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Author Topic:   Cranky Cap.....I feel your pisces man pain
willowing3
Knowflake

Posts: 16
From: crazyville, md
Registered: Jun 2006

posted December 07, 2006 02:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for willowing3     Edit/Delete Message
Been reading about your problems and my heart goes out to you. Two months ago I met my own pisces guy (and let me tell you, this pisces girl never thought she'd date a pisces guy). Instant connection and the definate feeling that we belong together. Well two days before our first date he got laid off from his job....very long story short, he is from CA and has been waiting for an opportunity to go back. SO he decided to go. At first I pulled away, because it would never occur to me to have a long distance relationship...I don't know if this is my gemini moon, but I tend to be an out of sight out of mind kinda gal. But, like Cranky Cap, I have only recently realized that I can't run away from the fact that I am totally in love with this guy and feel that we belong together...but he has things he needs to do in CA and we weren't quite together long enough to have that "chat"..and I'm a wuss:-)but my spidey senses tell me he feels the same...
SO, sorry for the long blabber, but CC, I related to your post...I have been crying, like riduculously crying for a week...and now that the gemini moon is passing and my tears are drying I feel what one of the other posters mentions...thoughts create action. I can see us together in my mind, and it is not a made up image...it just appears and something in my wacky pisces gut tells me that we WILL be together...it's just gonna take a minute or two.
wow, again, sorry to babble...I feel better.

One more random note....we both have Pisces Sun/Gemini Moon...gulp...if anyone could help with some future stuff, I have birthdates and would love the help.

Thanks again everyone for letting me vent. and Cranky Cap..hang in there....look deep inside, if you love him and feel that he is the one and he feels the same...well then like Swerve said...tell pisces guy how you feel, go on that grand adventure and don't look back....

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CrankyCap
Knowflake

Posts: 268
From: Powell, Ohio, United States
Registered: May 2006

posted December 07, 2006 02:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for CrankyCap     Edit/Delete Message
Wow Willow, it does sound like you're in a similar situation. I'm sorry to hear what a difficult time you're having, but I guess it is comforting to know that someone else can relate exactly to how you're feeling...and I know I can! Believe me, the tears have been rolling for me for two days now, and don't really show signs of stopping! There must be something going on lately...I've seen sooooo many threads on here about Pisces men lately. You'd think that the only males on the planet were Pisces! LOL...

So, has your Pisces already left for CA??? What state are you in? Have you talked to him at all since this decision was made?

I understand where you're coming from...I felt a connection to my Pisces the first instant I laid eyes on him. I wanted so badly to tell him the other night that I couldn't let him go, but I just couldn't utter the words...Now I haven't heard from him since Tuesday night. Don't know if he's been swirling this all around in his head, or if he thinks I'm angry with him...I have no idea what's going on or what he's thinking. He's got a Scorp moon, so when you put that with my Cap sun you've got two extremely cautious people who are all about self-protection...especially since we've both been badly hurt before.

That's interesting that you're both Pisces-Gems. My brother's a Pisces-Sag, and his girlfriend of almost a year is a Pisces too...although I don't know her moon. So, I do think that combo can work...hopefully one of the more advanced astrologers here can give you a little more insight.

I just feel like my head might explode right now. I'm trying to concentrate on work and things, but every time I close my eyes, he's in my head...

This is so hard...

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willowing3
Knowflake

Posts: 16
From: crazyville, md
Registered: Jun 2006

posted December 08, 2006 09:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for willowing3     Edit/Delete Message
Hey Cranky Cap.
Hope this morning finds you feeling a lil better, time does heal, each day seems to be a little easier for me. My guy left for CA last Thurs...we spent the night before together and I was so ok when he left that night, no tears, no pain...but the next day when it really hit home that he was driving away..well, that's when I started crying and up until yesterday it had been about a week straight of angsty tears. We've talked multiple times daily since he's left....it's hard...I am so happy to hear his voice, but so painful knowing how far he his....And I don't know if it is our shared pisces sun/gem moon, but I feel like we communicate despite being miles apart...one of those wacky ESP pisces things....so I just feel him missing me too. We'll see what the future holds...I feel that we will be together, but realistically, we'll just have to see how things work out.. But frankly, I'm sick of myself:-) with all the crying and pain, so I'm trying to get myself together....

SO, enough about my prob...did you decide to call your Pisces guy and speak from your heart? can't wait to hear the rest of the story............

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chrissymgreen
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Posts: 523
From: hurst, TX, USA
Registered: Sep 2004

posted December 08, 2006 03:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for chrissymgreen     Edit/Delete Message
Hello to both of you!

Pisces-Sag here...(28° Pisces Sun 6th, 27° Sag Moon 3rd)...willow, I wanted to point out that you & your man, being both Pisces/Gemmies, share the same soli-lunar cycle. This in addition to the compatibility of having the same Sun/Moon signs helps to create additional compatibility/intimacy. By soli-lunar cycle I just mean the relationship of the Sun to the Moon - you both have mutable Suns square mutable Moons, and it's the waxing square. See, me being a Pisces Sun/ Sag Moon means that I also have a mutable Sun square a mutable Moon (in the mutable houses, too) but my square is the waning square. Being on the same soli-lunar cycle generally means that you both have a shared sense of approach/attitude towards life.
http://www.khaldea.com/rudhyar/astroarticles/lunationbirthday.php

BTW, you guys (you & your guy I mean) are "B." on the list.

Incidentally with Suns & Moons conjunct in synastry this means in your composite the Sun & Moon will be in Pisces & Gem, respectively. With both the lights in a composite connecting back to your natals, this will feel like a relationship that really really *fits*.

CC, I just had to respond to your post because your story captured me and I feel your pain, sister. I even empathized with you on the whole Leo gal sub-plot (or however you want to say). I have this one Sun/Venus/Neptune Sag girlfriend with a retrograde Leo Mars and she's got tinges of your Leo gal pal's shall we say less positive traits. She's kinda competitive. Little easy. She's flirtatious with just about every man, even my own boyfriend. He's generally amused by her. Still, every now & then it bothers me a little. I trust my boyfriend and know that nothing that I could wildly conceive of would ever, ever happen but it bothers me that she would make flirtatious comments and do her little thing in his presence in the 1st place.

