Posts: 1829
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 21, 2010 06:01 PM         

---

Which one have you found to be more valid, and why, considering that Davison isn't a mathematical construct?

I have more (most) experience with the midpoint composite so I'm now wondering about others?

IP: Logged

Posts: 1556
From: richmond va
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 21, 2010 11:19 PM         

---

I have found the midpoint composite to be more accurate, even though its not a real chart (the fact that venus can be opposite the sun bugs some people apparently).

For instance, in the midpoint composite chart of vertex boy and i, we have a Sun, Venus, Mars stellium in the 12th. In Davison, its the 7th. Our relationship has always been clandestine, and most don't know or can grasp what a wacky relationship it is. I even had an affair (as in cheated on a boyfriend) with him. Definitely more 12th house than 7th.

IP: Logged

Posts: 6193
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 22, 2010 04:26 AM         

---

Have you read the article at cosmitech?

Sometimes I think it is all illusion anyway.
Some interprete the midpoint composite better, others Davison (I definitely am drawn to Davision for astronomical reasons, but end up looking at the midpoint composite in reality. lol).
sometimes we just don`t know what to look for or what it REALLY means anyway.
So probably not the c harts are "faulty", but our limited insights and knowledge is.

IP: Logged

Posts: 1829
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 22, 2010 04:36 AM         

---

Yes DD
Plus I read midpoint composites a heck of a lot better than Davison. So would like to hear from others on their reasoning for their preference.
For some reason Davison always seems lacking in a lot of information, more sparse, than the other. Maybe if you're better with the abstract then Davison is the chart for you.
But I don't read signs in midpoints, just houses and aspects.
So that's another factor, if signs would be valid in either.

I've never read a composite delineation or how-to book, mainly it's just from studying them after-the-fact. One thing I really disagree with is that the midpoint composite cannot be felt until the relationship is established. Very much disagree, but again only from experience.

IP: Logged

Posts: 11
From: Vienna, Austria
Registered: Jul 2010

posted September 22, 2010 09:10 AM         

---

I am only starting to work with composites and davison charts and they are very difficult for me to understand. For example I have with a very good friend of mine in our composite pluto and sun in der 4th house - pluto opposite moon and sun opposite venus. It is the most wonderful relationship I ever had with a man, but I do not understand what pluto opposite moon would mean in a very loving and friendly relationship. It is very intense, yes, but we do not have any manipulative power struggles etc. Jupiter is on the composite aschendant. Any suggestion what that pluto in the 4th opposite moon would mean?
Thanks a lot!
kama

IP: Logged

Posts: 1175
From: venus
Registered: Jan 2010

posted September 22, 2010 11:46 AM         

---

Davison is good for transits because it shows how the relationship manifests.

IP: Logged

Posts: 1829
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 23, 2010 03:21 AM         

---

kama, it's possible for the more feminine partner (usually the woman) to take on the characteristics of the moon in partnership...so the moon's aspects could relate to the woman's experience of herself while in the relationship (if you find yourself taking on a new persona around another, this is a key).. vs. her natal aspects to the composite which would be how she is affected by the relationship. with moon/pluto she'd be more able to tap into the depth of her feelings.
the best thing i can say, is read the composite most easily as a natal, but don't personalize the energies, view them from a detached perspective.
And if you're new to composites, please check the synastry of the composite with each natal. It gives a lot of information. That interpretation you can personalize for the partner whose natal you're comparing to the composite, keeping in mind that it's their perspective, only.

IP: Logged

Posts: 2059
From: Portugal
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 23, 2010 03:03 PM         

---

i still dont know which one is more accurate.

i mean..we can only tell if anything really strong happens in a relationship and then look at the charts isn't it?

it would be a great idea to start a thread about it like,share an event in a relationship and point what transits were there affecting the relationship chart?

------------------
http://modabelezaconsultoriadeimagem.blogspot.com/

IP: Logged

Posts: 1175
From: venus
Registered: Jan 2010

posted September 23, 2010 03:10 PM         

---

Composite is the mid points of the planets. Davison is midpoint of the time of births.

Composite is good for the relationship energies. Davison is good for the manifestation of these energies and how the relationship manifests. Simple.

There are big differences between them, they are equally important.

IP: Logged

Posts: 2059
From: Portugal
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 23, 2010 03:12 PM         

---

Raspberry

i see. and through each one of them,we can "predict" certain events with accuracy?

currently ive been looking at it with transits.

IP: Logged

Posts: 2059
From: Portugal
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 23, 2010 03:30 PM         

---

hmmm i just saw now one thing that i didnt looked at: tr Pluto is on our SN.

Pluto rules our 4th....this must be a very important phase cause SN is all about karmic events.something that must be cleared up and the 4th is all about family matters/our deepest Self.

Fortunately the UranusTR is getting out of our 7th-both in davidson and composite - so the jupiter there also has been helping the uranus instability.

i always thought that Uranus in 7th usually meant sudden break-up or separation/divorce when passing the 7th but in our case it wasn't

IP: Logged

Posts: 1829
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 23, 2010 03:34 PM         

---

jupiter-uranus is a sudden opportunity, it doesn't steady uranian energy.

