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Author Topic:   For those who have afflicted charts
Taineberry
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posted June 04, 2011 03:20 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taineberry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You are not alone and you are not doomed.


I have a major and angular fixed T-Square with : Saturn 10th house at the apex of the square part at 23 Aquarius - and Venus/Mercury 1st house conjunct btwn 19-22 Taurus on one side of the opposition – and Moon/Neptune 7th conjunct btwn 15-18 Scorpio at the other end. Yep, that’s right! – malevolent Saturn squaring ALL of my sensitive planets – Moon, Venus, Neptune, and Mercury. If that does not signify a life drained of anything that is good in it, I don’t know what does????

And I absolutely hate to admit it - but I think that my tight Mars/Uranus conjunction in the 1st and 2nd degree of Virgo in the 4th house (which also conjunct Pluto at 8 Virgo) means that my T-Square is actually a big fat Grand Cross as it opposes my Saturn in 23 Aquarius with an orb of 8 degrees. I can’t even begin to comprehend how this can foul up matters even further!!!

That means .......... every single planet in my chart is squared with each other except Sun and Jupiter (which are in tight Sextile in Gemini and Aries - This is my one and only soft aspect, and it is ruined by the fact that it actually forms the base of a tight yod to Neptune in Scorp - a very “challenging” thing in itself) . I have no trines at all, not even one natural blessing or talent. A chart that would make grown men weep! (Luckily, I am not a man!)

Somehow, despite this, my life is pretty good overall.

It is true that I have had to engage with my fair share of inner demons and obstacles to get to this point and I don’t take any of it for granted as I am keenly aware that some twist of fate could vaporize any or all of it in a flash - but I definitely can't say that I am or ever have been a depressed (Saturn), loveless (Venus), brainless (Mercury), delusional (Neptune) emotional wreckage (Moon) either, which is what my heavily afflicted chart seems to indicate I should be. Nor am I a reactionary, unpredictable warmonger bent on world domination ( if you count the Sat opposition to mars/Uranus/pluto). Actually I am quite a happy person most of the time, although I do have to work hard to centre myself constantly to live as mindfully as I can whilst dealing with the ups and downs of life.

So .... take heart all you people out there with heavily afflicted charts, you are not necessarily bad people doomed to only be able to express the most negative manifestations of your planets ..... you might need to live a little more consciously than most in order to dodge the arrows of misfortune and climb over all those obstacles without making your planets freak out, but hey... at the end of the day it is character building!

What am really saying is, do not be too quick to assume that hard aspects always bring out the degraded qualities of a planet, and only soft ones bring out the positive elements, as cookbook interpretations suggest. With a bit of awareness, the owner of an afflicted chart can lead a normal life, which includes a reasonable dose of love and happiness and stability, even if the path there is not always easy and even if you have no trines – which apparently, according to some astrologers, are the only way you can achieve good results in life.

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lalalinda
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posted June 04, 2011 03:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lalalinda     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hello Taineberry! Welcome to LL

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Lioness
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posted June 04, 2011 03:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lioness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for that info!

I agree anyone can over come any aspects, Astrology is a tool that shows you what problems you will have and possible outlets.

Yes and Welocme to LL!!!

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L0veLess
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From: Midgard
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posted June 04, 2011 03:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for L0veLess     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
can ya post yur chart? id like to see it

------------------
I became insane, with long
intervals of horrible
sanity.-Poe

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MertSerimer
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From: where the fun is
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posted June 04, 2011 03:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for MertSerimer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
thx for sharing. Many famous people have T-Squares in their chart. Especially Moon squares.. In fact due to producing more energy, if you direct these energies into your career or your aims these T-Squares and yods serves well.

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Taineberry
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posted June 04, 2011 04:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taineberry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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samsaoule
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posted June 04, 2011 12:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for samsaoule     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Taineberry:
You are not alone and you are not doomed.

A chart can be read at different levels depending on your living conditions. If you had good enough parents and a good health, it is easier to deal with such stressful aspects. But if you have to deal with issues linked to bad parenting and bad health, those aspects implying Saturn get a quite different taste...

