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Author Topic:   Moon / Chiron
Doux RÍve
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posted June 01, 2011 01:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux RÍve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I still can't grasp Moon-Chiron in the natal.

Depth of emotions?
Issues with emotions?
Issues with mother?


Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

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MertSerimer
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posted June 01, 2011 01:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MertSerimer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hola,

it is quoted
With hard Chiron-Moon aspects, there is a feeling of awkwardness about expressing our emotional needs. These people may easily tell others "I am really fine", and then privately resent them when they can't see the hollowness of that statement! There is a tendency to dramatize the emotions. Depending on the position of the Moon in the chart, this may take place on the inside or might be apparent to others. There can be a "bottomless pit" feeling on an emotional level--a feeling that emotional satisfaction is always just out of reach. Mothers with these aspects may often feel guilty that they are not doing enough for their kids. There can be a tendency for people with these aspects to pour their feelings out, and then feel guilty or awkward about doing so and they proceed to cover it up and avoid the issue.

Quoted from this website

CHIRON IN ASPECT TO THE MOON
Chiron aspecting the Moon means that the native will not be able to have any feelings unless the alchemical or spiritualized dimension is part of the feeling process. The Moon is our emotional vehicle which makes it possible to relate to other people, and the Moon is our way to go deep inside to experience the subconscious mind. All feelings are screened through our Moon and deposited into the subconscious mind. The subconscious mind contains all our experiences since the beginning of time, and we cannot know ourselves without journeying deep within by means of dreams, exploring past lives, or relating our present-day emotional experiences to deep feelings inside. Therefore, the Moon is a critical vehicle for Chiron to connect feelings to the deepest subconscious. If we can't feel what our spiritual essence might be, it is hard to get in touch with it. There are other vehicles in the chart for accessing deep feelings, which include the fourth house, Venus and Jupiter, but with aspects between Chiron and the Moon, the native possesses a great vehicle for exploring the subconscious mind and bringing in the Higher Self.
Chiron conjunct the Moon is a difficult position because the natives have such intense emotions that it is difficult for them to understand the effect they have on others. They are extremely sensitive, they are very mystical about emotional bonding, and the day-to-day levels of relationships are almost impossible to bear. The ideal for this native is to master Saturn and to form a solid bond with a mate, because then the power of Uranian transformation can enter his or her life through the relationship. This native will be almost terrified of restrictions because of the Uranian desire for freedom. But if he or she can find the right partner who will help work with Saturn without undue restrictions, then the possibility of kundalini energy will manifest in sexual sharing. This native may be too involved with his or her mother, which can block the opportunity for a relationship. Also, this native will tend to attract intense and transformative partners. The key to actualizing the spiritual beauty of Chiron conjunct the Moon is Saturn grounding and balance, with room for Uranian transformation.

Chiron sextile the Moon creates a perfected vehicle for understanding how emotions can help or hinder spiritual progress. These individuals, once mature, can usually heal other people as soon as they learn they can heal, if they can feel the energy of others. Many of the teachings about healing have warned against healers taking on the negative energy of clients, but this native must feel the vibration of a client deeply in order to move energy. This position creates compassion and great balance about the needs of others. In fact, the danger of taking on negativity from others does occur if the healer pities the person in need and takes on their karma. With true compassion, one does not take on this karma, that is, pity others. One simply responds to the needs of others from deep inside the heart chakra. You have nothing to fear from anyone if you respond with compassion from the heart. Chart 17 is that of a theologian who deeply understands feelings of others, and Chart 28 belongs to the astrologer who learned to heal by being able to respond to others with deep feelings. Zane Stein said of natives with Chiron sextile the Moon, "They are usually perceptive of the ills and weaknesses of others, their strong points and talents, their needs and wants." It is from this natural perceptual base about the needs of others that deep compassion is bom.

