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Author
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Topic: Direction of Pluto/Venus aspects
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LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 22, 2012 06:01 AM
  
Okay so I've had Pluto square Venus in two of my love relationships. One of them was a lot of games and hurt, the other...well I'm engaged to him  Both relationships very intense, but I noticed something that caught my interest. In the relationship that didn't work out it was my Pluto square his Venus that is conjunct my Ascendant.
My fiance has his Venus square my Pluto but on my Descendant.
I was wondering if the direction of the aspect had an effect.
I know that an aspect is usually considered being applied by the faster moving planet, in this case Venus. But if the energies go both ways (both planets' energies reach for each other and interact once they become close enough to create an aspect) my theory makes sense.
I'll use my experience as an example any feedback or personal experience would be appreciated My theory:
If you overlay the first relationship I had, his Venus conj my Asc, my Natal Pluto in my 4th house had to reach BACK to make the connection. His Venus was "younger" or "immature" in comparison to my Pluto. And seeing as how Pluto is supposed to transform going backwards doesn't seem like it would suit Pluto's energies in a positive sense. Also, because the faster moving planet is applying the aspect, maybe with his Venus "behind" my Pluto, it was making his Venus reach for heights it wasn't prepared for yet. My current relationship with my fiance, his Venus is conj my Des. My Pluto therefore has to reach forward and learn and grow to connect with his Venus and does so willingly because this is a type of transformation that Plutonian energy loves to create and embrace. I realize that each of their Venuses being on my ASC/DES gives them a special place in my heart no matter the location of my Pluto. Which is why I want other people's opinions on this
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Leo ASC, Pis Sun, Tau moon IP: Logged |
RedScorp
Knowflake Posts: 3633
From: GMT-5
Registered: Jul 2011
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posted September 22, 2012 06:09 AM
quote:
well I'm engaged to him
Congratulations! Venus-Pluto is always fun...throw in maybe a Mars-Pluto, and nothing will ever be boring, to say the least!  The theory makes sense, tho. If Pluto is behind the other planet, Pluto needs to work and reach forward, which it loves. IP: Logged |
LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 22, 2012 06:50 AM
quote:
Congratulations! Venus-Pluto is always fun...throw in maybe a Mars-Pluto, and nothing will ever be boring, to say the least! The theory makes sense, tho. If Pluto is behind the other planet, Pluto needs to work and reach forward, which it loves.
Thank you!! I feel like I'm marrying my best friend, soul mate, other half..whatever you want to call it His Pluto is semisquare my Mars and biquintil my Venus. Both minor aspects but are by an orb of 1 degree or less. My Pluto is square his Sun, Merc, and Venus (all close to or conj my des in my 7H) and sextile his Moon. Nothing is ever boring between us lol *edit*
I've just always thought of Pluto as a "forward thinker" and if the transforming or forward moving energy is already ahead of another it seems to me like the one behind would be tripping over itself to keep up and eventually become defensive because it can't. IP: Logged |
LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 23, 2012 02:42 PM
bumpIP: Logged |
LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 24, 2012 04:44 PM
has nobody else experienced the square between Venus and Pluto in more than one direction?IP: Logged |
Sorcha
Knowflake Posts: 518
From:
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted September 24, 2012 05:07 PM
In my case I have Venus (H2) square Pluto (H5) natally so every man from my generation has their Pluto squaring my Venus. Unless I marry someone much, much older than myself (or much much younger, which is very unlikely) then I'm stuck with being the Venus every time.The only way that I can relate to this theory is through oppositions and conjunctions. For example, in a relationship where I was very much in love and felt that there was growth, his Venus is at 3 Libra exactly squaring my Venus at 3 Cancer and my Pluto at 8 Libra is conjunct his Venus. Conversely, in my most recent relationship, the growth I felt in it was very hard won and difficult. His Venus is at 3 Aries (behind my Venus, so to speak) but still exactly square my Venus and opposed to my Pluto (as well as his own). The first relationship felt much lighter in terms of growth (ie I enjoyed the growth) whereas the growth I experienced from the second relationship was hard, hard, hard. I've never been the Pluto person in a square as I've never dated anyone with his Venus in Capricorn so it's hard to say based purely on the square alone for me. But if it makes any difference to where your thoughts are leading, both men broke it off with me.