Of course, there is always the possibility to accept life as it is, overcome difficulties by realizing the self, but that is not the case of the majority of people who are still living attached to their ego and suffering.

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amowls**
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posted June 04, 2011 02:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for amowls**     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The most successful people I know have a lot of t-squares and other hard aspects. It makes you have drive.

I, on the other hand, have a chart full of soft trines and sextiles and I am a lazy piece of crap.

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MertSerimer
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posted June 04, 2011 02:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MertSerimer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by amowls**:
The most successful people I know have a lot of t-squares and other hard aspects. It makes you have drive.

I, on the other hand, have a chart full of soft trines and sextiles and I am a lazy piece of crap.


You have many Garfield aspects? . I have just two of them which is entirely enough to make just sit and look around

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Taineberry
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posted June 04, 2011 03:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taineberry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for the encouraging insights. I love astrology but I have always felt a bit ashamed about my own chart and have mostly avoided even looking at it until now because (apart from Sun sx Jup), lets face it, it paints a dire picture.

Amowls - I would chew off my left arm for a chart like yours which would tell me all nice things about myself

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Taineberry
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posted June 05, 2011 10:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taineberry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
deleted

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Taineberry
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posted June 05, 2011 10:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taineberry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by samsaoule:
If you had good enough parents and a good health, it is easier to deal with such stressful aspects. But if you have to deal with issues linked to bad parenting and bad health, those aspects implying Saturn get a quite different taste...


Been thinking about this - maybe parenting does explain the the root of the harsh aspects. My dad had a drinking problem and was often abusive to me,and he did not show me affection. My mom never allowed me to utter a word against him - she was always loyal to him. She loved me, but was a control freak. However, this wasn't all bad for me in the long run - it just toughened me up emotionally.

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samsaoule
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posted June 05, 2011 01:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for samsaoule     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Taineberry:
Been thinking about this - maybe parenting does explain the the root of the harsh aspects. My dad had a drinking problem and was often abusive to me,and he did not show me affection. My mom never allowed me to utter a word against him - she was always loyal to him. She loved me, but was a control freak. However, this wasn't all bad for me in the long run - it just toughened me up emotionally.

Sometimes we may never be aware of the psychological roots of those stressful aspects and we work on them through difficult situations in our life (Saturn is then projected outwards).
But sometimes we become aware of the psychological origins of our pain (especially if we were the obvious victims of abuse in our childhood or if we had to deal early with a health condition) and we may work on those psychological schemes directly (from an inner perspective).
Either ways, consciously or not, Saturn makes us work on “lessons we have to assimilate”.

The roots of our pain is a combination of education, breeding ground both biological and psychological, karma and level of consciousness.

I guess the more advanced we are in consciousness the more detached to mental and emotional positions (as well as “situations”) we are. No matter what happens in our life, we feel free from inside.

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Lioness
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posted June 05, 2011 06:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lioness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have mostly easy aspects.. If you include Chiron I have a cradle with Chiron,Saturn,Sun,Moon,Merc and Uranus.

I do have a t-square with Venus/Pluto/Jupiter and Mars sq Neptune.
These are my only hard aspects I have.

My life has been anything but easy. I have had so many ups and downs. Ive been through just about anything you can imagine.

I also have my own abandonment issues.

My House placements of my planets just sux..
I have a Leo Stellium of Sun,Moon,Merc,Mars all in H6.. Totally kills the out going Leo..

I have Uranus/Pluto in H7..
Saturn in H3 also conjunct the IC
Cap rules H11.

Im not that outgoing Leo. I have very few friends, and I prefer to be home alone..

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samsaoule
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posted June 06, 2011 12:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for samsaoule     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Lioness:
I have mostly easy aspects.. If you include Chiron I have a cradle with Chiron,Saturn,Sun,Moon,Merc and Uranus.

I do have a t-square with Venus/Pluto/Jupiter and Mars sq Neptune.
These are my only hard aspects I have.

My life has been anything but easy. I have had so many ups and downs. Ive been through just about anything you can imagine.

I also have my own abandonment issues.

My House placements of my planets just sux..
I have a Leo Stellium of Sun,Moon,Merc,Mars all in H6.. Totally kills the out going Leo..

