posted December 21, 2019 11:03 AM            

1. Aspects to and from the Sun (in a woman's chart), or to and from the Moon (in a man's chart).

2. Applying aspects from the ruler of the 7th house.

3. Planets in the 7th house, and their aspects.

posted December 21, 2019 11:06 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by vansio:
If it’s ok I’d like to add my data to this exercise chain:
1. Sun applying quintile to NN, trine to Juno [all under 1° orb] next major aspect is a trine to ASC-Mars [8°]
2. L7 Saturn applies a sesquisquare to ASC-Mars [1°] then square to Pluto [3°] 😬, yet exactly applying square 5th House Vertex [0°]
3. Neptune-Uranus in 7th, sextile Mercury [2a°], sextile Pluto [5a°], square Venus [7a°]
4. No interception

From what I understand, some folks count a number of promises based off the each applying major aspect?

---

posted December 21, 2019 11:10 AM            

Although your exactly applying square from Saturn to 5th House Vertex does need to be considered, it is not shown on the above chart extract - because I do not know what letter Astrodiesnt use for the vertex in their programs. ... And I've left the Moon in, as it is at the anaretic degree and aspected by the Sun.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

1. Aspects to and from the Sun

The Sun (in Pisces/9th) is applying a 4-arc-minutes-orb 14th harmonic aspect to Mars (in Cancer/1st) ... indicating "striving to be noticed as someone-who-cares".

And ... it is making harmonic aspects to every other planet in the natal chart ... 71H to Moon : 61H to Mercury : 110H to Venus : 82H to Jupiter : 89H to Saturn : 9H to Uranus : 9H to Neptune and 19H to Pluto.

Currently though, I do not have even an inkling about the meaning of any prime number above 31 - so can produce working-interpretations only for the Sun's aspects to Mars : Venus (11Hx10H) : Uranus : Neptune and Pluto :-

Sun-Mars = "striving to be noticed as someone-who-cares".
Sun - Venus = "you know what/who you want - and nothing/no-one can stop you from getting it/him"
Sun-Uranus = "he has to be intellectually stimulating".
Sun-Neptune = "he has to be compassionate".
Sun-Pluto = "he has to walk-the-walk everyday, in every way".

So ... you have no difficulty in getting a partner (which the trine to Juno/Asc and quintile to NN confirm/reinforce) ... but partners will have difficulty in measuring up permanently, or even for long enough to be considered as a potential husband..

2. Applying aspects from the ruler of the 7th house.

Saturn makes an applying harmonic aspect to all other natal planets (but with varying %age strengths) :-

Sun 44H/71% : Moon 16H/77% : Mercury 14H/86% : Venus 7H/74% : Mars 29H/68% : Jupiter 45H/97% : Uranus 34H/55% : Neptune 34H/57% : Pluto 25H/72% ... and that almost exact natal Saturn-Jupiter aspect is applying only because Jupiter is retrograde.

My interpretations for these applying aspects from Saturn are :-

Sun-44H ... 'in situations which require compromise or/and diplomacy, your dogged defiance may be a problem"

Moon-16H ... "you have an emotional need to be in control, which (unnecessarily) creates obstacles or/and enemies."

Mercury-14H ... "intuition enables you to see behavioural patterns that others do not."

Venus-7H ... "intuition enables you to see who can/cannot be relied upon."

Mars-29H ... "you take pride in being someone-who-cares."

Jupiter-45H ... "you are devoted to duty."

Uranus/Neptune (34H) ... "you are a poster child for the rebellion through which your generation will change society."

Pluto-25H ... "you have the creative skills/abilities required to transform your society."

So ... with regard to the natal marriage promise ... I am leaning increasingly to the view that it may be "granted", rather than promised.**

[** My natal chart is that of a soul intending to experience life as a husband, father, grand-father and great-grand-father. Yet, when young, I was driven by the desire to succeed in my career - and did so (whilst also being a husband and father). Then, after retiring, a palm-reading psychic informed me that career success was 'granted' but marriage was 'promised' - which I can now see in my natal chart. ... In essence, both the palm-reader and the natal chart were telling me that "if push had come to shove, I would have sacrificed my career rather than my marriage" - and that would indeed have been so.]