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LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 24, 2012 05:52 PM
Thank you Sorcha! And your oppositions and conjunctions fall in perfectly with my theory especially when you know that in the first relationship I talked about, with his Venus on my ASC, his Pluto was Opp my Venus as well as the "backward" sq
to my ASC. Definitely not fair of me to leave that out! Like your second description, that relationship was a lot of hard lessons learned. Venus sq Venus Conj Pluto..That must have been fun! Did you guys share everything? By share I mean enjoy teaching each other about the things you like/love/desire in life. *edit* oops, posted too quickly! *edit*
quote:
The only way that I can relate to this theory is through oppositions and conjunctions.
I would say that for the opposition and conjunction it would have to depend on which side of Pluto the Venus person fell. Directly or exactly conj may produce feelings that can't be let go of. Not that it'd be hard to, but just can't. And anything 180-175 degrees opp would feel the "positive" influence whereas the 180-185 degrees opp would feel the negative side. In your first case, your Pluto was still ahead of his Venus even though conjunct. 5 Degrees in Plutonian time is still a lot of time for growth and change. Maybe a future chance at the relationship, when His Venus has progressed past your Natal Pluto, would be possible? I've gotta say I'm kind of obsessed with the energies these two planets create together. Heh, obsessed, with Pluto-Venus..Who'da thought it lol IP: Logged |
Sorcha
Knowflake Posts: 518
From:
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted September 24, 2012 09:10 PM
Glad to be of help As for a future relationship, that's doubtful. We are both in our mid-to-late 30's and his Venus progressed past my Pluto eons ago  But it was definitely a very important relationship for me (and I think for him too). IP: Logged |
Lily
Knowflake Posts: 28
From:
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted September 25, 2012 04:06 AM
It's not because it's "'reaching back." I'm not exactly sure what that means, because I've never heard of it before in astrology, but I think i know what you mean, and there's no such type of aspect in astrology. There's something else going on in the Synastry that made it very different. Venus/Pluto is inherently the same. It's an aspect, so it always behaves similarly. The placement of their Venus changes things too. His Venus on your AC is a different feel than the other guy's Venus on our DC, but that's not even enough for such a drastic change if we're only talking about the venus/pluto aspect. The sign of their Venus would have more of an effect than whether Pluto was reaching back as well. Maybe his Venus was stressed or in a sign that shows the way he behaved. it seems one had Venus in Leo which is very different from Venus in aquarius. If you posted the charts, I bet we'd be able to explain the difference. What I'm saying is that the difference has nothing to do with the Venus/Pluto aspect at all. It's something else. It could be anything in the Synastry. IP: Logged |
venuscorpio86
Knowflake Posts: 80
From: salem,or usa
Registered: Feb 2011
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posted September 25, 2012 04:28 AM
So, I have a question. How would venus conjunct pluto be in synastry? Me - being the pluto and he being the venus. He has his venus in scorpio and I have my pluto in scorpio. Any one have any really good information about this? Thank you! IP: Logged |
LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 25, 2012 05:06 AM
I guess a better way to say it would have been if Venus is applying or separating from Pluto. But that doesn't really convey what I feel is going on.
I know that the different Venus-Pluto aspect isn't the only reason the whole relationships felt differently. I was speaking only of how Venus-Pluto felt. I've had Venus-Pluto connections in almost every one of my intimate relationships. Granted there aren't THAT many but both people I'd been with before I was in a 5 year relationship(that had no V/P aspects)had Pluto/Venus aspects in synastry, and 2 of the 3 relationships afterward as well. The atmosphere created by it is familiar to me. Both in positive and negative ways. And yes you're right, an aspect is an aspect is an aspect and the energy will always flow SIMILARLY. Not exactly identical though and why couldn't this be the answer to the question why? We don't KNOW that planets' energies don't reach out to each other...
quote:
So, I have a question. How would venus conjunct pluto be in synastry? Me - being the pluto and he being the venus. He has his venus in scorpio and I have my pluto in scorpio. Any one have any really good information about this? Thank you!
