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Author Topic:   Eight of Swords
Twirl
Knowflake

Posts: 2410
From: Europe
Registered: Mar 2013

posted October 23, 2013 02:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Twirl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi

I have been going over this card a lot lately & I wonder how you guys read this. I'm often inclined to just look at the own limiting thoughts (swords representing the mind), but I actually noticed that at times it can be much more literal; someone does not exclude him/herself, but actually IS excluded/left on her/his own. So the 'alienation' is put upon this person from an outward level. The person still let it happens though & doesn't address it, so it is in a sense a 'victim role' & prison (one of the traditional meanings).

So what I'm trying to say: with this card I personnaly notice I have the tendency to look at the inner convictions of a person, but I'm starting to think that more often than not, the outward world (other people) have a lot to do with the position of the querant. So I'm not sure that looking at 'self blame' & 'how did you get here' is the only thing in this card. It can help of course to change perspective & feel better, but maybe it's sometimes good to realise that you didn't just get in this position by your own actions, but that the reality is that people really did put you in a certain corner in which case that should be the realisation of this card.

What do you think of that? And what are your experiences with this card? And what kind of less traditional meanings have you noticed? Or does it in fact reflect the mind very often for you?

Thanks

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Jessica2407
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From: Saturn
Registered: Sep 2012

posted October 23, 2013 03:47 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jessica2407     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Twirl,

This card has a special meaning for me because it is The Card that represents someone I have come to know and understand during the course of time. In every spread I make and at times I just have to concentrate on the image of that person and I happen to pull the 8 of swords.I shall come back to this thread and post my thoughts and understanding of that card with respect to the person I know when I find some free time!

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Twirl
Knowflake

Posts: 2410
From: Europe
Registered: Mar 2013

posted October 23, 2013 03:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Twirl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jessica2407:
Hi Twirl,

This card has a special meaning for me because it is The Card that represents someone I have come to know and understand during the course of time. In every spread I make and at times I just have to concentrate on the image of that person and I happen to pull the 8 of swords.I shall come back to this thread and post my thoughts and understanding of that card with respect to the person I know when I find some free time!


Hey Jessica!

That's very cool. I wonder what you will come up with. My mind started racing straight away with what it could mean for you, but I'll bite my tongue & wait for your views of the card After all, I was interested in other's experiences

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littlecloud
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posted October 23, 2013 11:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for littlecloud     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I look at it as a combination of both. The outside circumstances force this sort of victimization that is hard to walk away from. You feel trapped like you have no choice, like fulfilling a prophecy because you expect it to happen and act in such a way that ensures it will.

This card would come up a lot when asking how a guy felt about me, this and 5 of swords. We had a rather bad falling out, cursing and everything, my intentions had never been to hurt him but because he was a man of principle he felt he had to act a certain way. We eventually started talking again, but it's not the way it once was and we never really talked about the subject, kinda letting bygones be bygones.

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Jessica2407
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From: Saturn
Registered: Sep 2012

posted October 24, 2013 01:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jessica2407     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Lol Twirl

Okay got a few minutes to spare.

The 8 of swords for me represents a person who is 'difficult' to understand by other people.So they kinda get used to being alone because they are misfits or they alienate themselves for fear of getting hurt. A person who is complicated in their heads either because they don't see things the same way as 'normal' people would or because they prefer to engage themselves in much less obvious choices and decisions that are most of the time not understood by their peers. They are hard on themselves and they will never acknowledge that fact,such is their defense mechanism to ward off 'potential harms' because they feel threatnened all the time, their mental processes are most of the times against their emotional well being but deem to be the most appropriate actions to ensure their well being as a whole. I hope I'm making sense. Their issues are most of the times emotional, that relate to past disappointing events in their lives that have been marked forever in their minds. Words or actions that have been ingrained in their subconscious for years and they live with them without much expression because it hurts them to acknowledge the pain.So they end up jeopardising their own well being by over rationalizing their actions.However, feeling sorry for them is NOT the way forward because they are pretty good at identifying your own weaknesses that will be used without remorse to satisfy their emotional needs. They are awkward with the expression of emotions because verbal expression is something that hurts for them. Gosh I could go on with the 8 of swords but I think I'd stop here for the time being.

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Twirl
Knowflake

Posts: 2410
From: Europe
Registered: Mar 2013

posted October 24, 2013 03:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Twirl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hey Guys,

Oh, that's lovely how you both view the eight of swords. Very interesting description too, Jessica. Is that also greatly based on you friend & how you see him/others see him?
I do see some of your description, that I would find fitting for the 9 of wands. Is that by any chance also a card often showing for this friend?
I like the being 'stuck on thoughts from the past' & alienating themselves through those thoughts too.

And feeling trapped through outside circumstances, I can also see, LC.
I also see it a lot for people who 'can't get you out of their mind' or viceversa, lol.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this card!

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Jessica2407
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From: Saturn
Registered: Sep 2012

posted October 24, 2013 04:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jessica2407     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hey Twirl,

Yes, it's purely based on my cards with respect to my friend. I was going to come to the part where this card also represent how they can't get you out of their minds.Because I think the bondage is basically in their minds. Their mental activity is twice as much as any normal person. They overthink every morsel of info and actions and words are runned in their minds over and over searching for flaws or for the slightest indication that you will leave them or abandon them thus confirming their initial fears.9 of wands would be how they react towards you when these fears and emotions are awaken,their reactions are exagerrated and or over emotional AND they are good at playing the victim card. But the 8 of swords to me is as if they can't attack you verbally nor can they defend themselves from your reasoning of how things should be, to me it's like the hanged man which is another card I pull very frequently with regards to this person.8 of swords highlights a passive aggressive stance.

