posted July 22, 2005 12:29 PM              

If their orders of pollicy towards the civilians of Iraq where changed,,, that would probably help with us apearing transparently good as well... Lets just say when on duty, they arent allowed to give the US a possative image. And each troop ends up being belittled by superior's if they try to show a good freindly image. I dont know why our propaganda ridden media hasnt shown this when trying to one sidedly make W out to be what they want us to strictly see him as...

Probably because the troops arent allowed to talk about stuff like that in interviews...

posted July 23, 2005 07:54 PM            

Gee, I wonder what planet the person(s) who said that have been on?

This is one US company involved in restoring Iraq...using mostly Iraqi contractors and Iraqi labor. I know how much it galls leftists that someone is making a profit..or at least intends to make a profit but it is an imperfect world...now isn't it!

BTW, this is only one US company involved in Iraqi reconstruction.

"In support of the U.S. government's reconstruction effort in Iraq, Bechtel is under contract with the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID), for the emergency repair, rehabilitation, and reconstruction of critical elements of Iraq’s infrastructure. This initial effort includes assessing and repairing selected power, municipal water, and sewage systems; dredging, repairing, and upgrading the Port of Umm Qasr; rehabilitating selected schools, clinics, and fire stations; reconstructing three key bridges; constructing a key rail line; restoring telephone service to more than 200,000 Baghdad subscribers; and restoring Iraq's main 2,000-kilometer, north-south fiber optic communications backbone. In addition, on January 6, 2004, USAID awarded Bechtel a second contract known as Iraq Infrastructure II, a major USAID program of engineering, procurement, and construction services for a series of new infrastructure projects in Iraq. Bechtel is teamed with Parsons of Pasadena, California, and Horne Engineering Services of Fairfax, Virginia. This contract runs from January 2004 through December 2005 with a total value of up to $1.8 billion."

Reconstruction Highlights

As of June 2, Bechtel has:
Dredged Port of Umm Qasr, Iraq's only deepwater port, to enable commercial traffic. Restored the port’s grain handling facility, enabling the transfer of up to 60,000 tons per day.
Completed repairs to enable resumption of commercial flights at Baghdad and Basrah International Airports.
Renovated more than 1,200 schools.
Refurbished 10 fire stations and 52 primary health clinics.
Constructed 57 kilometers (35 miles) of new rail lines.
Restored switching stations required to reconnect more than 215,000 Baghdad telephone subscribers, and restored fiber-optic backbone connecting Iraqi cities to the Baghdad area network.
Completed power projects to make available an additional 700 megawatts of electricity, enough to serve 700,000 residents.
Repaired three bridges (Al Mat, Khazir, and Tikrit) critical to traffic flow across Iraq.
Completed seven wastewater treatment projects throughout the country, enabling the treatment of wastewater for more than 7.5 million people.
Rehabilitated seven water treatment projects, restoring their ability to provide treated water to 8.5 million people.

Airports
The immediate mission of the Airports program was to restore critical infrastructure at Baghdad (BIAP) and Basrah (BSR) International Airports to support opening of the airports for limited, international commercial flights operating under daytime visual meteorological conditions

Bridges
Bechtel reconstructed three bridges damaged in the 2003 conflict: Khazir Bridge, located between the northern cities of Mosul and Arbil; Al Mat Bridge near Ar Rutbah village in western Iraq; and Tikrit Bridge over the Tigris River.

Buildings and Facilities
The Buildings and Facilities program includes rehabilitating schools, primary health care clinics, and selected fire stations, and constructing a new children's hospital.

Ports
Upon entering Iraq in April 2003, Bechtel found the Port of Umm Qasr?consisting of the Old Port, New Port, and grain facility?in a rundown condition with limited commercial power or water supply. Bechtel's mission was to perform rehabilitation work and open Umm Qasr to receive humanitarian aid shipments.

Power
In April 2003, Bechtel entered Iraq and found the country's electric system in extreme distress, capable of delivering electricity to only a fraction of its 24 million inhabitants. Bechtel's first task was to assess the full extent of damage after three wars, sanctions, looting, and general neglect.