Chiron square the Moon creates a crisis over feelings and higher consciousness. In the early years, relationships are very difficult and intense. This position tends to appear in nativities of analysts and astrologers, because the early childhood creates many difficult emotional experiences which are a laboratory for understanding people and their complexes once the native has experienced the Saturn return. The potential with this position is the highest level of awareness about human emotions, and this native may even become an adept at connecting the higher self into the body. This native is usually involved with the occult because the Chirotic awareness factor is so intensified. This position also creates serious perceptual difficulties: these natives are so intense that they have great difficulty learning from outside reality and other people. They will tend to change environments and people so often that they will not develop long-term friendships. Channeling and drugs are very dangerous for these natives, because they will use the drugs to color perceptions about reality, and the channeling will just reflect the opinions they already have about other people and themselves. They need to become more objective about their own perceptions or they will entirely lose their ability to use their experiences with others as material to learn lessons from.

Chiron trine the Moon creates the opportunity for a powerful balance of the emotions and the higher self in consciousness. This native is naturally comfortable with soul attunement and tends to create a beautiful and harmonious environment. This is a great position for an artist or musician. The usual difficulties with laziness and non-activation of the trine are not especially noticeable with Chiron trine the Moon because the trine calms and harmonizes the Moon to Chiron. In general, aspects between the Moon and Chiron function well in the sextile and trine. One of the greatest therapists I know who is an adept at helping people works with the higher self and is given as an example with Chart 19.

Natives with Chiron quincunx the Moon are almost always healers. They are naturally sensitive to emotional intensity. Chiron tends to unbalance and irritate them in the quincunx until they learn to channel powerful healing forces over time. Chiron seems to activate sensitivity about energy and electrical conductivity, and the Moon seems to become their vehicle for understanding how people feel. This is not necessarily an easy position, because the healing energy in the body pushes on the native very hard until the Saturn return. In general, once these natives find out they can heal and create a life in which they can function as healers, they do very well. Until that point, they may seem to be very neurotic because they have exceedingly intense feelings about everything around them. Once Saturn returns and they balance more in the body, the intensity lessens and the power comes in.

Chiron opposite the Moon is the highest manifestation of the alchemized Moon. The Moon or perceptual screen is naturally open to all dimensions. The native has difficulty keeping the auric field clear and is open to astral interference. In the terms of traditional psychology, they have "boundary problems." This is a very hard position to live with before the Saturn return, and I have eleven individuals with this position in my files, which is way out of line statistically, indicating that I attract them. These natives tend to have very difficult early childhoods; they tend to have unusual sexual complexes coming from the powerful flow of kundalini energy in their systems. The neurological system is quite activated, which results in electrical healing skills and/or neurological difficulties. These natives possess great power and potential, and if they can balance the emotions they are capable of remarkable achievements. Chart 22 is a good example of Chiron opposite the Moon. This native is a very skilled astrologer who is especially adept at emotional counseling, and yet her own emotional reality is very difficult and complex. The Moon in the fifth house intensifies the sexual dynamism of this position. The charismatic physicist and writer of Chart 1 has Chiron opposite the Moon, with Chiron in the first house - Moon in the seventh, forming a T-square with the Sun and Saturn at the top. The feelings and charisma of this native are so intense that people flock to hear him speak. He has a stable marriage and family life which helps him to manifest the highest potential of his position. Incidentally, he does not seem to respond to transits in the normal fashion; a great deal of his energy seems to be coming from another dimension.

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roadwarriorsdp
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posted June 01, 2011 01:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for roadwarriorsdp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have chiron quintile moon. Unfortunately I require large amounts of money to divulge the nature of such an aspect, as it is ultra rare.

Sorry, capitalism is bigger than me.

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Doux RÍve
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posted June 01, 2011 02:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux RÍve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you Mert, great article.
I can TOTALLY relate, quite amazing.


quote:
Originally posted by roadwarriorsdp:
I have chiron quintile moon. Unfortunately I require large amounts of money to divulge the nature of such an aspect, as it is ultra rare.

Sorry, capitalism is bigger than me.


By the way, quintiles are minor aspects anyway.

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roadwarriorsdp
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posted June 01, 2011 02:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for roadwarriorsdp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Doux RÍve:
Thank you Mert, great article.
I can TOTALLY relate, quite amazing.


