posted April 10, 2012 12:24 AM            

I was thinking about gender in the Chiron topic & remembered this story. Did some research & found the mother's blog & LUCKILY she's quite anal about her postings because on 2 occasions she alluded to the child's dob,

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I'm starting this on Friday 24 November, exactly two weeks after the baby was born

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Friday, 15 December 2006
Five weeks old

So today it's five weeks since I gave birth

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Looking back at the calendar the boy's dob is Nov 10, 2006 & here is the chart - no time of birth unfortunately,

So there's debate over the ramifications this child will face over the course of his life re:this issue of gender identity. Do you see this in the chart?

posted April 10, 2012 12:39 AM            

She alternated his clothes, one day dressed as a girl, the next day as a boy (so says one article). The child played w.stereotypical male and female toys, so the issue of gender was just never introduced until 5 apparently.

posted April 10, 2012 12:55 AM            

He's got a few t-squares but his Sun (individuality) is the apex of it between Saturn and Neptune. This would obviously affect the rest of the stellium, his love life, venus, and learning Jupiter. I'm seeing all the connections but it seems too much to write... So many of his planets are in feminine signs which will make him a very feminine male. Girls I know with that many planets in fem signs always seem to be the feminine of the feminine.

He's going to have a tough life, poor kid. I don't know why his mother kept it such a secret. My intuition is telling me that a part of him always knew what he was...

posted April 10, 2012 12:59 AM            

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Originally posted by Lonake:
^ That's right it's for noon. I had to dig for the dob but there is unfortunately no time.

I've been interested in this one too (!) I hope the mother keeps up her blog. It is quite an experiment.

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posted April 10, 2012 01:14 AM            

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Originally posted by littlecloud:
I think she planned all of this secrecy while he was in the womb, would explain all the scorp, the Neptune... Otherwise we'd be looking at a very different chart.

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posted April 10, 2012 01:31 AM            

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Originally posted by Lonake:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by littlecloud:
[b]I think she planned all of this secrecy while he was in the womb, would explain all the scorp, the Neptune... Otherwise we'd be looking at a very different chart.

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posted April 10, 2012 09:42 AM            

And everyone's getting mad because the mother is supposedly "experimenting" on her son. That's probably not even her intention. She is raising him a specific way that coincides with her beliefs (that gender is a social construct). Just like parents who don't let their kids watch TV or parents who raise their children Christian. She's not letting society dictate the way he needs to act, she's lettinghim choose his own identity. Y'all need to calm down.

posted April 10, 2012 09:47 AM            

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Originally posted by Capriquarius:
That 9th House Scorpio (sexuality) stellium with Venus at the MC is already manifesting as fame for his gender neutrality (Venus/Mars almost conjunct).

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posted April 10, 2012 10:01 AM            

That's what this mother did. Rather than being content with a natural response to gender, she made a HUGE issue out of it, contacting the media, switching clothes around, making a blog, basically toying with her child's identity so she could garner attention to her own cause.

Everyone was basically invited to speculate about what was underneath this child's clothing. That's an invasion of privacy.

She was exploiting her child. Whether or not he appreciates being given this celebrity status in the future does not change the fact that it's inconsiderate to force someone who is basically powerless into the role of being a widely-discussed "freak show."

posted April 10, 2012 10:04 AM            

Earth void, Neptune singleton.

Definitely a *lot* of confusion, that's all I can say.

The Moon is well-aspected so his feminine side will be/is integrated.

Mars/Venus is where the issue is -> gender; and the Sun also squaring Neptune, it affects his whole identity, and thinking/communication (Mercury).

posted April 10, 2012 10:25 AM            

I understand that the parents are trying to give their child options and broaden his mind and really meant no harm. However, the parents are imposng a set of values and mindset on the boy at such impressionable age and most importantly, cannot choose. What may happen in the future is that most people may not be able to relate to this boy. Will the boy be strong enough mentally to deal with all these non-conventional thinkings unlike others - peer presure? Even if the child is mentally strong enough to handle the difference from others, he may not have enough friends that relate to him. No one is an island. We need to a certain extend some ppl to help us along in life. By doing what they did, are the parents helping the boy or fulfiling their ideals?

Being unique is special, interesting but I come to notice that life is so much more easier if one can just "fit in" and relate to ppl.. or at least pretend to fit in when circumstances expects.

posted April 10, 2012 10:29 AM              

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Originally posted by amowls**:
Sexuality, while can be tied to gender, is separate from gender.

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My prediction: he turns out fine.

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posted April 10, 2012 02:30 PM            

Hell, I have t-square with Chiron, Saturn/Uranus squaring Venus and I am FINNNNNNE. I have no issues with my sexuality or gender identity. I am probably even more aware than most people about those issues, actually, so I think I'm better off because of it.

posted April 10, 2012 02:39 PM            

Faith you eloquently expressed what I was thinking. She could have done all this minus the involvement of all the media, that is what I am very much against. She put her child in a very difficult position.
Like lillithpluto said, no one is an island. We would be remise to assume that this will not affect him in the future.
I recognize that every parent raises their child according to their own ideology but the media really didn't need to be involved. Scientifically speaking this is a poor experiment because you have too many variables, making it more difficult to make an accurate conclusion.

