Posts: 822
From:
Registered: Nov 2012

posted May 28, 2013 11:04 PM            

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This is what I friend of mine just said

Do you think so?

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Posts: 2198
From: Mercury
Registered: Dec 2012

posted May 28, 2013 11:14 PM            

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Psychology makes us puppets, thats my response to your friend who is obviously uneducated on the subject.

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Posts: 822
From:
Registered: Nov 2012

posted May 28, 2013 11:18 PM            

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He thinks that if astrology is true it makes us puppets under some superior being's system.

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Posts: 1942
From: Asheville, NC, US
Registered: Jul 2012

posted May 28, 2013 11:20 PM            

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Goodness, not at all, Astrology is a beautiful thing, however we also have choices.

Someone's sig mentions love can conquer, and it does, in a overly romantic way it matters more than the stars themselves as it is our choice to make.

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Posts: 6638
From:
Registered: Jul 2011

posted May 28, 2013 11:54 PM            

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Does a clock make the time, and worse, makes us slaves to time?

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Posts: 822
From:
Registered: Nov 2012

posted May 28, 2013 11:57 PM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Does a clock make the time, and worse, makes us slaves to time?

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What do you mean?

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Posts: 2014
From:
Registered: May 2012

posted May 29, 2013 12:51 AM            

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Its the good ol' - Determinism vs Free Will debate.
You can hold a belief that astrology is accurate and also reject determinism. That wouldn't be self-contradictory.

It depends on your interpretation of what astrology constitutes.

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Posts: 573
From:
Registered: Mar 2010

posted May 29, 2013 02:21 AM            

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Traditional astrology is pretty much clear cut and there is hardly any room for free will. And I must say experienced traditionalists are accurate.

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Posts: 2056
From: Saturn
Registered: Sep 2012

posted May 29, 2013 02:29 AM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Does a clock make the time, and worse, makes us slaves to time?

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LOL

well my alarm clock/watch is my master,tough one lol,especially in the mornings. He makes me pay big time for waking up at 6.01 am instead at 6.00 am

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Posts: 2056
From: Saturn
Registered: Sep 2012

posted May 29, 2013 02:31 AM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by goatcat:
This is what I friend of mine just said

Do you think so?

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To some extent,if you allow it to. Just like some occult practices.

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Posts: 1572
From: San Diego CA, USA
Registered: Jun 2011

posted May 29, 2013 02:35 AM            

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It's a bit like saying "Math defines the world". Math is a human system designed to quantify patterns we perceive in the universe. The same can be said for astrology. Astrology can only show you the colors on your palate. It has no control over which colors you choose to make by mixing or what work of art your life will eventually paint. You even have the freedom to choose not to paint at all.

Knowing the measurements of your kitchen makes you just as much a puppet to mathematics as knowing what degree your Sun is in, makes you a puppet to astrology. At the end of the day, neither of these pieces of information effects your ability to bake a delicious cake (unless you let it).

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Posts: 2374
From: CA
Registered: Oct 2010

posted May 29, 2013 04:05 AM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by goatcat:
He thinks that if astrology is true it makes us puppets under some superior being's system.

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You should introduce him to the phrase begging the question.

For example, who says it would have to be created by a superior being? My own theory is that astrology works because of the collective unconscious, that is when stars, planets, and asteroids are named then it imbues them with metaphysical qualities that vibrate through the collective unconscious. If, for some reason, Venus had been named Eris then humanity would've subconsciously poured out psychic energy that imbued it with far different energies and as it was reflected back at us then its effects would fit that of the goddess of change and chaos rather than love and beauty.

That aside, it's not determinism and doesn't affect anymore than the seasons. That is, it has an affect, but one can go against the current if one wants to and can find other ways to deal with the influence. Likewise, the energy affects different people in different ways, just as alcohol does (for example, one with a lot of Leo energy could be a dogmatic, obnoxious jerk while another is a champion who leads by inspiration and example, just as some drunks habitually become friendly or angry under alcohol).

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Posts: 863
From: Transylvania
Registered: May 2012

posted May 29, 2013 07:31 AM            

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To play the society game - you have to take the role of a puppet. Astrology has less influence from this point of view - it's meant as a helping tool - to help you define yourself better, but it doesn't impose anything... while society does - it does that since the second you were born trough a dogmatic system - which affected your parents and everybody who's part of it. So, maybe you should let your friend know that - he's already a puppet, he just doesn't know it yet.