I took a peek at your natal and I saw a few things. Hope you don't mind me diving in...

With your Moon in the 8th conjunct the SN, you have a natural ability to tap into powerfully unconscious complexes, but you can also be taken over by them. Could be you struggle with this at times. The Moon (consciousness) in your chart is challenged by Saturn/NN opposing: ending and separations for you more than many others are fraught with anxiety. Letting go feels like death. With your Sun/Mars in Cap plus the Moon connected to Saturn and the nodes yours is a heavily Saturnine consciousness. Saturn's retrograde to boot. In your case, with Saturn rx & NN in 2nd this speaks to a basic insecurity that is really really hard to shake (Saturn rx in a natal chart always points to someone who is usually far far far too critical of themselves...they always seem to possess an inner critic who is a bit of a bully). What people tend to forget about Saturn is that it's one of the most important planets, as it points to what we need to do in this life on this physical plane--if we listen to it, it plants a concrete desire/need in us that we know we should fulfill. Unfortunately, with Saturn, we often get a lot of fear about that very thing, and so we have the typical Saturn suffering about needing to act but being afraid of taking the steps. Saturn has a lot to say not only about the house we find it in but about the house it rules. So in your chart we have Saturn in the 2nd (on some deep level, those with Saturn in the 2nd are often unsure of their own innate worth and value) and it rules the 6th: your Saturn lessons are about developing a real sense of security and an inner authority...and they are also about the 6th house need to perfect things, to make them useful, functional, efficient. The 6th house explores the relationship between what we are on the inside and what surrounds us on the outside - the correlation between the inner world of mind and feelings and the outer world of form and the body.

But I digress...if I'm not careful I'll get caught up and not get to everything I wanted to say, so moving on...your 7th ruler Uranus is conjunct Venus in the 4th: you deeply (IC/4th) need a partner who will respect your freedom (Uranus)...

I looked at your synastry between you & the Pisces and it's *strong*. I'm sorry, CC, I totally got wrapped up at work today and I took a break from this response and now I'm almost out of time. I'll keep it short and check back in later. Anyway, I wanted to list out the main indications I see of real connection / a strong bond:

• your NN/Saturn on his ascendant (nodes to angles is the most common aspect in long-term marriages {15+ years}, the evolutionary astrologer that I'm doing correspondence work with told me this)

• your Venus/Uranus is on his Moon

• your Mercury Neptune Vertex on his Juno/IC

• your Sun Mars on his Mars/node

• his Jupiter on your DC

• his Moon on your Sun

• your Juno on his Venus Vertex

• his Chiron on your MC

I also wanted to go into your progressions and transits, but I have so little time, rats to that. But off the top of my head I would say after taking a peek at your progressions that you have a lot of progressed Moon stuff going on right now (and the progressed Moon is ALWAYS where we are AT, in a big way) and one of the things I noticed was a progressed lunar aspect to Pluto, a hard one. This talks to me about what you are going through right now...with the whole relationship that is up in the air type of thing. Also, I think I saw that you have progressed Sun semisquare progressed Venus applying by 1°....I think I got that right. Anyway, big time relationship indicated there. He had prog Sun applying to conjunct prog Venus applying by 3° -- in 3 years this aspect will perfect, and it is a classic signature for major relationship. I'd say that the shots are good this relationship will stick, and if you do the work and don't shut down (like your Venus / Uranus is prone to do ---- I know all about this one deeply since I have Venus/NN in Aquarius trine Uranus on the AC in Libra). Plus you've got that whole Chiron square your ascendant thing going on....you really don't give yourself enough credit. This relationship has deep karma attached to it, I'd definitely give it a shot if I were you. He is in your life to help you heal (his Chiron on your MC).

More soon!

Chrissy

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Azalaksh
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Posts: 3463
From: New Brighton, MN, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted December 08, 2006 04:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
CC ~

Will you be seeing Pisces this weekend??
Best of luck, hon.....

Z

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CrankyCap
Knowflake

Posts: 268
From: Powell, Ohio, United States
Registered: May 2006

posted December 08, 2006 04:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for CrankyCap     Edit/Delete Message
Willow - Good. I'm so glad to hear that the two of you are still corresponding. Just take it one day at a time...but I know it's hard. Don't worry that you're talking too much about it, or crying too much...if you EVER need someone to talk to about it, just put a post up here and I'll be all ears for you. Promise.

Chrissy - OMG!!! Thank you so, so, SO much for doing all that research for me! I am so greatful, and I'll try my best to take that advice to heart. Can't tell you how true it is that I'm very, VERY hard on myself. Nothing I ever do is good enough for ME! But I will try...thank you so much again for reaching out to try and help me and Willow.

Zala - Yes, I will probably see him tonight, and I'm supposed to go to his office xmas party with him tomorrow night. I'm scared to death!!! I called him last night and we both "acted" like nothing was going on, but I think the tension is pretty obvious right now...we definitely need to talk and clear things up. He said he couldn't sleep at all on Wednesday night...I asked him why and he said he thought it was b/c he had been working out all week preparing for a ski trip and his muscles were sore. I told him that was strange because I usually sleep BETTER when I work out...he hesitated and said that he usually did to. So I don't know...maybe all of this is bothering him too...
I'll give you all an update when I have one. Thank you for the well wishes.

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willowing3
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Posts: 16
From: crazyville, md
Registered: Jun 2006

posted December 12, 2006 12:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for willowing3     Edit/Delete Message
Thanks for all the well wishes. Thanks Chrissy for the scoop, although honestly, it just makes me a little sadder, cause it is what I already knew. It's so hard when you know in your heart and gut that you are supposed to be with someone, but logic says, it can't be...at least right now.

Haven't talked as much with my pisces guy since he actually arrived in CA (in case I forgot to mention it, I'm in MD). He has a lot of stuff to do and I have to keep busy so I don't think about him every minute....so we haven't talked in a few days. I'm doing my Pisces mind over matter routine to try and get him out of my head.

So, Cranky Cap....cheer us up...tell us that things went really well with your pisces guy...can't wait to hear the scoop. and thanks again for the kind words.

