posted January 17, 2009 04:28 AM         

Some of the Spiritual Rationalizations that are very frustrating are:

"It happened for your good" - Evidently not. What happened did not happen for my good.

"God gives not what you want, He gives you what you need" - No. He gave something that I cannot even bear.

"You have to live your Karma" - Another popular spiritual rationalization, it actually means you did something wrong even though you may not remember it. But it may be true. At least it says that you too are responsible for your fate not God alone.

People ask themselves at critical points in Life "Why God gives me all these sufferings?". And the rationalizations given are convincing enough to that person - though wrong. Even Bible had a chapter devoted to it - I think it is titled "Job". Even in Bible God does not reveal the reason for sufferings.

The truth is there is no real answer to the question so far. Because the question is based on the mistaken assumption that God is in charge. God is not in charge of our fate, we are in charge of our fate. It is painful to believe but it is the truth.

Many want to throw away the responsibility, the burdens to God and are perplexed when they suffer. May be it is a wake up call telling them to take charge of their life themselves.

It could be very difficult, while thinking all your life God was taking care of everything and then to be surprised when things go wrong. "Why God must do this to me?" Why indeed? The truth is God never did that to you. You did that to yourself.

I believe this is the key to spiritual evolution - the realization that you are responsible for your life - not a higher authority known as God.

posted January 17, 2009 07:16 AM         

Why God lets all the evil around us happen?

It's because you can handle it. What actions will you take as a result of any atrocities? If you are spiritual, then you should take at least one action. Your spirit will lead your hand. Your spirit may rationalise, but you should ignore any excuses, and DO SOMETHING. Action speaks louder than words, yeah? I won't answer the other possibilities, as I think you may be spiritual?

Cheers,
Dean.

------------------
I realized it for the first time in my life:
there is nothing but mystery in the world,
how it hides behind the fabric of our poor,
browbeat days, shining brightly, and we don't even know it.

Sue Monk Kidd, "The Secret Life of Bees", p79

posted January 17, 2009 10:58 AM         

To quote from Love Signs:

May be we shouldn't count on Him. May be the real truth is that He's depending on us...for some sort of ultimate miracle.

(Chapter: Sagittarius Man Capricorn Woman)

posted January 17, 2009 11:18 AM         

quote:

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Because the question is based on the mistaken assumption that God is in charge. God is not in charge of our fate, we are in charge of our fate. It is painful to believe but it is the truth.

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We are God`s hands and work together in a divine dance.

quote:

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May be we shouldn't count on Him. May be the real truth is that He's depending on us...for some sort of ultimate miracle.

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sufi parable: "Trust in Allah but tether your camel"

This saying comes from a small story. A master was traveling with one of his disciples. The disciple was in charge of taking care of the camel. They came in the night, tired, to a caravanserai. It was the disciple’s duty to tether the camel; he didn’t bother about it, he left the camel outside. Instead of that he simply prayed. He said to God, “Take care of the camel,” and fell asleep.

In the morning the camel was gone–stolen or moved away, or whatsoever happened. The master asked, “What happened to the camel? Where is the camel?” And the disciple said, “I don’t know. You ask God, because I had told Allah to take care of the camel, and I was too tired, so I don’t know. And I am not responsible either, because I had told Him, and very clearly! There was no missing the point. Not only once in fact, I told Him thrice. And you go on teaching ‘Trust Allah,’ so I trusted. Now don’t look at me with anger.”

The master said, “Trust in Allah but tether your camel first–because Allah has no other hands than yours.” If He wants to tether the camel He will have to use somebody’s hands; He has no other hands. And it is your camel! The best way and the easiest and the shortest way is to use your hands. Trust Allah–don’t trust only your hands, otherwise you will become tense. Tether the camel and then trust Allah.”

You will ask, “Then why trust Allah if you are tethering the camel?”–because a tethered camel can also be stolen. You do whatsoever you can do: that does not make the result certain, there is no guarantee. So you do whatsoever you can, and then whatsoever happens, accept it.

This is the meaning of tether the camel: do whatever is possible for you to do, don’t shirk your responsibility, and then if nothing happens or something goes wrong, trust Allah. Then He knows best. Then maybe it is right for us to travel without the camel. It is very easy to trust Allah and be lazy. It is very easy not to trust Allah and be a doer. The third type of man is difficult–to trust Allah and yet remain a doer. But now you are only instrumental; God is the real doer, you are just instruments in His hands.

------------------
~
What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world is immortal"~

posted January 18, 2009 05:33 AM         

In other words, you say we need to tether the camel and also trust God, because we have certain limitations, and beyond these limitations we have to rely on God. Though I can accept that we are instrumental in the hands of God, I see this problem differently. I see this problem from the one who tethers the camel and also the one who is stealing the camel. It is difficult to think of someone who steals as God's instrument. Why must someone steal your camel when they know it is unethical and it hurts you? There may be reasons and the thief may even justify his action. It is not only my problem, our problem and the God's problem, it is also the thief's problem. Those who commit atrocities have a problem, and they must realize it and must stop them voluntarily. As a whole it is humanity's problem. The thief must learn social responsibility. The truth is not all of us are the hands of God and it is the fundamental reason for evil to persist.