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Posts: 49
From: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Sep 2012

posted May 29, 2013 08:22 AM            

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Yes! Yes it does, but as you become more conscious and loving, oh, the wonders of the puppet master!!

<3 <3 <3

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Posts: 126
From:
Registered: Oct 2012

posted May 29, 2013 08:45 AM            

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I’ve always said there are right ways and wrong ways to practice astrology. You become a puppet when you wash all the responsibility from your own hands and start depending entirely on the stars. The stars don’t make us do anything. We do. The basis of astrology is that the movement of the starts is synchronized with people’s lives, the theory that everything is connected and everything mimics each other (like the structure of the atom is the same as the structure of the Solar system). Because there can be no psychical evidence of this synchronization, science rejects astrology. The only evidence you can count on is observation – to actually see the results of this synchronization.

Just like every other belief system it becomes corrupted when you stop thinking of it as a guide (which you can chose to follow or not) and start taking it literally and as something written in stone.

That’s why I find it ridiculous when people try to blame their natal charts for their problems. The natal chart is a guide which grows and develops the same way a human does. To say you can’t apologize for a mistake because you’re a Leo Mars and you’re too proud is snubbing a problem with an unjust rationalization. More commonly the situations are more subtle than this example but still – when you fall on anything (be it astrology, religion etc.) and let go of your accountability you become a puppet. It’s not astrology that makes you a puppet, it’s your refusal to take responsibility for your actions and your life.

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Posts: 6853
From:
Registered: Oct 2010

posted May 29, 2013 10:07 AM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by Kerosene:
Psychology makes us puppets, thats my response to your friend who is obviously uneducated on the subject.

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^This.

Enough said.

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Posts: 624
From: los angeles, ca, USA
Registered: Jun 2012

posted May 29, 2013 10:39 AM            

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Los Angeles makes puppets every day.

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Posts: 822
From:
Registered: Nov 2012

posted May 29, 2013 10:44 AM            

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Now mind you the guy that told me this was a Leo. He said if astrology is true then he feels less of an individual. I'm assuming Leos like to take credit for who they are.

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Posts: 492
From: IL
Registered: Dec 2010

posted May 30, 2013 03:18 PM            

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Tell him, no, we are more like characters in a book. haaahaahaa ;D

"take responsibility for your actions and your life" !!

lol meyray must have lots of Virgo energy. lol

Sorry, I'm feeling deterministic today. xo

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Posts: 53
From: Antwerp
Registered: Jan 2012

posted May 30, 2013 03:53 PM            

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Leo talking about individuality?

Noone to admire their bullcrap
Noone to point at your mistakes
Noone to hurt or boost your ego

Leo shouldn't speak about individuality should they?

Cuz they need others more then they think they do.But in their self admiration, they might miss a screw or 6 million :')

ps this is about individuality..
If u are a leo and get offended , then not only did u not use ur intelligence and wisdom, but u just allowed to put yourself in a box, wait...u just walked right into the box...and then blame...me maybe for doing it to you?

I didn't do nothing, u do things upon yourself without even realising it.

He who is trained in himself, he will not see others, and he who is trained for others, will not see himself

If a mouse runs into a trap because it got baited, its not the trap fault or he who layed it there..the mouse had the last saying, and he choose wrong=> SPLAT

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Posts: 126
From:
Registered: Oct 2012

posted May 30, 2013 04:19 PM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by Mystic Melody:

lol meyray must have lots of Virgo energy. lol

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lol 6th House energy more accurately. But I guess it's kind of the same thing.

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Posts: 334
From: Portlandia
Registered: Jul 2011

posted May 30, 2013 09:07 PM            

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I can understand that statement. Astrology can make a person take interpretations to literally to the point of being overly manipulated from astrology. I can admit that used to be the case for myself. But I've backed away from Astrology quite a bit until recently. I still am skeptical of a lot of interpretations and don't take readings literally.

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Posts: 1289
From:
Registered: Feb 2012

posted May 30, 2013 09:18 PM            

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Posts: 492
From: IL
Registered: Dec 2010

posted May 31, 2013 12:03 AM            

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meyray... woohooo 6th house energy Maybe some Capricorn/Saturn for you too then. lol Not that we don't ALL have Capricorn/Saturn energy.... somewhere... hehehe

nice puppet pic lol

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