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CrankyCap
Knowflake

Posts: 268
From: Powell, Ohio, United States
Registered: May 2006

posted December 12, 2006 02:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for CrankyCap     Edit/Delete Message
Willow, you're so sweet! I love your optimism! I was thinking about you this afternoon actually...it's funny how it's easier to be optimistic for someone else's situation, but for your own it's a different story.

So things are coming along ok for you right now? How did you leave things the last time you talked to your pisces? Are the two of you going to try and keep things going? Maybe take trips to see eachother occasionally?

I did talk to my pisces last weekend. I actually surprised myself and pretty much spilled my guts to him...told him everything that I had said to you guys on the forum. When I told him that I had already fallen very hard for him and that I was so very, very SCARED of the outcome of this situation, he said that he had fallen for me too and that we were in the same boat. He grabbed my hand and kissed it, and when I was done talking he said that the way I had worded everything was beautiful and sweet. He said that he didn't want to stop seeing me because of all this, but at the same time didn't think he'd be ready for us to live together in 3 months... When the conversation ended I just kind of let it go, and I felt better for a little while. We had a great weekend together, but he's sooooo weird! He runs hot and cold on me so much! Like I said, our weekend was great, but then he was acting aloof on Sunday morning when I left, and now I haven't heard from him since...

Like Chrissy said in her earlier post, I DO love freedom in my relationships, but only when I feel secure...with this guy, it seems like no matter what he says or does, I just can't shake the feeling that it could all disappear in a second... His hot and cold demeanor doesn't help with that either.

So, back to square one I guess. I'm not as emotional as I was last week, but I feel more melancholy and depressed. Kind of numb right now...

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chrissymgreen
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Posts: 523
From: hurst, TX, USA
Registered: Sep 2004

posted December 12, 2006 05:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for chrissymgreen     Edit/Delete Message
hey guys,

so sorry i didn't check back in earlier. ive been meaning to. just havent had the chance.

willow, im so sorry to hear that your situation is such as it is! i hope that you can find some peace & resolution in all this very, very soon.

cc, it's totally your man's venus in aqua, without a doubt. when i read over your most recent post just now, munching on chips from yet another holiday luncheon, i thought, this girl's pisces man has just GOT to have his venus in aqua (like myself). now i'm a pisces sun square a sag moon with pluto thrown in the mix as well (my sun opposes pluto exactly, moon squares both near exact) --- so i can be really intense, got that scorpio intensity even with no planets in scorpio. BUT -- i have that venus in aqua, just like your man...and even when i like someone very much i often act very cool about it. my boyfriend has the same venus / uranus conjunction in scorpio (on his ascendant) that you do (he was born a few months before you; he's a virgo sun) and he sometimes is baffled by me. it's just how the sign aquarius works when venus is placed there -- venus is for lack of a better way to put it how we act to attract...the sign our venus is placed in will often describe the very way we go about gaining the attentions of those we desire. with venus in aqua, the interest is in DISINTEREST. does that make sense?

AND he has moon square venus from the 3rd-6th house...this totally enhances the ... how should i put this... the objective approach, i guess id say. here we have linked together the 2 houses most directly connected to the processes of the logical and rational left brain. the tendency is for the mind to overwork. see, the 3rd likes to know a little about everything and the 6th likes to know everything about a few things. put these two together and here we have someone who wants to know as much as possible about everything. it's possible he analyzes everything out of existence. most positively, there is generally the pursuit of information (3) for the sake of using it practically (6).

i'd also say though that you should probably trust him...he means what he says. with saturn on the midheaven from the 9th side he is NOT going to be a ... man who dallies around. he means what he says too (he's got mercury / saturn with saturn most elevated). he's just not going to be ready to move in right away as he stated...because someone like him is going to need a bit more time. this is especially shown by his chiron in 7th almost exactly square his node (and mars) in 4th...your sun/mars hits his NN/mars so you activate his chiron, too (plus his chiron sits right on your MC). chiron in the 7th (i have this as well) is particularly prone to feeling unworthy in relationships...they don't feel they deserve to be loved. since his chiron / wound is directly connected to his nodes this DEEPLY felt. with this square between these houses, there is a likelihood that he projects unfinished business around a parent onto a partner. patterns established early in life (4) obscure our ability to see other people clearly (7). he's likely to have problems in establishing a home (4) with a partner (7).

i think, just give him some time...he'll be coming 'round (about the moving thing), i'm almost sure of it. just relax into your venus/uranus and enjoy the ride!

i will be checking back in tomorrow, ladies.


chrissy

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Azalaksh
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Posts: 3463
From: New Brighton, MN, USA
Registered: Nov 2004

posted December 12, 2006 06:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Azalaksh     Edit/Delete Message
chrissy ~

Acousticgod has a question in the astro forum.....

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willowing3
Knowflake

Posts: 16
From: crazyville, md
Registered: Jun 2006

posted December 13, 2006 11:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for willowing3     Edit/Delete Message
Holy Moly, my Pisces guy has Venus in Aquarius too...jeez. Luckily, I knew that, so I knew that when he acted like he didn't like me, he really did, he was just doing his disinterested aqua thing...but now that he's not around...arghh, how am I supposed to know if he is acting disinterested or really is?

Yikes, we really need to meet for a drink ladies!

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CrankyCap
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Posts: 268
From: Powell, Ohio, United States
Registered: May 2006

posted December 13, 2006 12:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for CrankyCap     Edit/Delete Message
Once again, you're right on the money Chrissy! Damn you're good! How long have you been studying astrology?

I figured it was that venus in aqua causing the detachment. I just can't believe that it's such a powerful influence. I would have thought he'd still be slightly more romantic with sun/moon in water signs...interesting. Does this mean it will take him forever to open up to me about how he feels?

Along those lines, you had mentioned earlier that due to my 7th house ruler being in Aquarius, I would require much freedom in my relationships. Do you think that could be why I often feel suffocated when I spend TOO much time with someone? For instance, when I'm with my Pisces I have a great time with him, and I usually spend the night, but first thing in the morning, all I want to do is get out of his house. I can't get out fast enough! I just need that time to myself. I was the same way when I first started seeing that Taurus. I used to wait until he fell asleep in the middle of the night, and I'd head home at 2 or 3 in the morning. He finally stopped that by picking me up one night, which freaked me out. I hate the idea of not having my own car to "escape" in if need be. Just curious as to whether or not that has anything to do with 7th house aqua...

