. I see you when I fall asleep, I see you when I dream."

posted July 29, 2005 11:20 PM              

You'll find that a person's level of self-esteem, ie what one thinks about oneself is related to how one is raised and treated as a youngster. It also depends upon the feedback one receives from others, and how we interpret that feedback.

As an example, i recently had to give a presentation on Surrealism to a class of thirty-odd of my fellow students. I felt so nervous, and was convinced that i'd **** it up completely, or that my research findings would be innacurate and totally rubbished. However, the presentation went smoothly and i received good feedback from my tutors. I left the 'stage' feeling a thousand percent more positive than ten minutes before!

This illustrates that the feedback one receives from others, especially our peers and valued elders makes a huge difference to one's self-esteem and self-image. Had i received negative feedback in the above example, i'd have felt a complete and utter pillock, and would probably have walked out of the college, never to be seen again!

On the subject of Self-esteem, you might like to read the following website's section. During my Communications Studies course, i found it fascinating:
http://www.cultsock.ndirect.co.uk/MUHome/cshtml/

I suppose that, from the astrlogical viewpoint, if one looked at the childhood and early adulthood, and found negative influences in, say, the first house (i have Saturn rising in Aries, which puts a huge damper on things for me!), one could predict a negative self-esteem in a person. But i don't think it would be predictable by Sun sign alone.

All IMNSHO, of course. And i don't claim any expertise except personal experience.

posted July 30, 2005 01:28 AM            

I've found Scorpio's have the highest self esteem... sometimes for no known reason, lol.

posted July 30, 2005 09:23 PM              

Gemini Nymph: thanks for your insight into Geminis.. I guess I have not scratched the surface enough, the people I know all seem so "up". As a virgo Ive always been a bit jealous of our Mercurian stablemate, as Ive always felt that they got the luckier breaks!

They are an optimistic bunch, while virgos are pessimistic.

posted July 31, 2005 11:18 AM              

As a Virgo, I don't agree with us having low self-esteem eventhough that seems to be the prevailing opinion around here.

First, let's examine what self-esteem is. According to the Webster's New Universal Unabridged Dictionary, self-esteem is

1. belief in oneself, and 2. self-respect.

I think the fact that Virgos obsessively analyze and criticize everything into oblivion makes it difficult to be gang-ho about stuff. It's kind of hard to feel optimistic when you see every worm in every apple you decide to look at. The question is, how do we internalize this, and how does it translate into action.

Acoustic, I think you are on to something - in a crisis situation, let's see who's handling himself. I doubt it's Aries, except to bump his *&^&*^*& head into a tree...

This is why I am not crazy about Sun Sign Astrology. Even though Linda Goodman's book is loads of fun, there are sooo many factors that goe into chart... A Virgo/Scorpio is going to operate differently than a Virgo/Taurus, and so forth.

A better question would be, which planets displayed prominently denote low self-esteem, or high-selfesteem, or whatever.

So, btw. here you even see it in action: Moonshine, you started this thread, and I just told you how to do it better. That's 1. Vintage Virgo, and 2. hardly an indicator of low self-esteem.

I rest my case....

love to all,

posted July 31, 2005 04:53 PM              

I plump for moon opposition venus, a Jewel of an apsect in my chart!

posted July 31, 2005 07:13 PM              

Also, the first house. I think the first house tells a lot about how the person feels about herself. In the absence of a planet there I would look for the ruler of the first, where it is and how it's aspected.

I would think that a first house Sun would be a good indicator of healthy self-esteem, even if it has "difficult" aspects.

As far as Moon opp. Venus, that's I think a relationship thing, perhaps oversensitivity or excessive need for approval. Maybe underlying that is a lack of self-esteem, maybe not. Moon aspect have to do with the emotional needs, the Sun with feelings about the self. The Sun, in a way, IS the self. So, if you want to understand how you feel about yourself, Moonshine, look to your Sun. Where is it, what's it doing?

posted August 02, 2005 07:38 AM            

look for planets IN the houseand also, very imp, look for the RULER of the house.

examples: Moon in the 2nd house means self-doubts (fear of not being worthy) - a fluctuation of self-esteem. of course, it also points to fluctuations of money earned. a friend of mine feld depressed whenever he run out of money; 'not gaving money' to spend is for him a prove of lack of self-worth. HVAING money makes him feel good about himself (moon-self-worth-money)

mars connected to the 2nd speaks of someone who feels worthy according to what they DO -

mars ruling the 2nd IN the 6th: self-worth proven tru work accomplishments.

posted August 02, 2005 02:03 PM              

In my opinion I have found Sags to have very high self-esteem w/out a bunch of self-loathing ...

Taurus also as well as Scorp and Libras ... Signs that don't look so much for validation or pats on backs or the need for "feed back" ... they just do

posted August 02, 2005 05:40 PM              

now let me follow my own rule and demonstrate. i get torn down a lot becoz people think i have very high self esteem. WRONG! i was a submissive sickening slave to my ex husb who took advantage of the fact that i had low self esteem. but i like it coz its what drives me to do better and better, kind of like what someone said about cap. in the end i try to end up at the top of my game. its coz i question myself, not doubt, which is different.

most geminis, even celebrities, have addictions, anorexia, mental ailments and breakdowns, image problems, and suicides associated with them later on in life. a large large number suffer manic depression. it emerges after the uproar has died down. most of them have self esteem issues.

posted August 02, 2005 06:31 PM            

We seem to always land on our feet and bounce back after failure in work and in social situations.

What we do lack is the ability to have that major high self-esteem / confidence when it comes to personal relationships.

Linda Goodman alluded to this in Sun Signs. Even though an Archer may be dead on when it comes to logic and debate, it can be another story when it comes to matters of the heart or friendships. That is when we seem to attract that takers - THAT can devastate us.. To learn that someone we cared about was only using us to gain friends, money, attention..etc.... is probably the hardest thing to endure because we can't imagine (well, most of us) doing that to another.

I had a co-worker that was like that. She rode my coat-tails for 2 years until I finally told her she needed to get on her own. She ended up getting fired because she could not perform. I had been cleaning up her messes that whole time. She turned on me as soon as the company let me go. I was heart-broken because I thought she was truly my friend.

But like I said, we do bounce back and we learn from our mistakes - so maybe that is how we come across as being more self-confident and with a high self esteem?

I have knowns all signs to be high or low - sometimes it is both at the same time. My ex-hubby, the Virgo is a very confident man and really entertained people with his stories. He is also extremely brilliant, but he always felt he wasn't good enough. He would pick himself apart - which in turn would cause him to become depressed.

I think there is a big difference between depression because you feel you can do better and low self-esteem in which you dwell on yourself and how you can look better.

I know a person that is young and fairly good looking. He is using steroids because he thinks it will make him look better and that will somehow make him a better person. He also wants to get a chin implant, liposuction...etc..all because he hates the way he looks. Actually, he looks good, or did, until the side effects kicked in. Now I am watching him turn...well, ugly.

An inferiority complex is really a superiority complex turned inside - you are still focused on you to the exclusion of everyone else.