posted December 29, 2008 04:27 AM           

As I have lost all my money, May 2003 (was betrayed over Internet Scam) now have seen, that in the Solar Return for 2003 Lilith was in my 10th house, conjunction Sun and square Jupiter in 12th (unknown people, foreigners). Also Pluto, ruler of my Natal 2nd was in 5th (Lotto) in square Moon in 8th. Moon square Pluto in Solar: I have always bad year.

I have only two Lilith aspects: opposition Venus and trine Mars. I have also Lilith sextile Pholus. I have no idea, what that means as I can't find aspects with Lilith.

Two years ago, I was told in German Forum, that my Lilith is not bad at all. It seems, that is very important in case with the money. In my Chart there is no other aspect of bankruptcy or betrayal.

What do you think about your Lilith?

I have Lilith at 29 degrees of Scorpio in 2nd house. Few days ago I have read, that such a Lilith position means bankruptcy.

Buena

posted December 29, 2008 04:43 AM           

When you go to Astro.com there is Lilith on the left side. The first is POF and the 3rd is Lilith.
I have seen also, that Lilith and Black Moon are the same. They are not?

Buena

posted December 29, 2008 05:06 AM           

Thank you for kind words.

As Murphy law is: if anything that can go wrong will go wrong.

Also my Solar that year: Sun in 10th house, some special place for SR Sun - nothing is true. If you don't have in Natal in 10th, then there will be nothing. I feel only good when my SR Sun in 7th house is as in Natal.

Buena

posted December 29, 2008 06:15 AM         

My true Lilith is retrograde conjunct my Sun with 22 minutes in Scorpio in 2nd
I think it is in synchronicity with my strong feminine traits,being a feminist as in believe in gender equality and that females can do anything that males can do and even better.

true Lilith seems like a shadow side of the Moon which is not necessarily bad.

My Sun trines Moon with 2'10 orb, and so my Sun aspects the Moon and its apogee. Therefore I have a very strong lunar energy in connection my Sun, and so strong feminine traits which could dominate over masculine traits. It makes sense, I knew only my mother.

my Mean Lilith is conjunct Uranus in Libra in 2nd within 1 degree. That could seem by belief in being liberalism in regards to women, attracted to liberal women.

Here is an interpretation of Sun conjunct Black Moon. It is from the free Canopus program from Clairvision.

I can strongly relate to this interpretation. This is pretty much all that I talked about in regards to my life and my father. It does mention that father can be absent and can be fought against. My father was physically absent(I never knew him,he disappeared when I was a year old),and I fought against my stepfather. I almost despised him. I had a strong disdain for his authoritarian nature. I haven't seen him since my mom broke up with him June 1990.

Sun-Black Moon conjunction:
Being conjunct to the Sun makes the Black Moon extremely powerful.
Especially (but not only) in a female chart, a major aspect of Black Moon to the Sun tends to create a 'Lilith character': strong-willed,stubborn, independent mind and lover of freedom, original,non-conformist, rebellious, passionately disliking routines and enslavement at large. Lilith was the woman who did not need Adam and left him - not a common thing to do in early biblical times - one reason being that she bluntly refused to lie under him during lovemaking.
There is a profound need to go beyond limitations of all kinds.
This, naturally, leads the native to challenge establishment. At times, it will create difficulties; a Lilith character does not hesitate to tell her/his boss what she/he thinks of him, and can't give a damn about consequences once she/he has made up her mind to do something.
The eyes shine, at times defiantly. The personality is sharp, with a marked taste for intensity. This, in Clairvision language,
corresponds to violent astrality - venom in large measure!
There are strong likes and dislikes, and a tendency to know immediately whether one likes someone or not.
This may have to do with the profound insights into the psychological motivations of other people. Being herself/himself so
well in touch with her/his shadow, the native has a fine understanding of other people's psyche. A Lilith character is often
subtle, with a great sense of nuances, and an EXTREME sensitivity.

Problems with the father:
With this aspect, it is not rare to find that the native had major problems with the father (especially in the chart of a female).
Either the father was absent, or perceived as absent, or was fought against.
There is likely to be some deeply rooted wound in the psyche, relating to the father, with profound consequences on the whole organisation of the personality.
In symbolical terms this conflict with the father goes far beyond childhood scenarios. It is the father image, in its widest meaning,which is involved here. Think of Lilith, angry at God for making her subjected to Adam's authority (and patriarchal establishment at large), and lamenting, "How could He [God the Father] do that to me?"
It is the same wound that you are carrying. It was so deep that it never healed.
When experienced on its highest level, a major aspect of Black Moon to the Sun can make the native quite psychic: premonitory dreams,intuition, natural affinity with the hidden mysteries of life, and clairvoyance.

