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Author Topic:   How manipulative and private are scorpio placements?
GrlyGirl20
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posted January 28, 2007 12:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GrlyGirl20     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hey I have been dealing with a guy with both a natal venus and mer. in scorpio and I have wanted to know if anyone has experienced manipulative or controlling behavior...in both themselves and how they relate to others? Or does anyone with strong pluto/scorpio placements see this in themselves? And does anyone with strong pluto or scorpio aspects find themselves in controlling relationships or realtionships that are unhealthy and they know it, but they won't get rid of the relationship for some reason? Thanks

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cristiname
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posted January 28, 2007 04:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cristiname     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
*it depends* and *very*

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SagSun
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posted January 28, 2007 05:00 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I know a girl who has Sun, Mercury and Uranus in Scorpio ... and I can tell you ... she is a manipulative b**** (sorry to sound so harsh ... but there's really no other way to describe her). She keeps deleting e-mails that her boyfriends receives from female friends of his ... but he doesn't have the slightest clue that she is doing those things, because she has a remarkable talent for twisting him around her little finger.

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aquaspryt69
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posted January 28, 2007 05:27 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Asc, Sun, Venus, Merc, and Nept in Scorp here.
When I was younger, I was definitely controlling. Never have liked to be manipulated or be manipulating. Been around too many Gemini's into mind control games if ya know what I mean.

Now that I'm much older, I'm still somewhat controlling but nothing like when I was young. I've learned things I can try to control. People are never on the list of things to control.

Bad relationships? I stayed with an abusive alcoholic Gemini Asc/Sag Sun/Aqua Moon for eight yrs. I allowed him to control me, dominate me and physically and verbally abuse me. Oddly enough, the relationship ended when I refused to be his drinking partner anymore. He couldn't manipulate me anymore coz I wasn't having blackouts and not remembering things. He had me convinced I was a worthless piece of crap. A totally worthless biotch nobody would ever want, and that I should consider myself lucky he showed any interest in me.

No, I don't like controlling or manipulative behavior at all!!

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alanabelle86
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From: Somewhere over the rainbow
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posted January 28, 2007 05:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Bad relationships? I stayed with an abusive alcoholic Gemini Asc/Sag Sun/Aqua Moon for eight yrs. I allowed him to control me, dominate me and physically and verbally abuse me. Oddly enough, the relationship ended when I refused to be his drinking partner anymore. He couldn't manipulate me anymore coz I wasn't having blackouts and not remembering things. He had me convinced I was a worthless piece of crap. A totally worthless biotch nobody would ever want, and that I should consider myself lucky he showed any interest in me.

I'm dating a Sag Sun/Aqua Moon...he is the exact same way. I did the same thing, refuse to be his drinking partner....cuz he was really manipulative and controlling and went kinda overboard when drunk and he flipped and said the exact same thing you just typed.. Weird...he has Mars conjunct Pluto in Scorpio and a Libra ASC...He could be the most ruthless, foul-mouthed, cutting person I'd ever known. He hates that he cannot control me, I will not subject to that. I drop him on his ass everytime he tries (Uranus conj. Ascendant). I will not have that. But it does get tiresome, ugh.


I'm a Sun, Merc, Venus, Pluto in Scorpio with Moon in the 8th and Sun conj. Pluto...and I'll be honest, I'm very aware that I can be manipulative and controlling. Extremely so. But I choose not to be for the most part. And it all stems from insecurity/jealousy. I'm glad i see that now cuz when I was younger, phew, there was just no living with me. ...I'm glad I've accepted that I can rise above those qualities...and only refer to them when one needs an a$$whoopin :-P


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Sweet Stars
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posted January 28, 2007 06:09 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Many can be but as the get older usually not.

------------------
I know you see me looking at you and you already know......I wanna love you, you already know.

*----------*

Gemini/Cancer cusp
Cancer Ascendant
Mercury Gemini
Taurus Moon *29
Venus Taurus
Mars Libra

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aquaspryt69
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posted January 28, 2007 06:19 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
We had many knock-down-drag-out-fights. None of them any fun. I'm no slouch, but I still came out bruised and bloody. I managed to make him see stars a couple of times and he literally tried to break my neck.

Watch out!! Get the hell out of that chit and don't look back. I don't regret leaving, I just regret not leaving after the very first fight.

