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posted August 01, 2010 01:12 AM         

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hope i'm in the right room...?

i came across the below info and at first i was saying to myself, "yes, makes sense" etc when i came to the bit about the third generation not reproducing...which rang a bell from reading about experiments with GMO foods and rats...

and then, even though it DOES make sense to feed cats raw food not processed grains etc, i have NOT noticed a shortage of cats! as an in the field observer i would have to say that cats continue to reproduce on ALL kinds of diets. which, picky virgo merc that i am, undermines the argument for me. like many arguments before it lol! still it's worth considering, because the recommended diet may still be BETTER for your cat.

Dr. Pottenger discovered quite by accident that cats degenerated unless they were fed raw food. In his 10-year study of 900 cats, he found the optimal diet for his cats was 2/3 raw meat and 1/3 raw milk plus a little cod liver oil. If either the meat or the milk was cooked, the cats degenerated. And if both were cooked, the degeneration was much worse, and the cats could no longer reproduce by the third generation. Some of the problems Pottenger found in the cats fed cooked food were: heart problems; nearsightedness and farsightedness; underactivity and inflammation of the thyroid; infections of the kidney, liver, testes, ovaries and bladder; arthritis and inflammation of the joints; inflammation of the nervous system with paralysis and meningitis. And in the third generation, some of the cats' bones became as soft as rubber. Lung problems, and bronchitis and pneumonia were also frequent. Moreover, the females became irritable and even dangerous, and the males became passive and lacked sex interest. Clearly, there was a direct link between the cooking of meat and the resultant evidence of malnutrition in Pottenger's cats. Click here to learn more
http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/renalfailure.htm

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posted August 01, 2010 12:20 PM         

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anyway i am actually wondering if anyone has ever treated a severely ill cat completely naturally and how that went?

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Posts: 557
From: California
Registered: Apr 2009

posted August 02, 2010 02:27 PM         

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In his particular study, it was a closed experiment........the cats in the study were kept in a laboratory. The 3 generations were only given either raw meat / raw milk or cooked meat / cooked milk. Also, genetic diversity is reduced because the cats in the experiment are reproducing together. Is he bringing in new cats to reproduce? If not, the gene pool could have mutations and unfavorable genes.

The average cat food which can be bought off the shelf is adequate in nutrition, vitamins, minerals, so cats generally in the world do keep producing in a healthy manner, yes.

And YES there is an overabundance of cats and kittens..........this years kitten season is astronomical. I foster kittens for my local shelter........my shelter is so overloaded with kittens right now that they drastically reduced the adoption fee temporarily, and many kittens are still being kept in foster homes even if they are ready to be adopted, simply because there isn't room in the shelters yet for them.

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posted August 02, 2010 09:40 PM         

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well my 13 yr old orange tabby - buff and in blooming health every one of his 40,000 or so days, suddenly went off his food, started pooping bloody muck and even refusing water. the vet says it is "probably minor renal failure" ie, he is getting old so it must be his kidneys!! but he also puked blood yesterday. today he is much better but i am trying to decide what to feed him from now on. not sure i like the "low protein" suggestion which is apparently standard for older, kidney-compromised cats, especially since i have only had "probable" diagnosis...

on the other hand the raw food diet is really out of my financial range...

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posted August 02, 2010 09:49 PM         

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good on you for doing that! i don't know if i would be able to pass them along, so i don't volunteer, though i do go give cuddles and playtime to some rescue kittens at my local (pet store that is)...

unfortunately i think the raw diet is out of my range financially, but i'm a little wary of changing his diet for a "probable" diagnosis...

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From: California
Registered: Apr 2009

posted August 04, 2010 05:05 PM         

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Yes he probably has the renal failure Sad........I had to put my sweet girl to sleep years ago from it.........

I hope things have gotten better since the last time you posted and my reply today?

Good luck and best wishes

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posted August 05, 2010 04:28 PM         

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he is much better now, but bit my daughter this morning! lol now i have to worry about her. the vet thinks he has incipient chronic kidney stuff and low protein diet has been prescribed. the only way i can find out if it was a temporary, part of the infection he seems to have had, is by doing more expensive bloodwork...so going day by day at the moment.

my older cat's kidneys failed on her a couple of years ago. i nursed her in everyway possible for about 3 weeks but she finally refused my aid and died...this one has been super healthy up till now and is not really very old yet. we'll see i guess and meanwhile more research!! like i don't have enough to do already...