3. Planets in the 7th house, and their aspects.

Bear in mind here that the Uranus-Neptune conjunction happens rarely (every 171 years or so), and seems to result in the birth of a generation which - in some way - reforms society (or the status quo.) ... So, whether consciously or unconsciously, this evolutionary objective/purpose will have a strong influence on you.

Hence, (in terms of the marriage promise), the contact made by the Uranus-Neptune conjunction to the Sun (9th harmonic, at 99% strength) is significant - because it makes you a "poster child" for (at least one of) those evolutionary changes. And, when combined with your (98% strength) Sun-Mars 14th harmonic "striving to be noticed as someone-who-cares", you have the potential to become a woman/Saturn that sacrifices her personal life/relationships for a 'greater cause'.

4. Duplication of 7th and 8th house cusps.

posted December 21, 2019 12:09 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by vansio:
an origami boat came to mind

---

However ... I initially read origami as (representing )
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

quote:

---

From what I understand, some folks count a number of promises based off each applying major aspect?

---

And ... in my own (male) chart, the Sun applies only to Uranus (I married an Aquarius Sun) plus Chiron (thus I was wounded in another relationship that had the potential to become a marriage). However, although my natal Moon applies to every planet except Jupiter and Saturn, I married only once - and will have been wedded for 50 years in January 2020.

posted December 21, 2019 11:32 PM            

quote:

---

I definitely see 'origami'.. whether the crane or boat, something that can float. as a child, I used to adore folding paper.

---

This was a heads-up for me (from transit Jupiter) - warning of the need to see this marriage promise through the eyes/persepective of the chart owner and myself, rather than only from my own perspective.

But ... might the current transit of Saturn over your 7th house Uranus-Neptune be (somehow) giving a heads-up to you as well? **

quote:

---

** 7Ruler in 9th house, perhaps a testament to expansion, foreignness and travel.

---

"When the ruler of the 7th is in the 9th, partnership is a learning experience. The general orientation is to seek out a partner with whom there are many shared intellectual (if Saturn/Uranus is involved) or spiritual interests (if Neptune is involved). The individual will want to travel with her partner, as the urge for adventure plays a significant role in the urge for relationship." ... (From Rulers of the Horoscope, by Alan Oken.)
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

quote:

---

congratulations on your golden wedding

---

Btw, and off-topic ... Your mentioning of the Crane reminded me of a (male) quiz show contestant who was asked to "name a bird with a long neck" - and answered "Naomi Campbell"

posted December 23, 2019 12:49 AM            

quote:

---

My 7th and 8th house Cusps are duplicated

---

However, when considering applying aspects made by the ruler of 7th, would you take Sun-Saturn to be a (32% strength, separating) conjunction or a (71% strength, applying) 44H aspect?

If a separating conjunction, we ignore it ... if an applying 44H*, we consider it.

[* The 44H = "effort" (4H) x "doggedly persistent defiance" (11H) = "actively working on being defiant". ... And, in terms of the marriage promise, that would translate as "being a pain in the ass, when interacting with partners" - ie. 'in situations which require compromise or/and diplomacy, your dogged defiance may be a problem".]

posted December 28, 2019 08:14 PM            

quote:

---

... if Marriage isn't promised, I wonder what is.

---

"to reclaim Uranus/Neptune rather than only projecting out"

quote:

---

I initially wanted to ask the difference between the separating conjunction and the 44th harmonic?

---

With regard to the difference between the conjunction (H1) and the 44H (44th harmonic aspect) though ... the behavioural traits become more deeply submerged in the subconscious as the harmonic number increases. Hence, chart owners are more likely to see/become aware of (their own) behavioural traits relating to lower-numbered harmonics than those relating to higher numbered harmonics.

quote:

---

I don't resonate with the word 'defiance' with partners, I'm actually quite accommodating (tolerating), and have had to take some time to think about this standing placement I initially agreed with, because of another resemblance. The energy I was reminded of when you said 'translates to pain in the ass' could be attributed to a natal mars-venus (aries) square, however with Jupiter in Libra, diplomacy and compromise are thematic in behavior and typically considered when I act. My point is I believe I agreed more with the generalized translation than the specific qualification. This is what sticks with me, and have been mulling over since. Perhaps they're two sides of the same coin from a holistic point of view. Because of the strength of the alternative aspect I want to give ground but I’m not sure I relate—could be semantics.

