posted June 02, 2009 07:52 PM         

I constantly have people coming up to me and demanding attention, whether it is the Leo "look at me" attention, the need to feel superior and crap on me or the Scorpionic "suck the life out of me thing".

It's happening with a couple of people in my life. Mr 23's career demands can be so great that it can be crushing and it has required me to sacrifice my independence.

Another friend for example rings me up two or three times a day and demands attention for her issues in her life or I have to see her every second day even though I've stressed on multiple occasions that I am introverted and need space. I still love her as a person and her genuine nature.

Other friends NEVER call me and when I don't call them, they let me know, yet I make the effort to visit them when I am in my hometown (1800 km away) or occasionally give them the interstate phone call and hardly visit me here.

This is not to mention parental issues and former work place issues.

I feel that I am constantly used. I feel that my desires and what I want is never listened to or achieved. I feel that I always have to give and do what others want. I feel that I am an emotional sink that people use to dump their emotional dysfunction on me. I feel so tired, that I have nothing inside anymore, I feel drained.

This morning I said to Mr 23 that there is something that I wanted done and it has bothered me for the last 18 years but I've never gotten it done because of lack of money, time or support. He said to me that he didn't realise that this desire was so strong (even though I have told him in gentler terms once or twice before) and said he would assist.

I have a real problem with expressing to people to back off and give me space in strong terms. I either get snitchy at them and they get offended or I disappear from for a while and they don't understand because they then see me always as cool with it.

As I've just written this post the friend called and told her to back off for a few days for the first time. I feel bad for her now and I hope that she isn't offended even though I told her that I love her.

I also feel very sensitive to other people's auras or emotions that it deeply troubles me and it gets encased in me and I have no barriers to it. I've discussed this issue as my Moon on the DC but again, no one really listened as usual (except Belage off memory)

I find it so hard to be Aqu with Libra Moon. I am constantly focussed on the other and feel that I give. I think also people use me for my expansive and good nature as I have Jupiter in the 1st and they never help. I've had to do a lot of things in my life by myself with half the support that other people get. My drives and desires are never expressed because I have Mars opp Neptune and unaspected Venus.

What do you think? How can I correct these issues?

I think part of the solution maybe my NN in Sco/8th. I need to learn how to use others for my own needs and desires and need to develop my own power. I've learnt material possessions don't help either, it makes me feel guilty that I give myself attention and that I'm wasting money (Tau/2nd SN).

posted June 02, 2009 08:41 PM         

No, I don't have any Aqua, and I do have a Cancer SN. Detaching is hard... I would say it takes time to process being there for people.
Empathy is a b!tch.
You don't have an unaspected Venus though - it's trine Jupiter, sextile Moon...

I think your Chiron looks tough too!
It's right in the 1st as well... I wouldn't be surprised if people just viewed you as a healer of sorts.

I don't know much about Scorpio NN.

"I have a real problem with expressing to people to back off and give me space in strong terms. I either get snitchy at them and they get offended or I disappear from for a while and they don't understand because they then see me always as cool with it. "

posted June 02, 2009 08:57 PM         

I think it's truly a confidence thing. You need to assert yourself. You need to stop living for other people, and put your own needs first. That means expressing your TRUE opinion. So if your friend calls and wants to talk about her issues, tell her that you're not in the mood to talk if you don't want to chat with her. Just be honest! You'll feel so much better.

posted June 02, 2009 09:02 PM         

Yin,
A Libra Moon
with Aqua Asc.

posted June 02, 2009 09:03 PM         

I think libra moon gets abused cos you are so lovely and full of goodness. Libra finds it hard to say no.

posted June 02, 2009 09:36 PM         

quote:

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I think part of the solution maybe my NN in Sco/8th. I need to learn how to use others for my own needs and desires and need to develop my own power. I've learnt material possessions don't help either, it makes me feel guilty that I give myself attention and that I'm wasting money (Tau/2nd SN).

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Wait! I don't think that your NN lesson is to learn how to use others for your own needs and desires! Well, since your NN is in Scorpio/8th house, your lessons here might be learn to understand your deep needs and desires, and also the needs and desires of others, through deep (and often intimate) interactions with others. You might have to deal with either yours or other people's deep life and psychological issues, and learn what it means to go into such depths.

With Jupiter on the Aries AC, and then Moon on the Libra DC, you might seem very nice, generous and positive to others. Libra DC also cares for other people, although not deeply and there's also still a need for independence.

Also, Sun opposes Saturn in the 4th house, so I wonder does this show the need of being alone from time to time. And Uranus is also squaring Sun, which might also add the need to escape from time to time.
Mars is opposed to Neptune, so I wonder if sometimes you want to do something yet you're unsure about it?

posted June 03, 2009 01:40 AM         

Oh, Libra Moon. Me too.

posted June 03, 2009 06:03 AM         

I too have:
Aries Asc ( 13 degrees )
6th House Pluto in exactly 11.3 Libra
Libra Moon (Mine is 6th House though)
Mercury in air sign [Gemini]
Uranus in Scorp 7.5 and Neptune in Sag 14.4

but
my Sun is in 3 Cancer. Exact Opposite.