I've got the sweetest and gentlest Leo Sun/Pisces Moon bf now. Am even considering marriage which is something I said I would never do.

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BornUnderDioscuri
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posted January 28, 2007 09:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BornUnderDioscuri     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Id say very much so they could be very manipulative and private depends on the environment though

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Sun-Gemini
Moon-Scorpio
ASC-Libra

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Dulce Luna
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From: The Asylum, NC
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posted January 28, 2007 09:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dulce Luna     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Depends. My bf has the sun in scorpio but his moon in pisces makes him a bit easygoing and sweet. His venus in libra combined with the sun being at the top of his chart make him friendly and sociable. Don't get it twisted though, that scorp has not been truly "diluted". He still likes some private time to himself (don't we all? Or is it just a water thing?) and I'm sure there are some things between us that he wouldn't want me sharing with the rest of the world...LOL.

Me, I have pluto at the top of my chart and a eighth house moon...I'm much more paranoid than he is about this...I'm the secretive one. (To me there is a difference between privacy and secrecy).

I will admitt that I'm the manipulative one...he doesn't like that either starnge enough. I think its his sag mercury...had it been in scorp it probably would've been a whole different story. (I have a cancer one btw)

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GeminiLover75
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posted January 28, 2007 09:38 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Moon conjunct Uranus in Scorpio here. Yes, I can be controlling and manipulative. Not extremely so, but I have noticed the tendency in myself. Like I'll manipulate my ex into doing things for me. But it's not something calculated, it'll be we're having a conversation and it just happens. Or in my flatmate situation there will be instances where I hold all the cards when it comes to random things like who has to buy the toilet paper... lol... and I manipulate it to go my way. My bf lives here with me and I notice he exhibits the same behaviour - currently he's holding onto $5 that belongs to them b/c they won't do anything about the broken vacuum cleaner. We sit here in our room concocting minor schemes... like writing our names on OUR milk container so they can't have it... He's Jupiter in Scorpio (8th house), Pluto square sun and a few other Pluto aspects I can't remember offhand...

And yes we both like our private time. In fact I need it, to recharge myself so I can become my sociable Sag ascendant again.

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GrlyGirl20
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posted January 28, 2007 10:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GrlyGirl20     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
"I think its his sag mercury...had it been in scorp it probably would've been a whole different story"

How on earth are scorpio mercuries manipulative? Are they the type to say one thing, yet mean another...and to not revel their feelings...as in openly say they don't feel anything or that they only want one thing, even though they have acted as if they didn't. Basically should you 2nd guess everything they say. I'm a mercury in leo...so I basically say exactly what I mean.

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Dulce Luna
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From: The Asylum, NC
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posted January 28, 2007 10:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dulce Luna     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
water mercuries are notorious for all the things you've mentioned above. I know because I have one.

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Gemini Nymph
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posted January 28, 2007 11:00 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Aquaspryt - I think you should rethink how you seem to imply that your ex's horrible behavior is due largely to his Gem ASC. I suspect there's some issues you still need to work out there. It makes much more sense that it has more to do with his Sun and moon and the synastry between you two. Truth is most Gem ASC guys are wusses - most I know hate violence and can't drink hard liquor. On the other hand, Sag sun and Aqua moon are common placments for violent offenders and murders. Those two together - a Sag god complex plus Aqua emotional detachment - could potentially be far more scary than the sort of "carefree party boy" most Gem ASC guys are.

As for Scorps - My experience is not "how much" but simply either they do or don't. Scorpio is a sign of extremes, and this is one of them. Unfortuantely, many that say they don't probably do. Many Scorps' idea of was is truth is somewhat, how should I say it...."flexible." In other words, I've know Scorps who think that whatever they want to be true is the truth, even if their own behavior completely contradicts.

I'm somewhat fortunate to have a 1H Pluto so I usually scare away the controlling/manipulative Scorps. I'm a little bewildered when I see other people get so entangled with a very sick Scorp - I don't get the appeal.

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GrlyGirl20
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posted January 28, 2007 11:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GrlyGirl20     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dulce Luna how would you deal with a water mercury...how do you get them to be expressive about their feelings.

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Lauren
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posted January 29, 2007 01:30 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I like Scorpio Mercury but my Mercury is Pisces so that would be a lot easier than the square, I'd imagine. They are private, but I'm not curious by nature so it doesn't bother me.

