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Author Topic:   Equality...A Cancerian quagmire?
BLKFox
Knowflake

Posts: 473
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Registered: Nov 2007

posted July 10, 2008 10:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for BLKFox     Edit/Delete Message
I'm wondering if America's Cancerian Sun make it difficult for the U.S. to understand the concept of equality. There seems to be a pervasive fear of "being wrong", or hurting some's feelings if you say a race or culture is different from "mainstream" American culture.
Living in the San Francisco Bay Area, I am very aware that we are a country of immigrants. Mainstream culture is a manufactured concept designed to make European Americans feel good when they, themselves are also the sons and daughters of immigrants.
Just as people are unique in their abilities, and lack thereof, the same applies to races and cultures. I believe the diversity of different races and cultures should be celebrated rather than "swept under the rug".
Astrologically speaking, this would be a really groovy country if it's Sun sign was Sag!

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Seeing Stars 7.21
Knowflake

Posts: 1301
From: New York
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posted July 10, 2008 01:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Seeing Stars 7.21     Edit/Delete Message
Its not so much a problem with grasping as it a problem with letting go. a common cancer challenge. Being controlled by england all those years and struggling to break free. I can see the cancer tendency in America with having trouble letting go of that and because the country didnt, they found a release through excersizing their own frustrations on African Americans controlling them through slavery. maybe the country's peronality resents foriegners. possibly seeing them as simply trying to reap the benefits from the hard work of the original colonists.

I would rather not have this country be a sag.

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blue moon
Moderator

Posts: 4700
From: U.K
Registered: Dec 2007

posted July 10, 2008 01:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for blue moon     Edit/Delete Message
Mrs Fox you always make me think.

In general the working people of England get impatient with "the P.C brigade" and the most common comment you will hear is "I just take people as I find them." Also fairly standard would be a comment that says 'I don't mind foreignors living here as long as they work and pay tax.'

Sounds about right for the Aries Ascendant, Capricorn Sun. This chart is taken from the 1066 invasion ~ which says it all, really.

Not that I'm denying there are racist bigots about, but in general the above is more typical. As a barometer of social opinion comments left on the Sun or the Mirror online aren't far out. The Guardian carries stories about 'institutional racism', but that's a more left-wing, middle-class paper.

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BLKFox
Knowflake

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From:
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posted July 10, 2008 03:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BLKFox     Edit/Delete Message
Seeing, your point is well taken & cause me to feel more compassionate about the situation. Are you a watery person? Or a wonderful, insightful Libran?

Blue,
Apples & Oranges demonstrate my point about people, Americans, having issues with equality.[--Your right, Americans also tend to be xenophobic!]
Apples & oranges are equal in that they both fulfill the definition of the word "fruit", yet, they do very different things in your body. Apples supply more potassium while Oranges provide more vitamin C. So, we can't say all fruits are alike, because it isn't true. Also, we can't say Oranges are better than Apples---that isn't true either. BUT, if you have Scurvy, it is much better to have an Orange than it would be to have an Apple.
Get my drift? People are equal in that they were created (I believe by God, or a creative force). During the creative process, people were endowed with special attributes, I believe this is true of an entire race of people---different attributes, qualities and predilections. ---At this point, many people trip & immediately go to the negative..WHY is that?
Think about a jigsaw puzzle...it wouldn't be very interesting if all the pieces were "cut" the same way, and it would be extremely confusing if all the pieces had the exact same scene painted on them.
People are EQUAL and DIFFERENT.
I rest my case!

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Seeing Stars 7.21
Knowflake

Posts: 1301
From: New York
Registered: Dec 2006

posted July 10, 2008 05:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Seeing Stars 7.21     Edit/Delete Message
hmm Bananas are higher in potassium then apples and are shaped differently. lol.

I dont think any specific race is endowed with special attributes.. maybe individuals yes. but not race's as a whole.

no comment on my sun sign btw

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BLKFox
Knowflake

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posted July 10, 2008 10:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BLKFox     Edit/Delete Message
I believe there ARE differences between the races...genetic & otherwise.
--this get back to the difference=Good or Bad argument....See, it's hard for Americans to think outside the box.

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Seeing Stars 7.21
Knowflake

Posts: 1301
From: New York
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posted July 11, 2008 09:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Seeing Stars 7.21     Edit/Delete Message
Actually America ranks very highly in our ability to think outside the box. I had an english teacher tell me once that although the chinese and such other countries have a better education system.. they are not taught to think outside the box.. but I guess a Communist country wouldnt want that.