Back to your last post - I think you may have really been onto something when you mentioned his square between the 4th & 7th houses, and how it projects unfinished business with a parent onto a partner. Mr. Pisces' dad is an extremely successful business man, and out of his 4 children (2 girls, and 2 boys), my Pisces was the one that he always felt would "do him justice." Pisces has always had that weight on his shoulders - "don't disappoint dad." In fact, last week when he first mentioned this Chicago thing, he even said how great it would be to show his dad that he can be just as successful as he was, and do it all on his own. He wants that pat on the back from his dad that I don't think he's ever gotten. He wants his dad to be proud of him, and in his mind a wildly successful business venture would do just that.

Interesting stuff...

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CrankyCap
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Posts: 268
From: Powell, Ohio, United States
Registered: May 2006

posted December 13, 2006 12:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for CrankyCap     Edit/Delete Message
Just read your response Willow...yeah, the Aqua venus thing can't really help us girls that are already dangling by threads! LOL...

Well, let's see...you're in in MD, I'm in OH, Chrissy's in TX...maybe we could all meet in Vegas sometime! You know, what happens in Vegas...

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chrissymgreen
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Posts: 523
From: hurst, TX, USA
Registered: Sep 2004

posted December 13, 2006 03:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for chrissymgreen     Edit/Delete Message

you know ive never been to vegas and ive always wanted to go! i sure do wish i had more girlfriends around here to go out with for a drink. i have one here (in texas) -- she's the one i mentioned that's like your ex leo gal pal, cc. she's the one who is flirtatious with just about every man she sees/talks to. you know what bugs me most about her? it's that she equates attention that she gets or does not get from men as a measure of her worth. i dont like that. or get it. she's a decent friend, though. she's just had a rough past (her dad...let's just say he was a terrible father and leave it at that, shall we?) and i see a goodness in her sometimes (plus she's bright and well-read and i like that). she's just really needy - she needs that attention from men or she'll wither (or she thinks she will, anyway). eventually she'll grow past that, i think. it's happening a bit for her now, kind of, with transiting uranus approaching her natal 1st house moon (15 pisces) & squaring her natal venus in 10 (15 sag).

anyway, moving on...i guess i've been studying astrology for about 10 years now. i haven't been formally trained, however. a couple years ago i discovered evolutionary astrology, and was lucky enough to find a professional EA astrologer/counselor who helped me through a very rough patch. since then ive taken some correspondence with her. it's helped me immensely with synthesis.

anyhow, to answer your question about aquarius on the DC and need for freedom .... you're right. your aquarian descendant speaks of a need to be free in relationships. you have a double signature, too, with the ruler of the 7th conjunct venus. venus is all about relating and with it conjunct uranus AND uranus as a 7th ruler this doubly implies that you will need to be free in a relationship. i can totally relate: i love my boyfriend and i enjoy being close with him, but sometimes i just ache for that alone time. i cannot wait until it's time to go so i can have some time to myself in the car listening to music & pondering things. you know how your mr pisces has moon 3rd square venus 6th and how i said that this points to someone who is always analyzing things, perhaps overmuch? well, i myself have sun 6th square moon 3rd so i know all about this over-analyzation bit. i can go to such extremes as to be almost ridiculous: i like to joke that the only real difference between the plays othello and hamlet is that the letters of the alphabet are arranged differently in each one.

which brings me to something that i thought about saying yesterday...later, after id posted my response. it's about you & mr pisces and his potential move to chicago in the spring. i took a look at his transits and progressions and it looks like a move is a possibility for him at some point next year or the year after. this is because i see that transiting uranus will be hitting his DC (18 pisces) sometime next year, subsequently squaring his MC/IC axis (17 Gem/17 Sag) at around the same time. it's the uranus square to the mc/ic axis that most indicates a potential shift in home base. this is what intrigues me though: eventually uranus will conjunct his 7th house mercury, and mercury is his 10th ruler. so i think when uranus hits merc prolly in early 2008 this is when his career could take off...perhaps he'll get that super big break he's looking for.

also, i see that his progressed mercury is at 15 pisces (mercury must have gone retrograde right after his birth...it is now direct by progression) and his progressed saturn is at 15 gem. so next year...i think it's in the spring, transiting uranus will conjunct prog mercury (natal 10th ruler) and at the same time squaring prog saturn (on his natal 10th cusp from the 9th side). this says to me that yea, his opportunity could come as early as the spring of 07. so he may be moving around then.


HOWEVER, you shouldnt fret, because i do see this: next spring his progressed chiron (in natal 7th) will have JUST hit his progressed descendant. progressed planets hitting progressed angles DOMINATE the life...they ALWAYS manifest in the life in some way. prog chiron on prog DC says to me that he is going to have opportunities for healing thru relationship. in his relationship with you, undoubtedly. i think even if he does move (as long as you stay open to the possibilities with him) that you guys will be able to find a way to be together. ohio & chicago are not that far apart. and just think how neat it will be to take the train or bus or whatever into the city and visit with him!

i am unlike a lot of people, i think, in that i believe long distance relationships CAN and DO work. i'm in one myself -- you know the boyfriend i mentioned? ive been seeing him since may 2003, and just this summer (of 06) he moved to austin for a job. im in the dfw area (dallas-fort worth)...he's from here (fw) originally. it's about a 3 hour drive to austin from here, so i just take a long 4 day weekend once a month to go and see him...and about once a month he comes here and we get to visit then, too. so i guess i see him on average twice a month for a weekend or a little longer each time. this totally works for me: my venus/NN in aquarius with ruler uranus in libra conjunct my libra ascendant loves it. i freakin love it. eventually perhaps i'll move down to austin...maybe. i am very happy with the way things are now, though.

oh yeah! about the sun/moon in water vs venus in aqua...remember no matter how sensitive someone with the lights in water can be, if theyve got venus in aquarius (especially with an aqua venus in the 6th) they will at times appear to be disinterested even when ALL they can think about is that special someone.

before i forget: i wanted to say that between your charts, with his venus in aqua and your venus conjunct uranus this is a point of compatibility. you actually have so many deep contacts between you that i can't see you guys not winding up together (if you both can let it, that is).


here's to us, ladies! (just imagine me raising a martini in toast here.)

chrissy

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willowing3
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Posts: 16
From: crazyville, md
Registered: Jun 2006

posted December 14, 2006 10:08 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for willowing3     Edit/Delete Message
Morning Ladies...I am so down for that drink in Vegas.....never been and just looking for a good excuse!

