posted August 10, 2014 10:46 AM            

Recently, I have been internalising more, so I guess that is some form of management, in as much as I do not hurt others as often by exploding.
I have also made great progress in understanding my triggers, and in separating them from the reality of the situation, but it is exhausting to have to juggle all the time when I come into contact with the world.

I feel like hiding away all the time just to protect myself, yet at the same time, I long to engage more with others. I am just so afraid to, in case it hurts me and I can't manage it.

I have come a very long way from my days of active BPD, but it really is a constant battle not to slip again, and give into the old fears.

Can anyone spot anything in my chart that I may be able to utilise to combat this tendency?

Are there reasons why self-soothing is so difficult?

I would be very grateful for help.
Any advice I can use on this will undoubtedly change my life.

Here is my chart:

posted August 11, 2014 06:32 AM            

Mars conj. Saturn conj. Pluto conj. AC, sq. Venus.

It's kind of obvious now really.
Venus is the key here, because these tendencies only manifest in relationships.
I'm pretty balanced and productive on my own.

It's funny, these aspects hint to me of my Chiron in H7.

I have more work to do.
I don't think there are any energies in my chart at my disposal that are powerful enough to overcome this, so I must find a way to always use this energy for the positive.
Instead of it bursting out or tunnelling in.

posted August 11, 2014 08:36 PM            

With Saturn on your ASC you are probably very hard on yourself, and always having self defeating thoughts. Feeling overly critical of your looks and how others are perceiving you. With Saturn and Pluto there, you might come across as cold or intimidating to others, which only adds to you being self conscious. Also, your 12th house Moon probably makes it difficult to really open up to others for fear that they won't understand you or like you. This placement also makes you empathetic of other's feelings, and you may even have some clairvoyant tendencies. Especially in dreams. It seems like everyone I know with 12th house placements has issues that they hide from everyone else, which makes it difficult for others to relate, because they don't know what the problem is. My sister has this placement, and her Moon also falls in my 12th. She hides her negative emotions, almost like she doesn't want to burden anyone with her problems, but it causes a lot of issues in relating to her in an authentic way. It's the natural tendency of the 12th house person to internalize things, and suffer alone, because they don't think others will understand.

Self awareness is a big first step, because you can't improve yourself if you are unwilling to acknowledge that there is a problem. You are obviously making a genuine effort towards self improvement, and setting that goal is half of the battle. You would probably benefit from meditation, or at least taking time each day to reflect on things. Try to focus on the positive interactions with people, and things that you are grateful for, and make an effort to not only see the negative side of things. Also, try to open up about your struggles to those that you feel that you can trust. They will probably be a lot more understanding and not as judgmental as you might expect, and feel closer to you once you let your guard down.

I saw your other thread apologizing for past behavior, so obviously you are on the right track. It takes a big person to admit that they've acted harshly towards others, and take ownership of their actions. Very few people are willing to do that, so kudos to you!

posted August 12, 2014 04:22 AM            

thank you so much for your insight here.
Yes, it is true that I do internalise for the most part.
I was more impulsive when I was younger and just rode the aggression horse whenever it bolted - I was so selfish - I thought, well, this is me, no one is going to change me, and the world can go to hell anyway.
I was so unevolved. I came from a very dark place.
But as I matured my conscience grew, and I realised I was becoming the very darkness that had hurt me, so I decided to change, and have been changing ever since.

I do actually follow a meditative practice now, and it helps immensely, so that is very good advice.
Writing, playing music is also an outlet that has been priceless, along with poetry and journaling.
I can verbalise better now too, and can speak more calmly about emotions.

But yes, what inspired this thread was that sometimes I do have "break-through" aggression. I could simply be talking about something I am passionate about (and I have a LOT of passion), and before I know it I'm rallying against the whole world, and even the person who has had the decency to sit through my sermon in the first place.
It is like everything that was ever repressed hops on the back of my passionate "speech" and it turns into a full scale war.

I catch myself most of the time, but it takes all my strength sometimes to control the power of my aggression. It is very tiring.

Yes I am hard on myself, and of course, when the aggression erupts, I am the first to berate myself, and can do for years over outbursts that others have long forgotten.

It's not all bad though, I have done a huge amount of work in therapy, and I am vastly improved from a few years ago. But the battle goes on.