If you don't ask questions, they warm up to you eventually so they'll be more comfortable being honest and opening up. But if you're a never-ending questionnaire in human form.. water mercury will be daydreaming about a beach somewhere in Hawaii and ignore every question you ask. They dislike snooping.

I know a guy with Venus/Mercury in Scorpio. He was manipulative but has gotten a lot better since then. It's an age thing as well, how old is this guy?

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GrlyGirl20
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posted January 29, 2007 02:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for GrlyGirl20     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hey Lauren,

The guy in question just turned 20 in December. It's weird that we have problems communicating, as my mercury is in leo and his sun is in sag, and his mercury is in scorpio, and my sun is in cancer. It's hard communicating because I'm so used to being loud, and being simple when I communicate. There are no hidden motives (even though I have the mer/pluto square). I had been dealing with this guy since Aug, and he and I have been off and on and we had a coversation last night, where I just realized that he was very manipulative, a game player, and it seems like he is pretty much testing me to see how far will go for him (or if I want him). If you look back at old posts I had gotten drunk one night and confessed everything good and bad that I felt. Well I had said I was gonna block him, after he asked me to block him. In the conversation he was like, "why didn't you block me?" And I said, "I don't block people, plus if he didn't want to talk to me he would have blocked me." He replied that he had gotten a new aim, and that he didn't know where the block button was (even though he has blocked me before, and almost all the aim's have the block button in the same place). And I replied with I can tell you where it is. And he replied with I had no idea you'd give up that easily. After he said that, I realized that he is a major game player. And that he doesn't want me to stop dealing with him, even though he has said he didn't care otherwise. But it's like some sick game almost. It's weird I thought anyone with a scorpio placement would want all or nothing and that superficial relationships would mean nothing to them. To me our sexual relationship means nothing, but our friendship and him do mean something (I blame my 11th house venus for that).

I will also admit that even though I have known that he is bad for me, it's almost as if I can't stop. Well I don't really want to stop, I like the intensity between us (I will admit that). And I can completely see that he is controlling, and manipulative...and he thinks he knows me but it's sad that I kinda want to beat him at his own game. And for some reason I don't believe him when he says that he just wants sex...no emotions. Or that he doesn't do emotions. I can't quite put my finger on it...but I just know he doesn't want that.

Lauren,
How is that guy with the venus, and mercury in scorpio behave? Especially in terms of romantically...does he test people at all that you know of? Thanks

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Lauren
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posted January 29, 2007 03:19 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi GrlyGirl - I think it's an insecurity thing to be honest. The testing comes from lack of trust. I was friends with him for a fair while before I met my ex bf and in that time he didn't test. But afterwards he got pretty weird and jealous of my bf so he tried to manipulate in a few different ways. A lot of lies going back and forth.. and trying to get attention.. It was pretty unnerving for a while, but it's been ages since and he has apologized.

With Scorpio Venus.. it's kinda like they want what they want the way they want it and depth means a lot to them. They have major trouble letting go once they're really into someone. Maybe that's why he couldn't block you. The guy I mentioned has a Libra sun, so his way of manipulating was pretty undercover. I actually think Libras with Scorpio Venus get hurt most in relationships, because they’re so sensitive. My grandma was one as well.

There’s also a Sag in my life right now who has a Scorp Venus but he just turned 23 so he’d have a different chart. He doesn’t come across as manipulative to me.. not yet anyways.

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Venus De Milo
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posted January 29, 2007 03:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Venus De Milo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I actually like Scorpio people very very much. My favorite Aunt is a Scorpio (Cancer moon, Libra ASC)... she actually doesn't have many Scorpio placements other than her Sun (only Chiron). She comes across as much more Libran and watery sensitive than anything dark, secretive and manipulative.

One of my best friends is a triple Scorpio, she is really sweet and completely unmanipulative. She makes A LOT of really awful choices in her romantic life, and she ruins a lot of relationships with her obsessiveness and neediness, but she honestly doesn't have a bad bone in her body.

I have another best friend who is a Scorpio with an Aqua Moon and Gemini rising and she never lies. I've known her since the 2nd grade and I'm trying to think of even a little white lie she's told and I honestly can't. She is one of the funniest, bluntest people I have ever met. She really isn't manipulative at all, but she's very passionate in her relationships and has a lot of isues with self-esteem and neediness.

