posted April 25, 2006 12:16 PM              

i have an exact natal venus-saturn square, venus being my chart ruler.

posted April 25, 2006 12:28 PM              

i have a question...my venus and saturn in libra..is that means conjuction...again venus and saturn in 10 th house..is that be delay my marriage or something else..or is it depends on the person who i will marry..ok here a person:his saturn in virgo and venus in pisces....and his venus in 5 th house and saturn in 11 th house..or should i looked other aspects...

thank you again

posted April 25, 2006 12:37 PM            

Venus Quincunx Saturn... both Rx and both in the Fall position... Venus conjunct Sun is the only other aspect either planet makes in my chart...

posted April 25, 2006 02:08 PM            

"anyhow .. I followed Liz Greene' advice before she wrote the book ..
.. and left home at 16 "

Me too... at 16! I didn't know squat about anything just "knew" I had to go...

My Father was the sore spot... Alcoholic, never home, very strict, old world European 100% Macedonian Man.... We get along fine now, however.
He is a Libra/Gem Moon/Libra Rising...It was like living with a prosecuting attorney....

" but somehow the pain is replaced by knowledge and understanding .."

* * * * * * * *
For me, pain replaced by knowledge has been my understanding.... along with the occasional look in the mirror

posted April 25, 2006 02:09 PM            

I think the key concepts for the first section are these:

"Venus-Saturn contacts cannot be consciously utilised in a constructive way unless an effort is made at honesty with oneself.
Regardless of how badly the person with Venus-Saturn wants to express sexually and emotionally, there is usually an equally intense unconscious fear which makes defense necessary at all costs.....[but] the mysteries of union are within the grasp of the person with this contact - he also holds the key to a relationship which is lasting and real."

posted April 25, 2006 02:18 PM              

This article also made me tear up, but alas I am at work so I cannot let them all out!

I have struggled and still constantly struggle with this aspect!!! I have Saturn square Venus & Saturn opposed Moon (exact degree). Venus is the focal point in this oh so loverly T-Square <grumbles> It makes me constantly doubt my worth as a friend and makes me wonder if i'm needed at all! I have to consciously fight off depression, which I am indeed very sucessful with, but it's like the monster waiting for my guard to fall.
The part where it said:
"Venus -Saturn combinations imply a certain amount of emotional pain and rejction in the early home life. This may be of an obvious kind, such as the home where nobody touches each other or expresses any overt display of affection or warmth." This was right one. This fits my parent's to a T! Don't get me wrong I love them so much and I know they love me, it's just how it was! I can see where they've passed this behavior or down to me too.

Something else i've just recently noticed was Lady Lilith. Reading yer posts it seems that you read up on the Dark Moon quite a bit. Well, in relation to yer original post, I have Lilith squaring both my Saturn & Moon & opposed my Venus which forms a Grand Cross! If you have any thoughts on Lilith's placement as the missing leg of my T-square, please let me know! Lilith in this placement sounds sorta depressing... Where can I read up on her?

P.S. I've noticed that yer blueyonder site thingy has not been up as of late. I loved lookin at yer aspect links! What's goin on?

------------------
`Who are you?' said the Caterpillar. This was not an encouraging opening for a conversation. Alice replied, rather shyly, `I--I hardly know, sir, just at present-- at least I know who I WAS when I got up this morning, but I think I must have been changed several times since then.'
~Lewis Carroll

posted April 25, 2006 07:30 PM            

Whilst browsing the other day, I ran across an image for your signature
Feel free to nab it!

posted April 26, 2006 01:33 PM            

What an excellent, in depth post. It made me look at the relationships with my past mates. I found that in almost all my significant relationships - especially those that caused me so much pain, the men had serious Venus-Saturn aspects.

One ex had Venus conjunct Saturn in Cancer in his 2nd and 3rd house respectively. I was the apex of his T-square involving Jupiter in Aries in the 12th house and Pluto in Libra in his 5th house.

Needless to say, he had a very abusive upbringing that involved various forms of abuse and neglect. As a result I believe he is a full blown narcissist (a subject he used to research profusely) and may have manic tendancies. I say this because the world became about him and what he could do to procure affection from a woman. He hated women and loved us at the same time. He was extremely attracted to beautiful well-versed intellectuals, but then would degrade himself with women that amounted to human refuse.