So, Chrissy, would it be too much to ask to take a look at me and my pisces guys charts? Your scoop for Cranky Cap is great. If so, I am 3/3/71 Westminster, MD at 8:09am. Mr Pisces is 3/1/74 Fairfield, CA at 9pm. If you don't have time, I totally understand, but if so, I would love your thoughts on our synastry. Thanks!

Hope all is well Cranky cap.....Chrissy's words make a lot of sense...! Off to work, talk to ya soon ladies

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chrissymgreen
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Posts: 523
From: hurst, TX, USA
Registered: Sep 2004

posted December 14, 2006 10:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for chrissymgreen     Edit/Delete Message
hey willow,

i will totally take a look for you later today! i'll try and respond before the day's out. should have plenty of time this afternoon. i work for a college and this is my last week of work for the year...ill have 3 weeks off starting tomorrow afternoon. im excited. the air around here is very relaxed, and tho i have one project im trying to get finished, it's really not much and i hope to be done by lunch-ish.


anyway, ill be back later on today with some info for you!


c

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CrankyCap
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Posts: 268
From: Powell, Ohio, United States
Registered: May 2006

posted December 14, 2006 11:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for CrankyCap     Edit/Delete Message
LMAO!!! Chrissy, you sound JUST like me! That's exactly what I do - get in the car, put on some tunes and ponder life! Hahaha...I've put soooo many miles on my cars that way...it's like therapy to me. I know what you're saying about the long distance thing too - I had my moments of loving it too when I was with the Taurus. It's actually kind of nice to know that you have a boyfriend, but you really don't really have to "deal" with a boyfriend. It probably would have worked out fine with me had I actually TRUSTED the guy, but that's a different story... Maybe the Pisces will be different...

Your friend does sound a lot like my Leo friend - she has MAJOR father issues as well, and it didn't help her to have a mother that bashed men in front of her her entire life. Most of my closest girlfriends have either moved away or married, so I've kind of hung on to the Leo partially because there aren't many other single girls around for me to hang out with. Sounds a bit selfish, but what can you do? BTW, what are the rest of your placements Chrissy? So far, I've figured Libra Asc, Pisces Sun, and Sag moon right?

Willow - I was wondering when you were going to give up your birth info! Chrissy has soooo much knowledge, and it's so kind of her to do all the research for us. It's MUCH appreciated Chrissy!

Well, if none of us have ever been to Vegas...we really should go!!! I think that would be such a good time. Gamble a little, get to know each other, have a few drinks, AND get a tan! LOL...honestly ladies, I'd be down if you are!

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chrissymgreen
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Posts: 523
From: hurst, TX, USA
Registered: Sep 2004

posted December 14, 2006 01:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for chrissymgreen     Edit/Delete Message
dear willow,

i took a look-see at your synastry with mr pisces number 2 (hehe) and it indeed is also very strong. i'll let you girls in on a little secret (or well, it's not really a secret, i'm just into sounding dramatic this morning)...the main things i look for in synastry are:

--angular contacts:

When planets and angles get together between charts, there are sparks, even with a tough old guy like Saturn. (Saturn on another's angle can feel very, very cosy and familiar - at first). The angles are not just a measurement, they are very much alive and very sensitive to others' planetary energies. Whatever hits an angle goes directly into our being. The angles are the most important consideration in a synastry--they are what is most immediately felt between two people. Planets to angles are the first things you look for. (The second thing you look for is contacts between angle rulers.) You can have a not-very-interesting synastry between two people, but if there is a lot of angle contact they will be very responsive to one another. Angles are kind of sexy--they're sensitive and receptive.

--vertex contacts

I've watched the vertex axis in charts for a while now, never really getting a handle on it. I didn't find that it brought 'fated encounters' necessarily, but that it opened doors of opportunity--and sometimes it opened doors where that fated encounter could come walking in, if the person cooperated. But it wasn't until I met the EA counselor (who really made sense of it for me) that I stared to get a handle on it. She presented the vertex/anti-vertex as an alternate Asc/Desc axis (as most do). But where the usual Asc/Desc axis has to do with identity (self versus other) in the here and now, the vertex/anti-vertex is an axis of spiritual identity. The vertex is the ascendant of the integrated self, and a place of spiritual power. This is why the encounters seem 'fated'. It operates on the level of synchronicities, and in any encounter or event where the soul is struggling towards integration. It's where we are trying to become our best self in the deepest way.

What I've found is that aspects to the vertex, particularly the conjunction, bring tremendous opportunities for growth. The odd thing is that they aren't always on the surface. You have to keep your eyes and ears open, and follow your truth, or they'll pass you by. I look for synchronicities when the vertex is active, or anything that seems to connect at a deep level.

From what I've seen, it's the anti-vertex that's the power point in terms of relationships. That's the place that we'll experience fated encounters. I don't throw around the term 'soul mate' but you'll find conjunctions to the anti-vertex signify deep, deep connections between people. They may not last forever, but these anti-vertex relationships always aid a person in their spiritual growth. I haven't seen enough charts to really be certain, but I have seen it active in the 'love at first sight' phenomenon.

For vertex/anti-vertex I look at conjunctions only. I haven't found any other aspects to be significant.

As for who is affected more, it isn't so much that the vertex axis person is affected more by the relationship, but that the vertex person is particularly sensitive/receptive towards that particular planetary energy of the partner, and usually feels that energy as crucial to his/her becoming whole. It's a very powerful contact, but like all aspects alone it is no indicator of relationship longevity. Usually, though, even long after the relationship is over, the vertex person will feel that something good came out of it.

--contacts between outer planets (uranus, neptune, pluto) to inner planets

The relationship planets of one chart (Sun, Moon, Venus, Mars) making tight aspects to the outer planets in another chart usually brings an intense transforming energy to the relationship.