Doux, my thoughts exactly on the astrology of it.

posted April 10, 2012 06:00 PM            

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Originally posted by amowls**:
It's amazing that everyone is freaking out over this kid not knowing his gender. He's 5 years old. It shouldn't even be a issue at that age.

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Agree completely with you on this even though I believe gender is not a social construct; gender roles are.

The kid is five freaking years old. The mother is trying to raise him with a neutral gender expression and while I do not place much value in media attention, I understand her motives: allow the child to grow with whatever gender identity they wish.

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Originally posted by Faith:
You distort the meaning of gender all out of proportion by exaggerating your response to it.

That's what this mother did. Rather than being content with a natural response to gender, she made a HUGE issue out of it, contacting the media, switching clothes around, making a blog, basically toying with her child's identity so she could garner attention to her own cause.

Everyone was basically invited to speculate about what was underneath this child's clothing. That's an invasion of privacy.

She was exploiting her child. Whether or not he appreciates being given this celebrity status in the future does not change the fact that it's inconsiderate to force someone who is basically powerless into the role of being a widely-discussed "freak show."

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Pray tell what is the "natural" response to gender? Also, what is the meaning of gender according to you.

Gender is simply not male or female. There is cisgender: identifying as the same gender assigned to you at birth which is the majority and there is transgender. There is intersex, there is androgyne, there is gender queer, pangender, trigender. Which of these is the natural gender response?

After a cursory reading of her blog, I believe she is mixing up gender with gender identity. According to her, her child is aware that he is a boy; his gender however is not the first thing they reveal to others.

The issues she has touched upon, ignoring the terminology, are very real. Gender roles imposed by society are imbibed by children which they later spit out as prejudices. Phrases like, "be a man", "you run like a girl", "nancy boy"; so called social constructs like "boys like blue, girls like pink", "girls play with dolls" etc. promote a very narrow view of a gender identity to which one must conform or be ostracised from groups and cliques. Being forced to conform to narrow roles is not conducive to anyone's mental health, I guarantee you that.

What would YOU rather choose: being made to fit into what you're not or being accepted for who you are?

posted April 10, 2012 06:52 PM            

Unnatural response is making a circus out of someone's gender, involving the media and widespread attention.

posted April 10, 2012 07:42 PM            

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Originally posted by Faith:
You distort the meaning of gender all out of proportion by exaggerating your response to it.

That's what this mother did. Rather than being content with a natural response to gender, she made a HUGE issue out of it, contacting the media, switching clothes around, making a blog, basically toying with her child's identity so she could garner attention to her own cause.

Everyone was basically invited to speculate about what was underneath this child's clothing. That's an invasion of privacy.

She was exploiting her child. Whether or not he appreciates being given this celebrity status in the future does not change the fact that it's inconsiderate to force someone who is basically powerless into the role of being a widely-discussed "freak show."

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I agree. I know she wanted to point out that gender was influenced by society, but then again her rebellion and big hoopla over his gender neutrality was also defined by the same societal pressures. It's ironic, and sadly she doesn't seem to get that.

A parent should make the child resilient and able to function at their optimal in society, since we are not living in an isolated jungle.

I watched the video and I think it's her self righteousness that is being displayed. 1. If you don't care about gender, then do that: don't care about it. Why talk about a tutu and comment about how pretty he looks in it? Why not let him choose what to wear? I think she made him wear that tutu and then supported the tutu project by complimenting him and saying not that he's handsome in it or even good looking but instead that he looks so pretty in a pink tutu. I mean come on. There is something wrong with her.
It's unbelieveable how self absorbed she is.

2. Why does her issue with gender neutrality need all that publicity? She put him on youtube etc. It's only important if a. You are backed in a corner and are trying in vain to support your project and b. If you are an attention w h o r e.

3. What is the difference between this lady and the tiara moms? Same fanaticism in different directions I suppose; none being healthy.

4. Why make your child into a school project? He's the only kid with parents that choose to experiment with his formative years in this way. What if ....say something doesn't go well? What then? What if he gets way too confused and doesn't understand how to function at optimum in society? He might be a genius and before his time, but he'll be a lonely depressed genius. I would want to give my child happiness over trying to be a revolutionary. We already have c r a p to deal with; why would a loving mom add more complications to the mix?

5. My brother played with teddy bears, dressed up, had a girly play name I gave him, but he did it and had fun. Today he's totally against all the girly shenanigans men, grown men, are up to. He thinks a majority are simply attention seekers. I tend to agree. I think some women are the same way. I remember in high school kids would have signs saying: I'm unique and different etc. That's fine but they were also very in your face and needed the attention. That takes away from genuinely different people who try to make it.