I think I need more self-soothing strategies.
I have accepted that my passion is not bad unless it harms, so I just need to get better at soothing myself when the passion is devolving into wayward aggression - when it is just dispelling pent-up energy (and there is a LOT).

posted August 12, 2014 07:27 AM            

It is easy for you to escape into the world of thought leaving all else behind. Even your moon (Virgo) is about analyzing one emotion over another until they really do not know if they were angry or acting on impulses.
Jupiter in Scorpio is about getting to the bottom of things. And this is what you do most every day. Sometimes this more than anything else causes you grief. As we expose our own underbelly, others can be affected. We are simply exploring ourselves when out of nowhere … someone objects. How is this possible? Scorpio touches everyone. It rules other peoples finances but I think it really is about what other people care about and finances make up a great deal. It’s an oversimplification.

Venus in Capricorn gives you a base but in this placement far-fetched ideas about love, sex and money come to mind. Better to live in your head than transition to reality. I get the voice of the sea. Everywhere I Iook in this chart I see water over air or air over water. And without an outlet, this is what makes up hurricanes and then tornadoes. Right now you have Pluto about to go over your Venus, Saturn has been transiting your Jupiter and everything is headed for your moon in a couple of months. With all the abilities you have to reach beneath the surface and grasp the very depths of our souls… no wonder you are having quandaries.
Uranus has been opposing your Saturn (within a couple of degrees) and this aspect ALONE would be enough to cause trouble to a weaker soul. You …You can handle what most people could not fathom. And that says a lot. If you spew over someone… take note… maybe… JUST maybe… they needed some of their rough edges smoothed.

posted August 12, 2014 09:24 AM            

thank you so much for your insightful post.
I am continually amazed at how giving LL members are.

So, we can confirm I have my work cut out for me!

But seriously, you have helped me understand more aspects. I am indeed guilty of intellectualising emotion - until I am hurt - then its ... TSUNAMI! Anger? Yep, you got it - TORNADO!

You'd think with all that Libra I'd have half a chance at balance, although I think this is the mistaken belief about Libra. Rather than the epitome of balance, they seem in a constant tizzy TRYING to balance.

I find it strange your comment about water, as I always felt that more water in my chart would help get me out of my head?
but I have always been puzzled that I feel things so awfully deeply _ I thought this was a water trait, but I cannot find my water!

Wait... is Pluto basically a concentration of water? maybe that's it.

Like you said, I can be my own worst enemy, and can think myself into a meltdown at times. My mental stamina is frightening. And not always productive.

posted August 12, 2014 10:01 AM            

You are amazing in the amount of time and talent you have devoted to the LLs.

posted August 12, 2014 09:53 PM            

I am no expert but if you have a stellium, then you must look for positive aspects to release any frustration and anger you feel.

I also have Mars in 12th. Put shortly, it is annoying and suppresses your temper tantrums. It is very important you find exercises to relieve the stress which can accumulate. You have a bevy of unfulfilled potential waiting to be dug out of the dirt from the 12th house and it is within your karmic responsibility to do so, as Saturn is placed there too, in a very karmic position, no doubt.

Stepping back for a moment, your sun positively aspects every single planet in the stellium. That is your ticket out. Your Aquarius Sun is in the opposite house and is conjunct the 5th house cusp. You must find a creative outlet for your individuality. Aquarians are inventive, eccentric and coin brilliant ideas. Find a form of expression that suits your ideas.

Venus is heavily aspected by the stellium. It's ruler, (Saturn) receives it and therefore makes love seem like a heavy burden you may or may not feel up to the task for. There is also a ticket out of there. Write about it. Moon-mercury trine with an addition of your Venus aspecting the moon makes your emotions highly tangible in literate form. Moon in Virgo, (ruler of Mercury) especially is good for analysing, and since Mercury is considered exalted in Aquarius, you may turn out to be phenomenal at it.

posted August 13, 2014 04:25 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Iced8Ace:
Hi,

I am no expert but if you have a stellium, then you must look for positive aspects to release any frustration and anger you feel.

I also have Mars in 12th. Put shortly, it is annoying and suppresses your temper tantrums. It is very important you find exercises to relieve the stress which can accumulate. You have a bevy of unfulfilled potential waiting to be dug out of the dirt from the 12th house and it is within your karmic responsibility to do so, as Saturn is placed there too, in a very karmic position, no doubt.

Stepping back for a moment, your sun positively aspects every single planet in the stellium. That is your ticket out. Your Aquarius Sun is in the opposite house and is conjunct the 5th house cusp. You must find a creative outlet for your individuality. Aquarians are inventive, eccentric and coin brilliant ideas. Find a form of expression that suits your ideas.

Venus is heavily aspected by the stellium. It's ruler, (Saturn) receives it and therefore makes love seem like a heavy burden you may or may not feel up to the task for. There is also a ticket out of there. Write about it. Moon-mercury trine with an addition of your Venus aspecting the moon makes your emotions highly tangible in literate form. Moon in Virgo, (ruler of Mercury) especially is good for analysing, and since Mercury is considered exalted in Aquarius, you may turn out to be phenomenal at it.