True Lunar Apogee isn't the only astronomical point that conjuncts my Sun. The South Eris Node(diversity,divergence) conjuncts my Sun with 10 minutes of arc. Ixion,a kuiper belt object classed as a plutino, is only 5 minutes conjunct my Sun.

I would think that a conjunction to the lunar perigree would actually be an easier lunar influence because that's a conjunction to the point of the Moon's orbit that is closest to the Earth.

I was actually think of Black Moon Lilith today when I was eating dinner at the mall. I find it interesting that somebody made this Lilith post.

I thought that with Black Moon Lilith being the lunar apogee which is the point of the Moon's orbit most distant from the Earth that it could be about rejecting traditional female roles. An opposition to it which is same as conjunct the lunar perigree, might be more accepting of traditional female roles.

all objects have apogees by the way. all it is the most distant point of an objects orbit from the Earth.

My Mercury is only a few minutes conjuncts its apogee. Mercury at the most distant point of its orbit from the Earth. Therefore, My Mercury conjunct the shadow side of Mercury

posted December 29, 2008 06:22 AM         

With the time of birth given me by my father, I have BML exactly conjunct the Moon, no seconds to spare.

Some sources say problems in childbirth. Well that's not true, anyway you try to fit the facts.

Here is something (from Glaucus) from a previous thread :-
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/009918.html

quote:

---

Moon-Black Moon conjunction:
A major aspect of the Black Moon to the Moon tends to add depth and
stamina to it. The Moon, which by itself can be rather mellow, is
reinforced by the qualities of independence and originality
associated with the Black Moon, which many astrologers associate
with Lilith the rebel, the woman who was created at the same time as
Adam, not after him, and who separated from him because she could
not bear to be subjected to his authority.
The Moon and Black Moon are both related to the subconscious and
unconscious parts of the psyche. People with this aspect are likely
to be quite in touch with the depth of themselves.
Consequently, at times there will be extremely violent emotions -
the monsters of the depth are not buried far away, as they are in
most people; they tend to manifest more directly in the person's
mind.
But on the higher mode, the result of a Black Moon - Moon major
aspect can be an exceptional intuition. In particular, the person
can understand other people and feel what they feel as if they were
inside them. There is also likely to be easy access to clairvoyance
and higher aspects of spiritual Sight.
With this aspect, it is likely that the transits of the Black Moon
on the native Moon and Black Moon will be felt with great intensity.
On the lower mode, they may cause periods of emotional instability.
But on the higher mode (if the native has worked on himself/herself)
they may be times when great inner insights can be achieved, as well
as remarkable spiritual progress.

---

There is some truth in there, and just one small mainfestation is my impatience with some of the more simplistic interpretations of water voids. Can they feel? etc, these type of threads pop up in cycles.

None of my planets are in water signs. Though I have Scorpio rising, and my chart ruler, Pluto, is conjunct Moon/BML.

posted December 29, 2008 06:40 AM           

The meaning of my Lilith: it is not good for sex and less for the money. About money is the truth; about sex, it depends who is on other side or with me.

Hi BM,

We have here Sign and House position of Lilith. Where are the aspects?
Strange, I had them but don't know where?

Buena

posted December 29, 2008 07:06 AM           

I don't know either, but my Lilith position is right. I would like to have them somewhere else.

Here are three kinds of Lilith:

posted December 29, 2008 07:15 AM         

This talks about the astronomical and mythological symbolism of Black Moon Lilith
It's written by Juan Revilla. He is an astronomically-oriented astrologer

I. The True or Osculating Black Moon.

The true or osculating Black Moon is "a new arrival" into the pile of astrological "bodies" or sensitive points. It arrived in the early 90's, when it began to appear in published tables, at the same time than the centaurs. Like the centaurs, it requires research, hard work, and time. However, it is often neglected in place of the "mean" value, either because a lack of understanding of how fictitious the mean Black Moon is, or from the empirical evidence that validates it.

The Mean Apogee or Black Moon is an artifice, like the "fictitious Mean Sun" used by astronomers for the measurement of time. It moves very regularly, describing a perfect circle around the earth/moon barycenter (not the earth). Its movement is actually as round and regular as the hands of a clock and it is very easy to calculate. This roundness of its motion is not a good representative of the nocturnal and magic demoness Lilith; roundness and steady motion belongs to the Sun; it is alien to the world of the Moon.