---

quote:

---

the enemies bit is an odd assessment, perhaps because I am not easily influenced

---

quote:

---

Ruler of my NN, Jupiter, in my 5th house (Placidius), devoted to... Love and creativity.

---

posted December 29, 2019 05:17 AM            

quote:

---

quote:
These kind of "enemies" are people that (in secret/behind-the-scenes) will actively try undermine you, rather than people with whom you will have face-to-face confrontations.

I've heard this, have been warned of this, a handful of times.. Its one thing and quite understandable for others to be jealous of what another has but an entirely different experience (conundrum) of jealousy or contempt from who you are. Fascinating and slightly creepy.. I would like more information about this.

---

With harmonic aspects, H1 reveals the chart owners potential and each subsequent primary number relates to a specific behavioural trait ... H2 = seeking feedback from others ... H3 = taking a talent for granted ... H5 = ability to recognise patterns (intellectually/consciously) ... H7 = ability to recognise patterns (intuitively/subconsciously) ... H11 = ability to (defiantly/steadfastly) "stand apart" from others ... and the list goes on. ...... However, no matter how far up that list we look, only the 2H involves contact with others - and this 2H aspect series manifests in a very specific way :-

1) 2H = oppositions ... in which the chart-owner is unaware of a behavioural trait in himself/herself, so projects it onto another person. Thus, the other person becomes a mirror that enables him/her to (eventually) recognise the trait in himself/herself. [At the H2 level, third party observers tend to be able to see the trait in the other but not in the chart-owner.]

2) 4H = squares ... it now becomes apparent to third party observers that the chart-owner has the behavioural trait that he/she is projecting onto others. [But, those third party observers tend to not point this out to the chart-owner - who remains unaware of the trait in himself/herself.]

3) 8H = semi and sesqui squares ... third party observers become irritated by the chart-owners failure to recognise in himself/herself what (to them) is now glaringly obvious. [So, now the third party observers do try to make the chart-owner aware of the issue - but remain tolerant of his/her failure to see it.}

4) 16H = aspects that are multiples of 22deg30mins ... third party observers become annoyed with the chart owners inability to see in himself/herself (what, to them, is) a blatantly obvious behavioural trait that he/she persists in projecting onto others. [And now, those observers decide that pointing this out to the chart owner is never going to work - so they begin conspiring to make life difficult for him/her, in the belief that this will result in the chart owner realising he/she has an issue/problem which needs to be resolved.]

posted December 29, 2019 12:33 PM            

quote:

---

quote:
if Marriage isn't promised, I wonder what is. [..] "to reclaim Uranus/Neptune rather than only projecting out"

Because it's the ruler of my 10th? Or perhaps the generational conjunction? In other words, do I have a career promise?

---

posted December 30, 2019 07:07 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by vansio:
Hakuin: ‘Is that so?’

these third-party harmonics sounds like they’re meant for others to grow from as much as the native, conspiring being a strong word the way you’ve described it seeming justified whether one’s conscious of the superficial context of such a thing.. what is a third party anyways? Judah or the Jewish Authorities?

I’ll tell you this much about the expression of hidden enemies on a personal note; a few of the people who have so-called conspired against me (scapegoated) have also unexpectedly come back much later after the undisclosed fact to offer gratitude recognizing something or seek forgiveness for having contributed. on separate occasions.

---

Ah. ... Like you, I have been awarded that particular t-shirt many times ... and worn it with a kind of defiant pride.

posted January 12, 2020 06:28 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by vansio:
Hi graham, I’d like to add that my natal Mars is Out of Bounds (declination 26°41'46")

---

posted January 15, 2020 12:20 AM            

quote:

---

So ... with regard to the natal marriage promise ... I am leaning increasingly to the view that it may be "granted", rather than promised.

---