By the way, quintiles are minor aspects anyway.


True, but so are all aspects when considering free will, and that we are horny regardless of the planets.

The water of life is about perspective, and true aim.

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Aya_and_baby
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posted June 01, 2011 02:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Aya_and_baby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Moon conjunct chiron here (Gemini/7th/conjunct DC)


In short, I've got all of the above.

In a bit longer:

I don't agree with how my mother raised us. It's easy to point the finger at her, but something just seems wrong about her clearly preferring my older brother on an emotional level. She indoctrinated me with the idea that I must be the same as her because we're both Scorpio sun. She is stubborn and dominating and even though I like to think I don't, I seem to still let myself be influenced by what she says. Because she simply won't let me ignore her.

Her behaviour has had a grave effect on me as a child. I can trace back my fear of intimacy back to her inability as a young mother to rear two children by herself or even with my father (she always left us somewhere else overnight), my fear of opening up emotionally ("crying is weak!" is something I always heard, also at a very young age when I loved giving hugs and such, she got annoyed and eventually shouted out to me that she "wasn't gay". Those are things that stick).

She also left me with this pet peeve for people who think they know what I am like, and treat me as such (She'd keep on insisting that I was stubborn because I "didn't want to come out on her birthday!". I could never go to karate because she didn't want it, I couldn't go to music class because I was like her and she had no musical bone in her body so it was a waste of time - the truth is that musically, I luckily take after my father - I couldn't do anything creative or artistic because it was a waste of time. Same with the classes I wanted to take: "dead languages are a waste of time and you're not going to be an archeologist anyway", among many, many things) So now, when someone says "you're such-and-such personality, I go straight into defense mode, especially when they're wrong. (If it ever happens here, my apologies. It has been indoctrinated and is still an ongoing issue, I don't mean to be defensive).

Thankfully, thanks to her I also got a pet peeve for people who want to manipulate and people who play games with someone. Which is good in terms that I don't let people play games with me ---- anymore, it has to be said.


I don't like her at all and if she wasn't my mother, she would be the type of person I would never be friends with, but since she is my mother, I do love her. And she's not all bad. In her adulthood she has finally realized that it is sometimes better to let someone make their own mistakes and not to interfere, which I do thank her for. She has also - finally - learned that I'm not at all like her and she has stopped forcing me into that role. She does still think I'm an enfant terrible though, because I've been rebellious against her ever since I can remember.

All in all, I think the mistake she made was becoming a mother at too young an age. She wasn't even halfway into adulthood when we were growing up and I think she just wanted to take that frustration out on what she figured was a younger version of herself.

So far for my mother issues. They do lie very deep, as you can see.


Issues with emotions is a bit shorter. It's an existing issue which came to light a few days ago - funnily enough, when the transit sun conjuncted my natal moon-chiron conjunction. I suddenly realized how hurtful it is for someone else when I keep my emotions hidden safely away, when all they want is a bit of reassurance. I also realized how hard I find it to emotionally open up to someone because my emotions are already so frail (which is one of the reasons why I keep them under lock and key) not to mention that I sometimes don't want to believe that I do have emotions (if I forget about them, they might go away, right?).


The depth of my emotions? Never thought about that. I often like to say that my emotions are very shallow, because my Gemini moon analyzes them to the core and breaks them down until there is nothing left. But I know well enough that they run quite deep - they must, if they can hurt me so bad.

Wow, some rant. Sorry for that

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roadwarriorsdp
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posted June 01, 2011 02:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for roadwarriorsdp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As someone with moon quintile chiron I can heal those with conjunctions and squares and oppositions. However, as rare as my services are, I charge a high fee...


once again

CApitalism is much greater than I...

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roadwarriorsdp
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posted June 01, 2011 02:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for roadwarriorsdp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here I'll go ahead and do it for you...

