posted May 01, 2012 12:09 PM            

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Originally posted by NativelyJoan:
Agreed. The truth is they don't care about the poor, they don't care about anyone but themselves. People serve as a platform for them to further exploit.

It all just goes to show the differences between the types of people these "religious right" actually are and the false image they project to the world. They're basically just out for themselves. They're pretty much Barbarians except Barbarians aren't ashamed to admit they don't give a d$mn about anyone else. It's quite a paradox really and sickening. I'm just waiting until these things known as religions are poof gone! It's time for people to take ownership for their actions and not hide from their true motivations. Religious affiliations will no longer act as a shield for people behaving badly and dividing the masses.

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Very true, this was just on ScienceDaily today in fact: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/04/120430140035.htm

posted May 01, 2012 12:29 PM            

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Originally posted by RegardesPlatero:
Just in general. I hear that a lot. Especially on childfree places (most childfree people are atheist, though not all). I'm childfree too and it can get off-putting sometimes. I just kinda want to go, "hey now, we're on the same side!"

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posted May 01, 2012 01:35 PM            

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:
Very true, this was just on ScienceDaily today in fact: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/04/120430140035.htm

The proof is in the pudding.

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Empathy is not the domain of the secular. Astrology teaches as much.

I was empathic when I was religious, and I am empathic now that I am no longer religious. Pisces moon, born in the Year of the Hare- whatever you want to call it.

My parents were religious and sacrificed so they could help poor people, and I know other people who are the same way.

What do we gain by making generalizations about this? A sense of superiority over religious people?

posted May 01, 2012 02:19 PM            

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Originally posted by Faith:
Empathy is not the domain of the secular. Astrology teaches as much.

I was empathic when I was religious, and I am empathic now that I am no longer religious. Pisces moon, born in the Year of the Hare- whatever you want to call it.

My parents were religious and sacrificed so they could help poor people, and I know other people who are the same way.

What do we gain by making generalizations about this? A sense of superiority over religious people?

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A lot can be gained from discouraging religion and ENcouraging secularism in general. Don't even get me started on that. All I have to say is - would you rather live in Saudi Arabia, or Switzerland?

posted May 01, 2012 02:21 PM            

Would you rather live in Saudi Arabia or Japan? (the latter is a conservative atheist state).

posted May 01, 2012 02:27 PM            

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Originally posted by Faith:
It's a shame that you say that. I know a lot of religious people who help the poor, without asking anything in return.

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posted May 01, 2012 02:40 PM            

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Originally posted by Mblake81:
In these days a lot of people talk about tolerance and equal rights. The fact is that most people look down on each other because of their occupation, education, appearance, religion, culture, gender, sexual orientation, color of one's skin and a lot more. There's discrimination, suppression and racism all over the world. I think a lot of misunderstanding rises up because of prejudice, not knowing other cultures, religions and maybe many people are afraid of that and so they act in a hostile manner.

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I completely agree with you. It's all just a reflection of human nature at this point in our human evoluton. You wonder why people are so xenophobic? Why are they so afraid of the unknown and what they don't know or understand? It's interesting. I'm very multicultural and have a deep seated respect for all cultures and a deep interest specifically in ancient cultures.

I see culture as a two edged sword. I sometimes ask myself: Can we be free and equal within a cultural community? Can we have freedom when living our lives through traditional customs and practices? Can we have culture without tradition? And where exactly is the place for freedom and acceptance in our cultural communities across the globe. Where is freedom within our cultural and traditional practices that seem to further exploit and divide humanity as a whole? How much do we really need culture? Can we exist without cultural communities and the need to identify ourselves with an outward identity. Have we evolved past the need to define ourselves by outside means? Who are we as individuals freed from our cultural identities? Humans fight to keep these structures in tact. Why not let them fall apart, so they could evolve and change. Why are we so resistant to change? We'll evolve regardless of our resistance to keep things the same, but why are people so intent on fighting it?

posted May 01, 2012 03:06 PM            

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:

A lot can be gained from discouraging religion and ENcouraging secularism in general. Don't even get me started on that. All I have to say is - would you rather live in Saudi Arabia, or Switzerland?

Enough said.

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I realize it's hard to make distinctions in cases where the religion causes widespread oppression of certain groups like women or children.

Still I think it's possible and desirable to discourage religion without making sweeping generalizations about the people who subscribe to these religions.

posted May 01, 2012 03:26 PM            

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Originally posted by Faith:

I realize it's hard to make distinctions in cases where the religion causes widespread oppression of certain groups like women or children.

Still I think it's possible and desirable to discourage religion without making sweeping generalizations about the people who subscribe to these religions.

We should exemplify tolerance and acceptance if we want others to do the same, right?

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I think that's fair enough, but I just wanted to point out that if you read the article, there's nothing all that offensive stated in it. It says:

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...researchers hypothesize that deeply religious people may be more strongly guided by a sense of moral obligation than their more non-religious counterparts.