With me he loved how people would say "Wow, she is the most beautiful woman you have ever dated" and would brag about me being a bio-chemist. Yet, he took ever chance he could to degrade and humiliate me in front of others or challenge anything I had to say in order to set up his control and dominance. If that failed he would use his massive physicality to keep me in line. He also enjoyed lying and cheating on me (knowing that I would catch on but thriving on the fact that he was doing it).

In all, I learned to identify people with certain issues. LOL... In our synastry charts there was an indication that he and I had past Karmic issues (His Saturn / Venus aspect completed my T-square as mine did his. Both completing planets just so happen to be our chart rulers - mine being Mercury his being Venus). He used to bring up how the karmic report stated one of us alienated the other in the past and caused mass heartache. He then attributed that to me because the cause and him being the victim.

My ex-husband also had a Venus-Saturn aspect. He came from a family where love was not shown- touching / sex were taboo subjects and he suffered from a fear of rejection and a fear of women. Once a woman became a part of his life and he fell deeply in love with them, he could no longer be intimate. The Madonna / Wh0re complex. He had Saturn in the 6th in squaring his Venus in the 4th (which also squared his Uranus in the 3rd).

But.. I never felt that he hated women. It wasn't that, but just more of a fear of intimacy.

Mr. Leo has Venus square Saturn in his chart as well. Saturn is in Cancer (but doesn't complete my T-square thank God) and it squares his Venus in Virgo (by degree yet not by sign). His Venus also tightly conjuncts my Pluto within 2 degrees

That may also be a contributing factor depending on what you believe. Even in the case of my ex-husband his Saturn was in Libra while his Venus was in Leo. Libra doesn't square by sign, but it did by degree. So does that lesson the complication?

I don't see any type of loathing of women in Mr. Leo. I do know that he has always been the kind of guy that starts a relationship (when he does start one) and then stays with that person unless there are mitigating factors that lead to a break up. He is fiercely loyal and has never cheated on a person. (I know this because his friends tease him on his morals).

He also had the aid of a beautiful trine with Jupiter, Mercury and a conjunction with Pluto.

In my own chart I don't have an aspect with Venus in Sag and Saturn in Taurus (although my Sag Sun conjuncts my Venus and trines my Saturn in degree. Venus is just a smidge off from being a trine and consequently does not make an aspect).

posted April 26, 2006 09:49 PM              

I cannot thank you enough for posting this. For most of my life, I have struggled with a harsh Venus-Saturn aspect (a square). To make matters worse, there is a vertex in my chart that stabs right into the area of intimacy, where I am particularly sensitive. Thanks to your thoughtfulness and sharing, I now am on a better path to understanding myself.

To you and anyone else reading this: What are the best ways to heal? Any specifics that I can turn into behaviors? I know instinctively that I will need to learn how to love myself. How can I achieve that, how do I get over the sense that I would "fail as a woman"?

posted April 27, 2006 12:38 AM              

Venus (relationships) and Saturn (duty, also structure, restriction) in a challenging aspect, such as a square, suggests that the person needs to have some sort of "structure" to their relationships. This aspect is commonly found in long-lasting marriages, since marriage creates a "structure" in which the person with the Venus-Saturn combination feels comfortable. It is possible that you simply need to find a serious relationship and may not be interested in the more typical "dating" relationships.

Unfortunately, a frequent lesson learned at an early age from challenging aspects to Venus-Saturn challenges is love restrictions. This is common when young and a person has very little control over their own energies, but when a person becomes an adult, then they can "reimage" their childish ideas in an adult way and USE their energy. Also, it is common for people with Saturn challenges to only be able to fully use their energies after they become an adult in the outer world.

Explaining,

posted April 28, 2006 09:07 PM              

Tim,
You've brought up a very constructive way to deal with the hard Saturn-Venus. The idea of a solid marriage truly resonates with me, as I need the structure (you hit it right on the head). When you talk about energies and love restrictions, what do you mean? I think growing up, I scared men away because I was so bent on the happily-ever-after. Am I going along the right lines?