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From: California
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posted August 05, 2010 06:24 PM         

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Glad he is doing better, I totally understand about the $$ for bloodwork, the Vet charges are ridiculous......sooooo expensive......I hope he keeps improving

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posted August 05, 2010 11:19 PM         

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had a long chat with vet today and it seems the low protein prescription for aging cats with kidney issues is to make them more comfortable in the digestive area..does nothing to slow what is seen as the inevitable progress of chronic renal probs in older cats. and yet they push the special Prescription only foods which, she admitted, many cats never get a taste for!! even if it weren't prohibitively expensive the fact that you can only get it at the vets' seems criminal to me. and i can't imagine a cat eating food it hates for long. he's already not sick enough for that!!

i guess i am going to be at the old drawing board trying to figure it out for myself now...but he absolutely refused the subcutaneous fluids today and is eating (less than normal and not much water!) and up and about. comes to attention as normal when i get the food can out.

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From: California
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posted August 06, 2010 12:32 PM         

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I spend a lot of $$ on dog and cat food, I buy only very healthy brands.......right now my dog and cats are eating

"Taste of the Wild".

How did he refuse subcu? Did he fight?

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From: Columbus, GA USA
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posted August 10, 2010 04:07 PM         

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------------------
"I have found a desire within myself that no experience in this world can satisfy; the most probable explanation is that I was made for another world." -C.S. Lewis

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From: California
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posted August 16, 2010 11:46 AM         

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How is your cat doing??????

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posted August 16, 2010 12:07 PM         

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he's funny. seems fine, insists on going out, was eating really well for a couple of days but now getting fussy again.

with the subcutaneous stuff he just would not submit. started fighting and squirming too much for the needle. don't want to have to give it to him again, tho i know people whose cats have received same for YEARS in their older days. my cats don't like being "messed" with, though they have always been affectionate with me, too much fussing sends them ducking for cover at best, lashing out at worst. like me i guess. going to get some of the kidney-prescribed kibble today and see if he takes to it. though i found a grocery store kind that is half-way between that and his old stuff for protein content a friend who boards other people's cats and worked in a vet's for years says most older cats LOVE the stuff - my other cat was ADDICTED to science diet..after awhile on that she wouldn't touch ANYTHING else, although she continued to love brussel sprouts, a bite of salmon when we ate it, she would NOT convert to the special kidney stuff and wouldn't accept manual feeding either.

but apart from the sluggish appetite this one seems right as rain again. just hoping he is not drinking some nasty outdoor water and making himself ill again...cos keeping him in is cruelty in the small space i have.

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From: California
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posted August 16, 2010 01:31 PM         

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They could put a towel over his head so he can't see the process with the needle........

I hope he gets better

I'm not sure if Taste of the Wild would work for him but our cats and foster kittens all love it!!!

Whole Foods has raw dog food, not sure if they have raw cat food...........

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posted August 16, 2010 02:51 PM         

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well if low protein is the way we have to go to protect his kidneys, raw food is the exact opposite...thanks for the tips i will look em up! got some special kidney related kibble today and he went straight for it, so maybe not worrying about how much he eats for today while i look into longterm alternatives.

if he keeps insisting on going outside he is going to be catching high protein meals but he does seem to like the low-pro sd.

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posted August 20, 2010 01:06 AM         

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I've just read these posts, how is your cat
doing now Katatonic. Believe it or not the
only thing my 10 yr old female will eat are
Temptation cat treats, nothing else.So far
she's healthy.

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posted August 20, 2010 01:07 AM         

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I've just read these posts, how is your cat
doing now Katatonic. Believe it or not the
only thing my 10 yr old female will eat are
Temptation cat treats, nothing else.So far
she's healthy.

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posted August 20, 2010 02:39 PM         

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thanks cathy. like i said, he seems mostly fine - his old self - but he has started fussing a bit over food. if the can has been open more than a day he sniffs and walks away! i cleaned out the fridge extra well to make sure nothing was making the food smell bad...this cat has always been a cheap date" where food was concerned. he's 13 and until he got sick 2 weeks ago he would wolf down some wet food and graze on dry. two days ago he was doing the same! yesterday hardly ate at all. an ongoing mystery!!

of course i can't know if he eats when he goes out, or if he's getting into something that doesn't agree with him, but he's too well to stay in, no end of whining if i don't open the door for him!! i threaten him with fluids if he doesn't self-regulate lol..

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posted August 20, 2010 08:02 PM         

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I ended up posting twice as it seemed I had
to re-enter my password, so I figured I had
to. Anyway glad he's doing ok, mine is strictly a house cat, I lost my 14 yr old male last month when a neighbour hit him with his car.

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posted August 20, 2010 08:35 PM         

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my london cat was an indoor girl...except she used to climb over the balcony to next door's and hide under their beds. that was the big city and the door in and out was a heavy swinging one she couldn't manoever without help. so she stayed in until we got to cali and she discovered the great outdoors (tr. heaven)...

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posted August 20, 2010 10:58 PM         

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Mine just won't go out, she'll sit at the open door though.

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