I have Uranus/Pluto in H7..
Saturn in H3 also conjunct the IC
Cap rules H11.

Im not that outgoing Leo. I have very few friends, and I prefer to be home alone..


Hi Lioness

Well, it means having « easy » aspects does not necessarily means having an easy life as planet positions are crucial as well. It also means we never know how people will play their cards. I had an astrologer teacher who could feel at which level the birth chart could be read (level of consciousness in particular, but the way he “felt” a chart was not easy to reproduce by his students).

However, to my opinion, it is quite simple: as long as there is ego identification, there is suffering, whatever the chart! So, most of people have something to complain about, small or big and most of the time they see their “situation” as something terribly big.

I have myself a bunch of stressful aspects and very little “good” aspects, as well as very challenging planet positions in houses (Saturn retrograde in XII, Pluto in IV, etc.). I had to deal with heavy issues, but I try to keep going :-) One day or another all that big joke will end. Carpe diem. Lol.

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Taineberry
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posted June 06, 2011 01:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taineberry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Am I understanding this better now?

A person who has hard aspects is likely to manifest negative outcomes when dealing with problems, as they tend to instinctively operate from a p.o.v of ego and fear. This causes them to react in destructive/self-destructive ways. It is only when they become actively conscious, that they learn to respond with inner awareness in a way that will manifest a better result.

However, with soft aspects, the demand for a conscious response within the individual is less, because they innately possess qualities that will enable them to respond in a way that will lead to a better outcome.

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samsaoule
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posted June 06, 2011 02:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for samsaoule     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Taineberry:
Am I understanding this better now?

A person who has hard aspects is likely to manifest negative outcomes when dealing with problems, as they tend to instinctively operate from a p.o.v of ego and fear. This causes them to react in destructive/self-destructive ways. It is only when they become actively conscious, that they learn to respond with inner awareness in a way that will manifest a better result.

However, with soft aspects, the demand for a conscious response within the individual is less, because they innately possess qualities that will enable them to respond in a way that will lead to a better outcome.


Very well synthesized. It is what I think as well :-)

Edit : however, I think that if the urge (consciously or not) for consciousness may be stronger for people with hard aspects, it still exists for people with softer aspects AND planet positions.

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popcorn
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posted June 07, 2011 11:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for popcorn     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I've an t-square to my moon. I was poor once a time. I've never been afraid of hard work and today I'm rich and can give my children a good life and future.

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sand
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posted July 05, 2011 04:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sand     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
...

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MsCandeh
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posted July 05, 2011 11:18 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for MsCandeh     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Taineberry:
Am I understanding this better now?

A person who has hard aspects is likely to manifest negative outcomes when dealing with problems, as they tend to instinctively operate from a p.o.v of ego and fear. This causes them to react in destructive/self-destructive ways. It is only when they become actively conscious, that they learn to respond with inner awareness in a way that will manifest a better result.

However, with soft aspects, the demand for a conscious response within the individual is less, because they innately possess qualities that will enable them to respond in a way that will lead to a better outcome.


This makes sense. I never really thought of it this way but was always thankful I only have one square because of the other crap in my chart. I have three oppositions within 2 degrees - venus/saturn, sun/mars, mercury/pluto; moon/jupiter are square.

*Edit: .. dont' feel like airing my dirty laundry tonight*

I am glad that you have mastered or had inner wisdom to be able to have a well-rounded balanced life despite the squares!! It's just a potential anyway and does not depict who we are.

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Taineberry
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posted July 05, 2011 11:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taineberry     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hehe! ... MsCandeh .. I did see your post anyway before you edited it. You are still young though, and I believe that after a while you will be not be phased by ANYTHING that tries to knock you in the areas of life where those hard aspects function.

As for the trines, well, I have no experience. Just guessing, but I imagine any problems would be because others take advantage of your natural good nature in that respect.

In fact, it would be interesting to hear from someone who has the crown jewel of all trines in their chart ie."sun trine moon" and see what they have to say - if their life is really a breeze with pretty much everything going their way; OR if they struggle with people taking advantage of their trusting nature because they have little experience of inner conflict on the most fundamental level.

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