Rail
Bechtel and Iraqi Republic Railways (IRR) jointly constructed a new European-standard rail line in the Basrah region to improve freight transport service from the Port of Umm Qasr to the rest of the country. The existing single-track line had not been upgraded since it was constructed during the 1960s and its poor condition caused derailments, accidents, and delays to rail service.

Telecommunications
The larger telephone exchanges within Baghdad, as well as the critical national fiber optic backbone connecting Iraqi cities to the Baghdad area network, were damaged in the 2003 conflict. Bechtel's role in the reconstruction program has been to restore connectivity to telephone subscribers in the Baghdad area and to restore the fiber backbone to pre-conflict capability

Water/Wastewater
Bechtel's Water and Wastewater program is restoring water and sanitation systems to ensure a reliable supply of treated water to the general public. Iraq's water and sanitation systems, designed to protect public health, were in a state of general disrepair following years of war, sanctions, and inadequate maintenance.

Subcontractor Information
As of July 17, the Iraq Infrastructure Reconstruction Program has awarded to Iraqi companies 253 out of 393 subcontracts for services. Additionally, over 10,000 companies from 100 countries have registered on Bechtel's Supplier and Contractor portal.

A key Bechtel and USAID goal under the Iraq Infrastructure Reconstruction Program is to maximize Iraqi participation in our work. Indeed, to increase the cost-effectiveness of the work, and to help revitalize the Iraqi economy, Bechtel decided to award the vast majority of the subcontracting work to Iraqi subcontractors.
http://www.bechtel.com/iraq.htm

I know, it's not enough..in spite of the fact Bechtel is only one construction and engineering firms working on Iraq's infrastructure. And it's not fast enough..it should have been completed within 60 days of Saddam's fall. And it never should have been necessary anyway because Saddam was taking care of Iraqi citizens quite well before the US interfered. Families flying kites in the parks, picnics down by the river, and a grand time was being had by all Iraqis.

The problem with leftists is that their rhetoric only serves to hide their real feelings and intent. Nothing the United States does will ever be right, good enough or timely. On the other hand if the US does nothing at all, that's equal grist for the mill because leftist's real problem is that they hate America, encourage America's enemies and make common bond with them under the axiom, "the enemy of my enemy is my friend".

posted July 23, 2005 08:22 PM              

I'm certainly not against making a profit in the process. (That was part of the charm of the Marshall Plan) As long as it is in the process and not the goal.

posted July 23, 2005 08:44 PM            

As usual, it's not good enough, it's not enough, it's not fast enough but underlying all that is the fact that if it wasn't this issue it would be another for the leftists because Iraq has nothing to do with their hate for America...it's just a vent for their bile, bilge and spleen against the US.

posted July 23, 2005 08:50 PM            

Never mind our previous conversation about Iraqi infrastructure under Oil For Food (remember those dual-use items they needed to repair all the stuff Bechtel is now fixing?).

Do you see what I'm saying now, Jwhop? The people you support, support my theory. They are not just concentrated on the kill kill kill aspects of winning the war on terror. The fact they create infrastructure that may indeed help terrorists does NOt make them terrorist apologists even though it may inadvertently help terrorists. They are working toward taking away the motivation.

If you reduce the war on terror to simple violence without regard for morality or decency (on either side), then there will never be an end to terrorist action, and there will never be an end to this war.

posted July 23, 2005 09:07 PM            

Your assumption that Bechtel is rebuilding Iraq for terrorists makes me sense you believe the terrorists...ummm freedom fighters are going to win in Iraq and control the country. Do you?

America has plenty of bullets, cruise missiles and precision guided bombs Acoustic. As long as there are people in the world with the mistaken notion they have a license from their god to kill everyone who won't submit to their rule or convert to their religion, the job won't be done.

It seems to me dual use items don't figure into fixing bridges, telephone service, electric generating plants, water treatment and/or waste water treatment plants, rail lines, oil field piping, well heads and pumps, schools, hospitals...need I go on?

posted July 23, 2005 09:50 PM            

Sure, I know about the grey fox. Are you the reincarnation of General Robert E Lee...back to raise the South?