Many people do not tether the camel, trust God and when the camel is stolen, ask the question "Why did God let my camel to be stolen?". I have faced many difficulties and never once did I ask that question. I consider the tough times to be part of pressures from an ununderstanding society (society really meaning people who don't empathize with your problems and who are certainly not your well wishers), natural limitations, limitations due to circumstances, and things that are obviously not under my influence and no way for me to control them. Never once did I considered them to be doings of God. When people ask that question "Why me God?" I believe they are asking the wrong question. The question does not empower them.

quote:

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Maybe its your definition of "God" that needs revision.

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HSC, May I know how?

posted January 18, 2009 11:52 AM         

I think it makes sense to form a personal definition of God based on clear-eyed observation and experience.

What makes no sense to me is attempting to make your observations and experiences fit with some preconceived definition of God.

Most athiests think they are refuting God, when they are merely refuting other people's definitions of God.

As I see it, "Is there a God?" is a trick question...

That which is, is God, however you define It/Him.

And the heart of that which is, is the heart of God.

This can mean many things.

Each person ought to work out for themselves their own definition of God.

Marcel Proust wrote:
"The atheist forgets that what he is affirming is, precisely, a negation."

posted January 18, 2009 12:13 PM         

"God sees the truth, but waits."

Perhaps God, or the Universe, if you prefer,
is teaching you personal responsibility by "not being there"?

Personally,
I see God as the personification of the Universe,
and this personification is mythical, but also practical.
If the universe is worthy of reverence, it is worthy of the name "God".
In my experience, when our souls open we begin to see everything as alive;
even inanimate obects become imbued with will and personality.
Our dialogue with God is also our dialogue with "the big empty",
and with the hidden aspects of ourselves coming into consciousness.

Projecting the image of a personal God onto the great, faceless scape of being is, for me,
a way to encounter and dialogue with the most universal and profound aspects of myself.

This can only be understood when you reflect that "no man is an island";
and "myself" is, to speak precisely, "myself-in-the-world".

You are "you-in-the-world".

Moreover, God is "God-in-you".

At least, to the extend that you may know "Him".

"The proper study of man is man." ~ Francis Bacon

And that includes "God-in-man".

posted January 18, 2009 12:27 PM         

It is the faith to return to our contemplation of God every morning, and every moment.

It is trusting enough to release our worries just long enough to relax our minds.

And trusting that this relaxation will facillitate a more clear-eyed approach to our problems.

One way of looking at it says: "Trust in God, and do your best."

Another says: "Do your best, and leave it to God."

Its the same thing, depending on how you look at it.

The key is distinguishing between efficient action and useless worry.

Do your best, and know that the rest is out of your control.

Since it is out of your control, you leave it "in the hands of God".

It doesnt mean God will make everything comfortable.

What is in God's hands may really be out of control.

But that's okay. Let it go. Give it to God.

Not trusting that it will turn out well, but,
that it will turn out as well as it can.

Because you've done all you can.

A Chinese Proverb states:
"If you can do something about it, why worry?
If you cannot do something about it, why worry?"

All of this expresses, to my mind, what it means to trust God, and to "tether your camel".

Really, trusting God and tethering your camel are the same thing.

But that's another sermon, lol.

posted January 18, 2009 11:50 PM         

raj:

posted January 19, 2009 12:06 AM         

Juni ~ You've posted that story before and I loved it then.

What a blessing this conversation is... thanks to all of you.

posted January 19, 2009 08:29 AM         

w The trick is to free yourself and experience the all. God is as strong as the weakest link in the chain of existence.

i But I refute your God - that is your belief. It doesn't put food on my table or ensure the security of my family.

w If you trust in God, your family is already taken care of. God is as strong as the weakest link in humanity.

i I refute your humanity! You call people that cause atrocities humane? To be human is worse than an animal! Have you seen what people have done? The only answer is revenge!

w The only answer is compassion. God is as strong as the weakest link in forgiveness.

And so on. The ignorant man will never see the wise man's God - only his own, and that ego think will make his point of view so much more important and correct than the wise man. And yet, does the wise man learn something in this exchange?

posted January 19, 2009 10:09 AM         

The word God is more like the word Good. God represents the highest Good in all of us. He also represents the highest form of power, intelligence and ability.

Above all God is joy. Pure Joy.

When speaking about God I would like to use the metaphor Ocean. God is like an ocean and we are all droplets in the Ocean. If a drop needs to know the Ocean how would it do it? The essence of the Ocean is already in the drop and the drop could know the ocean by knowing itself.

God is in every atom of the cosmos. Unless you experience the pure joy that He is, you may not really experience Him.

You have to find God within yourself first. But some may find their spiritual evolution to be the in the opposite direction. Unless they experience God as an entity outside themselves, they may not be able to realize the God within them.

Sometimes God may want you to take care of things yourself and not rely on Him. May be that is the reason He sends crisis on your way.

posted January 20, 2009 01:24 PM         

That sums it up.

With the deeper meaning that no man is able to help himself without the help of God.

posted January 20, 2009 02:08 PM         

How about this one:

He is elected, whom has elected God.

posted January 20, 2009 03:40 PM         

Never , he does not exist in the first place only you exist everywhere.

God is and is not - Upanishad.

So if you lived half your life thinking God is now is the time to swing and look at the other side of the coin i.e God is not.

And vice versa for others.