--nodal contacts

In general, after a few years of studying them, I've found that the nodes in synastry are at least as important as the Moon. Remember that the nodes are lunar nodes, and as such are symbols of the evolving consciousness. When there are strong interchart aspects with the nodes, particularly conjunctions, the node person will feel that the planet person is very much a part of 'where I'm coming from' (south node) or 'where I'm headed' (north node). The reaction of the nodal person is instinctive and emotional, and there seems to be an element of need involved, which is very lunar. It's almost as though, in synastry, the nodes are the open arms of the Moon. Contacts to the nodal rulers are important, but don't seem to have the same emotional impact.

--chiron contacts

The way Chiron seems to work in synastry is that the Chiron person will feel any kind of 'wounding' the other person feels in regards to the planet involved. Chiron is extremely empathetic that way. All Chiron placements reflect a unique gift, a unique way to self-expression, that we may give to the world around us. Most Chiron-influenced relationships are highly charged, with potential for mutual disappointment and wounding but also incredible empathy, the deepest empathy that you could ever imagine -- remember they myth of Chiron? Chiron gave his immortality for his friend Prometheus, who had been bound to a stake on Mount Kaukasos where an eagle was set to feed upon his ever-regenerating liver or heart (depending on version).

Chiron represents the limitations we feel between our everyday 'reality' and our higher purpose. It's the place we feel we're locked out from divine connection--and as such it becomes the very place where we can connect. I think it's very difficult to interpret Chiron correctly unless you look at it as a part of a story. Saturn represents the limits of our material reality; our Saturn lessons are our limitations in this life and our necessary 'this world' duties, lessons we have to literally, physically incorporate into this world/life. On the other hand, we have the other-worldly evolutionary influence of the outer planets, which represent our spiritual imperitives. Chiron represents the gate between our divine impetus and our Saturn realities, the place where we can take our spiritual trials/lessons and bring them into the world in a concrete way. (Sometimes this is wonderful, sometimes painful.) Thus it represents an outlet both for divine and material world energies to work together. The fact that Chiron was a centaur, half animal, half divine--represents this. Chiron had an unhealable wound (representing the constant struggle between the divine and the unawakened material energies)but he was also a great healer and teacher.

--saturn contacts

Over the years I've discovered that Saturn has a lot to say about a choice of partner for both sexes. Saturn by transit or progression or in a chart comparison over relationship planets can act just like Mars (in disguise--until his agenda comes out later). Saturn in his good light can act responsible and committed in relationship. In his bad light, he is repressive and restricting. In a relationship, you can get one and then the other, or a bit of both. The energy will always reflect the natal Saturn position and needs/fears, and getting into these Saturn relationships is usually a passionate business at first.

Saturn represents what we need to do in this world and practical lessons we need to learn--often, those involve partnership, and Saturn will go after those partnerships with great force.

Saturn can almost be thought of as a grown-up Mars (when he's behaving). We get what we want through Mars, but what we do with it once we get it is Saturn's domain. You can see how this stretches to relationships.

--juno contacts

Juno relates to committment and expectations and has some of the qualities of Venus in that (at its best) is about appreciation and respect. Usually, conjunctions to Juno work very well in synastry--Juno greatly appreciates that planetary quality in the other. When Juno opposes or squares a planet, Juno needs to incorporate that planetary quality into its relationship 'landscape'. With Uranus, for example, the lessons would be about freedom within relationship; with Saturn, committment issues would be focal.

There are two things I can say for certain about Juno. One, she is certainly active by progression and transit in marriages and serious partnerships, oddly enough, especially in couples older than 30. She is active both at the time of the meeting and at the time of the marriage.

The other thing is that Juno has a lot to do with partnership expectations and projections. Sometimes when Juno is very prominent in a chart, the person has a hard time seeing the partner for who he or she really is.


--soli-lunar phase

The other thing that may not be noticed often in synastry, but which I think is vital, is the soli-lunar phase. If the soli-lunar cycles are radically different, and let's use the example of a balsamic Moon paired with a new Moon person...this would show a difference in the entire approach to life itself, and this is something that usually is very difficult to resolve.

###############################################

So, willow, the primary indications of intensity and compatibility between your charts are, as I see them:

• Your soli-lunar cycle is the same, as you both have Pisces Suns / Gemini Moons. This, as I mentioned before, also creates a composite chart between you two which would have a Pisces Sun & Gem Moon. The sense of 'couple-ness' is quite strong here.

• His Chiron/vertex is conjunct your ascendant, his anti-vertex on your descendant.

• Your vertex / Uranus is on his ascendant; your anti-vertex / Chiron is on his descendant. His Pluto also happens to oppose your Chiron -- Pluto's polarity point is a strong point of interest. (The planet Pluto, by house, sign, and planetary aspects reflects the evolutionary journey of the soul and the past life choices/conditions of its development. It indicates what we are most used to and comfortable with subconsciously and will revert to for emotional security purposes. The actual bottom line purpose of this incarnation is reflected in the Pluto polarity point, i.e. the opposite house and sign.)

• His Mercury / Jupiter is conjunct your NN.

• Your flipped AC/DC axes creates a strong attraction.

• His NN is on your Mars.

• Your Moon/Juno is conjunct his Mars -- Moon/Mars contacts between people generate a sexual heat that is hard to ignore.

There is of course more, there always is. But these are the primary indications of a strong pull between you two, and a karma to work out together. I have not looked at either of your progressions or your directions, but I promise to do so soon. Perhaps we can get an idea of why you came together (which will be partly revealed by your progressed charts) and what's in store (progressions, directions, transits). I hope this helps at least a little bit. I know it can be extremely painful when a relationship such as this one obviously was ends / shifts / changes. It's never easy, even when you're not strongly connected with someone! I would, if I were you, take a particularly close look at his Saturn/SN with the Moon not far off (Saturn/SN can indicate a past life where there was fear or limitation, problems with authority...in 9th this has something to do with beliefs/faith/religion). This is a tough signature, and your Mars sits right on his NN, where he has no planets. This too is tough -- you are leading him forward, kicking and screaming no doubt, by your actions / beliefs. This is very intense, as Mars is your chart ruler. An intense synastry, no doubt about that.

###############################################

CC, yep, I've put far too many miles on my car taking my little "drives". And you're right -- I love the fact that I have a boyfriend but I don't have to deal with one directly. It just gets too messy for me. I'm lucky enough to be involved with someone who completely understands this about me. We both have Uranus-ascendant conjunctions (though his is joined by Venus) and so I think this creates a compatible approach to life. I know he enjoys our arrangement as much as I do.