All that said... I must admit... I am wary of Scorpio risers. I have a former best friend with Scorpio rising (Sag Sun/Virgo Moon) and she is the most mercenary, fakest person I have ever known. And she is so secretive and strange about anything to do with her personal life. I used to think she was smart to never EVER talk about her relationship, it's like... none of us know anything about her marriage, and they've been together for 10 years (married for 3). Whenever we've seen them socially, she and her husband hardly interact and it's all very polite and superficial between them... and it's SO OBVIOUS to everyone that she married him for money. Anyhow, I recently heard through my Scorpio/Aqua Moon that the Sag is a bonfide alcoholic... she stayed with them for 10 days and the Sag was finishing entire bottles of wine by herself in the afternoon and having vodka and oj first thing in the morning... So I guess, this secretiveness of hers hasn't been as great an idea as I originally thought.

Then there is that jerk... the Pisces sun/Virgo moon... he's another Scorp. rising and he is the KING of manipulation and lies and treating women like sh*t. He shares a lot of very similar placements to Casanova. He's an emotional vampire and manipulator extraordinaire. He comes off as the nicest, most geniune, most amazingly sweet, sensitive, honest person you could ever meet and he loves tricking women into believing they have something really special with him... when in reality, he just thrives on the adoration and affection. It's not even about sex to him. He's a horrible lay and not even that into it. He just wants to be adored, he's a black hole of egomania. He exhibits all the lowest traits someone could possibly imagine of someone with a Pisces/Scorpio personality.

And he is the most secretive of anyone i have ever met. his life is so perfectly compartmentalized and he's perfected all the perfect lies and and perfect fascade so that nobody ever questions him. He has women who are in love with him and think they are the only ones in LA and Vegas and New York. He's an actor and he's in a band and his day job allows him to travel and his personality and vibe is so perfectly constructed and so "apparently" transperant and honest, that no one even checks up on him.

I know this, because I was one of them for awhile. Although I did check up on him and I knew about the chick in LA, but at the time we weren't committed and I had just gotten out of a marriage, so I justified him lying about her to me because I figured he wanted to remain available to me, and I was entangled in a marriage until recently... HAA!!! Boy, was I fooled.

I don't think I would ever get involved with a Scorpio rising, I don't trust them.

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Lady Dee
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posted January 29, 2007 09:40 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

I'm a Sun, Merc, Venus, Pluto in Scorpio with Moon in the 8th and Sun conj. Pluto...and I'll be honest, I'm very aware that I can be manipulative and controlling. Extremely so. But I choose not to be for the most part. And it all stems from insecurity/jealousy. I'm glad i see that now cuz when I was younger, phew, there was just no living with me. ...I'm glad I've accepted that I can rise above those qualities...and only refer to them when one needs an a$$whoopin :-P

I can relate to this, very well!

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Green Fairy
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posted January 29, 2007 10:06 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't think that only Sun/Moon/ASC placements can give us a clear image of manipulative people.

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alanabelle86
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From: Somewhere over the rainbow
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posted January 29, 2007 10:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I agree with Greenfairy.

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Dulce Luna
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From: The Asylum, NC
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posted January 29, 2007 12:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dulce Luna     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Dulce Luna how would you deal with a water mercury...how do you get them to be expressive about their feelings.

Well the best advice I can give to you is to never back us into a corner...that'll just make us want to retreat even more. As in, don't ask to many quetions. We gotta feel comfy around you in order for us to open up....it isn't easy. Its a trust and security thing.You should know too; you are a cancer sun.

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Sweet Stars
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posted January 30, 2007 03:07 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Depends. My bf has the sun in scorpio but his moon in pisces makes him a bit easygoing and sweet. His venus in libra combined with the sun


Nice Dulce! My boyfriend has Scorpio Sun, Venus in Libra, but his Moon is in Taurus.


------------------
I know you see me looking at you and you already know......I wanna love you, you already know.

*----------*

Gemini/Cancer cusp
Cancer Ascendant
Mercury Gemini
Taurus Moon *29
Venus Taurus
Mars Libra

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aquaspryt69
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posted January 30, 2007 07:14 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
GN~Don't tell me what to think, not think, or re-think. What I said was in no way directed to anyone here in LL.

I won't rethink what I said about the Gemini's I have been unfortunate enough to know. Two of whom I am related.

If you're looking to start a fight or an argument then I suggest you look elsewhere.

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