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Twirl
Knowflake

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From: Europe
Registered: Mar 2013

posted October 24, 2013 10:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Twirl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for your thoughts Jessica

quote:
Originally posted by Jessica2407:
A person who is complicated in their heads either because they don't see things the same way as 'normal' people would or because they prefer to engage themselves in much less obvious choices and decisions that are most of the time not understood by their peers.

How would you feel if I say that the person actually isn't that complicated, but became to belief he or she is, because others (the 'normal people') have said so.
Would that be fitting to you & along the lines you are saying here?

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littlecloud
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posted October 24, 2013 11:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for littlecloud     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh damn...I'm the 8 of swords :-( *hangs head* 95% of what Jessica said applys to me and makes a lot of sense in that reading you were helping me with Twirl. It makes a lot of sense this way with the 8 of cups following wihich is the struggle to leave behind this thinking.

I'll have to post a picture of the cards so you can see what I mean.

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Twirl
Knowflake

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From: Europe
Registered: Mar 2013

posted October 24, 2013 11:21 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Twirl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by littlecloud:
Oh damn...I'm the 8 of swords :-( *hangs head* 95% of what Jessica said applys to me and makes a lot of sense in that reading you were helping me with Twirl. It makes a lot of sense this way with the 8 of cups following wihich is the struggle to leave behind this thinking.

I'll have to post a picture of the cards so you can see what I mean.


Awww
Luckily you are also the page + the 8 cups is highly spiritual

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Jessica2407
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From: Saturn
Registered: Sep 2012

posted October 25, 2013 01:21 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jessica2407     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Twirl:
Thanks for your thoughts Jessica

How would you feel if I say that the person actually isn't that complicated, but became to belief he or she is, because others (the 'normal people') have said so.
Would that be fitting to you & along the lines you are saying here?


Hmmm well yes but not quite.

They ARE complicated because that's how they are wired. BUT being complicated doesn't mean you get rejected or abandoned because of it. They are MADE to feel guilty for who they are, for how they think, for the ways they differ from 'other' people. They are told that nobody would want, nobody would stick by them. Nobody wants someone who is as complicated as them. Imagine how much the ego suffers when it was made to feel less for who s/he is when s/he is compared to another man/woman who happens to be more physically attractive for instance.I'm just taking an example. I also think that people who are represented by the 8 of swords are VERY strong in their heads, their despair and loneliness becomes their strength if that makes sense. They will never get involved in meaningless relationships like you know just dating or fooling around. What I mean is they can withstand years of loneliness. AND they are very intuitive people. Nevertheless they will seldom act on their intuition because doing so will cause them harm or so they think.

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littlecloud
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posted October 25, 2013 01:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for littlecloud     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Omg!!! Jessica!!! You're in my head!!! *hides in corner* the above is very true and a lot of other people have a hard time understanding why I think the way I do. Well I haven't been taught otherwise! If so many people are telling me the same thing, than how can it not be true? In some type of reality, it is true, and it doesn't matter whether I believe it or not, everyone else does!

At the end there you made it not sound so bad lol. You hit many nails on the head there. The bit about using someone else's weaknesses against them, I don't do that, only in the rare case that I see I'm extremely threatened and don't care for the consequences. Other than that I usually can pick out someone's weakness fairly easily but I use it as a way to understand them, not bring them down.

It's a very lonely place to be and I've been here for years. My mind is my solace and my prison. It's where I'm trapped but it's also where I've been able to survive some nasty **** . The hardest part is trying to reprogram your thinking, to move away from the negativity holding you down because at the end of the day you're safe but not whole and I want to be whole again. If I can even remember what that feels like.

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Twirl
Knowflake

Posts: 2410
From: Europe
Registered: Mar 2013

posted October 25, 2013 02:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Twirl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
@LC: I think it's very common for 8 of swords behaviour to belief (and thus recognise yourself) completely in this

Breathe in...
Breathe out...

For me 8 of swords is really the believing in what the others said you are & thinking, 'yes, they are right'. That's what gives it a powerless feel, the identifying with THEIR image. After all, when you were raised as a penny, you will never be a pound, etc. So you admit to those opinions and really, that's just how imaging works. People always have a certain image of you (most often not that reality based at all) and when you think they are right then you get into that behaviour, because you belief that of yourself. I've heard the most flattering & most unflattering things about how I supposedly am & they could be completely diverse and mostly they were untrue.
One can be akward in one group of people, a genius artist in another surrounding. It's all in the eye of the beholder...
- I just woke up. Not have my contacts in. lol. 'm sending this now-

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Twirl
Knowflake

Posts: 2410
From: Europe
Registered: Mar 2013

posted October 25, 2013 02:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Twirl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks Jessica. Very insightful.
I still think the end conclusion should be that it's the crowd who surround them, that made them judge how they are (no room for expression the self) & feel they deserve this. So it's a 'farce' in a sense, because we are not defined by our surroundings. Even if that's a common belief system. They will see that when the 8 of swords reverses.

quote:
Originally posted by Jessica2407:
Hmmm well yes but not quite.

They ARE complicated because that's how they are wired. BUT being complicated doesn't mean you get rejected or abandoned because of it. They are MADE to feel guilty for who they are, for how they think, for the ways they differ from 'other' people. They are told that nobody would want, nobody would stick by them. Nobody wants someone who is as complicated as them. Imagine how much the ego suffers when it was made to feel less for who s/he is when s/he is compared to another man/woman who happens to be more physically attractive for instance.I'm just taking an example. I also think that people who are represented by the 8 of swords are VERY strong in their heads, their despair and loneliness becomes their strength if that makes sense. They will never get involved in meaningless relationships like you know just dating or fooling around. What I mean is they can withstand years of loneliness. AND they are very intuitive people. Nevertheless they will seldom act on their intuition because doing so will cause them harm or so they think.


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