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BLKFox
Knowflake

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posted July 11, 2008 11:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BLKFox     Edit/Delete Message
I agree, Americans are innovative in many areas---not when it comes to social science.
Granted, it would be challenging for ANY society to address & accommodate the racial and cultural conglomeration we have going in the U.S. AND, oddly, it may be because of the racial and cultural mixing that we are so innovation. We still have problems meeting people from different racial and cultures as they are without needing to think in terms of 'colorblindness' or saying "we are all the same"<---that just isn't true!

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alanabelle86
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Posts: 1840
From: Connecticut
Registered: May 2005

posted July 12, 2008 10:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message
quote:
I believe there ARE differences between the races...genetic & otherwise.


Interesting statement. What is race to you? Do you mean culture? Because what race actually is, is a means of classification founded during the earliest days of European Expansion and Imperialism, for the Europeans to label and classify the differences in the phenotypes or physical characteristics of people they'd found through their expeditions. They traveled to Africa and found the Africans to be "dark!...as if black skinned" and lo and behold they became BLACK people.

So all in all if you think about it, the actual RACE really can only be attributed to pigmentation and other identifiable characteristics, like hair texture, cranial shape and development, which would vary according to where you originate from on the planet. Obviously those closer to the Equator will be darker skinned due to the intensity of the Sun, versus those who live in extreme latitudes where the Sun's intensity is much weaker, and so the amount of melanin and/or pigmentation is significantly decreased. Same as feature development. Those in warmer climates tend to have wider noses than those in cold climates generally possess slimmer/smaller nostrils..this is a marked trait of evolution and adaptation to the environment


That said, it doesn't make sense to believe there are differences between races because race is nothing but a societal classification based upon ones appearances.


Cultural differences are another story. That's probably more likely to what you mean because it has to do with the mores, norms, values, and conditions under which you were raised and what you've associated with your entire life (for some).


That said, I find it interesting that America is a Cancer. You definitely see the negatives and positives. Like our insane need for security at all costs, attributing to our crazed materialism and boundless capitalism, the "American Dream", the need to mother other all nations but we can't even see what's going on in our own house, the inability to be objective about almost ANYTHING hidden by blind Patriotism, all of the family issues, "race" issues (though this isn't really a "Cancer" thing, it attributes to ones roots), obesity issues, etc.


If America was a Sag, it'd be interesting to see how the country's attitude towards immigration shifts- if it shifts at all

------------------
Sagittarius AC, Sun in Scorpio, Moon in Leo

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BLKFox
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posted July 12, 2008 01:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BLKFox     Edit/Delete Message
I believe race is more than a mere societal designation. I believe it is a "persuasion" and that it is way more than "skin deep". And cultural can be tied to race, or it can be learned (assimilation or acculturation).
--Europeans are assigned WAY too much power in the world which,I believe is the core reason why some European Americans find it difficult to embrace the idea of racial diversity. I believe the fear is, the myth of their superiority will be shattered.
If America was a Sag, I believe we'd be excited about each new group that arrived...we wouldn't hesitate to learn their native language, eat food from their country, and adopt their mode of dress.---it would be cool!!!!

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Seeing Stars 7.21
Knowflake

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From: New York
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posted July 12, 2008 02:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Seeing Stars 7.21     Edit/Delete Message
then we would have nothing to call our own. If we adopted to many foriegn beliefs and customs I dont think America would have ever risen to prominence. If one seeks to experience foriegn culture there is travel. Not sabotaging ones identity with that of many others. I dont think that too many other countries are trying be overly american.

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BLKFox
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posted July 12, 2008 09:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BLKFox     Edit/Delete Message
The San Francisco Bay Area has a "Sag" personality.---esp. in San Francisco, different cultures are embraced. It's wonderful---many people have their favorite Chinese, Mexican, Guatamalan, Ethiopian, Vietnamese restaurants...there are cultural festivals all year long..children can get educated at bi-lingual schools...the experience is in keeping with an expansive world view.
Please tell me what YOU think it means to be an American...we're a country of immigrants (This Land was THEIR Land), & now, more than ever, more people DO NOT have their roots in Europe.
American doesn't have ONE identity---that is the issue we've been struggling with...
It is NOT, baseball, apple pie, mom...& it never really was...