As an aside, I noticed your Venus conjunct your South Node. If you believe in past lives, there's an interesting tidbit there with the ruler of Venus (Libra) heavily aspecting your Venus.

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Ice8Ace,

that is brilliant advice.
And yes, I adore writing. It is very helpful for channelling my emotions, thank you for encouraging me that I can be good at this.

Also, that is very encouraging that my Sun can help me. It makes sense that grounding exercises would be useful, as they would strengthen my connection to my essence (sun).

posted August 13, 2014 04:26 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Love&Light:
Voix I have Uranus Confunct Moon with 5 planets in the 10th with SN. Do I know what you are talking about. The only saving grace is all are in virgo. But in Navamsa Chart i.e. D9 all are in one house with a few more and its ruler is in 10th. The ruler? Mars. So I am just like this but with milder tones. Can make us wonder if we are going to go nuts.

How I cope. Don't concentrate on the BPD. Whatever we focus on becomes more concrete, it materialises more. So forget that. Concentrate on how you LOVE yourself and accept the whole you. Both the things can co-exist like two children who always keep fighting can live together. Fight and play. It only needs a loving mom. YOU. Once that point sinks in you will start living that way. Ebb and flow. Be a Hermit and the Sun. On and Off. Nothing wrong with that. You don't have to be consistent like others. Afterall even this pattern is a consistency, right? You are consistent in your inconsistency. I have accepted it. Living my whole life with Uranus with moon and Jupiter with SN in 10th. All Conjunct. So you can do it. Actually are doing it. Just needs little more time and practice. Within no time you would have mastered it. All the best. And others will love you for that. Just learn to curb it a little. Your heart will tell you how much. My thoughts shared here are based on my onw experience.

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Love & Light,

thank you for the excellent advice.

yes, whatever we feed will grow. I find myself saying this often. and then spiral down into a negative rumination! I must take my own advice!

I seem to be repeatedly receiving advice to "tone it down a bit", "don't let passionate become challenging" - signs for sure.

posted August 13, 2014 10:02 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tphoenix5:
I have to second the advice of concentrating on the positive. I have a lot of neptune in my chart by sign or by house and what an amazing astrologer said to me one day is ... if you can think it... it will occur. I spent my youth worrying about this one or that one not liking me. Here I am with you folks young enough to be my grand or great grand children... The point is I waasted time worrying what others thought of me. Instead of how I FELT about a situation.

You are gifted and talented and IT SHOWS...

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Tphoenix,

another piece of excellent advice from you.

posted August 13, 2014 11:50 AM            

I just understood what you meant by "air over water, water over air":

I have most prominent planets/configurations in water houses, but the planets are mostly in air.

I think you found my water for me.
It was there all the time, I just couldn't see it.

posted August 14, 2014 05:00 AM            

you are so kind. You have made me feel awesome, even though this thread was about my darkness - what a gift!

Oh, and I also found more of my water:

Moon sq. Neptune (1')
ASc. sext. Neptune (3')
Sun sext. Neptune (pretty big though at 5')

But I think that square is more powerful than I thought, and I get the feeling there is a capacity for softness through that, which might help to temper that stellium.

And of course, more wateriness.

You know, it would make sense for you to have a lot of water, you seem very in tune with your intuition. I can see that in the apparent ease with which you read charts, but also, you express what you see very poetically, and it really does just seem to *flow* from you.

posted August 14, 2014 10:33 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tphoenix5:
http://i1248.photobucket.com/albums/hh495/tphoenix5/mycht_zps30ac9a0b.jpg

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Ahhh water Moon and Sun, and Sun conj. Neptune.

What is Neptune in Scorpio conj. Sun like?

posted August 14, 2014 12:38 PM            

But to answer your question a bit more specific... it was told to me once by the native americans that I can walk a mile in anothers moccasins. That is what it is like ... I feel it from there side... which in itself it NOT reality... it is how they see or feel it. And the reason I choose to be alone in my older years. Having made unwise decision because it was so easy for people to get over on me... But there is a saying for that too... What you allow.... will continue. And thus, I am learning boundaries in all shapes and sizes.

So I am similar in many ways to a Pisces...I used to hate it so... I mean .. who wants to be so spineless... but now... it has a lot of advantages... as long as you see them for what they are.

posted August 14, 2014 04:18 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tphoenix5:
Well it is self deception and until I became homeless... I really did not believe that. But my family whom I devoted a great deal of time to... well... money is money.. I suppose and I am grateful or greatfilled that it is not my god.