A deep emotional and physical connection. I've never had the conjunction. Only opps and squares You guys may have been drawn together to heal a wound in one another or to teach some lesson in love. It may be a little too intense at times since these two planets are both very powerful in their own respects. But if it's anything akin to the opposition it can have a tendency to lead to obsession and heart ache. Although with his Venus in Scorpio he may very well be fine with a little obsession in the love department IP: Logged |
LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 25, 2012 05:13 AM
quote:
Glad to be of help As for a future relationship, that's doubtful. We are both in our mid-to-late 30's and his Venus progressed past my Pluto eons ago
But it was definitely a very important relationship for me (and I think for him too).
I think that "very important relationships" is what Venus/Pluto creates. I don't think either person could ever be the same in love after a relationship with aspects between the two. Venus affects Pluto just as much as Pluto effects Venus and both people are left changed for it, be it for better or worse. And it's only for worse if you let it be, ie: don't learn the lesson from the heartache.
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Lily
Knowflake Posts: 28
From:
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted September 25, 2012 05:27 AM
Applying and separating make a bit of a difference, possibly. It would probably depend how closely applying and separating.
Is one of the Venus' closer in orb?
"And yes you're right, an aspect is an aspect is an aspect and the energy will always flow SIMILARLY. Not exactly identical though and why couldn't this be the answer to the question why? We don't KNOW that planets' energies don't reach out to each other... " But it is identical. The aspect is the aspect like you said. The different signs make a difference and so does the house. It will be the same energy but felt a little differently because of the different houses and Venus signs. So it will outlet in different areas of your chart(s) and in a different way because of the signs, but its the same energy.
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LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 28, 2012 07:41 AM
bump. I'm convinced there is something to this but I think I have to explain my theory a little better.If you take the Zodiac for what it is, it's a cycle of life and rebirth for planets/asteroids. "Birth" being the time when any given planet crosses the cusp from Pisces back to Aries and "death" or even maybe "the other side" being represented in the last degrees of Pisces. No matter where your soul decided to join this cycle (your ASC) your planet placements are directly related to each planets' current journey or "life path" through the Zodiac. So a Venus in Aquarius would be older or more "mature" than a Venus in say, Leo or Virgo.
The same would go for comparing different planets. But when comparing different planets, it makes sense to me to not start out with the faster moving planet "behind" an ever-changing energy like the one created by Pluto. Depending on which slower moving planet you are looking at, it might make a difference. But I would imagine that having someone's personal planets (those that are moving/learning/growing more quickly as they progress thru the Zodiac) forming an aspect from "behind" slower moving, therefore slower/deeper learning would make the Sun, Moon, Merc, or Venus person feel uncomfortable because they are used to being "quicker" or "ahead" because of their speed in comparison to a planet like Uranus, Neptune or Pluto. Whereas the personal planets of Person A being "ahead" or farther progressed than Person B's outer planets would make Person A feel more comfortable around Person B because their personal planets are "in the lead" as they should be since they move faster. I wish I could explain myself better, or let you guys look in my brain to see exactly what I mean lol *sigh* IP: Logged |
12thhouser
Knowflake Posts: 664
From:
Registered: Feb 2012
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posted September 28, 2012 08:31 AM
quote:
Originally posted by LionFish:
bump. I'm convinced there is something to this but I think I have to explain my theory a little better.If you take the Zodiac for what it is, it's a cycle of life and rebirth for planets/asteroids. "Birth" being the time when any given planet crosses the cusp from Pisces back to Aries and "death" or even maybe "the other side" being represented in the last degrees of Pisces. No matter where your soul decided to join this cycle (your ASC) your planet placements are directly related to each planets' current journey or "life path" through the Zodiac. So a Venus in Aquarius would be older or more "mature" than a Venus in say, Leo or Virgo.
