posted January 19, 2008 05:37 AM         

By the word "dishonest" I am not thinking about people who say a few white lies (or even black ones) because of circumstances. I am not thinking about people in situations where being dishonest was the only choice. I am not thinking about those who are cornered and they had to escape.

I am thinking about those who have chosen dishonesty, consciously and knowingly. They could get ahead with serious preparation and a little hard work. But they do not like the path. They tend to think "If you can earn a lot, without any work, just by pulling a few tricks on people, it is just a waste of time spending all those hours on upgrading and preparing."

They chose to be dishonest as a simple solution, a shortcut, that would require less energy and more fun.

And there is something with them that just does not add up. Such guys are religious and some of them even full time devotees.

They would visit their religious centers with great devotion and passion. They wake up every morning with their cd player singing devotional songs. They advise that faith will work miracles.

If they are so god fearing, then why do they choose the obviously wrong path? Do they believe and perceive God as a producer of shortcuts?

That contradiction in character is ununderstandable and I believe the dishonest guys themselves would not be able to explain their contradiction meaningfully (except by resortng to philosophy or rationalizations)

I see this in people who try to get rich by changing their car license numbers. They tell you with beautiful poetry, references and citations how life is controlled by the divine forces of the planets and man would not realize he is powerless against them. If you do not have power over the forces from the planets, then why do you try to change them?.

If the forces in astrology would hold, and you are powerless against them, then what is the point of changing them?

posted January 19, 2008 06:35 AM         

The world has become so diseased with lies and deceit.

The world is crying out for honesty.

No-one knows who they can really trust any more.

Without honesty, there can be no intimacy.
It is a lonely journey.

Sure, a dishonest person can still be good in other ways.
I feel that there is beauty in everyOne.

However, we always need to keep growing and working on ourselves.
There is nothing we can't do- no problem that can't be overcome.....in time, with the required amount of action.

"Actions speak louder than words".

Lyrics from Teardrop by Liz Fraser:

Love, love is a verb
Love is a doing word
Fearless on my breath
Gentle impulsion
Shakes me makes me lighter
Fearless on my breath

Teardrop on the fire
Fearless on my breath

Nine night of matter
Black flowers blossom
Fearless on my breath
Black flowers blossom
Fearless on my breath

Teardrop on the fire
Fearless on my breath

Water is my eye
Most faithful mirror
Fearless on my breath
Teardrop on the fire of a confession
Fearless on my breath
Most faithful mirror
Fearless on my breath

Teardrop on the fire
Fearless on my breath

Stumbling a little
Stumbling a little

posted January 19, 2008 11:01 AM         

quote:

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Can a dishonest man be a spiritual, religious, god fearing citizen?

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Spiritual?
He may think he is whilst immersing himself in certain new age books and think by doing yoga or meditating, or dangling a crystal around his neck or waving a smudge stick about, chanting something found written on an
angel card from his pre-packaged kit he purchased from Shanti Poo Poo Gaia Mystic Supreme Mother INC.,complete with a healer's certificate offer(he can send back in for $100 and get his Reiki certificate etcetera) and his certificate saying he is a real psychic medium and and invitation to go to a psychic retreat(send in $$$ and buy even more "proof" of his spirituality)...
Yes...
he may believe that he is a spiritual man...
Or he does it because it is trendy and that is as deep as it goes.

Religious?

Oh my yes!
A very common thing!

But truly devout and understanding?...
and not just running with the "program"...then NO I do not think so.

posted January 22, 2008 09:55 AM         

As for your question about the planets:

quote:

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If you do not have power over the forces from the planets, then why do you try to change them?

---

"A wise man rules by the stars.
A fool is ruled by them."
- Hermetic Axiom

Adapting, and changing oneself,
in response to the provocations of the planets,
so as to more easily accord with the will of the planets,
is a far cry from "trying to change the planets".

We do not change a king, or rule over him,
when we carry out his will, or adapt ourselves to it.
The king's will is to reward or punish us -
we may, by our actions, "change" his response
from punishing to rewarding,
but, really, we dont change anything.
We do exactly as he wanted in the first place -
he would have been as happy to reward us as to punish,
since it is all the same to him;
it is one action,
and whether we experience it
as "reward" or as "punishment"
depends not on any change in the king's will,
but, a change in our relation to his will.
Whether we are rewarded for agreeing,
or punished for diagreeing, with his will,
we remain, nonetheless, subject to it.

And just because you are destined to do something,
and know you are destined to do it,
doesnt mean you know how, what, when, why, etc.,
or that you can undermine your own destiny;
or take precautions against one planet,
without obeying the stronger provocations of another planet.

posted January 22, 2008 10:26 AM         

quote:

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Deception is the child of self-deception.

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Self deception is also the child of denial and self delusion.
What an awful "family" tree.

Denial begets Delusion
Delusion begets Self Deception
Self Deception begets Deception/Deceiving
Deception/Deceiving begets Lying and or leads to begetting a more powerful form,
A child who is blend of Self Deception and Deceiving.
Concepts of truth elude them.
They sincerely believe all is right with themselves and everyone else or things is what is screwed up.
Totally clueless.

posted January 22, 2008 10:51 AM         

quote:

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Can a dishonest man be a spiritual, religious, god fearing citizen?

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No, a dishonest person can never be spiritual.

Yes, a dishonest person can be religious.

And yes, a dishonest person will always be a god-fearing person, they can never rise to the level of God-loving person.

posted January 22, 2008 04:58 PM         

I think the most spiritual amongst us are probably the least vocal on their spirituality, but I could be wrong. I don't know the answer.

quote:

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Does God provide shortcuts?

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posted January 24, 2008 07:27 PM         

So, these people try to adapt certain parts of spirituality thinking it will be enough to pull them through. But it's not.

Religion on the other hand comes in segments. You can select and apply the parts that you feel are suited to you. By this I mean that a religious dishonest-person will justify their behaviour by knowing that it will be seen as a sin. But, all they have to do is confess this sin and repent. And all may be forgiven.

Spirituality is different because it affects you at a soul level.

People can only change if they want to change. There are plenty that acknowledge they need to change but just won't step over that fear threshold. And then, it's only really lip service with no action and they are stuck in this lack-of-growth cycle.

I don't think God (or the Universe) provides shortcuts but I do believe that some lessons and consequential healing can be fast-tracked. Not for the liars, cheats and dishonest amongst us though. Only for those souls who exhibit trust, honesty, integrity and love.

posted January 24, 2008 07:48 PM         

quote:

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spirituality is a way of life - I don't feel you can turn it off or on. It's like being pregnant. You can't be a bit pregnant - you either are or you are not.

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posted January 25, 2008 08:47 AM         

quote:

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The enemy of spirituality is not dishonesty but pride.

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posted January 25, 2008 10:24 AM         

Shortly before his death,
a woman correspondent complained to him
that the road to clarity and moral
freedom was a painful struggle and a never-ending conflict. His rather impatient
reply was, "What are you writing me of your inner conflicts? To have these is obviously the trait of all humans--that is, all of those who are above the ordinary...
It causes great pains but also extreme joy."

~ on Fyodor Dostoevsky