IP: Logged

Posts: 2059
From: Portugal
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 23, 2010 03:42 PM         

---

Lonake

So,only because Jup is there,it makes the Uranian energy more "luckier"?

in our chart,jupiter co-rules the 4th and Uranus rules the 6th.perhaps opportunities that are sudden,will arise in these areas of life then.

------------------
http://modabelezaconsultoriadeimagem.blogspot.com/

IP: Logged

Posts: 1829
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 23, 2010 03:49 PM         

---

yes, it is luck, in a sense, in the sense that you can make your luck. it's not calm as the energy is that you are on the lookout for an opportunity to jump at..so it's excitement for change coupled with keeping your eyes peeled and being ready to grab for a chance at a moments notice..then you move feverishly to get to that thing you want, and it falls right in your lap.. so there's work, and some tension, involved but it's exciting and not what we normally think of as labor-intensive.

IP: Logged

Posts: 2059
From: Portugal
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 23, 2010 04:40 PM         

---

lonake

that is great news

IP: Logged

Posts: 11
From: Vienna, Austria
Registered: Jul 2010

posted September 24, 2010 09:06 AM         

---

Lonake, when making a synastry composite/ natal, do you put the composite inside or outside?
Thanks a lot for your patience and help!
kama

IP: Logged

Posts: 1829
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 24, 2010 04:38 PM         

---

The natal person on the inside, on the outside the composite..altho some composites can't be saved as their own file as they're in the middle of an ocean, etc. If I had SolarFire or some such, I believe it would be a bit easier.

IP: Logged

Posts: 757
From:
Registered: May 2009

posted September 24, 2010 05:48 PM         

---

Kama, that is odd, I keep having Moon opposite Pluto in most of composites that I've had sexual relationships with.

But when there is a stellium, which usualy happens a lot of times in midpoint composites, it seems to be more significant.

Bob Marks Astrologer is all for davidson charts, but the midpoint method makes more sense to me.

Check out this composite:

IP: Logged

Posts: 1150
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 25, 2010 09:57 AM         

---

Nice thread. I agree with DD, that it depends a lot on the reader's skill/preferences for a certain method to be accurate or not. Also, we can only conclude if a method itself is really valid/accurate or not after having studied it deeply.

I disagree that midpoint composite can't be a valid method just coz it's not a real chart. I mean, if we discard the validity of the midpoint theory itself just coz it's not a valid chart, then how can we then consider the time midpoint theory valid, since it's derived from the very midpoint theory too?

Personally, I'm more into midpoint composite, coz it makes more sense to me to use the midpoints of the actual physical positions of two charts rather than their time midpoint. But well, I've read something interesting about the time midpoint perspective too, that I'm still open to the Davison chart's method - after all, time is also a dimension.

Actually, composite isn't just about the "visible" aspects. Aspects to/between midpoints are also relevant too.
But well, an interesting question is, if we look at too many midpoints (midpoints of midpoints of midpoints and so on lol), then wouldn't each level of midpoint be less "strong/relevant"? I haven't analyzed this deeply yet, yet I feel that the aspects to/between midpoints in a midpoint chart can be equally relevant as the "visible" aspects themselves. Yet the more objects in a midpoint, the more themes we are mixing together - like Venus/Pluto midpoint's theme represents more (or is more specific) than just Venus' theme in the chart.
There are many midpoints, but relationships are in fact very complex, yet it's important to focus on what really matters to be analyzed (the big picture).

IP: Logged

Posts: 6193
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 25, 2010 10:03 AM         

---

I think the underlying theory behind the Davison method is the thought that everything we are is already inherent in our birthdate, like a seed, so a midpoint between these would be the middle between our two seeds, which enclose our personalities already.

I used to only use DAvison chart, because of the originial premise of astrology that has been derived from actually looking at the sky and what is up there instead of imposing a lot of theoretical mathematics to it.

But after acknowledging the validity of midpoints and I think they are, there is no reasonable reason to dismiss the composite for me.

Not sure how valid both of these charts really are and how much we are reading into them. But then that is the problem with everything in astrology I guess.

IP: Logged

Posts: 1150
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted September 25, 2010 10:17 AM         

---

The Davison chart might be a "real" chart that represents real planetary positions, but it's theory is based on midpoint itself, which is also mathematical.

Actually, we can't really exclude the validity of an astrological method just by its mathematical abstractions, as the astrology system itself is abstract/hypothetical (by associating symbolism with celestial objects) and mathematical (aspects are mathematical).

IP: Logged

Posts: 11
From: Vienna, Austria
Registered: Jul 2010

posted September 27, 2010 05:44 AM         

---

Vertiver, thanks for your reply!
Your composite is really hot stuff!!!!
Interesting you say you had Moon Pluto
always in your sexual relationships. Sex is in fact the only thing I do not have with my friend and surely I wonder why, everybody used to ask us whether we are together....
But the intensity is there anyway.
In fondo what is so amazing with astrology that we can have twenty aspects showing attraction, soul mating, obsession, addiction, whatever, - there is never a way to tell if there is really love. sometimes love is unrequited and there is no way to tell from astrology if we are loved back. All our threads here testify our desperate need to feel sure about the other's feelings....
But love remains a big secret, right?
kama

IP: Logged