The same would go for comparing different planets. But when comparing different planets, it makes sense to me to not start out with the faster moving planet "behind" an ever-changing energy like the one created by Pluto. Depending on which slower moving planet you are looking at, it might make a difference. But I would imagine that having someone's personal planets (those that are moving/learning/growing more quickly as they progress thru the Zodiac) forming an aspect from "behind" slower moving, therefore slower/deeper learning would make the Sun, Moon, Merc, or Venus person feel uncomfortable because they are used to being "quicker" or "ahead" because of their speed in comparison to a planet like Uranus, Neptune or Pluto. Whereas the personal planets of Person A being "ahead" or farther progressed than Person B's outer planets would make Person A feel more comfortable around Person B because their personal planets are "in the lead" as they should be since they move faster. I wish I could explain myself better, or let you guys look in my brain to see exactly what I mean lol *sigh*
Possibly. At the same time, in my opinion, that might be looking at the zodiac too linearly. I actually talked with an astrologer friend of mine years ago about this, and she shook her head. In my opinion, it would be nice to think of the zodiac this way, especially if you have personal planets "near the end of the zodiac," but I'm not sure it works this way. We look at the zodiac in the sky and read them left to right. We could have just as easily come up with a system that read them right to left, putting Aries at the end. So, I do hear what you're saying. I'm just not sure how much water it holds. It's thought-provoking, though. IP: Logged |
amowls**
Knowflake Posts: 1904
From:
Registered: Dec 2010
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posted September 28, 2012 08:58 AM
I've had 2 Venus square Pluto relationships (I'm Pluto). One was horrible, another was great. The bad one was his Aqua Venus square my Pluto in Scorpio. The good was Leo Venus square my Pluto. I can't say that my experience agrees with your theory. IP: Logged |
LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 28, 2012 09:16 AM
Well, to make it a little less linear what if it was only used to compare a faster moving planet to a slower one? Or the other way around? Instead of using it to say "oh my Aries Venus is young and immature" compared to someone else's further along in the zodiac?
Even though the "me me me" attitude, constant playfulness, want for attention, and slight jealous streak in love seem to go hand-in-hand with young love When one's Sun, Moon, or Pluto aspects my Venus I'm like a smitten school girl lol Also, what if you were to use it in relation to YOU? Your ASC being the point of birth for all the planets in relation to you personally instead of automatically starting it with Aries and ending with Pisces. It would then vary for each person along with their natal chart. But that doesn't seem quite right either. Aries was chosen as the "beginning" for a reason. Spark of life = Aries based (1st house) energy... It's more circular than linear. Basically like reincarnation on a yearly basis for the Sun, Merc, Venus, and a few more times than that for the Moon Keep in mind they aren't repeating the same lives over and over again because as they go thru their rebirth in the zodiac to "start over" they are still moving forward in the Age of Aquarius. I'm thinking too much and gotten way off topic  IP: Logged |
LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted September 28, 2012 09:25 AM
quote:
I've had 2 Venus square Pluto relationships (I'm Pluto). One was horrible, another was great. The bad one was his Aqua Venus square my Pluto in Scorpio. The good was Leo Venus square my Pluto.
I can't say that my experience agrees with your theory.