The Osculating Apogee, on the other hand, represents the shape of the lunar orbit at one specific instant of time. It is not averaged as the mean apogee, and it is already geocentric, unlike the mean apogee. Some people reject it because it doesn't make any sense to them to have it swing as much as 30 degrees from the mean position and have abrupt and irregular changes of velocity and direction, but I think it is precisely this erratic behavior what makes it the best representative of the irrational, instinctive, and primal symbolism of Lilith.

This True Black Moon does not have the decades of astrological and interpretative elaboration that the Mean Black Moon has. It has been available only after 1992. You won't find simplistic formulas to make its interpretation easy. It requires research and willingness to try the new. It needs not receive the conventional meanings given to the round and astronomically featureless Mean Black Moon; but, as far as I am concerned, is the best symbolical representative of the demonical, nocturnal, and primal Lilith.

NOTE: for a long and detailed discussion of the astronomical difficulties and alternatives involved in the definition of the Black Moon, see my old compilation "An Astronomical Discussion of the Black Moon Lilith". For an answer to the common objections to the use of the osculating apogee, see my latest essay " Variants of the Apogee".

II. Astronomical Symbolism.

One important distinction is that the apogee/perigee axis is very different from the ascending/descending nodes axis, because at the nodes there is an intersection of 2 planes, like a meeting, or a door from one level to another, or a confluence of 2 worlds (the lunar and the earth realms).

But the apogee or the empty focus of the lunar orbit is a purely lunar realm. It is not in contact with anything. It is only the Moon per se, in isolation from everything else... therefore they are different concepts or orbital symbols. The apogee/empty focus (="kenofocus") is really like a womb, a receptacle, an accumulator, a point of emptiness...

As part of the "emptiness", this empty focus is also the place of dreams, the garden of desires, the pot at the end of the rainbow, the "impossible dream", the "primal mate", the twin-soul, etc... but this place is very, very dangerous... it can devour you like a whirlpool!

NOTE: everything here refers to the osculating lunar apogee, not the mean apogee. If astronomical symbolism must match astrological symbolism, then the mean apogee is very alien to this symbolism.

Astronomically, the Black Moon is an isolated point, a point of neglect, repression, fermentation, and "magical" transformations that belong to a phantasmal, nocturnal, and instinctive/erotic world. It contains all the more instinctual energies (including the atavistic wisdom and clairvoyance, which is dependent on bodily functions) deep within the psyche, of which sexuality is of course paramount, and which manifest themselves in fairy tales and in primitive lunar symbolism: the night, the mystery, the magic, the danger, the secret, the fear, that which is forbidden...

There is a dynamics between the 2 foci, they are seeing each other, like 2 twins, although one is physical and has weight while the other is absent and ghostly. It represents an absence, a ghost, an emptiness, like the emptiness of the womb or an unattainable ideal. Seen dynamically, there will be important differences between men and women... which is part of the dynamics of the 2 foci seen each other and getting polarized, fighting against a ghost and against emptiness, or trying to attain its invisible and ideal part.

posted December 29, 2008 07:26 AM         

remember.....Black Moon Lilith is the lunar apogee.....the point of the moon's orbit most distant from the Earth

the opposite point is the lunar perigree...the point of the moon's orbit closest to the Earth.

Therefore your Venus is conjunct the Lunar Perigree, and so your Venus has a lunar influence, and it does not involve the shadow side which is the Lunar Apogee aka Black Moon Lilith

I believe that astronomy is important to understand to get an idea of the astrological influence.

posted December 29, 2008 07:58 AM           

Thank you for explaining my Venus and Lilith.
Lunar Perigree is totally new to me. I must study a bit more about that.

Wish you all the best and more such a good informations as you do.

Buena

posted December 29, 2008 05:42 PM         

interesting

I have Sun conj True Black Moon Lilith,and I am male.

I thought it had to do with my having strong pastlife history as female,having many pastlives as female. I also think that it might have to do with karma involving females....especially with my Moon being the apex of a t-square with squaring opposition of Jupiter and Saturn-Neptune. My 12th house ruler Sun trines Moon though, and so could be good female karma too.

I think the the mean and true Black Moon Lilith work

my exgf has Moon in Scorpio square Mean Black Moon Lilith in Aquarius with only 1 minute of arc.
She is a feminist,believes females are minorities and she doesn't care for traditional feminine roles. She told me that her mother hates men and thinks that they can't be trusted because my exgf's father cheated on her and left her with no money before my exgf became a teenager. He screwed her really bad. She thinks that all men are bad and doesn't want her daughters being with men at all.

That's why my exgirlfriend broke up with me. She is very close to her mom,feels the need to be there for her. So very complicated.