The Aries Ascendant is full of life giving energy, honesty, zest, verve, ideas, action and all of this without the Leo "look at me, aint I great" pride. AA's cannot accept charity. AA's find it difficult to say no to helping others due to EGO. "How can I not be able to help?" is the thought pattern.

Whether astrologers accept ot not, the mathematical fact will always remain that Pluto is the true ruler of Aries. I gave a synchronicity of Superman. Every astrologer will unanimously agree that the Aries Asc is the Superman of the Zodiac. And Superman was seeded into the collective consiousness in the 1930s, after Pluto's discovery.

Now for me and for you, Pluto is virtually on the Descendant and is in the 6th House which is NOT Virgoan but Piscean in Nature. Hence it will fall for empathy seekers and sympathy seekers. Psychic Vampires seek us out like bears hunting for honey after hibernation. The Cardinal Sun also gets a kick out of "leadership" in helping/assisting. The Libra Moon will confuse our inner conflicts with regular intervals. "I am being used, no I am not, yes I am... " ad infinitum.

The solution is to be seen in a Tom and Jerry Cartoon. Tom begs Jerry to let him in as it is freezing outside. He then throws Jerry out to impress the house owner.
Luckily Jerry tricks Tom out to the snow again. This time when Tom asks for help, Jerry throws down a sweater and a pair of skis...

Give help seekers only tools to help themselves. Pride yourself that you are the best in being able to lead in helping with provision of tools. Empathize with people who do not have the tools for solving problems than empathizing because they have problems. This little shift in mental bandwidth will solve all the problems without guilt or inner conflict. Our Libra Moon will also concur

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posted June 03, 2009 05:56 PM         

I guess the general consensus is to learn how to say "NO" LOL! I think issues concerning Mr 23 and my family are unavoidable. They need support as it is really familial duty even though it can be hard on me. They do give me things in return too.

As for the friend, she hasn't called back. I'll speak to her in the the next few days when I feel like it.

quote:

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Wait! I don't think that your NN lesson is to learn how to use others for your own needs and desires!

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Sorry that was a cheap shot at Scorpio That's just how a bad Scorpio acts from experience.

quote:

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Mars is opposed to Neptune, so I wonder if sometimes you want to do something yet you're unsure about it?

Lastly, sometimes the planets on our DC can indicate what type of people we tend to attract. So I guess that you might attract needy and/or erratic/unpredictable people to you sometimes?

---

I won't deny that I do have this see-saw thing happening in me, it is probably the Libra Moon. As for the Moon opp Neptune, I just feel that it limits your drive or makes it less potent, more fuzzy. Leads to passive-aggressive behaviour too.

I'm a very tolerant person in general. A lot of people who might have been rejected as wierdos or freaks or test other people's patience, I have been able to have a relationship of some sort with them. I guess I do attract needy people at times, most often than not, I don't mind assisting. It's just that some people seem to get fixated on a problem and can't move on, I've had those people in my life.

posted June 03, 2009 06:02 PM         

quote:

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Just a couple of paragraphs in I am going to go with my gut instinct answer that you are one of those capable women who get relied upon to help other people through life.

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Provided I'm not to read a map or plug in wires between things. I'm more responsible and have common sense than capable. My capabilities come from good organisational skills and cautiousness, this has always gotten me through. I don't do silly things, I think things through and always assess situations so I don't get into trouble (that's one for the air bashers out there to take). Financially stretching yourself and getting involved with others on an intimate level are dangerous things. Other people who know me would say that I'm either serious and strict or stupid/dumb and frivolous (Aries ASC + Jupiter) but I don't think they don't know me too well.

posted June 03, 2009 06:10 PM         

There is a bit of ego feeding, I would say that it does satisfy me helping others and as I've gotten older, I do help less as the hassle is so great that I just like to mind my own business instead, which I have found to be the much easier less energetic path . My ego is Aquarius, not Aries Rising, I'd see that solely as projection. However your AA analysis is interesting, I certainly don't like taking charity from others or being a sob story. Edit - a lot of my not taking help or asking from help from others is about control. Taking helps implies possibly that someone may see you as owing them something and then controlling you.

I believe that Pluto is exalted in Aries but we've had this "disagreement" before.

quote:

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Psychic Vampires seek us out like bears hunting for honey after hibernation. The Cardinal Sun also gets a kick out of "leadership" in helping/assisting. The Libra Moon will confuse our inner conflicts with regular intervals. "I am being used, no I am not, yes I am... " ad infinitum.