Hm, well, having an experience exactly opposite mine wouldn't support my theory at all would it? lol
Thank you for sharing I was hoping for someone else who'd had two opposing squares to chime in! What houses did their Venuses fall in? And your Pluto? IP: Logged |
vickymadness
Knowflake Posts: 809
From: Minnesota
Registered: Jan 2012
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posted September 28, 2012 09:32 AM
0-0IP: Logged |
starfairy
Knowflake Posts: 42
From: los angeles, california, USA
Registered: Jul 2010
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posted October 04, 2012 12:46 PM
Venus-Pluto: This is one of the hottest sexual synastry aspects two people can have! Pluto represents sex, obsession, and intimacy, while Venus represents love, beauty, and affection. Together, this spells g-r-e-a-t s-e-x! You stimulate each other’s desire to experience the depths of sexual intimacy. Physical intimacy is especially important with this interaspect; you feel a strong desire to be physically close to each other. In fact, you may find you become obsessed with one another! This aspect also indicates power struggles and domination, especially on the part of the Pluto person. The Pluto person feels a strong desire to “merge” with the Venus person. Pluto finds Venus beautiful and intriguing. Venus is strongly sexually attracted to Pluto, as Pluto puts her in touch with her primal, sexual feelings. This is especially true of the conjunction. The trine and sextile indicate intense, but pleasing and harmonious sexual interactions. These aspects deepen the intimacy shared by the couple, but not in an overly obsessive or destructive way. In the case of the square and opposition, strong sexual energies are also indicated, but this may be accompanied by an unhealthy desire to control one another through manipulation, jealousy, and possessiveness. The square and opposition can also indicate sexual and financial exploitation, as well as abuse. Nevertheless, Venus-Pluto in synastry is just plain hot.
http://astrolady.wix.com/astrolady#!sexual-synastry/c1bxb I have the square at 10 degrees separating in my chart, so guys who are 2-7 years older than me have their Plutos square my Venus. Basically, it's been in every relationship I've ever had! Super intense, super sexual, super obsessive. Lots of possessiveness, amazing sex.. Hard to let go, hard to forget.. IP: Logged |
Lily
Knowflake Posts: 28
From:
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted October 04, 2012 07:03 PM
Why do you believe the difference in the relationship can be pinned down to the Venus- Pluto? I'm sure they have totally different charts, but you keep focusing on the Venus Pluto aspect. IP: Logged |
Sorcha
Knowflake Posts: 518
From:
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted October 04, 2012 08:07 PM
quote:
Originally posted by LionFish:
I think that "very important relationships" is what Venus/Pluto creates. I don't think either person could ever be the same in love after a relationship with aspects between the two. Venus affects Pluto just as much as Pluto effects Venus and both people are left changed for it, be it for better or worse. And it's only for worse if you let it be, ie: don't learn the lesson from the heartache.
Agreed. My problem is that I am still working through the lessons meant to be learned from the second guy - the one who not only broke my heart but also betrayed me. I also believe in learning from every relationship but betrayal is a hard one for me. I'm sure eventually it'll lessen though and I will completely forgive. The other thing I find interesting about Ve/Plu double whammy aspects in synastry is that often people ask about who is more in control or who feels it more - Venus or Pluto? I find that there is no answer to this. I have heard of (and experienced) Venus being more in charge and I have also heard of (and experienced) Pluto being the ultimate decision maker when it comes to who is more in love/obsessed/committed/etc. In my experience, having Venus conjunct Pluto is definitely the most intense experience (for both people) and those feelings leave but they never really go away, if you know what I mean. It's kind of like a scar - it's there for life except you have really good memories associated with it.
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LionFish
Knowflake Posts: 89
From: Yakima, WA, USA
Registered: Aug 2012
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posted October 06, 2012 08:07 AM
@LilyIt's not that I think the difference between the two relationships can be linked JUST to Venus/Pluto, I wanted opinions on differences between "directions" of aspects formed between these two planets. There are a lot of differences in the charts, also a lot of similarities in the way they fall in houses, if not by sign. Both men have all of their planets (not asteroids) from their MC to their 3rd house (left side of chart) whereas all my planets fall between the 4th and 10th houses (right side of chart.) I was specifically asking about Venus-Pluto because I wanted others' experiences and insights into the matter. Whether or not it made a difference. I'm really not just focusing on the Venus-Pluto aspect, but that IS kind of what this thread was started to discuss.. I just wanted to keep to the topic I had in mind by not derailing with other subjects/planetary placements.
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Lily
Knowflake Posts: 28
From:
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted October 06, 2012 11:10 PM
Okay. IP: Logged |
Lily
Knowflake Posts: 28
From:
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted October 06, 2012 11:11 PM
Okay. IP: Logged | |
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