posted January 20, 2005 03:32 PM              

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I'm no Bush fan... but this extremist name calling is just ridiculous

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posted February 02, 2005 11:08 PM              

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So what the hell would u call a baby killer an angel? I don't think so.

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~*~ Cusp: Gemini/Cancer, Cancer rising, Taurus moon ~*~

Let's go...

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Posts: 112
From: Okinawa, Japan
Registered: Apr 2009

posted February 03, 2005 09:22 AM            

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If you live in America and work then you most probably pay your taxes. As such, whether you agree or disagree on a mental level with what your goverment does, you still physically, albeit indirectly, support their actions with your money. So, if Bush is a "baby killer" for his policies and the way he is running this war, then the rest of us are, too, for supporting our government's actions financially. His alleged "baby killing" is done indirectly, as well ... as in, he doesn't actually go out there and kill babies personally. In fact, more than babies have died, so the term "baby killer" isn't appropriate on its own. You can't call him simply a "killer of innocents" either because more than innocents have died in this war. I suppose "killer" would work, if you think along those lines, but it doesn't have the same shock value as "baby killer". Either way, all of us tax paying citizens of the U.S. are "killers", as well, even if it's just indirectly so. (Granted, I'm not saying this is so ... just taking the argument up for argument's sake.) Sure, if you don't pay your taxes, you may end up in jail. But what's a little jail time when you consider that you've upheld your moral values and beliefs as far as it was within your means to do so? Thoreau was willing to do it. Are you? Because if you're not, then, as free as you are to believe and speak what you will, you are still a part of the "problem" that you are so adamantly opposed to in your mind and perhaps in your soul, as well. Ah, but to risk your own personal comfort for a cause ... how many are willing to go that far and live, truly, without a trace of hypocrisy in their being? Actions do speak louder than words, you know.

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"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Ghandi

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posted February 03, 2005 09:31 AM              

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*claps*

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posted February 03, 2005 10:28 AM              

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i've read of a number of people who actually have chosen to relinquish their lifestyles for those of a more self-sustaining, i.e. none tax-paying, existence. they grow their own food. they engage in barter for goods and services whenever possible. they eschew owning personal vehicles, or choose to drive illegally. all in an effort to avoid paying the taxes that go for this funding.

many people are choosing, conscientiously to live this way, and to do so to varying lengths of illegality -- not for the purpose of criminality, but for what they consider morality.

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posted February 03, 2005 12:14 PM              

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Well what did u expect? I'm not gonna call a baby killer a saint either.

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~*~ Cusp: Gemini/Cancer, Cancer rising, Taurus moon ~*~

Let's go...

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From: Okinawa, Japan
Registered: Apr 2009

posted February 03, 2005 12:31 PM            

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Saffron
Hi, haven't spoken with you in a while. Nice to see you around.
I understand that there are people trying to avoid paying taxes as much as possible, but it's highly unlikely that the majority of people against Pres. Bush and/or this war are doing so. It's also highly unlikely that you can completely escape paying at least some forms of taxes. Granted, I'm not judging anyone either way. It's no one's business but your own if you follow your conscience over the law or the law over your conscience ... unless you get caught doing something illegal. Then it becomes the government's business, as well ... but again, can we really judge each other on a personal level either way? Some will, of course, but what's the point?
Anyway, in this particular case, the opposing argument is sure to come up, as it always does ... why live in a country whose policies you don't support? Why make such extreme efforts to live in a country that represents things that would force you to go so far out of your way, even to break the law if need be, in order to avoid being a part of it as much as possible anyway? And, of course, the ever popular ... why should you benefit at all from the things that you like enough about this country so much that despite your morals you still wish to live here when you aren't willing to support your country in return?

Again, I'm not making these arguments because I feel this way myself. I'm just bringing them up for general discussion.

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*waving at proxieme*

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"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Ghandi

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posted February 05, 2005 01:25 AM              

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hi Eleanore...i spoke to you just a few days ago in HC. hope puppy is happy and well.

about the people of whom i spoke -- there are a number of people doing this...more everyday. yes, i'm sure not everyone who disagrees with the current policy employs these methods of protest.

i just mentioned that i've read of some of these people; i referred to them as them, as i only happened to come across the subject, and found it somewhat interesting. you probably are using you universally and generally in your reply, but just to be clear, i said only that i've read of these people, not that i am one of them.

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posted February 05, 2005 01:39 AM              

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See thats the problem the media hear doesnt say it but it is true guys. Not many people are informed about this.

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~*~ Cusp: Gemini/Cancer, Cancer rising, Taurus moon ~*~

Let's go...

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From: Okinawa, Japan
Registered: Apr 2009

posted February 05, 2005 11:13 AM            

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You're right, Saffron, I did mean "you" generally, not specifically you-Saffron. Sorry for the confusion.
Oh, yeah, the puppy thread! I don't know why I forgot about that. Silly me, I kept thinking about your "feeding the birds" thread.

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"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Ghandi

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