The issue with you and the emotional nature is not your mother

it is your perception that life is not perfect as is...you say she had you too early, but had she not had you then, you would not be now as is.....and therefore rather than being displeased with the before, you are actually dissatisfied with teh now, and placing blame...

it is true, paretns make mistakes with regards to what the children think is proper and correct, teh children take this into account, do research, and adjust upon their own kids, but even they, if looking at the glass half empty, will find faults with the most perfect of all existences.

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Aya_and_baby
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posted June 01, 2011 02:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Aya_and_baby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting fact: in the last 60 years (at least up to 10 years ago, I've lost count since then) Chiron opposite Uranus was quite common, so most aspects with Chiron and the Moon would have also invloved Uranus


90% of the charts that I have show a Chiron-Uranus opposition. Or maybe I just attract such people!

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roadwarriorsdp
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posted June 01, 2011 02:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for roadwarriorsdp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have chiron opposite saturn and chiron quintile moon, and moon square uranus conjunct mercury.

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roadwarriorsdp
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posted June 01, 2011 02:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for roadwarriorsdp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
To be entirely honest I think my true healing ability is sexual in nature, but is currently self focused, meaning celebacy devoted to chi gung, and internal alchmey for perfection of vocation, and art.....long and straneous process, but michelangelo is my rolemodel, luckily my vocation is in business, so maybe i won't be as miserable, since money can by a few moments of hedonistic pleasure here and there, like bird seed for a pelican.

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Doux RÍve
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posted June 01, 2011 02:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux RÍve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Aya, thank you so much for that great reply!
I feel the same way about my emotions.
I tend to supress them, because otherwise I end up really hurt and upset.


road, I agree that it's not our parents' fault if we are dissatisfied with some areas in our life.
But the early conditioning plays a big role.
However we are the only ones responsible for ourselves.

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Aya_and_baby
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posted June 01, 2011 02:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Aya_and_baby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What I have said about my mother up there are my personal experiences alright, but I made sure I wouldn't include anything that wasn't already confirmed by others who also know her and have the ability to be objective about this. She simply is not liked by family, by her in-laws or by my sister-in-law (at least if my brother ever pops the question) ... or by any of my potential partners. She has actually successfully chased a few away, who clearly told me that they wanted me, but simply couldn't live with the idea of her as a mother-in-law. That says quite a lot in my humble opinion.


What I do now with the personality I'm given natally and am conditioned with while growing up, is purely my own business, I agree. Hence why I have to kindly decline any assistance - especially when it is of a sexual nature.

I also agree that if my mother didn't have me when she did, I would not be the person that I am now. I told her that often enough myself, following with that she should be happy with the fact that I am who I am now instead of trying to change me. That still doesn't take anything away from the fact that she was a bad mother to both of us, that we both still bear the "scars" of that and that she should have matured more before thinking about motherhood. But the past is the past and it can't be undone, and despite my mother-issues and emotion-issues and self-esteem-issues, I am incredibly happy with who I am. I wouldn't want to trade my personality for anyone else's. The above mentioned issues are things I can still work through if I put myself to it.

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Doux RÍve
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posted June 01, 2011 03:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux RÍve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you for sharing Aya.
It's good to see that you're happy with who you are.
It's never too late to mend anyway

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Doux RÍve
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posted June 01, 2011 03:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux RÍve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Anyone else with natal Moon Chiron aspects?

Can you relate to the descriptions in the article?

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roadwarriorsdp
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posted June 01, 2011 03:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for roadwarriorsdp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It's a difficult task to blame achievement or satisfaction on another because there is always someone who has it worse but has more satisfaction and achievement than us...

That's all I mean to say

so as early as you were born and as disatisfied as you were with your mothers perfromance

there are others who have achieved more or are more satisfied and were nearly stabbed to death by thier but have forgiven them and even said to be better mothers than average except for tha tone mistake...

do you see what i'm saying?

it's a relative perception taht can be molded to change your present reality...if looked under a different light, otherwise you will go down teh path of the person who is disatisfied by the mother archtype,....which is a common path and people usually respond to this in the same fashion...it is a limitation of thoguht.