But to answer your question a bit more specific... it was told to me once by the native americans that I can walk a mile in anothers moccasins. That is what it is like ... I feel it from there side... which in itself it NOT reality... it is how they see or feel it. And the reason I choose to be alone in my older years. Having made unwise decision because it was so easy for people to get over on me... But there is a saying for that too... What you allow.... will continue. And thus, I am learning boundaries in all shapes and sizes.

So I am similar in many ways to a Pisces...I used to hate it so... I mean .. who wants to be so spineless... but now... it has a lot of advantages... as long as you see them for what they are.

Tell me about aquarius. They intimidate me...

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Well being able to feel another's experience is certainly a useful gift.
It's hard to connect in this world, so the more feelers the better IMO.

Hm. I'm not sure how I feel aquarian tbh.
I do have a deep well of concern for the future of humanity as a whole, and I can see the bigger picture (virgo moon helps me out when it gets too big and Dali-esque) and I am dedicating my life slowly but surely to taking healing journeys with individuals.
I also hope to work on wider social issues - there are problems we have that could be intercepted before they bring people down, and we see them in the mental health service.
Aside from that, I'm not sure?

Lover of freedom - who isn't?
Wired to the moon - who hasn't been?

Why do they intimidate you?

I have difficulty imagining a Scorpio Sun being intimidated by anyone?

Perhaps you soak up the zealousness a bit much?

One thing I have noticed that I can do without meaning it is when I am passionate about solving a problem in society or even myself, the way I talk about it can lead others to feel guilty - they have told me.

Tell me about this intimidation?

I think this would be quite upsetting to an aquarian as they want to reach everyone, know everyone, and equalise everyone.
I hate feeling anyone has been left out or ostracised.

posted August 15, 2014 03:34 AM            

I am not intelligent about lion behaviour, but I am intelligent about human behaviour.

Intelligence, to me, is simply an indication of the level of effort one applies to a subject.

I don't believe in prodigies, nor "talent", nor "aptitude".

Anything I got good at, I got good because I done it non-stop.
Anything I understand, I understand because I read, and read, and wrote, and contemplated, and discussed.

Intelligence is 30% passion and 70% graft, IMO.

Sometimes the early conditions of a child's life will foster development in a certain area over other areas, for example, the child grows up in a house of musicians - the child will have an ear for music.
Is this intelligence? Not really, just regular exposure, which in the brain is essentially a level of study.

Although there is one aspect that seems to be common in Aquarians: a deep curiosity about the world - that'll make you observe and dig and learn. But surely everyone is curious about something.

So, you need to work at it? So did/do I.
So so does everyone IMO.

Another example: was an excellent serial killer born with an innate intelligence for serial killing? I don't think so.
He may well be born with personality characteristics that produce a propensity for violent or anti social behaviour, but if we examine serial killing, we notice it gets cleaner, more thorough and planned over time.

Basically, the killer gets more intelligent about killing, the more he does it and studies it.

I believe I am Pluto in Libra, although the "P" position makes it look like its in Scorpio.

posted August 15, 2014 06:12 AM            

Pluto in Scorpio is about a generation that will seek violence (bomb their own schools, churches, families, etc) for the sake of experiencing death on an intimate level. On the positive side their abilities to heal will lead us to the discoveries that will be unheard of at any point in history. Taking us to the place of Atlantis where they were so bored they started taking horse heads and human torsos and putting them together just to see what they could get.

I studied with Jeff Green for a while. Pluto was all he taught. It was very enlightening to say the least.

posted August 15, 2014 07:06 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by tphoenix5:
Pluto in Libra... I cannot read the chart you posted one day... you will have to send me your birth infor and I can erect a chart using my own solarfire. I am much more at home with that than the way the charts post from astro or the others.

Pluto in Scorpio is about a generation that will seek violence (bomb their own schools, churches, families, etc) for the sake of experiencing death on an intimate level. On the positive side their abilities to heal will lead us to the discoveries that will be unheard of at any point in history. Taking us to the place of Atlantis where they were so bored they started taking horse heads and human torsos and putting them together just to see what they could get.

I studied with Jeff Green for a while. Pluto was all he taught. It was very enlightening to say the least.

I should have figured Pluto in libra... MORE air, my friend.

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I often wonder about Atlantis - a race so apparently great that it actualised its own downfall. I wonder what their excess was.

Breeding experiments - is this what happened?
I have never heard this before.

Just googled Jeff Green - an evolutionary astrologist. I think really plumbing the depths of Pluto would be amazing.
That must have taught you so much about yourself, considering all the Scorpio you have.

Did he believe that Pluto was the most definitive part of the natal?
I guess it could be regarded as the point of transformation, so anyone who is done with the day-to-day may do well to focus there.