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posted May 01, 2012 06:28 PM            

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Originally posted by NativelyJoan:
We don't even yet know how we'd manage to live in such a world, where differences and our individuality weren't used as a way to divide.

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http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?defid=690293&term=that%27s+the+way+the+cookie+crumbles

posted May 02, 2012 08:01 AM            

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Originally posted by NativelyJoan:
Oh sorry Faith, I wasn't talking about all religious people, just specifically the far right religious fanatics or religious fanatics in general. Yes they're definitely are religious people that help the poor I don't deny that. They are humans first. Compassion and empathy go beyond religion, it's an expression of universal love.

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I know far right fanatics who help the poor, too. I went through a phase where I was super religious, so I know a lot of these people personally, and I feel they are misunderstood.

Granted, I can no longer stomach their religion, and they have their faults. But I'd rather look at the good things about them.

Not trying to sound like a goody-goody who loves everybody, because I have just as much pent-up anger in my body as anyone, when I think of the horrible things that people do.

But I've learned that it's better not to dismiss any category of person, or insult people by the group. I try to make my criticism specific to a certain behavior or to one person at a time.

posted May 02, 2012 11:26 AM            

I'm a Libra and all about fairness, but I go off of what I know and what I've experienced. We are subjective beings and the world is what it is. If all you know is suffering how can you speak of happiness? You can't if you've never experienced it however you can theorize or hypothesize or even have faith (lol ) with the hope of an better situation. You learn and grow then adjust your viewpoints. Everything in a sense is relative, but you manage that with what you've experienced in life. We can't help the way we experience the world. If we don't learn what's wrong, will never learn what's right, so as we grow and learn we transform our judgments. I can only go off of my own experiences. The way far right religious individuals treat you, may not be the way they treat others. I'm an agnostic and most religious right individuals don't particularly like me. It's the way of the world, we haven't evolved yet.

posted May 02, 2012 03:39 PM            

I know some perfectly kind and rational Creationists.

posted May 02, 2012 04:52 PM            

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Originally posted by Faith:
^ Do you talk to many "right wing religious fanatics"? I feel like there exists a caricature of these people, and rumors about what kind of people they are....but not many people are really like that. I'm just wondering in what context you meet them.

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I grew up with some of them. Fanatical Catholics, and my sister is a Jehovah's witness. I went to a private catholic school growing up. This is the context. I've known these kinds of people my whole life. They've been in my household as a child, in my community and at school.

I know you're just trying to make a point Faith, but we can't put a value or measurement on experiences. I don't like to talk about my highly toxic religious environmental past. I'm still learning how to accept the decisions made by my parents in forcing me as a child to become something I didn't support or believe in (Christianity). The reason I've explained that we are different is to avoid getting into a long discussion about our pasts in order to measure experiences. Everything we've experienced in our past counts as valid reasons to develop particular judgments.

posted May 02, 2012 10:18 PM            

I was raised as a strict Catholic, too, and went to Catholic school K-12 grade. I refused to get confirmed because I couldn't stand that religion.

For some reason I always think of Protestants or Muslims with the "far right fanaticism"- maybe because the Catholics I've known don't seem to take their religion seriously. I mean, they do, but not like Protestants.

Anyway, I'll shut up now.

posted May 03, 2012 02:54 PM            

Lol, it's cool. We learned a bit more about each other and why we see the world the way we see it. It's all good things. It wasn't a bad discussion. I'm glad we were able to learn a bit more about the world and differentiating viewpoints through this discussion.

posted May 07, 2012 07:37 AM            

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Originally posted by Aquacheeka:

Some CF people can be extraordinarily extreme, that's true. Namely the ones who prefer animals to humans.

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*shyly raises hand*

I kind of prefer animals, to an extent, but mildly. Not every single animal, but like dogs. I love dogs. I care more about issues concerning the well-being of dogs than I do about some people-related issues, to be honest: not that I don't care about people at all, but dog issues touch my heart. I just have a soft spot for most dogs.

Hard to feel connected to a lot of people with whom I'm acquainted, but dogs are just pretty great.

posted May 07, 2012 09:32 AM            

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Originally posted by RegardesPlatero:
*shyly raises hand*

I kind of prefer animals, to an extent, but mildly. Not every single animal, but like dogs. I love dogs. I care more about issues concerning the well-being of dogs than I do about some people-related issues, to be honest: not that I don't care about people at all, but dog issues touch my heart. I just have a soft spot for most dogs.

Hard to feel connected to a lot of people with whom I'm acquainted, but dogs are just pretty great.

I'd like to have more friends, but I really feel like people don't like me/find things wrong with me. I don't dislike people exactly, but they tend to disappoint me. Not every single one, but many. I feel like I disappoint them, too.

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