Naturally, I would prefer the "grey fox" be a fairy tale. I just love a good fairy tale...with a happy ending

posted July 23, 2005 10:52 PM              

Reincarnation of the Lee, huh? You're closer than you think.

posted July 23, 2005 11:56 PM            

I'm not at all saying that the terrorists will win Iraq. I'm saying that they live there. I'm saying that our government hired Bechtel to rebuild Iraq's infrastructure, which aids the terrorists in bringing clean water, electricity, and communication lines. I'm saying it's hypocritical of you to say that "leftists" are in bed with the enemy when your own side is following at least partially the plan that those on the left would.

quote:

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America has plenty of bullets, cruise missiles and precision guided bombs Acoustic. As long as there are people in the world with the mistaken notion they have a license from their god to kill everyone who won't submit to their rule or convert to their religion, the job won't be done.

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This is exactly what I was talking about in the last post. If you keep framing it as only kill kill kill, it's never going to get better, and the terrorists won't go away.

quote:

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It seems to me dual use items don't figure into fixing bridges, telephone service, electric generating plants, water treatment and/or waste water treatment plants, rail lines, oil field piping, well heads and pumps, schools, hospitals...need I go on?

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You know that at least part of this statement is untrue. Lumping all those things together to try to slide it past isn't going to work. I've had you read the reports. If you don't want to believe the experts, then that's your own liability. It won't be the first or the last time you turn a blind eye to reality. Same with your disbelief that America hasn't done anything to harm innocent Iraqis. This has all been proven over and over to you. Your refusal to accept it doesn't change the facts.

posted July 24, 2005 12:13 AM            

Reincarnation of the Lee, huh? My mind works in strange ways at times, so I might be closer than I think?

From everything I know about Lee, he was an honorable man and the land was certainly a very big issue in his life. Whether that overshadowed his loyalty to the truth is something I can't answer but I often wondered if he was bitter at the end. What truth do you think Lee cast aside?

There are many things which will ruin the ending of an otherwise good fairytale, that is, if there really is an ending to a good fairytale.

It was interesting you asked if I have heard the term "grey fox". Of course I have...in several usage's...one of which is associated with Lee, General Robert E. Lee, "the gray fox". Never know what kinds of associations words might conjure up.

posted July 24, 2005 01:09 AM            

Leftists have been in bed with America's enemies since at least the 40's and I mean in bed with every enemy, during the Korean War, during the Cold War, during Vietnam, during the Nicaragua/Contra affair, during the first Gulf War and in the present war in Iraq. Leftists opposed kicking Cuban forces off Grenada...while they were in the process of building a suitable runway for Soviet long range bombers. Leftists have been on the side of the enemy in every disagreement, over every issue, leftists have taken the side of the enemy. Leftists also gave American nuclear technology to the Soviet Union, gave nuclear weapons and missile technology to the communist Chinese, gave billions to the murderous little bast*ard in North Korea and put another murderous little communist bast*rd back in power in Haiti. So, save the bullsh*t.

Leftists wouldn't have raised their little finger to help the people of Iraq. They opposed it then and they still oppose it, so the idea leftists would do the very same thing the US is actually doing to rebuild the infrastructure of Iraq is just so much more leftist bullsh*t.

The terrorists will be killed or captured, tried by a military tribunal and executed if found guilty. They are going away, one way or the other and this in spite of leftist drivel we should try to see their side of the issue. People who make war on civilians, people who believe they have a right to kill anyone who does not accept Allah as god..i.e., infidels can only be dealt with in one way and that way is a bullet. Those captured inside of Iraq will more than likely be tried and executed by the Iraqis.

You have proved nothing in your snide remarks that America repressed Iraqi civilians except to mark yourself as seeing America as the problem. It is true we've covered all that ground and the truth remains that Saddam refused the Oil for Food program for 5 years, that after accepting the program, Saddam ripped the program off...along with the UN and some UN people Saddam bribed..among a cast of other misbegotten individuals...mostly leftists. It's also true as I proved to you that the water treatment plants in Iraq didn't have to have chlorine to function...that there are other methods just as effective which were not banned as precursors to chemical weapons. You want to ignore the truth because it gets in your way of making the US the bad guy. Get it straight Acoustic, Saddam was the bad guy and you leftists attempted in every way to protect Saddam. If you leftists had had your way, Saddam would still be in power in Iraq.

posted July 24, 2005 03:01 AM            

quote:

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It's also true as I proved to you that the water treatment plants in Iraq didn't have to have chlorine to function...that there are other methods just as effective which were not banned as precursors to chemical weapons.