Trust is going to be a big issue for you, with your Pluto/IC. Plus your Saturn rx / NN conjunction in the 2nd (2nd house is all about security) is particularly intense. The place where Saturn lies in our charts is often a big ouch; with Saturn retrograde it becomes a very big ouch. With the nodes connected to that ouch, it becomes amplified even more. One of your big lessons in life is to develop an inner security that others can't take away.

I understand about hanging on to the Leo. I keep Nikki in my life because she has many redeeming qualities even given the nature of her competitiveness and insecurity. Heck, we're all a little insecure. Plus I have to admit, she's close to my home / work, and she has plenty of free time so we get to go do girlie things together (all of my other girlfriends are long distance). I'm not really a girlie girl but I like having a girlfriend I can go get a pint with, or go CD or book shopping with. Plus she's amenable to my interest in Buddhism. She attended temple with me last week and really liked it. I got her interested in signing up for a course on letting go of guilt as well. This is nice for me as I don't really have anyone to share this with. Gordon -- my boyfriend -- has some amount of interest but as he's not in my immediate area we don't attend temple together or anything. I've been meaning to find a Mahayana Buddhist center down in Austin so we can go together sometime.

As for my placements, I'm a visual person and I like to SEE a chart, so I've included an image of my chart below!

We definitely need to meet in Vegas. Maybe in the spring...! Early spring would perhaps be best...to avoid the tourist season. Would Feb or March do so? I guess it's probably always tourist season in Vegas. At any rate, great idea! I'm totally game.


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willowing3
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Posts: 16
From: crazyville, md
Registered: Jun 2006

posted December 14, 2006 01:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for willowing3     Edit/Delete Message
Chrissy...you rock. Thanks so much, that must have taken some time to write that out...appreciate it. I've done some very very amateur synastry myself from our charts on astro.com...and I know we have a lot of good stuff....I am curious about this that you wrote..'This too is tough -- you are leading him forward, kicking and screaming no doubt, by your actions / beliefs. " SO, my problem of late is does he feel the same way that I do..ie. does he feel this pull between us, this urge that we are supposed to be together, this wacky love for me that I feel for him? Based on your statement, I might think not....I'll be curious to see what you have to say about the future...

I'm so feeling the ladies love....how random would it be to meet up and carry on in vegas and talk astrology..cause I don't know about you all, but I dont' have anyone in my world to really gush about astrology with...hence my love of this forum!

K, back to work, thanks again!

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chrissymgreen
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Posts: 523
From: hurst, TX, USA
Registered: Sep 2004

posted December 14, 2006 02:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for chrissymgreen     Edit/Delete Message
dear willow, don't fret -- i do think he feels the attraction or pull just as strong as you do. your synastry is strong and it goes both ways. one particularly intense connection is his chiron/vertex/descendant being conjunct your ascendant/anti-vertex/chiron. it used to be thought that angles didn't influence planets in synastry, that they (angles) just absorbed the planetary energy of others (in other words, having someone's venus conjunct your ascendant would cause the ascendant person to feel venus' energy but not the other way around). i firmly believe now though that this is just not the case. the planet person does FEEL the ascendant energy -- the planet person is DEEPLY affected. i can personally attest to this as i have met several pisces ascendant men in the past few years and the attraction and appeal was instant on my end. i talked about this with the EA counselor, and she says that what the ascendant (or other angle) person ends up doing is shining their angle light onto the planet in question. so your ascendant is shining its light onto his chiron and vertex. this is incredibly intense for him -- and probably makes him feel unbearably empathetic toward you. not only that, the vertex/ac connection goes both ways. you've got a double whammy going on there.

the other thing that’s noticeable here is that his chiron (and vertex) is conjunct your anti-vertex (and ascendant, chiron) . this means that he identified deeply with your wounding in a very spiritual sense. Your wound was at the essence of his being, and it caused an intense identification.

with him having no planets on his nn and saturn conjunct the sn he needs more than those with planets conjunct the nn to focus on his nn lessons (people with planets conjunct the nn often have a need to re-capture or re-claim their south nodes). having saturn conjunct the sn is a big ouch, and he's prone to sticking with his sn with a planet there. this is why your mars on his nn probably creates a fear in him. he might be afraid of the lessons you have to teach him, because instinctively he's gonna know this means he has to deal with the ouch saturn/sn causes.

i took a look at his progressions, and he has the prog sun in hard aspect with prog venus -- it's clear he has relationship issues on his mind. this (yous) was a pretty important relationship to him, id gather.

what i am seeing is that he's going thru a very rough time -- trans pluto is on his north node, and he probably needed the move back out to cali in order to gain a spiritual perspective on your connection to him. trans pluto conjunctions can often feel like we're being buried alive -- there's no place to get air. in addition, one thing astrology hardly ever talks about is that you must consider the natal position of the transiting planet. by this i mean that since trans pluto is on his nn, we must look at his natal pluto & the house pluto rules to see where he's feeling the effects of this pluto transit. we can see that he has pluto exactly conjunct his ascendant -- this pluto transit is affecting his very sense of self. he probably doesn't know who he is anymore. in addition, pluto rules his 2nd so he's also probably feeling insecure at this time.

in addition to trans pluto, we can see that he has trans uranus on his sun and squaring his natal moon. this is changing his sense of self, his operating "I", if you will.

i think it's incredibly fascinating to see that you both have the same t-square -- moon opposite neptune with sun squaring both. sheesh, and i thought gordon and i had incredibly similar charts with our uranus conjunct ascendant and chiron on descendant opposing. with the moon opposite neptune you both have the tendency to lose yourself in relationships, and you're both being hit pretty freaking hard too with transiting uranus on each of your suns, squaring both moons and both neptunes. wow. there is an eternal longing with (natal) moon/neptune, an ever-hungry emptiness for a fulfilment that will never occur, because the real ‘relationship’ that must develop is a spiritual one. one must acknowledge that one’s deepest and most intense desire is to give. until that happens, one can wander for years looking for a satisfaction that does not exist. moon/neptune is highly sensitive, almost psychic, and can sense what they need long before they see it coming. also, they can have an idealized sense of who others really are—they are always doing things ‘for the best’ without consulting the other person. when the boundaries get slippery, they get scared, because they can’t fathom what they feel. this is hard on the partner, who never knows quite what’s going on.