What's ironic is that I don't fit traditional male stereotypes either. I am a male with strong feminine traits which leads me to be a feminist,believing in gender equality. I became more of feminist last summer by joining National Organization of Women. I donate monthly to Equality Action Fund. Therefore,her mom can't group me into the typical male category.

I don't believe that people should stereotype and hate people based on what a few people did. That's ridiculous.

posted December 29, 2008 06:20 PM         

quote:

---

I have them since ever at 29 degrees of Scorpio, in 2nd house. People with planets at 29 degrees of Scorpio are clairvoyants. I see less, than I should see.

---

Really?? I need to know more about this! Would the clairvoyant thing still be strong, as someone's planet's degree gets closer? eg, 27*

posted December 30, 2008 10:51 AM           

Now don't be scared or shocked when I post all about 29 degrees from our Astrologer in Belgrade.

THE SECRET OF THE 29TH DEGREE
OF EACH ZODIAC SIGN

Before I ventured into the astrological research of the secrets of the Zodiac degrees, I had, quite naturally, checked what the foreign astrologers wrote on the Zodiac degrees. My not being able to find anything on the subject did not surprise me. Namely, my rule has for a long time been to verify in practice both mine and somebody else’s various astrological big and small theories. If an astrological finding can be verified in practice, in real life, then I accept that finding as correct; and vice versa – if an astrological finding has not been verified in real life I ignore it as incorrect, a nonsense.
In the books on the Zodiac degrees written by foreign authors, the only degree that “passed” the test in practice and the symbolic of which was confirmed in real life is the 29th degree of each Zodiac sign. That degree means – clairvoyance, to be clairvoyant. Somehow, at the same time when I began searching for the meaning of this degree and finding its confirmation in practice, I met a young man who was known as a Clairvoyant Boban (15 May 1970, 2:08 AM, CET-1, 20E30, 44N50). Very soon I was convinced of his clairvoyance. Let us have a look at his horoscope: His Ascendant is at the 29th degree of Pisces. Neptune, the ruler of the Ascendant is at the 29th degree of Scorpio and the cusp of the 10th house at the 29th degree of Sagittarius.
Yet another chart which convinced me of the meaning of this degree – clairvoyance - belongs to my friend Nina (13 January 1963, 3:27 AM, CET-1, 20E30, 44N50) whose Ascendant is at the 29th degree of Scorpio. Pluto, the ruler of her Ascendant, is in the 9th house of her horoscope, i.e. the house which indicates everything that takes place during the university studies. She says: “During my studies I was incredibly lucky. I had an incredible feeling regarding the questions I was going to get at the exams; I knew exactly what I should study to pass exams …”. My friend Nina was not aware that for her clairvoyance regarding the questions at the exams she owed to the position of her Ascendant at the 29th degree of Scorpio and the position of the Moon at the 29th degree of Leo in her 9th house.
Just recently I got in touch with a girl who has been pursuing astrology for years. Her Ascendant (11 December 1974, 00:17 AM, CET-1, 21E11, 44N38) is at the 29th degree of Virgo. She said that when interpreting someone’s horoscope “… I spontaneously utter the sentences as if the saints from heaven tell me what to say…”. Certainly - “saints from heaven” - because Mercury (communication) the ruler of her Ascendant is in Sagittarius (in a wide conjunction with 4 more planets) square Jupiter in Pisces (saints).
I also predicted to a client of mine that she could easily become a minister only if she wanted to. In confirmation to what I’d said to her, she tells me that her friend often says: “And why don’t you want to be a minister …”? Her friend has the Sun at the 29th degree of Capricorn - the degree of clairvoyance. As Capricorn symbolizes negative response - to say no - his words perfectly explain the 29th degree of Capricorn (And why don’t you want - 29° of Capricorn – to be a minister?).
I might have already written somewhere that my readers who often told me “… You really write like a professor …”, actually prompted me to open my school of astrology. When I got acquainted with my first group of students at my first lecture and having realized that the true astrology lovers who had been occupied with astrology for 10-15 years, such as myself, were sitting in front of me I, as their teacher, felt an irresistible urge to somehow impress them.
What did I do? I started watching the X-Files from the astrological viewpoint and making the astrological chart of each installment and everything taking place in it, interpreting the chart of that installment. Simply, nothing happens by chance. Everything is predetermined by the position of the planets.