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Regardless of your point on the different methods of creating clean water, it was a huge issue for them wasn't it? Perhaps you should have been there for the Iraqis with your alternate methods when they needed you.

quote:

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Leftists wouldn't have raised their little finger to help the people of Iraq. They opposed it then and they still oppose it, so the idea leftists would do the very same thing the US is actually doing to rebuild the infrastructure of Iraq is just so much more leftist bullsh*t.

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You outdo yourself with your nonsense.

quote:

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can only be dealt with in one way and that way is a bullet.

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So you're really standing by that, huh? You want the terrorisism to continue on for the next generations? You don't ever want America to concern itself with it's public image so long as it's killing foreigners? Violence perpetuates violence. This is why inner city gangs don't go away. Someone's always killing someone else creating new enemies.

Do you understand the reason Ghandi and Muther Luther King Jr preached non-violent protest?

posted July 24, 2005 01:01 PM            

Clean water was and is an issue for Iraqis. However, the duty of providing that clean water fell on the shoulders of Saddam Hussein, not the United States. The duty fell to Saddam to maintain the water treatment plants, he didn't. The duty fell to Saddam to maintain the chlorine production plant, he didn't. The duty fell to Saddam to find alternate sources of water purifying processes...which were readily available and not banned for import into Iraq, he didn't. My point was valid when I made it and it's still a valid point that no amount of spin on your part is going to overcome.

Sorry Acoustic, the spin you've applied to what I said about leftists not raising a finger to help the people of Iraq can't stand any scrutiny..not even the slightest scrutiny. It was the leftists, communists, socialists and members of terrorist organizations who marched in the streets of America to protect their little communist pal, Saddam. This at a time when the entire world believed Saddam had WMD, this at a time when the record was already clear that Saddam had sheltered terrorists, was paying the families of terrorists for terrorist acts committed by their children and that Saddam's regime was itself a terrorist regime. This was also at a time when the information was widely disseminated that Saddam was responsible for the deaths of up to 1,000,000 of his own citizens, by torture, by hanging, by immersion in acid filled vats and by running them through his plastic shredder. Not to mention the rapes and torture of Iraqi children. These are also the groups of leftists who signed a communist inspired and communist written petition to impeach Bush....before the war started.

Now, tell me again Acoustic, how leftists have any regard whatsoever for the Iraqi people. Don't you ever tire of having your feeble arguments slapped down?

Your arguments against finding and killing terrorists is laughable Acoustic. Terrorists commit terrorism. Dead terrorists commit no terrorist acts whatsoever. It is a hallmark of the left that America must live up to the standards of the corrupt French, the corrupt Syrians, the corrupt Iranian government, the corrupt North Korean government and the corrupt communist government of China and the utterly corrupt UN. You can stuff that argument Acoustic because I'm not at all persuaded by arguments the US must be seen to be better than our enemies. If you think this is a popularity contest, you're mistaken. Of course, I just see this line of attack on the US as one more lying talking point in the arsenal of the lying left.

Any and I do mean any of the current crop of terrorists would have beheaded Gandhi and King in a heartbeat. Making war against those who have declared war on you and actually attacked you for years is not violence Acoustic, it's self defense and the best self defense is a bullet for every terrorist. I wonder why you leftists don't attempt to take your talking points about peace and the peaceful resolution of disagreements to the terrorists to make your case? Could you give us a few paragraphs on that Acoustic? My guess is of course you wouldn't because a peaceful resolution is not a leftist goal. Painting the US as the bad actor in the world is the goal of leftists. If you really wanted to protect innocent people around the world Acoustic, you would be clamoring for the death of terrorists around the world..because it's terrorists who are deliberately killing innocent civilians.

Next argument Acoustic and I hope you have something in reserve which contains the moral clarity your arguments have so far lacked.