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This I won't deny. I've met my fair share of them. But I know that I'm stronger than them, I've crunched a couple of them in my life after pushing me. I don't deny I like to lead but rarely do as I now I avoid it out of hassles and most people again, think that I can't do it, just thinking of all the times in school and other places where I would have done a way better job than any of the popular kids. I'm an INTJ btw.

quote:

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Empathize with people who do not have the tools for solving problems than empathizing because they have problems. This little shift in mental bandwidth will solve all the problems without guilt or inner conflict. Our Libra Moon will also concur

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Thank you, I think everyone has been saying what you have been saying. As I've said, I can't avoid it with my spouse and family but can with others.

posted June 03, 2009 11:26 PM         

I know about the need for solitude and boundaries. Like you, in my chart I have parts of myself that crave independence, and other parts that crave union. On your independent side - Aqua Sun opp Saturn and square Uranus, plus your Aries Asc. On the partnership side - Libra Moon on your DSC, and Mars opp Neptune. Sounds to me like you've been dealing with that inner conflit by identifying yourself with the self-reliant aspects, and others with the side that needs to be loved. But actually, you have both sides in yourself, as do your loved ones.

Much of what you described sounds like Neptune's work to me, especially this:

quote:

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I feel that my desires and what I want is never listened to or achieved. I feel that I always have to give and do what others want. I feel that I am an emotional sink that people use to dump their emotional dysfunction on me. I feel so tired, that I have nothing inside anymore, I feel drained.

---

---Quote by 23's Mars.

With others, your 8th house Neptune takes on their needs. Your Mars, instead of being used to assert who you are, becomes whoever they need. Your Mars-Neptune opp has been a one-way street, with you pushing your Mars out to the other through your loving & giving Neptune.

But Neptune can give to you, too! And this is what I think your Scorpio NN wants. Instead of seeing saying "no" as prioritizing your own needs above someone else's, see that moment as an opportunity for someone to give you the love & care that you need. People want to give that to you! Mars doesn't have to be drained. He can receive the sublime feast that others have to offer you.

If you tell your friend something like, "It would make me feel good to know that you'd let me be myself and love me for who I am, even when I'm not available to you. To know that I could take that time-out from us and the world, and that you'd still be there for me when I come back, would mean so much to me."

As someone who also needs a lot of alone time, I've found a discussion like that is the best way to get it. (It even works on telemarketers, very well!) You can, of course, adjust the level of sappiness to your liking. People eat that type of communication up because it's honest. It's honest because it's acknowledging a basic truth in all of us: we all need love. And in that conversation, you're letting them know how they can love you. Yes, people want their own needs met, but one of (most) people's needs is to also fulfill other people's needs. Let your friend know that she's giving you a valued gift when she gives you peace. A part of her will likely still resent having to give up what she wants, but another part of her will be thrilled to be giving you something you need.

Same thing with your SO. You said that you had previously mentioned a need of yours to him "gently." Gently because you didn't want to nag him, or gently because you weren't yet ready to tell him how you need him? Need doesn't make you weak; it makes you human! And you're a delightful one.

posted June 04, 2009 06:42 PM         

I think your advice is very true, there is an inner conflict in me for sure about what you have mentioned and also other points in my chart.

I think your NN advice is very true especially since my NN is conj my Vx as well.

I think in relation to the 18 year thing, I think that it is my fault in not expressing myself. It's not essential that I get this thing done but what I need to get done will take a long while and because our living circumstances have not been stable for the last five years, I haven't been able to get done. However, I just feel very bad when I express a need, a lot of needs of mine just don't get fulfilled because of this. It's something that has been repeated a lot in hindsight.

Thanks all for your help, there is definitely truth in each response.

I feel a bit better. My friend hasn't called me since I told her to give me space and I feel that has replenished me a lot. I will get in touch with her over the weekend and explain that I need space and why.

posted June 11, 2009 03:01 PM         

Well, I'm only human. Must be that unaspected Sag Venus of yours.

You said what you want done isn't essential, but being yourself is essential, right?

I know what it's like having Neptune whispering in your ear how unfixed you are, and that you can become whatever it is that's required of you. But I don't want you losing too much of yourself in that process, leaving you drained. Your Moon-Dsc conjunction must make you even more prone to giving priority to someone else's needs. That's why a change in the way you conceive giving & receiving can be such a help. Instead of seeing the giver as on the losing end, you can see how they're fulfilling a need of their own when they give. So when you receive, you're simultaneously giving.

posted June 16, 2009 06:34 AM         

I think as we grow, mature and become more aware of situations around us, it can switch on a light of understanding and connectedness.

This is the skill that maturity asks of us. To find the balance, to know when to withdraw to recharge, to know when to step forward and make a stand.

The more we become to understand, the more accountable we are to our knowledge - that puts a tremendous burden of responsibility on us. It also places another valuable lesson on our path - that is, to cope with the responsibility of knowledge.

You recognise people may use you. You feel that you are being used. This situation has come to your attention and you feel its burden. But look at one thing you did - you asked a friend to give you a few days space. If they are your true friend, they will understand and come back later. You excercised the Power to say No. This is a great skill at self-help.

My intuition is saying to do the things you want to do for yourself for the next couple of years; keep exercising the right to say No; direct your Life force back into your own body until you feel you are ready to give; beware the act of giving, as vampires, leeches and general unevolved people will abuse your Light; give each act of giving a blessing; honour yourself and each moment you experience.