For studying the 29th degree the installment of Clyde Bruckman’s Final Rest is interesting. This installment was on the TV Pink channel on 11 November 1998 at 23:05, (CET-1, 20E30, 44N50), in Belgrade. What happened in that installment? In the town of Saint Paul somebody was killing clairvoyants, the people who, in various ways, “were able to read” human destiny. Naturally, Skali and Molder were interested in that case. They came to that town where they met the life insurance agent Clyde Bruckman, also a clairvoyant, and he informed them in detail about the killings which were going to take place. At the very end of the installment, we learned that the killer was Puppet, the hotel courier, a clairvoyant himself. How can one see that in the astrological chart of the beginning of this installment? The first thing we may notice is that the Moon at the 29th degree of Leo sign is in the 1st house – i.e. the main subject, the main heroes (the Moon in Leo) of this installment were clairvoyants (29°). When analyzing deaths and killings it is expected to start from the 8th house of the horoscope. The cusp of the 8th house begins at the 15th degree of Pisces. This house describes both victims and killers. Jupiter in the 8th house indicates many (Jupiter) victims. It is not surprising that the ruler of the 8th house occurs at the 29th degree of Capricorn and therefore, victims are clairvoyants (29°). The eighth house also describes the killer. That house begins in Pisces and, as it is known, that sign rules the hotels. The cusp of the house at the 15th degree (the degree with the symbolic of Gemini – messenger, courier) tells us that the killer (the 8th house) is the courier (15°) of the hotel (Pisces). Neptune, the ruler of the 8th house, is placed in the 6th house (work, worker), which also tells us that the killer (Neptune, the ruler of the 8th house) works (the 6th house) in the hotel (Pisces, Neptune). Neptune (the killer) at the 29th degree (clairvoyance) tells us the assassin is also a clairvoyant.
If you were naive enough to think that all this “coincided” by chance, let us have a look at the horoscope of the installment of the X-Files titled Paper Heart which was on the TV Pink channel on 23 December 1998, 23:02, CET-1, 20E30, 44N50), in Belgrade. What happened in this installment?
Molder had nightmares about some light leading him to a park where he finds the dead body of a girl. When he woke up, he found that park and the body of an innocent victim. In order to find the murderer, Molder recalls the serial killer whom he sent to prison a couple of years before. The murderer was a salesman who kidnapped girls and sexually abused them. He got in touch with him and learned that this serial killer had kidnapped his sister. Molder released the serial killer who subsequently ran away and hid in the old buses junkyard…

How could all this be seen in the horoscope
of the beginning of this installment?
The Ascendant of the beginning of this installment is at the 24th degree of Virgo, and that degree has the symbolic of Pisces (as well as the 12th degree of any sign); the Moon is at the 0 degree of Pisces – both Pisces degree and Pisces sign rule dreams and hence, the installment began with Molder’s dream. Molder dreams about a murdered child. In astrology, Mercury symbolizes child while Pluto symbolizes a corpse. In the horoscope of the beginning of this installment, Mercury (child) is in conjunction with Pluto (corpse). In astrology, a kidnapper is symbolized by Pluto which, in the horoscope of this installment, is at the 8th degree of Sagittarius. Molder recalls the kidnapper of children (Pluto – kidnapper, conjunction - Mercury – children), who sexually abused children (Pluto at 8° - Scorpio degree – sex ) and murdered them (also 8°). He is in prison – Jupiter, the ruler of Pluto in Sagittarius, placed in Pisces – prison. That person used to work as a traveling salesman (Pluto in the 3rd house - trade) – Pluto conjunction Mercury (trade). He sold vacuum cleaners – Pluto, conjunction Mercury (air) at the 10th degree (Capricorn degree – something dirty). Molder learned that he had kidnapped his sister too – Pluto (kidnapper) in the 3rd house (sister). Molder released the kidnapper (Pluto – kidnapper, sextile Uranus – freedom) who ran away (Pluto – kidnapper, square Moon in Pisces – escape). He hid at the old buses junkyard – Pluto (kidnapper, but also the junk yard) conjunction Mercury (means of transportation) in Sagittarius – large-size means of transportation (buses) which are old (Mercury at the 10th degree with the symbolic of the 10th sign of Capricorn – old)! The kidnapper was killed – Pluto (kidnapper) at the 8th degree of Sagittarius (8° - Scorpio – death). Fascinating, isn’t it?
So, nothing happens by pure coincidence, everything has been determined by position of the stars …
Well, let us get back to our subject matter – the 29th degree of each Zodiac sign - we may now state with certainty -means to be clairvoyant, clairvoyance.
This degree is active in the chart of the author of this book, as well. The cusp of my 10th house is at the 29th degree of Taurus and Jupiter, the co-ruler of my Sun, is at the 29th degree of Virgo. I must admit that many people think that I am second sighted. I reject this as untrue and know that my accurate forecasts are the result of my astrological knowledge. However, when it comes to the mundane astrology, I have always had a feeling that some invisible hand guided me towards dealing with subjects essential for our community and the world in general …
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