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mintgirl123
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posted June 01, 2011 07:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mintgirl123     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have this chiron square moon and venus.

As well as moon square neptune

I'm really sensitive. =/ (must be also my libra aspects and virgo sun) But people won't see it. I like to keep it hidden.

And the article up there is very accurate.

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roadwarriorsdp
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posted June 01, 2011 07:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for roadwarriorsdp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Imagine your emotions are ingredient...hiding your emotions is like shoving them under a matress...or putting them in a safe, or at worst, putting alot of pressure ove them...depending on what the emotions are, this can lead to an explosion, assuming they are explosive emotions, like repressing desires is one thing, but repressing feelings is a whole other.....there are different ways to express emotions...the best ways are effective but subtle, the more extreme we become in expression, the more polar we also become, and the less stable

trust me, the emotional body is something i know well....moon quintile chiron.

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enchantress299
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posted June 01, 2011 08:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for enchantress299     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have Moon sextile Chiron.

quote:
Chiron sextile the Moon creates a perfected vehicle for understanding how emotions can help or hinder spiritual progress. These individuals, once mature, can usually heal other people as soon as they learn they can heal, if they can feel the energy of others. Many of the teachings about healing have warned against healers taking on the negative energy of clients, but this native must feel the vibration of a client deeply in order to move energy. This position creates compassion and great balance about the needs of others.

That part there is quite true of me. I can't tell you how many people have told me that they are naturally at ease with me. I've had several people tell me: "You're just so easy to talk to." These are usually people who don't know me well and find a sudden rapport. Pretty basic really. Plus, my chart is 'bucket' shaped and the Moon is the handle, so essentially I filter my natal placements through that one. It's easy for me to empathize with others on an emotional level even if I don't agree with them.

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blugrey
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posted June 01, 2011 10:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for blugrey     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
-

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vertiver
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posted June 01, 2011 10:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for vertiver     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Chiron trine the Moon creates the opportunity for a powerful balance of the emotions and the higher self in consciousness. This native is naturally comfortable with soul attunement and tends to create a beautiful and harmonious environment.

Wow, no wonder I'm so sensitive and adept to other people's emotions, I thought it was just having Pisces Moon in the 3rd, but I guess Moon trine Chiron could be it. Also I have a really good relationship with other women and my mother especially.

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Lioness
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posted June 01, 2011 10:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lioness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I also have the trine..

Chiron trine the Moon creates the opportunity for a powerful balance of the emotions and the higher self in consciousness. This native is naturally comfortable with soul attunement

I agree with this part.

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starcrossedleo
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posted June 01, 2011 10:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for starcrossedleo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

I have Chiron quincunx Moon and have recently taken an interest in healing to include astrology (considered one of the healing arts)aromatherapy and Bikram yoga. I am also interested in learning Reiki. I found this description interesting!


Natives with Chiron quincunx the Moon are almost always healers. They are naturally sensitive to emotional intensity. Chiron tends to unbalance and irritate them in the quincunx until they learn to channel powerful healing forces over time. Chiron seems to activate sensitivity about energy and electrical conductivity, and the Moon seems to become their vehicle for understanding how people feel. This is not necessarily an easy position, because the healing energy in the body pushes on the native very hard until the Saturn return. In general, once these natives find out they can heal and create a life in which they can function as healers, they do very well. Until that point, they may seem to be very neurotic because they have exceedingly intense feelings about everything around them. Once Saturn returns and they balance more in the body, the intensity lessens and the power comes in.

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SmilingHeart
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posted June 01, 2011 10:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SmilingHeart     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Moon conjunct Chiron in Cancer....
I think that speaks for itself. I like to guard my feelings like treasured gold. I almost always keep them to myself. Yes, I am very sensitive; I try not to be by being hard on myself and sometimes on others but I can never really escape my sensibilities.
I think the Moon/Chiron conjunction- description is very accurate.

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Doux RÍve
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posted June 01, 2011 10:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux RÍve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yes I have the conjunction too.
It's a very difficult aspect to have, in my opinion.
I have a very hard time with emotions.

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