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koiflower
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Posts: 1258
From: Australia
Registered: Jun 2008

posted July 12, 2008 10:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for koiflower     Edit/Delete Message
European? Anglo-Saxon? Caucasian? assigned too much power in the world. Who is, sorry? I missed who you meant by that description, sorry BFox

Global warming is going to make Earth a level playing ground for everyone when we all start fighting to survive, anyway - a true definition of one big melting pot. Okay, sorry, that kinda just slipped out - must be Mars in Leo today or something


celtic polynesian leo/aries/sag koiflower

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koiflower
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Posts: 1258
From: Australia
Registered: Jun 2008

posted July 13, 2008 12:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for koiflower     Edit/Delete Message
okay on a more serious note now.....

quote:
Please tell me what YOU think it means to be an American...we're a country of immigrants (This Land was THEIR Land), & now, more than ever, more people DO NOT have their roots in Europe.

I think new countries have this struggle - an uncertainty of cultural identification. It was very easy before invasions, colonisations etc... Indigineous peoples lived deep and secure within their culture.

The pouring in of people from different lands to build a 'home' have left the ones being born into that new 'home' with a question of societal identity. Culture can come from the home and home roots: "My grandparents are Irish", "My grandparents are Italian". But stepping out into the greater environment leads to the question of "Who are we?"

It's okay to have your 'roots' in Europe, because that is the history of your country. It's okay to have your 'roots' in Africa, because that is the history of your country. It's okay to have your 'roots' in Italy, Ireland or Spain.

However, the confusion is probably the 'approach' to living in cultural activities, when there is such rich cultural diversity to draw from.

Use "Legislation" as a barometer of cultural diversity. The greater the diversity of culture, the more legislation required to live in that culture.

USA is the most legislated country in the world, and Australia is second. These are two relatively 'new' countries. Academics churn this topic over and over again "What is our cultural identity?" because these countries are still a progressive work in art.

New Zealand, a 'new' country as well, seems to embrace the indigenous culture and is pro-active in putting it to the forefront of its Anglo-Saxon dominated lifestyle. Although, the country has gone through 'growing pains' to get there.

I imagine Hawaii to integrate the 'western/asian' lifestyle, while acknowledging and up-holding the previous Hawaiian culture.

Japan are steeped in its own culture, with very little influence of others arriving on its shores. For those who have lived in Japan, there is a saying "That's very Japanese". Japanese folk seem very secure and proud of their 10,000 year old cultural history. Is Japan Taurean, by the way?

I'm guessing Hawaii would be strong in Fire, too.

Not sure about New Zealand or Australia Sun Signs - will have to look into those two for a good read

In regard to genetics, check out:
http://www.hapmap.org/originhaplotype.html.en

You may find you are genetically related closer to someone living Brazil, then to someone in your area of clanship.

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Dazzled
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From: It's a Fine City.
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posted July 13, 2008 03:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dazzled     Edit/Delete Message
I once asked on the boards about the outcome of my 3 month stay in America(which is still ongoing) because we do not exactly have a very good impression of America.
Sex, drugs, rock and roll, violence and all that. I was told to give America a chance.

I came here with an open mind and excited heart, furthermore I am a Cancerian so I thought perhaps this country would resonate with me.

Sad to say, I got disillusioned and grew to really dislike the "American" way of life. I won't expound on this too much right now because it's 3.30am and I'm sleepy.

If I was neutral about America before I came, my opinion now veers towards the negative.

Will I get lambasted for stating my piece?

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koiflower
Knowflake

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From: Australia
Registered: Jun 2008

posted July 13, 2008 05:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for koiflower     Edit/Delete Message

You ought not to be lambasted for your views, Dazzled.

You have the right of freedom of speech, for that is the democratic way

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Seeing Stars 7.21
Knowflake

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From: New York
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posted July 13, 2008 12:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Seeing Stars 7.21     Edit/Delete Message
Dazzled you are very right.

as much as I love my country I am in disgust with it. something needs to change and yes socially. If there is a country of sin, this is it. and most of the people in this country are are the very epitome of blind ignorance. The thing I hate most about my country is the corrupt value system. All these liberals spouting how they want the freedom to do anything. well you cant have the freedom unless you prove yourself responsible, and you have sadly failed at that. Yes I think this country needs to move backwards a bit. the need to adopt something more conservative.

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