i believe that the element of spiritual development in this relationship with mr pisces number 2 may not have been understood properly, and it's possible his move was necessary in order to gain perspective.

i will have to put this on hold for now, willow, but i will be back to check in later, probably tomorrow or this evening. you take care of yourself -- all right?

c

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willowing3
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Posts: 16
From: crazyville, md
Registered: Jun 2006

posted December 14, 2006 06:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for willowing3     Edit/Delete Message
Chrissy..wow. Like Cranky cap, I bow down to you.:-) You are right on...he lost his job three days before we met, prior to that he had been getting his act together, and at first he was positive that he could get another job, but when he couldn't..well, I think he lost himself. And off to Cali he went. We IM'd last night and I asked him if it was like he rememberd, and he said no, not even close...so I'm thinking even though he is still settling in..he's not happy. and still a little lost. anyway. I'm trying to give him some space..that's my prob with the aqua venus...he's so detached...should I be detached too? cause I have this whole pride thing going on (not my best quality, I knwo) that makes me not want to call or contact him and let him come to me? but jeez, who knows, I will never claim to be know men..duh, that's why I'm here.

Thanks again.....anything you have to give about this situation I am eternally grateful....Cranky Cap...how are things with your pisces...doing ok?

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CrankyCap
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Posts: 268
From: Powell, Ohio, United States
Registered: May 2006

posted December 14, 2006 07:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for CrankyCap     Edit/Delete Message
Willow - I'm in the EXACT same boat as you with that darn Aqua venus! That is going to be such a challenge for me. Like I had said in an earlier post, and Chrissy confirmed, trust is a big problem for me to begin with, and although I know it's MY problem, his detachment makes me feel a lot less secure. At the beginning of the week for example, he pulled away for a couple of days. I'm the same way you are, in that my pride tells me I should pull away too...but I can only last so long. I saw him Sunday morning, didn't talk to him on Sunday night, or Monday night, then by 9 PM on Tuesday I couldn't take it anymore. I start to get crazy thoughts running through my head and my stomach twists up in knots...BIG problem, and I know I need to work on it. Anyway, when I talked to him on Tuesday he said he felt sick to his stomach and thought he ate something that upset him...he actually thought he might be sick so he jumped off the phone pretty quickly. I still felt uneasy yesterday...but when he called last night everything seemed fine. He had stayed home from work since he was so sick the night before, but said he was feeling a little better. He said that if we didn't get together tonight (Thursday), we definitely had to do something Friday since he hadn't seen me all week. Well, HELLO??? He could have called me right? LOL...I just know that little dragon of a scorpion that lurks in me is NOT going to have an easy time dealing with that water-bearing venus! Definitely a challenge...At least you and I have each other and Chrissy to go to for comfort now!

As far as our earlier talks about a possible Vegas trip go...I think we should do it!!! It sounds like so much fun! I think it would be exciting and a bit spontaneous to meet up with a couple of pen pals there! And you're right, I don't have many people I can discuss astrology with either...well, actually no one! LOL...plus I think Chrissy could teach us a lot!

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chrissymgreen
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Posts: 523
From: hurst, TX, USA
Registered: Sep 2004

posted December 15, 2006 12:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for chrissymgreen     Edit/Delete Message
i think it's a universal problem, actually. men being hard to figure out, that is.

this happened not that long ago: gordon was in town for thanksgiving weekend and we got together the friday after thanksgiving day. it was a very lovely visit -- we saw the fountain, went and had beer, did some shopping. my car got broken into that night and so we stayed up all night and took it into the garage in the morning and spent most of that saturday waiting on it, walking in the park, drinking more beer (but not at the park), eating tacos from some taco stand near TCU that's really good. even with all that niceness, and goofiness, so on and so forth...i couldn't help getting worked up when, having gotten excited about the coming holidays and the chance to come visit him down in austin for a whole week, i started talking enthusiastically about aforementioned trip -- and he gets all virgo on me and starts talking schedules. immediately i sort of detached myself and started worrying about it, i just get to where i think to myself, "Eff it all! Who needs this crap?!". Know what I mean? it's my saturn in the 8th square venus/nn in 5th, i just know it. i have a deep-seated fear of intimacy and every little reason i can think of to detach -- like telling myself he doesn't care because he wants to talk schedules instead of being excited about seeing me -- i exploit to the hilt. i just can't help myself. the EA counselor i was seeing said that i don't know what i have to offer because i don't know what i bring to the table in terms of relationships. she said: "The problem of not knowing what one brings to the table in terms of relationship stems from the feeling that one is not inherently worthy of being given anything, just for being one’s self. One feels that one should earn everything that one is given. While this is a noble sentiment for getting on in the world, it blocks the generous and spontaneous exchange one has in relationship, where by its very definition, one should not have to earn anything—one should simply be loved and admired for who one is. It also lends one to have ‘accounts’ in relationships—I gave you this much, so you owe me that much." this is beyond true -- i can't even begin to go into how true it is here. i'm working on it, though! muddling through somehow. i do know this: relationships that push our buttons, the buttons that hurt or buttons we don't want being pushed are often the very relationships we NEED to be in, because they teach us much if we let them.

so when i detached after he got all virgo on me, he immediately saw i was hurt. it's a funny thing about gordon -- when i think i am being implacable and hard to figure out and going inside my own brain for my own space where nobody can hurt me...gordon dives right in, he knows me. it's like he's inside, i can't hide from him (sheesh, that sounds cheesy, and i hate cheese). it's true though, he picks up on it right away and so of course he made the usual apologies and insisted i e-mail him with all the details. he even brought it up again right before we parted ways that weekend. i, of course, have not e-mailed him with the dates at all. i'm too proud.

when i said i was working on it, i didnt mean i was making a whole lot of progress, as you both can see...

so at any rate -- i know where you ladies are coming from!

my personal e-mail is green.chrissy@gmail.com. i'd like it if we could all keep in touch, and really plan that vegas trip for maybe early spring or something.

i have to jet now...but let's please keep in touch!


c

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